MD 3.0 uGPA 3.6 gGPA 513 MCAT

[girlinthebar]

First MCAT (2013) 26 (55%) - expired
Second MCAT (2015) 29 (73%)
Third MCAT (2017) 513 (90%) - 128/128/128/129

State: NJ Resident

Race: Asian

Gender: Female (27)

Undergrad: Private Top 30 (Economics)

Grad (MS): Private Top 20 Med School (Physiology) - Finished in 10 months + completed additional semester of courses to boost GPA

Clinical experience: Mental Health Clinician (4000 hours, 2 years), Founder of Non-Profit/Work in Nutritional Health for Disadvantaged Population (5000 hours, 3 years), Epilepsy Grand Rounds (30 hours, 1 year)

Research experience: Economic Theory Research (3 years, 300 hours), Clinical Researcher in Neurology Lab (2 years, 1000 hours), 3 Neurology Publications (2nd, 4th, 6th author)

Shadowing: Neuro-ICU (150 hours), Overseas OB/GYN and Prenatal (250 hours),

Non-Clinical Volunteering: New York Cares (60 hours, 1 year), Music Outreach at Nursing Homes (200 hours, 4 years), Autism Outreach ( 4 years, 200 hours)

Other ECs: NCAA Div. I Fencer (600 hours), Juilliard Violinist (5000 hours), Ranked University Table Tennis Player (300 hours), University Student Gov't Board Member (60 hours, 1 year)

LORs: Stellar letters - 1 from clinical work experience, 2 from clinical research, and 1 committee letter from grad school

Relevant Honors/Awards: Academic Scholarship for National Merit Scholar (top 5% of class), University-Wide Grad Student Leadership Award

Story: Low GPA resulted from dealing with a death of parent due (cardiovascular disease) and having to support the family while finishing college. Personal experience with father further motivated me to pursue medicine and help those who were disadvantaged and/or had similar needs.

Interests: CVD/Obesity, Pediatrics, Mental Health (Neurology), Global Health Concerns on Healthcare Delivery

Uncertain where to apply due to low undergrad GPA, however also only looking to apply to MD schools. I have been several years out of college and there is an upward trend from freshman year to grad school. Focusing on targeting my state school and schools in the NYC/Tri-State area - short list includes: RWJ, Rowan, NJMS, Columbia, Albert, and Icahn. Chances for school list?

School List:
Albany
Albert Einstein
Boston
Brown
Columbia
Cooper
Drexel
Dartmouth
Georgetown
Harvard
Hofstra
Icahn
NJMS
NYMC
NYU
Penn State
Quinnipiac
RWJ
Stony Brook
SUNY Downstate
SUNY Upstate
Thomas Jefferson
Tufts
Weill
UBuffalo
UPenn
URoch

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[Faha]

Are you a New Jersey resident?

 

[girlinthebar]

Are you a New Jersey resident?

Yes, NJ resident.

 

[Faha]

The GPA-MCAT grid shows that you have only a ~30% chance of a MD acceptance with your stats. Most of the schools on your list are unrealistic and your GPA is below the 10th percentile for all the OOS schools on your list. There is a chance you could receive interviews at your 3 NJ MD schools. What is your undergraduate sGPA?

 

[girlinthebar]

The GPA-MCAT grid shows that you have only a ~30% chance of a MD acceptance with your stats. Most of the schools on your list are unrealistic and your GPA is below the 10th percentile for all the OOS schools on your list. There is a chance you could receive interviews at your 3 NJ MD schools. What is your undergraduate sGPA?

sGPA is 3.0

However, I believe some of these OOS I have listed are open to "reinvented" older applicants. What schools would you suggest instead other than my in-state schools? Very much open to suggestions.

 

[THEBACKANDFORTH]

Uncertain where to apply due to low undergrad GPA, however also only looking to apply to MD schools. I have been several years out of college and there is an upward trend from freshman year to grad school.

sGPA is 3.0

However, I believe some of these OOS I have listed are open to "reinvented" older applicants. What schools would you suggest instead other than my in-state schools? Very much open to suggestions.

Confirmation bias--the tendency to interpret new evidence as confirmation of one's existing beliefs or theories.

