Anesthesia Side Hustles

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DM27

DM27

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Does anyone have any insight into decent supplemental income as an MD in general or as an MD in Anesthesiology?

Locums or moonlighting is not something my schedule would allow so it’s more non clinical work. I’ve signed up for some medicolegal stuff but the opportunities seem infrequent at best.

I’ve gone through the examples on blogs like WCI and PassiveIncomeMD and was wondering if anyone else had any input.
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Real Estate (can be risky).
Investor in a startup business (riskier).

These are the two supplemental incomes I have in my porfolio. Both are passive in the sense that I put very little effort into them per year. It does require a little bit of paperwork.
Goal is to retire with passive incomes that are self sustaining.
 
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I've always wondered how far concierge doctors can go.

Like if Michael Jackson or Heath Ledger had a concierge anesthesiologist, they'd be alive.

The problem comes with the ethics and monetizing it. Like i didn't go to med school so some druggy could do drugs safely, but there seems like there could be a market for it.
 
Lurch said:
Dealing fentanyl pays well I’m sure.

Too soon?
Click to expand...

it wasn't dealing fentanyl that got them in trouble, it was specifically dealing the spray type while taking kick backs. 🙂, regular fentanyl is ok.
 
Falls into the realm of clinical, but if there are any contract research organizations doing drug trials in your area, the one I used to work for paid 3 anesthesiologists 8k a day (4 hours) total to monitor sedation when remimazolam/midazolam were being tested. 75% of the time the subject was getting placebo anyway, so they got paid like ~$675/hr to make small talk with people that were bummed they didn't get the good stuff.
 
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dchz said:
I've always wondered how far concierge doctors can go.

Like if Michael Jackson or Heath Ledger had a concierge anesthesiologist, they'd be alive.

The problem comes with the ethics and monetizing it. Like i didn't go to med school so some druggy could do drugs safely, but there seems like there could be a market for it.
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There are already some cities talking about having “safe injection facilities” so depending on the political climate of the city the ethical question is slowly disappearing. I mean it’s not that much different from the “Hangover MDs” in Vegas
 
How much cash would one have to accrue to make an investment to get around 8% return to go part time?

Vague question I know
 
acidbase1 said:
How much cash would one have to accrue to make an investment to get around 8% return to go part time?

Vague question I know
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It's not a vague question; it's a nonsense question.

There is no amount of cash that magically opens a door with safe 8% returns behind it, that you can count on to be there month-to-month to finance an early retirement.

In general, I don't like to make predictions, but here's one I'd bet my house on: a lot of people whose only experience with investing has been the extraordinary 2009-now bull market are going to lose a lot of money in the next 10 years, doing the same dumb stuff they've been doing since 2009, but getting away with because a rising tide lifts all boats. You can tell who they are because they talk about stock picking and 10% returns like they're normal for anybody who "knows that they're doing" ...
 
There was a day pre-2009 where savings accounts had 3 % APY. 3 million dollars in one of those accounts returned 90k a year which you can definitely live on. Sadly those days are long gone

The best thing anyone can do now, as a physician, is
1) Buy a modest home in a decent cost of living area
2) AVOID Divorce
3) Save whatever money you can
 
Echo "Avoid Divorce". Better yet, don't get married or if you do, sign a rock solid prenup. There is nothing more financially devastating to a high income wage earner than divorce. That can radically alter your asset and retirement landscape. Planned on retiring at 60? Try 75 after that big D with a much lower standard of living. I love how people like to talk about their personal "strategy" to avoiding divorce, as if you're making all the decisions. You're only 50% of the marriage. People change and people grow apart, tis the nature of life and love and If that other person decides to split at any point in time, there's absolutely nothing that you can do about it and if you are the high wage earner, you are the only one that suffers in that scenario with most current divorce laws. If you happen to not live in a no fault divorce state, then prepare to pony up even more.
 
I remember my Orange ING savings account had a rate of 5% in 2007. Incredible to think about now.
 
btbam said:
I remember my Orange ING savings account had a rate of 5% in 2007. Incredible to think about now.
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It's really wild. You could actually conservatively save money and get a return on your investment. Now, you're better off keeping your money in your checking account.

In all seriousness, if you look at the Dow trends over long periods of time, it always trends up. Yes it will dip but the trend is always up. If you stick blue chips or whatever follows the Dow, your money will always be there.
 
