Any of you prescribing ivermectin?

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GeneralVeers said:
Agreed holding it for the long term. I consider it gambling. I might lose all or most of it, but the potential to make 10X on the original amount is huge if Lucid is a success.

Just got a new Tesla S (with the wacky steering wheel) but I definitely would have gotten Lucid if it was available as I think the design and branding are better.
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Thought you said something about potentially losing your job
 
namethatsmell said:
This concern is a big reason why Lucid may break out from the rest of the pack. Their range off a single charge is better than any other EV -- up to 520 miles per the EPA. And with their tech it takes 20 mins of charging to yield 300mi of range.
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LCID was up 10% today, but it generally has big ups and downs. I've seen the range figures, but they have yet to actually put the car into production. QC on the battery cells might limit real world range. We will see how they do. I'm hopeful because we need a good EV competitor.
 
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I looked up supercharging sites and I would hate to get there and have to wait.
 
GeneralVeers said:
LCID was up 10% today, but it generally has big ups and downs. I've seen the range figures, but they have yet to actually put the car into production. QC on the battery cells might limit real world range. We will see how they do. I'm hopeful because we need a good EV competitor.
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I doubt competition in the EV market is going to be a problem. Everyone and their grandmother is trying to manufacture EVs now. Ford already has a huge waitlist for their F150 lightning.

The bigger companies like Toyota or Honda will likely have the added advantage of not having the production shortages that Tesla has had forever,
Chip shortage not withstanding.

Since Tesla hasn’t exactly cornered the market on EVs like say apple did with the smartphone, they’re going to get smoked by the competition.
 
bravotwozero said:
I doubt competition in the EV market is going to be a problem. Everyone and their grandmother is trying to manufacture EVs now. Ford already has a huge waitlist for their F150 lightning.

The bigger companies like Toyota or Honda will likely have the added advantage of not having the production shortages that Tesla has had forever,
Chip shortage not withstanding.

Since Tesla hasn’t exactly cornered the market on EVs like say apple did with the smartphone, they’re going to get smoked by the competition.
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I hope you are right. Tesla's only choice is to raise the bar on quality and interior fit/finish or they will be destroyed. Their main is technology, and their EV powertrain is unbeatable at the moment. I considered the Taycan as well, but for $105,000 base price it didn't make much sense. In typical Porsche fashion they make you buy "packages" just to get a few features you want, and reasonably optioned was over $120K. Likewise the new Mercedes EQS, which should be competition starts at over 100K for a relatively low-performing, single motor version.
 
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GeneralVeers said:
LCID was up 10% today, but it generally has big ups and downs. I've seen the range figures, but they have yet to actually put the car into production. QC on the battery cells might limit real world range. We will see how they do. I'm hopeful because we need a good EV competitor.
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Too much going on today to see it dipped below 24.5, might have bought more then. Suspect a pop coming next week.
 
namethatsmell said:
Too much going on today to see it dipped below 24.5, might have bought more then. Suspect a pop coming next week.
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I wouldn't buy over 25, literally just two weeks ago it was 17. It likes to go from 20 to 26 every month or two, then it comes back down.

Even buying LEAP call options only gives you 2-1 leverage, the 20 strike call option expiring 1/2023 sells for 11 bucks (meaning you make money if the stock ends > 31 by 1/2023), and the first available 3-1 leverage LEAP call option is the 27 strike call option, which sells for 8.29.

Anyway as a speculative stock it's not a bad one. Make it 2-4% of your portfolio sounds reasonable. Or more if you like to gamble vegas style.

Sure is an active, high implied volatility stock. The Oct expiry has over 100,000 contracts (puts and calls) outstanding with implied volatilities > 100% for most strikes.
 
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Re: LCID, if anyone is into writing puts as a means to acquire stock (which is a very good way)...the Oct 15 21.00 put has a bid of 0.71.

What that means is if you sell one contract, you get $71 up front for you to keep. No matter what. You never give it back. Yours to keep forever. If LCID ends up < 21.00 by October 15, you are required to buy 100 shares of LCID at 21.00 (meaning you have to have or keep about $2100 collateral in your account). That is a legal obligation you can't get out of it.

But if LCID ends >= 21.00, then you keep the $71.00. What this means is that if the option expires worthless, you have set aside $2100 to make $71 in about 3 weeks time. That represents a 3.4% return on your investment or capital. (0.71 / 21.00 = 0.034). That's pretty darn good. If you do that three times a year, you will have made about 10% return. That more or less beats the S&P.