If you apply only MD, I doubt you will get in. Every med school is a "top 30" school. You can't gun elitist when you get straight B's.

 

[Faha]

I suggest these OOS schools:
Albany
New York Medical College
Quinnipiac
Seton Hall
Drexel
Temple
Jefferson
NOVA MD
Oakland Beaumont
Rosalind Franklin
I also recommend applying broadly to at least 12 DO schools and consider all these:
PCOM (all 3 schools)
LECOM
ACOM
ARCOM
BCOM
WCU-COM
LMU-DCOM
UP-KYCOM
WVSOM
VCOM (all 3 schools)
UIWSOM
ICOM
NYIT-Arkansas

 

[girlinthebar]

@THEBACKANDFORTH -

That's a fair point. However, we also know that adcom no longer want to admit applicants with only stellar stats and no ec's or practical attributes that show he/she can be a compassionate doctor.

Regardless if my numbers are low, if med schools are able to look past the numbers, they will want to hear the story behind the applicant. Those are the schools I am hoping to target (reinvention). I think there is a very interesting story I can share about my personal and professional experiences in various aspects of the healthcare field.

Furthermore, at the end of the day, there is not much I can do to raise my GPA given I have been out of school for so long, it would probably even be mathematically impossible now to focus on my GPA as something to be changed. Rather than trying to show them I am an "A-Grade" applicant, what I actually need to do is convey in my essays how I have overcome this and that the me now is not the same me of then, and I can handle a rigorous medical school curriculum.

With my decent grad GPA and competitive MCAT score, it should at least ease the minds of adcom with that regard. If they are able to get past this and see me as the individual I am, I think there is something to be said about someone with the resiliency and maturity to continue working towards his/her dream despite encountering major setbacks in life.

@Faha - Thank you for your suggestions and additional list of schools. I believe I have already included the east coast schools you listed for me (Albany, NYMC, Quinnipiac, Drexel, Temple, and Jefferson), but will certainly add Seton Hall to the mix as well. Unfortunately, at the moment I am still opposed to applying to DO schools and would like to give MD schools a proper shot before considering DO options. But nonetheless, thank you for your advice.

 

[bears1992]

You should probably take a look at the MSAR to see which schools you can add/remove. From the 2018 AAMC survery, adcoms give little weight to graduate work so I wouldn't rely on your graduate GPA to give you much help. To be honest, that grad GPA probably hurts you as adcoms expect graduate GPAs to be inflated. A 3.6 graduate GPA is still below the average matriculant undergrad GPA.

https://www.aamc.org/download/462316/data/mcatguide.pdf#page=10

Your MCAT is above average for matriculants so you just need to work on your uGPA. For MD, you'll probably need to do a year or two of postbac or a SMP. Don't bother with the top 20 medical schools though, they are not really the type for look for reinvented applicants that have 3.0 GPAs.

 

[WIMNFamilyMed]

@THEBACKANDFORTH -

That's a fair point. However, we also know that adcom no longer want to admit applicants with only stellar stats and no ec's or practical attributes that show he/she can be a compassionate doctor.

Regardless if my numbers are low, if med schools are able to look past the numbers, they will want to hear the story behind the applicant. Those are the schools I am hoping to target (reinvention). I think there is a very interesting story I can share about my personal and professional experiences in various aspects of the healthcare field.

Furthermore, at the end of the day, there is not much I can do to raise my GPA given I have been out of school for so long, it would probably even be mathematically impossible now to focus on my GPA as something to be changed. Rather than trying to show them I am an "A-Grade" applicant, what I actually need to do is convey in my essays how I have overcome this and that the me now is not the same me of then, and I can handle a rigorous medical school curriculum.

With my decent grad GPA and competitive MCAT score, it should at least ease the minds of adcom with that regard. If they are able to get past this and see me as the individual I am, I think there is something to be said about someone with the resiliency and maturity to continue working towards his/her dream despite encountering major setbacks in life.

