Anyone else have a hard time believing in evolution?

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There's a lot of ego and intolerance up in here.

*sigh*

Belief systems are part of humanity. If it's science you worship, why study medicine?

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The responses in this thread piss me off. I don't understand why everyone is flaming OP just for believing what he chooses to believe. There is no need for everyone to be an ass. Whether he's right or wrong is a different story, but quit being ignorant. And for everyone insinuating that he should not be a doctor or he will be DO, that's just stupid and immature. Go **** yourselves.
 
annnnnnnnnnnnd this is why religion sucks :D Dude, the evidence for evolution if outstanding. I don't know if you have taken general genetics/biology classes but if you go into molecular genetics or evolutionary developmental biology you will see the homology between basic units of cells and how one shift in chemical gradient during embryologists could lead to physical changes in an organism that evolution can then act upon.

Religion teaches you what exactly?
 
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There's a lot of ego and intolerance up in here.

*sigh*

Belief systems are part of humanity. If it's science you worship, why study medicine?
Because science is a belief system and has nothing to do with medicine.



/Trolololo lolo lolo
 
annnnnnnnnnnnd this is why religion sucks :D Dude, the evidence for evolution if outstanding. I don't know if you have taken general genetics/biology classes but if you go into molecular genetics or evolutionary developmental biology you will see the homology between basic units of cells and how one shift in chemical gradient during embryologists could lead to physical changes in an organism that evolution can then act upon.

Religion teaches you what exactly?

How does evolution discount the possibility that the supernatural or a 'higher-intelligence' exists? So what if we evolved from a microbe. How can anyone prove or disprove that the whole evolutionary process isn't just how "God" (what ever that means) does things? Isn't it just as possible that aliens planted DNA seed here on earth? What would make an alien creation story different than any other creation myth? And where did the big bang come from? Was it caused from a collision between two 'extra' dimensional membranes (a la m-theory)?....or was the big bang just one of the many cycles of universal birth-rebirth? What about the theory of Parallel universes....If they exist, would they provide an 'scientific' explanation for spiritual phenomenon? I need answers people!!! And I highly doubt your future medical abilities if you can't validate your claims!!!!
 
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Watching that video made me approve of california for the first time
 
The responses in this thread piss me off. I don't understand why everyone is flaming OP just for believing what he chooses to believe. There is no need for everyone to be an ass. Whether he's right or wrong is a different story, but quit being ignorant. And for everyone insinuating that he should not be a doctor or he will be DO, that's just stupid and immature. Go **** yourselves.
umad? OP was trying to get flamed because he was TROLLING. As he has mentioned multiple times. reading fail?
 
annnnnnnnnnnnd this is why religion sucks :D Dude, the evidence for evolution if outstanding. I don't know if you have taken general genetics/biology classes but if you go into molecular genetics or evolutionary developmental biology you will see the homology between basic units of cells and how one shift in chemical gradient during embryologists could lead to physical changes in an organism that evolution can then act upon.

Religion teaches you what exactly?

You are dumb.
 
annnnnnnnnnnnd this is why religion sucks :D Dude, the evidence for evolution if outstanding. I don't know if you have taken general genetics/biology classes but if you go into molecular genetics or evolutionary developmental biology you will see the homology between basic units of cells and how one shift in chemical gradient during embryologists could lead to physical changes in an organism that evolution can then act upon.

Religion teaches you what exactly?

Fellow SDNers, this is a prime example of hateful intolerance born of ignorance.

The evidence for evolution is NOT outstanding. If you want to have a big boy conversation about it, I'm game. Name-calling and ridicule are not a substitute for a reasoned argument. Shame on you.
 
It seems a lot of people ITT keep assuming Evolution infers that there is no God.

Evolution makes no assertion about a deity at all, why keep arguing with Scientific Theory and nitpicking? ie, "Evilution is false because it doesn't express that God did it, but a bad definition of ID is better!"
 
Fellow SDNers, this is a prime example of hateful intolerance born of ignorance.

The evidence for evolution is NOT outstanding. If you want to have a big boy conversation about it, I'm game. Name-calling and ridicule are not a substitute for a reasoned argument. Shame on you.