I served as an expert witness for a defendant once. It was an educational and insightful experience and also paid very well. The jury gave a defense verdict. I would recommend doing it at least once for any anesthesiologist. The system needs smart, honest people who are not professional experts.
 
See if there are any bio-tech or medical device companies in your area. The will regularly have focus groups seeking input on new products. I’ve been doing this semi-regularly for the last year or so. Usually pays around $400/hr.
 
I have a few friends that are on "advisory panels" for various companies. Gets them an extra +$100k per year....but you probably have to sell your soul
 
sleepallday said:
I have a few friends that are on "advisory panels" for various companies. Gets them an extra +$100k per year....but you probably have to sell your soul
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Bart only got $5.

screen-shot-2011-12-08-at-1-00-52-pm.png
 
Groove said:
Echo "Avoid Divorce". Better yet, don't get married or if you do, sign a rock solid prenup. There is nothing more financially devastating to a high income wage earner than divorce. That can radically alter your asset and retirement landscape. Planned on retiring at 60? Try 75 after that big D with a much lower standard of living. I love how people like to talk about their personal "strategy" to avoiding divorce, as if you're making all the decisions. You're only 50% of the marriage. People change and people grow apart, tis the nature of life and love and If that other person decides to split at any point in time, there's absolutely nothing that you can do about it and if you are the high wage earner, you are the only one that suffers in that scenario with most current divorce laws. If you happen to not live in a no fault divorce state, then prepare to pony up even more.
Click to expand...
Or marry rich.

Seriously: I saw gas MD opening acupuncture salon. Advertised to improve skin tone, sleep, wellness, and fertility etc.
 
sleepallday said:
I have a few friends that are on "advisory panels" for various companies. Gets them an extra +$100k per year....but you probably have to sell your soul
Click to expand...

I have an ortho friend who makes about 250k a year consulting on top of his ortho salary. It is ridiculous but he definitely figured out how to play the game.


I tried to do some consulting stuff in the past but it never went anywhere. If you wanted to do stuff for drug companies you needed to be one of their top prescribers and I wasn’t about to write narc scripts just to land some company speaking gig.
 
Twiggidy said:
It's really wild. You could actually conservatively save money and get a return on your investment. Now, you're better off keeping your money in your checking account.

In all seriousness, if you look at the Dow trends over long periods of time, it always trends up. Yes it will dip but the trend is always up. If you stick blue chips or whatever follows the Dow, your money will always be there.
Click to expand...

I'm always amazed when people think a high interest rate in a savings account means something when inflation is also high. 2007 had a US CPI of 4.08% so getting 5% or even close in a savings account just wasn't that impressive. I mean it might have felt nice seeing the interest added to the account, it's just that the similar loss of purchasing power eroding from it was invisible.

When saving money, it's only the real rate of return that matters (nominal-inflation). As a general rule of thumb, no savings account or CD is going to provide you with much real return. The nominal return will ebb and flow similar to inflation. So when the interest rate gets really high and you feel good, it's likely because inflation is creeping up higher and erasing those gains.
 
Thursday has a reopening of the 5 year TIPs that was first auctioned in April of this year. Real rate of return should be about 0.8% (based on Friday close). Best for tax deferred accounts. The highest yield this maturity has seen for a long time. Plan to throw a chunk of IRA money at it. Least dirty shirt at the safe fixed income laundry.
 
Mman said:
I'm always amazed when people think a high interest rate in a savings account means something when inflation is also high. 2007 had a US CPI of 4.08% so getting 5% or even close in a savings account just wasn't that impressive. I mean it might have felt nice seeing the interest added to the account, it's just that the similar loss of purchasing power eroding from it was invisible.

When saving money, it's only the real rate of return that matters (nominal-inflation). As a general rule of thumb, no savings account or CD is going to provide you with much real return. The nominal return will ebb and flow similar to inflation. So when the interest rate gets really high and you feel good, it's likely because inflation is creeping up higher and erasing those gains.
Click to expand...

I get where you're coming from, but in the simplistic and frugal sense, if I had 3 million in an account that gave me even 3% return, I wouldn't have to go to work tomorrow...or the next day. First I need to find that 3 million dollars though.
 