@Faha - Thank you for your suggestions and additional list of schools. I believe I have already included the east coast schools you listed for me (Albany, NYMC, Quinnipiac, Drexel, Temple, and Jefferson), but will certainly add Seton Hall to the mix as well. Unfortunately, at the moment I am still opposed to applying to DO schools and would like to give MD schools a proper shot before considering DO options. But nonetheless, thank you for your advice.

If you’re opposed to DO your chances of becoming any sort of physician aren’t great unless you go back into undergrad classes as detailed above. Apply md and do this cycle if you can afford it, because otherwise you’re likely to just waste an entire year hoping for an md interview or to get off a WL if you are lucky. The more cycles you have to apply, the more money you spend and the less you can earn in your lifetime. You make your career shorter by being MD or bust. Unless you use the year of your app cycle to fix your gpa, you probably wasting that year if you apply strictly DO.

 

[795722]

You should probably take a look at the MSAR to see which schools you can add/remove. From the 2018 AAMC survery, adcoms give little weight to graduate work so I wouldn't rely on your graduate GPA to give you much help. To be honest, that grad GPA probably hurts you as adcoms expect graduate GPAs to be inflated. A 3.6 graduate GPA is still below the average matriculant undergrad GPA.

https://www.aamc.org/download/462316/data/mcatguide.pdf#page=10

Your MCAT is above average for matriculants so you just need to work on your uGPA. For MD, you'll probably need to do a year or two of postbac or a SMP. Don't bother with the top 20 medical schools though, they are not really the type for look for reinvented applicants that have 3.0 GPAs.

This is the most BS** advise ever.

 

[bears1992]

This is the most BS** advise ever.

What about it was BS?

 

[795722]

What about it was BS?

Fact that you talking about someone with 513 MCAT not getting any acceptance. Really SDN is so f**** up and tbh this forum is the worse to get an advise. In the real world she will get accepted into several schools but on SDN she won't. I have seen people with worse stats getting in so cut the BS you amateur premed who haven't stepped an inch of skin in med school. I am sick and tired of SDN screwing people's lives with BS advice.

 

[candbgirl]

OP only you can decide if you want to be a doctor And apply accordingly. You have GPAs so low that you might be autoscreened at some of your schools(Harvard? Really)You also have three MCATs so your 513 is nice but it took you three times to get there. You grad GPA is average and will do you no good at MD schools. MD don’t really consider grad GPAs. (DO do consider grad GPAS). You have gotten some very good advice here but you seem reluctant to consider it. If that’s true why did you post looking for advice?

 

[bears1992]

Fact that you talking about someone with 513 MCAT not getting any acceptance. Really SDN is so f**** up and tbh this forum is the worse to get an advise. In the real world she will get accepted into several schools but on SDN she won't. I have seen people with worse stats getting in so cut the BS you amateur premed who haven't stepped an inch of skin in med school. I am sick and tired of SDN screwing people's lives with BS advice.

According to data based on 2014 matriculants, someone with a 3.0 and 513 MCAT has between an 18-30% chance of getting accepted. I do not consider those chances to be good. If OP wants to improve her chances, she should work on her uGPA. increasing her MCAT to a 519+ will still only give her a 40% chance while boosting her GPA to a 3.4 will give her a 58% chance.

It's not about telling someone they shouldn't apply, it's about telling them how likely they are to get in with their stats and how to best improve their chances to get an acceptance. In OPs case, the AAMC data says that she does not have a great chance with a 3.0 and 513 MCAT. So what can OP do to give her a good chance at getting an acceptance based on the GPA and MCAT data? Well she can improve her MCAT which only gives her a little bit of a boost or she can improve her GPA which, according to the data, will give her an above 50% chance of acceptance.

Edit: Also, according to the 2018 adcom survey, GPA has greater importance than MCAT. While a 513 MCAT is great for MD, it still is not considered more important than a great GPA. This data is only for MD schools. OP could probably get into a DO school with her current stats.

 

[Dr. Meliodas]

According to the latest AAMC Table: 3.0 + 513 has a 34.8% chance of receiving one acceptance.
When you look at the older AAMC data for Asian applicants: 3.0 + 513 (34) has about a 30.2% chance of receiving one acceptance.

