Advice for Choosing Post Bac (Career Changer) Schools and Essay Advice

[Caesar1108]

Hi everyone,

First time poster here. I've been browsing this forum for a while, which I have found to be a tremendous resource, and I'm just about to get started with my applications, so I'm hoping I could get some more tailored advice for my situation.

I am currently a senior and a Government major at an Ivy League university, with a rather poor GPA of 3.01. I decided I wanted to become a doctor my junior year. I was the typical overachieving, overworked student in HS (GPA 3.8/4.5, SAT 2270), but finally having some freedom in college, I fell in with the wrong people and spent my first few years involved with some hard partying/drugs that eventually left me physically and mentally broken down. The recovery process from this ordeal, along with close family suffering from significant medical problems, led me to consider a medical career. I entered college dreaming of helping people as a lawyer, leaving, I decided I wanted to help people through a career in medicine.

I am fully committed to my new career direction, and I am determined to get into the best post-bac I can so I can fulfill this ambition. My academic record is definitely flawed: there are a few C's and a D- (in a language class). There is an upward trend, including a 3.5 last spring, but this semester I only managed a 3.0. On the positive note, I have taken Introductory Biology (a fantastic experience which reaffirmed my decision) and Neurobiology, and managed A-'s in both, so I know I can handle hard science classes if I put my mind to it. I am volunteering as an EMT and I also hope to volunteer at a free clinic next semester.

I am looking to get into a supportive, full-time Post-Bac program with small class sizes. From what I have gathered on this forum, Bryn Mawr, Goucher and Brandeis would fit the bill for me, but I am worried my academic record may not be competitive enough for them. I am looking at programs at Scripps, JHU and Temple as well. I am also considering applications to HES, Penn, Columbia, Tufts, NYU and UVA as "back ups" as well, as they are (reputedly) less competitive for admissions, although I am hoping to avoid taking classes with undergraduates. Based on my academic record and my experiences, what schools will I have the best chances with? Also, should I include my past history with partying/drugs on my application, as it is a big part of the reason I chose to become a doctor, or is it something better left unsaid?

Thanks for reading and I appreciate any advice and pointers you could throw at me.

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In summary:

Overachieving HS student gets involved with drugs and alcohol in college, ends up developing health problems, decides to become doctor due to this experience and also medical problems in family. Should I "sanitize" this story for applications/interviews or be as genuine as possible?

Stats:
High School
GPA 3.8/4.5 weighted
SAT 2270

College (currently a senior at an elite university)
GPA 3.01 - generally an upward trend
Government Major
A- in Intro Bio
Experience as EMT, volunteer at free clinic

Looking for full time (preferably 1 year but doesn't matter) career changer Post-Bac program with small class sizes that are not with undergraduates, but will settle for the program with the best reputation. What are my chances/best bets? I would also appreciate any information on the specific programs.

Top Choices: Bryn Mawr, Goucher, Brandeis, Temple, Scripps
Also looking at: Tufts, JHU, Columbia, HES, Penn, NYU, UVA
Safety: Rutgers (near home)

Thanks again.

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[Futurenobelwin]

You're on the bubble for Goucher/Bryn Mawr. You probably could get into to most of the others. You want to apply now? Not great that your last semester was so-so. Being from an Ivy will help (although how much depends on which one), and your SAT is very good, but the grades will scare them. I wouldn't sanitize the story about why you want to become a doctor.

I would think your best bet is to do great academically in the spring, spend some time volunteering/working directly in a health-related field, then apply.

 

[deleted248403]

You're on the bubble for Goucher/Bryn Mawr.

What? With a cGPA of 3.01? You must be joking

You probably could get into to most of the others. You want to apply now? Not great that your last semester was so-so. Being from an Ivy will help (although how much depends on which one), and your SAT is very good, but the grades will scare them.