Curious, how would an engineer-- Alas, I'm just a lowly Bio major-- account for the abundance of noncoding genetic material(Both Pseudogenes and pseudoviral), MGEs, etc. that are homologous between closely and more distant species?

Also, what do you consider the correct ways things came about, change, and/or happened?
 
^ you're just a dumb retrovirus
 
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How was my statement borne of ignorance? I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you meant my statement about religion was ignorant because I assure you that haven taken not only the general biology classes required for med school I can give a pretty good argument for evolution on a molecular level (which i think offers a much stronger argument than the usual "there are fossil evidence for it"). As for having a "big boy" conversation, is there a need to? The simplest of arguments would be just to compare homology of DNA or function of proteins. You can argue about not having fossils all day but can you really argue about homologous histones found in archea that eukaryotes use today?

As for my statement about religion... I do not see how it aimed to "ridicule". One can argue that religious officials offer as much false hope as astrologists and apothecaries. I am sorry that I offended you but I do categorize religion on that level.

I never mentioned god. My statement was aimed more at the culture that religion creates. One that always seems to be on the opposite side of rationalism, of innovation and progress. Evolution to me is just as real as gravity so I cannot understand why anyone would have a hard time believing in it.

I think most misunderstanding of evolution comes from ignorance. From not delving deep enough in order to understand it from a molecular level. Eh maybe I have been spending too much time mutating my little microbes in lab...:p
 
The evidence for evolution is NOT outstanding. If you want to have a big boy conversation about it, I'm game. Name-calling and ridicule are not a substitute for a reasoned argument. Shame on you.
Haha, if you believe that, we can't actually have a reasoned argument.
 
I agree with OP. As a bioengineer I'm definitely curious to know how living organisms work, but evolutionary theory as-is leaves me more questions than answers.

There are a lot of glaring holes in Chuckie D's evolutionary theory, but my favorite is the ever-true order cannot come from disorder. fully-functioning, self-replicating micromachines do not simply appear. wings do not simply appear. eyes do not simply appear. Desmosomes, anybody? It's freaking brilliant. Living tissues have the stamp of purpose.

Convergent evolution makes the whole idea twice as unlikely. And when you consider the fossil record, you must consider the elephant in the room that is "punctuated equilibrium." The dramatic overnight changes that must occur among so many different species all at once in discrete intervals drops the probability of evolution by random mutation to unfathomably low, yet it is purported to have happened multiple times this way.

In addition, geological and paleological sciences are barely a few hundred years old, and radioactive dating techniques are not dogma. There is not enough data to assert the accuracy of these methods. Even carbon dating was recently found to be error-prone, and that method is only good for 40,000 years or so. Extrapolating farther than your data is perilous. There is also the precision and accuracy of the instruments used to consider.

Also, talk of evolving bacteria is silly. Natural selection, not "fortunate mutation in the nick of time just before extinction" leads to superbugs, because those defenses must have already been present in some strains. They did not appear just as the penicillin showed up.

Since evolution is, after all, a biomechanical process, it cannot simply be proved by pointing to rock formations and comparing similarities between animals. There must be a proven process. When you consider that according to current evolutionary theory the creation of new genetic material is due entirely to random mutation, any good engineer would laugh. Optimization requires careful planning. Things left to themselves fall apart.

There is definitely evidence for changing life on earth, but I am not prepared to accept the current theory and even those who love to get degrees in the soft sciences would be better served by considering the facts more closely than by ridiculing those who have.
Yea, like the mutation to eat nylon existed before nylon. Obviously. Stupid statements like this is why you've removed yourself from reasoned discussion.
 
Yea, like the mutation to eat nylon existed before nylon. Obviously. Stupid statements like this is why you've removed yourself from reasoned discussion.

Eh, it's obvious that antibacterial compounds were invented the second Penicillin was used for treatment. It is not like they are produced naturally beforehand...
 
Haha, if you believe that, we can't actually have a reasoned argument.
:thumbup:

I chose to not even address the initial spiel on how this awesome engineer feels about evolution because it was that much filled with misconceptions and a general lack of in-depth familiarity with evolutionary biology.
 
Or maybe...they can just say "god created something extremely simple that was smart enough to evolve into something complex" everyone is happy?