Incidentally, Black-Sholes Model theory suggests that the probability of assignment (meaning you have to buy 100 shares) of the above put option is 18%. 18% of the time you are buying stock, 82% of the time you are not. 100% of the time you get to keep $71. It's remarkable how closely theory parallels real life statistics.
 
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thegenius said:
Re: LCID, if anyone is into writing puts as a means to acquire stock (which is a very good way)...the Oct 15 21.00 put has a bid of 0.71.

What that means is if you sell one contract, you get $71 up front for you to keep. No matter what. You never get it back. If LCID ends up < 21.00 by October 15, you are required to buy 100 shares of LCID at 21.00 (meaning you have to have or keep about $2100 collateral in your account). That is a legal obligation you can't get out of it.

But if LCID ends >= 21.00, then you keep the $71.00. What this means is that if the option expires worthless, you have set aside $2100 to make $71 in about 3 weeks time. That represents a 3.4% return on your investment or capital. (0.71 / 21.00 = 0.034). That's pretty darn good. If you do that three times a year, you will have made about 10% return. That more or less beats the S&P return.

Incidentally, Black-Sholes Model theory suggests that the probability of assignment (meaning you have to buy 100 shares) of the above put option is 18%. 18% of the time you are buying stock, 82% of the time you are not. 100% of the time you get to keep $71. It's remarkable how closely theory parallels real life statistics.
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Theta gang!

By the way, you aren't necessarily legally obligated to buy shares with a put, as long as you buy to close before the expiration date.
 
Siggy said:
Theta gang!

By the way, you aren't necessarily legally obligated to buy shares with a put, as long as you buy to close before the expiration date.
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Thetagang indeed!

And you are right...you can definitely close your position before expiration and make a fraction (50%, 75%, etc) of your initial credit. But since this is an MD forum and not an investing forum, I chose not to mention that.

If LCID goes to 23 or maybe a little lower, I very well just might write some put options on it. I own 300 shares and I'm OK adding more to it. Maybe a little more.
 
thegenius said:
Thetagang indeed!

And you are right...you can definitely close your position before expiration and make a fraction (50%, 75%, etc) of your initial credit. But since this is an MD forum and not an investing forum, I chose not to mention that.
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If I'm making any serious money off of a specific option (not, say, $10 for a Ford weekly), I'll normally close out at $5. First, I can always turn around and resell a covered call at a higher strike price, second I've seen some of my calls go from worthless on Wednesday to closing in the money on Friday.
 
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Siggy said:
If I'm making any serious money off of a specific option (not, say, $10 for a Ford weekly), I'll normally close out at $5. First, I can always turn around and resell a covered call at a higher strike price, second I've seen some of my calls go from worthless on Wednesday to closing in the money on Friday.
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Yea especially good idea for high IV stocks (e.g. LCID) ....those prices can move quickly.
 
BoardingDoc said:
Anyone still curious about ivermectin?
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Now that people have been threatened with sanctions by their medical board for considering Ivermectin, how much bias will that introduce in the current research ongoing on the use of Ivermectin in COVID?

Let's say you're running a trial on ivermectin. It's a randomized, double blinded, placebo controlled trial. You've heard that you're a quack if you prescribe ivermectin, talk about it, espouse it or even have an open mind about it. Everyone that think it works, might work or could work possibly maybe in a million years, is a pariah. You're expecting your trial to be negative, because of all the chatter.

Then, your results come in, and they're strongly positive. What do you do? Do you publish? Do you feel free to publish? Do you start questioning the results, go back and "take another look," perhaps considering ways to "look differently at the data?" Do you start wondering about the consequences of publishing a positive study? Will you be looked at as a quack? Will your future work be questioned?

Is it even possible, for ivermectin to get a "fair trial" at this point, so to speak?
 
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BoardingDoc said:
Ivermectin --> Boosters --> Car analogy --> Lucid --> Stock options.

Anyone still curious about ivermectin? Or has this thread run its course?
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Here in SC MUSC has started an ivermectin clinical trial. If anyone asks about it I give them the handout for the clinical trial and let them go from there.
 
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Birdstrike said:
Is it even possible, for ivermectin to get a "fair trial" at this point, so to speak?
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No. It kills parasites by acting on invertebrate nerve and muscle cell membrane permeability. SARS-CoV-2 is a virus. Ivermectin as a treatment for COVID-19 lost the basic trial of credibility based upon its mechanism of action.

I understand your argument though, which is valid. Bias is everywhere and heavily affects all studies.

The prevention for a virus that eventually will infect everyone is general health and a competent immune system. The temporary cure is supportive care. The ultimate cure and antidote will utilize a specific antiviral mechanism of action. It won’t be just a drug that when given at high enough doses kills everything.
 