A shot at most of the others - but certainly not a guarantee apart from maybe HES and thats cos they accept everyone. And being from an Ivy is meaningless - undergrad university plays very little role in med school or most post-bac admissions. The argument of "a B at an Ivy is equivalent to an A everywhere else" just isn't true - in fact, if you are at some of the Ivy's well known for grade inflation then actually having a B average is probably even more damning.

OP - HS is irrelevant except from the SAT which is probably your last standardized test.

I suggest your backups or 2nd tier schools are probably more within your range than the top choices you listed. I would concentrate on those and throw out hail-marys to the top tier programs.

 

[henge]

And being from an Ivy is meaningless - undergrad university plays very little role in med school or most post-bac admissions.

I don't think this is true for top post-baccs. Look at Bryn Mawr's listing of where their students came from: The top 5 feeders are all Ivies and the next 5 are all in the top 10 USNWR rankings for national universities or in the top 5 for USNWR rankings for LACs. http://www.brynmawr.edu/postbac/program_facts_undergraduate.shtml

Hopkins and Goucher also get a lot of students from top undergrad schools.
http://web.jhu.edu/post_bac/program/students/
http://www.goucher.edu/x20303.xml

Without seeing who applied, of course, you can't draw firm conclusions, but it's hard to believe BM, especially, does not give a strong preference to students from top schools.

That said OP's GPA is pretty low. Still, if you don't apply, you definitely won't get in, so the sooner the better.

 

[Caesar1108]

A shot at most of the others - but certainly not a guarantee apart from maybe HES and thats cos they accept everyone. And being from an Ivy is meaningless - undergrad university plays very little role in med school or most post-bac admissions. The argument of "a B at an Ivy is equivalent to an A everywhere else" just isn't true - in fact, if you are at some of the Ivy's well known for grade inflation then actually having a B average is probably even more damning.

I suggest your backups or 2nd tier schools are probably more within your range than the top choices you listed. I would concentrate on those and throw out hail-marys to the top tier programs.

Yea, I agree that Goucher and Bryn Mawr may be a stretch, but the fact that they have small, focused programs tailored directly for post-bacs is a big plus for me - so I guess might as well throw up those hail mary passes. Would anyone happen to know of any programs that are similarly supportive, but perhaps not as competitive? Brandeis looks like a very attractive program for me, does anyone know how competitive it is for admissions?

Btw, I'm from an Ivy that is NOT known for its grade inflation - quite the opposite actually. Most pre-med students with a 3.4 and above here have successfully been accepted to med school.

You're on the bubble for Goucher/Bryn Mawr. You probably could get into to most of the others. You want to apply now? Not great that your last semester was so-so. Being from an Ivy will help (although how much depends on which one), and your SAT is very good, but the grades will scare them. I wouldn't sanitize the story about why you want to become a doctor.

I would think your best bet is to do great academically in the spring, spend some time volunteering/working directly in a health-related field, then apply.

Thanks for your encouragement. I got a little too ambitious this semester and ended up overloading myself with 22 credits and an EMT course at night. I really don't want to wait another year or so to apply, but I do plan on having a strong semester in the spring, and getting more volunteer experience. Would benefits do you think I could get from applying later rather than now?

 

[betterlate]

In summary:

Overachieving HS student gets involved with drugs and alcohol in college, ends up developing health problems, decides to become doctor due to this experience and also medical problems in family. Should I "sanitize" this story for applications/interviews or be as genuine as possible?

.

Unfortunately, I have to agree with the posters who indicated that your GPA makes you an unlikely candidate for the top career changer programs (Goucher, BM, etc), where I think the unofficial GPA cutoff is >3.5. Submit an application anyway; even if you're rejected, you're no worse off than if you hadn't submitted an application, so what do you have to lose?

Re: the story of drugs and alcohol, it's a tough call. Although your experience played a pivotal role in your decision to enter the field of medicine, substance abuse is a huge red flag that you should think twice about waving in any application.

Years ago, my mom gave me some great advice about applications and interviews: a school/employer is sifting through a massive pile of applications that often look pretty similar. To make their decision easier, they're effectively looking for reasons NOT to hire/accept you. Don't give them one!