Thats what I've been saying this whole time.

I am a practicing Christian who believes God created life and it evolved from there. Apparently me believing that made some people hurt in the butt...
 
Eh, it's obvious that antibacterial compounds were invented the second Penicillin was used for treatment. It is not like they are produced naturally beforehand...
Not sure what antibacterial resistance has to do with nylon eating bacteria, but....ok.

:confused:
 
I just want express my opinion. In the case of evolution, I personally believe that micro-evolution is indeed true. However, I don't believe that macro-evolution is even near possible. Let's take a few moment and trace our ancestry according to the evolution theory. You came from your parents. How about your parents? Your grandparents. Okay... let's trace your lineage even more. Evolution theory states that you came from chimpanzee and so on. This logic of transformation from one organism to the other baffles me because it explicitly contradicts the law of second thermodynamics, which is widely known as entropy. Entropy states that the disorder in the system always increases or stays the same. So, how likely is that more complex organisms have been evolved from less complex organisms, unless there was a creator who created all things. Any comment is welcomed.
 
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This logic of transformation from one organism to the other baffles me because it explicitly contradicts the law of second thermodynamics, which is widely known as entropy. Entropy states that the disorder in the system always increases or stays the same. So, how likely is that more complex organisms have been evolved from less complex organisms, unless there was a creator who created all things. Any comment is welcomed.
In the system is the key word there. Simple example: a liquid cooling to form a solid. The solid itself is more ordered, but the second law is not broken because the system gains the heat that the liquid gave off. This was actually discussed in this thread already.
 
This logic of transformation from one organism to the other baffles me because it explicitly contradicts the law of second thermodynamics, which is widely known as entropy. Entropy states that the disorder in the system always increases or stays the same. So, how likely is that more complex organisms have been evolved from less complex organisms, unless there was a creator who created all things. Any comment is welcomed.
By that definition, a seed can't grow into a plant. But it does. If only there was a big yellow ball of energy that would explain the influx of energy into the system. :confused:
 
I just want express my opinion. In the case of evolution, I personally believe that micro-evolution is indeed true. However, I don't believe that macro-evolution is even near possible. Let's take a few moment and trace our ancestry according to the evolution theory. You came from your parents. How about your parents? Your grandparents. Okay... let's trace your lineage even more. Evolution theory states that you came from chimpanzee and so on. This logic of transformation from one organism to the other baffles me because it explicitly contradicts the law of second thermodynamics, which is widely known as entropy. Entropy states that the disorder in the system always increases or stays the same. So, how likely is that more complex organisms have been evolved from less complex organisms, unless there was a creator who created all things. Any comment is welcomed.

facepalm.jpg
 
I just want express my opinion. In the case of evolution, I personally believe that micro-evolution is indeed true. However, I don't believe that macro-evolution is even near possible. Let's take a few moment and trace our ancestry according to the evolution theory. You came from your parents. How about your parents? Your grandparents. Okay... let's trace your lineage even more. Evolution theory states that you came from chimpanzee and so on. This logic of transformation from one organism to the other baffles me because it explicitly contradicts the law of second thermodynamics, which is widely known as entropy. Entropy states that the disorder in the system always increases or stays the same. So, how likely is that more complex organisms have been evolved from less complex organisms, unless there was a creator who created all things. Any comment is welcomed.
This is a completely incorrect statement. It's like saying "I am a descendent from my cousin" (barring any incestual relationships in your family tree, of course:smuggrin:). Humans share a most recent common ancestor with either the common chimpanzee or the bonobo (as of a year and a half ago, my evolution prof said that scientists have yet to form a consensus at to which one is actually more closely related to us). We aren't descended from them

And your entropy stuff is a ridiculous argument as well (see number 10 on this list http://www.uwgb.edu/dutchs/pseudosc/top10mythsevol.htm)
 
To the OP, I'm a practicing Catholic. I thought it best to find some kind of middle ground, so I just believe in theistic evolution- evolution happened, but a greater force ordained it (whoever you believe that greater force to be).
 
a3ca148f-bf7c-4c93-a044-43849a48ce5c.jpg


To the 'evolution is just a theory' trolls... So is gravity. Go jump off a bridge and come back to me with what it means to be a proven scientific theory.
 