GeneralVeers said:
I hope you are right. Tesla's only choice is to raise the bar on quality and interior fit/finish or they will be destroyed. Their main is technology, and their EV powertrain is unbeatable at the moment. I considered the Taycan as well, but for $105,000 base price it didn't make much sense. In typical Porsche fashion they make you buy "packages" just to get a few features you want, and reasonably optioned was over $120K. Likewise the new Mercedes EQS, which should be competition starts at over 100K for a relatively low-performing, single motor version.
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Their tech and supply chain gap is huge ATM. They get ~30% more range for battery size then the competitors which equals lower costs. They have huge investments in battery tech and battery manufacturing that will continue to keep their costs/cell down. Currently I can get a Model 3 for 52k that smokes a M3 (3.7 vs. 4.1s 0-60, and the difference is even more drastic in everyday use looking at 0-30 time).

Agreed their fit/finish needs work, but personally I like their interiors compared to the entry level BMWs or other luxury cars, much less busy. Obviously can't compete with S-class and the like. Always rooting for more competition though.
 
Birdstrike said:
Now that people have been threatened with sanctions by their medical board for considering Ivermectin, how much bias will that introduce in the current research ongoing on the use of Ivermectin in COVID?

Let's say you're running a trial on ivermectin. It's a randomized, double blinded, placebo controlled trial. You've heard that you're a quack if you prescribe ivermectin, talk about it, espouse it or even have an open mind about it. Everyone that think it works, might work or could work possibly maybe in a million years, is a pariah. You're expecting your trial to be negative, because of all the chatter.

Then, your results come in, and they're strongly positive. What do you do? Do you publish? Do you feel free to publish? Do you start questioning the results, go back and "take another look," perhaps considering ways to "look differently at the data?" Do you start wondering about the consequences of publishing a positive study? Will you be looked at as a quack? Will your future work be questioned?

Is it even possible, for ivermectin to get a "fair trial" at this point, so to speak?
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As we all know, any study can be picked apart in some way or another. But, if its a reasonably well designed study that shows benefit I would hope it gets published without too much trouble. I would say that I also hope they would be much more thorough and deliberate than usual for something like this to minimize that sort of thing.
 
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VA Hopeful Dr said:
As we all know, any study can be picked apart in some way or another. But, if its a reasonably well designed study that shows benefit I would hope it gets published without too much trouble. I would say that I also hope they would be much more thorough and deliberate than usual for something like this to minimize that sort of thing.
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Getting published is one thing. People accepting a new finding, even if accurate and true, would be entirely something else.

For all the talk of “evidence based medicine being superior to dogma,” once dogma is established, which can sometimes happen in a matter of days, it can sometimes take decades to reverse, even with clear evidence.

You really think the “smart people” would be so quick to admit they were wrong, change course and start recommending a new standard of care?
 
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Birdstrike said:
Getting published is one thing. People accepting it, even if accurate and true, would be entirely something else.

You really think the “smart people” would be so quick to admit they were wrong, change course and start recommending a new standard of care?
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Maybe?

I'm pretty anti-ivermectin at the moment, but if a halfway decent trial comes up saying it helps I'll likely change my practice. Looks like lots of different places are looking into this. If several reputable places all have positive results, that should count for something.
 
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VA Hopeful Dr said:
Maybe?

I'm pretty anti-ivermectin at the moment, but if a halfway decent trial comes up saying it helps I'll likely change my practice. Looks like lots of different places are looking into this. If several reputable places all have positive results, that should count for something.
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No frickin’ way, if even two or a hundred studies are positive, are the “smart people” going to reverse their threats of sanctioning people, and all of a sudden admit they were dead wrong. No frickin’ way. They’ll hum, they’ll haw, they say, “Well, but uh…we..uh…hrrum…hrrum…have other better treatments now, such as …. and ….blah blah, such that we don’t have to prescribe HORSE MEDICINE, to people after all.”
 
@Birdstrike Why are you so in support of giving the study of Ivermectin the benefit of the doubt? Do you think it might work? Do you believe in fully analyzing a therapeutic without any political influence? Is it all about the hypocrisy? I (and I think most others) are pretty skeptical. Doesn’t mean we are 100% right, but the odds don’t look good for an anti-parasitic medication to suddenly result in the end of a viral pandemic.
 