However, that being said, when taking into account OP's story and ECs (which seem pretty freaking good and unique to me) OP has a good chance at schools that really value service - GW, Drexel, Drew/UCLA, Georgetown.

OP make sure to highlight this in your app (personal Statement or secondary) : Founder of Non-Profit/Work in Nutritional Health for Disadvantaged Population (5000 hours, 3 years).

@Goro would also be able to help add schools to your list.

 

[Goro]

Fact that you talking about someone with 513 MCAT not getting any acceptance. Really SDN is so f**** up and tbh this forum is the worse to get an advise. In the real world she will get accepted into several schools but on SDN she won't. I have seen people with worse stats getting in so cut the BS you amateur premed who haven't stepped an inch of skin in med school. I am sick and tired of SDN screwing people's lives with BS advice.

A 513 score is not an auto-accept into med school. There are numerous threads by people with 4.0 and 517+ who have no accepts.

 

[878956]

@THEBACKANDFORTH -

That's a fair point. However, we also know that adcom no longer want to admit applicants with only stellar stats and no ec's or practical attributes that show he/she can be a compassionate doctor.

Regardless if my numbers are low, if med schools are able to look past the numbers, they will want to hear the story behind the applicant. Those are the schools I am hoping to target (reinvention). I think there is a very interesting story I can share about my personal and professional experiences in various aspects of the healthcare field.

Furthermore, at the end of the day, there is not much I can do to raise my GPA given I have been out of school for so long, it would probably even be mathematically impossible now to focus on my GPA as something to be changed. Rather than trying to show them I am an "A-Grade" applicant, what I actually need to do is convey in my essays how I have overcome this and that the me now is not the same me of then, and I can handle a rigorous medical school curriculum.

With my decent grad GPA and competitive MCAT score, it should at least ease the minds of adcom with that regard. If they are able to get past this and see me as the individual I am, I think there is something to be said about someone with the resiliency and maturity to continue working towards his/her dream despite encountering major setbacks in life.

@Faha - Thank you for your suggestions and additional list of schools. I believe I have already included the east coast schools you listed for me (Albany, NYMC, Quinnipiac, Drexel, Temple, and Jefferson), but will certainly add Seton Hall to the mix as well. Unfortunately, at the moment I am still opposed to applying to DO schools and would like to give MD schools a proper shot before considering DO options. But nonetheless, thank you for your advice.

Actually, you are wrong. The process is more about numbers than ever before! Adcoms like to spew the rigamorole about holistics and getting to know the whole applicant, but that is a lie!!!!
Everyone has a compelling story (****, I was homeless for two years and my mother had a mental disorder). Did not stop most schools from giving me the auto reject. I have a similar MCAT and my uGPA is a 3.8.

I think you should add some DO schools to your lists the same cycle you apply to MD because if you don't get MD then you will have to reapply to DO and compete against a more competitive bunch.

 

[Dr. Meliodas]

Actually, you are wrong. The process is more about numbers than ever before! Adcoms like to spew the rigamorole about holistics and getting to know the whole applicant, but that is a lie!!!!
Everyone has a compelling story (****, I was homeless for two years and my mother had a mental disorder). Did not stop most schools from giving me the auto reject. I have a similar MCAT and my uGPA is a 3.8.

I think you should add some DO schools to your lists the same cycle you apply to MD because if you don't get MD then you will have to reapply to DO and compete against a more competitive bunch.

Sorry just making sure I am understanding things correctly, are you saying you had a 513 MCAT and a 3.8 uGPA and you got auto rejected?

 

[878956]

According to the latest AAMC Table: 3.0 + 513 has a 34.8% chance of receiving one acceptance.
When you look at the older AAMC data for Asian applicants: 3.0 + 513 (34) has about a 30.2% chance of receiving one acceptance.

However, that being said, when taking into account OP's story and ECs (which seem pretty freaking good and unique to me) OP has a good chance at schools that really value service - GW, Drexel, Drew/UCLA, Georgetown.

OP make sure to highlight this in your app (personal Statement or secondary) : Founder of Non-Profit/Work in Nutritional Health for Disadvantaged Population (5000 hours, 3 years).