Unless your history of substance abuse is documented in a way that must be reported in the application (e.g. criminal record), then don't address it in your personal statement. (That would give them an additional reason, beyond your GPA, to reject w/o an interview.) If you get an interview, THEN you can decide how much of your history to disclose. Sensitive topics may be better received in person vs on paper, depending on how you present it. Do NOT go into an interview without first planning out if/how to talk about your substance abuse, and if at all possible, practice the conversation in a mock interview with the premed advisor at your alma mater. That will give you the best chance of being calm, professional, and articulate during the real interview.

Unsolicited advice from a stranger on the internet: feel free to skip. I've seen several colleagues (all of whom were in recovery) struggle with substance abuse and/or eating disorders once they were in the high-stress environments of premed postbaccs and medical school. Some went so far as to drop out because they felt they couldn't do what they needed to do to stay sober while simultaneously succeeding in school (and obviously sobriety was their top priority). Be aware that these intense academic environments may bring up some issues that you haven't had to deal with in a long time, and be sure to set up whatever supports you need to manage that stress before it becomes a problem. /unsolicited advice

Good luck in your endeavors!

 

[Caesar1108]

Re: the story of drugs and alcohol, it's a tough call. Although your experience played a pivotal role in your decision to enter the field of medicine, substance abuse is a huge red flag that you should think twice about waving in any application.

Years ago, my mom gave me some great advice about applications and interviews: a school/employer is sifting through a massive pile of apps looking for reasons NOT to hire/accept you. Don't give them one!

Yea, I am definitely wavering on what I should do regarding my past substance abuse history. I was really only seriously involved with drug/alcohol problems my freshman year of college - I was generally straight edge before, and I went a little overboard my freshman year due to my naivete. I ended up having cardiac problems, along with anxiety, stress and other issues due to my idiocy. I spent the rest of my college career recovering from my health issues and struggling to relearn the proper study habits in order to stay afloat in the cutthroat environment that is my university. In many ways I'm still a work in progress.

Unless your history of substance abuse is documented in a way that must be reported in the application (e.g. criminal record), then don't address it in your personal statement. (That would give them an additional reason, beyond your GPA, to reject w/o an interview.) If you get an interview, THEN you can decide how much of your history to disclose. Sensitive topics may be better received in person vs on paper, depending on how you present it. Do NOT go into an interview without first planning out if/how to talk about your substance abuse, and if at all possible, practice the conversation in a mock interview with the premed advisor at your alma mater. That will give you the best chance of being calm, professional, and articulate during the real interview.

I really haven't opened up to anyone about my past except on the internet, so I definitely will try and work with my advisers to find the best possible angle for my story. I think I definitely will make my experience a big focus on my applications to the "top tier" programs - after all, I have nothing to lose, high risk = high reward. I think my drug history and health problems "explains" my poor grades and my SAT scores and more recent grades show that I do have academic potential. For the programs that are less of a reach, I will probably minimize or not mention this part of my past and hope that my transcript on its own will be good enough to get me in.

Unsolicited advice from a stranger on the internet: feel free to skip. I've seen several colleagues (all of whom were in recovery) struggle with substance abuse and/or eating disorders once they were in the high-stress environments of premed postbaccs and medical school. Some went so far as to drop out because they felt they couldn't do what they needed to do to stay sober while simultaneously succeeding in school (and obviously sobriety was their top priority). Be aware that these intense academic environments may bring up some issues that you haven't had to deal with in a long time, and be sure to set up whatever supports you need to manage that stress before it becomes a problem. /unsolicited advice

Thanks for the advice. I am absolutely focused in my dedication to pursue a medical career - and if there was anything my struggles throughout college taught me, it was how to handle stressful environments, haha.

 

[drizzt3117]

When I was at Scripps the average GPA of accepted applicants was about 3.7. Pedigree does matter, but a lot of really good candidates were turned down; I remember a guy who went to Harvard ug and HLS who didn't get in with great stats, it's just tough.