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Apollyon said:
The last few posts from @Birdstrike just reminded me of something from over 40 years ago. Laetrile, anybody? Ask Steve McQueen how that turned out.
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Yeah, lol. That reminds me. Recently, my wife was telling me about a mutual acquaintance of ours whose kid was recently diagnosed with "chronic Lyme" and who was thinking about taking her to Mexico for some "experimental treatments" so cutting edge, you "can't get them in America, yet." Lol.

Uh..no.

Maybe I should've just told her to google, "Steve McQueen dies in Mexico."
 
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I've tested ABEM's professionalism reporting tool by sending in an ED doc operating a quick-buck telemedicine service giving on-demand ivermectin + fluvoxamine prescriptions.

I highly doubt there's any teeth to it.
 
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xaelia said:
I've tested ABEM's professionalism reporting tool by sending in an ED doc operating a quick-buck telemedicine service giving on-demand ivermectin + fluvoxamine prescriptions.

I highly doubt there's any teeth to it.
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It depends what claims he's making. If he's prescribing a medication and claiming it does something it doesn't then that would be fraud. Writing to the State Medical Board would probably get more done.
 
this has taken an interesting turn…

can you imagine how much nebulized hydrogen peroxide would burn the lungs?

www.nbcnews.com

'Vigilante treatments': Anti-vaccine groups push people to leave ICUs

As the anti-vaccine movement escalates its rhetoric, doctors warn that they're dealing with the fallout: "They’re starting to target people, the messengers — nurses and doctors."
www.nbcnews.com www.nbcnews.com
 
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GeneralVeers said:
I'm all for it. Natural Selection at work.
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i’m just imaging some poor grandpa going along with what the kids want not really realizing what’s going on and getting taken out of the hospital for “hospice care” only to get subjected to this ivermectin and nebulized hydrogen peroxide “protocol”. jesus.
 
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wholeheartedly said:
i’m just imaging some poor grandpa going along with what the kids want not really realizing what’s going on and getting taken out of the hospital for “hospice care” only to get subjected to this ivermectin and nebulized hydrogen peroxide “protocol”. jesus.
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I think nebulized hydrogen peroxide would definitely kill COVID Particles in the lungs....so there's that.
 
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GeneralVeers said:
I think nebulized hydrogen peroxide would definitely kill COVID Particles in the lungs....so there's that.
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I read a little more and the original recommended diluted dose was what I would describe as homeopathic…. of course most people think more is better and most probably can’t do an accurate dilution so…
 
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GeneralVeers said:
It's hard when we have welfare programs and food stamps that keep people going who would otherwise be unable to support themselves.
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Furthermore, a lot of those people are able to support themselves if it came down to it, but they'd rather not make the uncomfortable choices required to do so. Like, you know... giving up cigarettes, weed, and booze to stay alive. Or even just foregoing the next elaborate tattoo or newest iPhone.

Difficult circumstances are a great motivator for positive change.
 
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It's all f'ing nonsense. I'll prescribe ivermectin once all the studies are back and a bunch of people around a round table, who are 10 times smarter than me, endorse it. Until then ivermectin is junk and best used on large 4-legged animals with parasitic infections.
 
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thegenius said:
It's all f'ing nonsense. I'll prescribe ivermectin once all the studies are back and a bunch of people around a round table, who are 10 times smarter than me, endorse it. Until then ivermectin is junk and best used on large 4-legged animals with parasitic infections.
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It was a rhetorical question.
 
gutonc said:
What kind of nonsense is this then...
"People interested in the trial will have the option to choose which study arm they would like to be a part of."

WTF kind of "science" is that?
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So that isn't as clear as it should be (thanks for making me defend MUSC).

The trial is studying 3 different drugs. Patients can choose which drug arm they want to be in. They are then randomized to either control or treatment arm for that drug.
 
VA Hopeful Dr said:
So that isn't as clear as it should be (thanks for making me defend MUSC).

The trial is studying 3 different drugs. Patients can choose which drug arm they want to be in. They are then randomized to either control or treatment arm for that drug.
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Slightly less stupid.
 
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Apollyon said:
Last edited by a moderator: A moment ago

Nice, real nice. Admin knows how much I just love anonymous moderation.
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Obvious breaches get immediate action.
Volunteers offer opinions on the appropriateness of interventions.
Therefore, one can accurately assume any act of moderation is based on consensus.
 
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so apparently my link got some messed up re-direct or was hacked - but here is a different link

There have been two deaths associated with the drug when used inappropriately.

www.nytimes.com

New Mexico health officials link misuse of ivermectin to two Covid-19 deaths.

Calls to poison control centers have soared across the country as misinformation spreads touting the anti-parasite drug as a Covid treatment.
www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com
 
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