@Goro would also be able to help add schools to your list.

Sorry just making sure I am understanding things correctly, are you saying you had a 513 MCAT and a 3.8 uGPA and you got auto rejected?

From a lot of school yes.

 

[Dr. Meliodas]

@H20_Jay On what basis are you saying you were auto rejected. What do you mean by auto-reject?

Are you saying you had a 3.8 uGPA and a 3.0 sGPA took a science intensive Masters (like OP) where you held a 3.6 and where screened out?

There are schools where these stats would not be enough and applying to those schools would be donations. However, there are also plenty of schools that reward reinvention and that look well beyond stats when selecting there class. Like I listed above GW, Georgetown, Drexel, and Drew/UCLA are these kind of schools.

Additionally, there are also schools where the 10th percentile sGPA for accepted are bellow a 3.1 these include:
Howard
Rosalind Franklin
Morehouse
Meharry
Mercer
Quinnipiac
Georgetwon
Tulane
NYMC
Loyola
Western Michigan

Schools with 10% sGPA for accepted students bellow 3.2 include
Albany
University of Miami
Drexel
Geisinger
Tufts
Dartmouth

The key thing here is that everything else in your app needs to be strong (Clinical volunteering, non-clinical volunteering, research, shadowing, LOR, AMCAS Personal Statement, Activity Descriptions, and Secondary Essays, strong interview). It seems as OP has done this - if he continues and writes a strong primary and secondary apps and interviews well)

All this being said none of this means OP deserves to get an MD acceptance (no one deserves this regardless of stats, having the opportunity to be a physician is a privilege), but OP has a chance of getting an acceptance if not MD then DO.

 

[ParallelLines]

You should probably take a look at the MSAR to see which schools you can add/remove. From the 2018 AAMC survery, adcoms give little weight to graduate work so I wouldn't rely on your graduate GPA to give you much help. To be honest, that grad GPA probably hurts you as adcoms expect graduate GPAs to be inflated. A 3.6 graduate GPA is still below the average matriculant undergrad GPA.

https://www.aamc.org/download/462316/data/mcatguide.pdf#page=10

Your MCAT is above average for matriculants so you just need to work on your uGPA. For MD, you'll probably need to do a year or two of postbac or a SMP. Don't bother with the top 20 medical schools though, they are not really the type for look for reinvented applicants that have 3.0 GPAs.

I have always found that annoying. Graduate work is supposed to be harder than undergrad/post-bacc and the material similar or the same as what is covered in medical school.

Actually, you are wrong. The process is more about numbers than ever before! Adcoms like to spew the rigamorole about holistics and getting to know the whole applicant, but that is a lie!!!!
Everyone has a compelling story (****, I was homeless for two years and my mother had a mental disorder). Did not stop most schools from giving me the auto reject. I have a similar MCAT and my uGPA is a 3.8.

I think you should add some DO schools to your lists the same cycle you apply to MD because if you don't get MD then you will have to reapply to DO and compete against a more competitive bunch.

Yeah I'm not sure if you're trolling or just not telling us the whole story. A 90th percentile MCAT and 3.8 GPA is interview material at the majority of MD programs provided that the rest of your application is solid.

I will echo what you and others have said about OP applying to lower tier MD schools as well as DO. Fwiw, my application was actually pretty similar to her's w/ the differences being a higher graduate GPA and not as good ECs.

To the OP, forget about Harvard, Columbia, etc. You have next to no chance against the 100s of other Asians applying with 4.0/518+ MCATs. Stats wise you probably have a shot at schools like Rosy F, Penn State, Drexel, Cooper, Cal Northstate, etc. I don't know too much about schools that value service since my application wasn't geared like that, but the MSAR has a very good summary of every school's mission (something I completely overlooked when I applied).

In terms of DO, I think you would have a strong chance at most of the high tier DO schools like PCOM, MWU (AZCOM, CCOM), Rocky Vista, etc. Rowan will love your application since you're a NJ resident and they value service above all else. It doesn't hurt to throw a few mid/low tier ones in just for safety such as the Touros, NYIT, ACOM. I would avoid the new DO schools that have yet to graduate a class. Good luck.