Twiggidy said:
I get where you're coming from, but in the simplistic and frugal sense, if I had 3 million in an account that gave me even 3% return, I wouldn't have to go to work tomorrow...or the next day. First I need to find that 3 million dollars though.
Click to expand...

But that's the thing, if inflation was 5% per year you'd basically be losing 2% per year in terms of purchasing power and that ignores the principal you removed.
 
Twiggidy said:
I get where you're coming from, but in the simplistic and frugal sense, if I had 3 million in an account that gave me even 3% return, I wouldn't have to go to work tomorrow...or the next day. First I need to find that 3 million dollars though.
Click to expand...
A 3% sustained withdrawal rate (SWR), which accounts for inflation, is very likely attainable and sustainable forever, barring global thermonuclear war. I.e. if you find your $3M you could safely count on taking out $90K/year, inflation adjusted, forever, given a reasonable and conservative asset allocation.

(Probably. Some people argue that 2% or 2.5% are the new 4% when it comes to SWR.)
 
pgg said:
A 3% sustained withdrawal rate (SWR), which accounts for inflation, is very likely attainable and sustainable forever, barring global thermonuclear war. I.e. if you find your $3M you could safely count on taking out $90K/year, inflation adjusted, forever, given a reasonable and conservative asset allocation.

(Probably. Some people argue that 2% or 2.5% are the new 4% when it comes to SWR.)
Click to expand...


Agree.

2.5 as a SWR would be extremely conservative, haven’t seem many advocating going that low. At that point, You'd be better off buying an annuity that will pay you 5-6% of your principle and you can live 3x better. (Or use some portion of your nest egg to annuitize).
 
pgg said:
A 3% sustained withdrawal rate (SWR), which accounts for inflation, is very likely attainable and sustainable forever, barring global thermonuclear war. I.e. if you find your $3M you could safely count on taking out $90K/year, inflation adjusted, forever, given a reasonable and conservative asset allocation.

(Probably. Some people argue that 2% or 2.5% are the new 4% when it comes to SWR.)
Click to expand...

But that 3% SWR is in a portfolio of equities and bonds, probably on the order of 50% to 70% equities which will generate a return far greater than any savings account can provide.

3% is not sustainable if drawing it out of a savings account. People should not feel good about getting a 3% interest rate on their savings account and expecting it to provide income lasting forever which is what that post was referring to.
 
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Mman said:
But that 3% SWR is in a portfolio of equities and bonds, probably on the order of 50% to 70% equities which will generate a return far greater than any savings account can provide.

3% is not sustainable if drawing it out of a savings account. People should not feel good about getting a 3% interest rate on their savings account and expecting it to provide income lasting forever which is what that post was referring to.
Click to expand...
Yes, totally agree, that's why I said a "reasonable and conservative asset allocation" ... 100% fixed income won't do it. 🙂
 
I just wanna echo the "AVOID divorce" part. I was out fishing yesterday with an ortho buddy who's in the middle of a divorce. He was telling me that poof, 1/2 of his net worth is gone (and 1/2 was still into the 7 figures). That doesn't even factor in the future lost earnings from alimony, etc. He was joking that the 250K he has into his boat was the best money he ever wasted 'cuz if ti was still in the bank then 1/2 would be gone anyways.

Remember the rule of 1's:

You get:
1 Good Job
1 Wife
1 Mortgage
1 Expensive hobby
Maximally fund your 401K

Do all the above and you'll be fine financially.
 
SaltyDog said:
I just wanna echo the "AVOID divorce" part. I was out fishing yesterday with an ortho buddy who's in the middle of a divorce. He was telling me that poof, 1/2 of his net worth is gone (and 1/2 was still into the 7 figures). That doesn't even factor in the future lost earnings from alimony, etc. He was joking that the 250K he has into his boat was the best money he ever wasted 'cuz if ti was still in the bank then 1/2 would be gone anyways.

Remember the rule of 1's:

You get:
1 Good Job
1 Wife
1 Mortgage
1 Expensive hobby
Maximally fund your 401K

Do all the above and you'll be fine financially.
Click to expand...

The only problem with that list is most people come out of residency with 2 mortgages. It’s just that one of them hangs on the wall in their office
 
Twiggidy said:
The application box to NYU will be overflowing this year
Click to expand...
They are clever. They just ensured they'll get their pick of the absolute best applicants in the country. People will be turning down Harvard, Duke, etc to go there.

I wonder how they're funding this.
 
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