To the OP, I'm a practicing Catholic. I thought it best to find some kind of middle ground, so I just believe in theistic evolution- evolution happened, but a greater force ordained it (whoever you believe that greater force to be).

Well...you're going to be a terrible doctor. Caribbean for you.
 
To the 'evolution is just a theory' trolls... So is gravity. Go jump off a bridge and come back to me with what it means to be a proven scientific theory.

I have the feeling that Newton and Einstein wouldn't agree with each other about what gravity is.
 
I have the feeling that Newton and Einstein wouldn't agree with each other about what gravity is.

Does it matter if they agree or not? Both used scientific research to attempt to prove an observable entity of physics.

Evolution on the other hand, has two parties. 1) The scientists who have hard scientific evidence over hundreds of years and 2) the crazy people who base all of their knowledge from an invisible man in the sky, who if they're good, will grant their wishes. Is it just me or does god sounds a lot like a big fat bearded man who rides on a sleigh every Winter?

I have no problem with religion whatsoever, but when claims are made with 0 supporting evidence AGAINST claims with centuries of supporting evidence, it makes my blood boil.
 
Word.

Or "veritas" as I've seen lately. :confused:


That would be my veritas you've been seeing running around.

I took a latin class 2 years ago... it's about the only word I retained.


As for the rest of this thread.... veritas et utilitas... truth and usefulness... one without the other is useless.

This thread is no longer useful... LET IT DIE PLEASE.
 
That would be my veritas you've been seeing running around.

I took a latin class 2 years ago... it's about the only word I retained.


As for the rest of this thread.... veritas et utilitas... truth and usefulness... one without the other is useless.

This thread is no longer useful... LET IT DIE PLEASE.

Never. It's immortal.
 
Evolution is BS. I will share the truth with you all. In the beginning there was nothing.

Then the Flying Spaghetti Monster once came forth from the nothingness and with his noodly appendages created a mountain, trees, and a midget.

Evidence:
flying_spaghetti_monster_creating_mountain_trees_and_midget.jpg
 
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This thread has evolved.


See what I did there?


PRESS PLAY BEFORE READING!!!


[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KwT8FOyXkMw[/YOUTUBE]



"Huh? THREAD is evolving!"

....

"Congrats! Your THREAD evolved into TROLL THREAD!"



Oh shi-....
 
Evolution is BS. I will share the truth with you all. In the beginning there was nothing.

Then the Flying Spaghetti Monster once came forth from the nothingness and with his noodly appendages created a mountain, trees, and a midget.

Evidence:
flying_spaghetti_monster_creating_mountain_trees_and_midget.jpg

No Pirates?
 
No Pirates?
Pirates were the original Pastafarians (as shown by the pirate fish fossil on the left), but Christians spread fake rumors about them being thieves and such so now they have a bad reputation. As a result pirates these days are now nearly extinct.

Somali pirates are fakes and the Church of the FSM does not condone their violent actions.
 
Pirates were the original Pastafarians (as shown by the pirate fish fossil on the left), but Christians spread fake rumors about them being thieves and such so now they have a bad reputation. As a result pirates these days are now nearly extinct.

Somali pirates are fakes and the Church of the FSM does not condone their violent actions.

:laugh:
 
no ones going to ask about the midget?
 
That would be my veritas you've been seeing running around.

I took a latin class 2 years ago... it's about the only word I retained.


As for the rest of this thread.... veritas et utilitas... truth and usefulness... one without the other is useless.

This thread is no longer useful... LET IT DIE PLEASE.
20+ years ago here. Lesse:

Amo, amari, amavi, amatus.
Semper ubi sub ubi (yeay for Latin slang).
Insula est magna. Puella est magna!

and that's about it. Obviously an infinitely useful part of my life...
 
Fellow SDNers, this is a prime example of hateful intolerance born of ignorance.

The evidence for evolution is NOT outstanding. If you want to have a big boy conversation about it, I'm game. Name-calling and ridicule are not a substitute for a reasoned argument. Shame on you.

His post was unnecessary, but if you believe that the evidence for evolution is anything other than outstanding then there is really no point in discussing the issue with you. You obviously arent going to change your mind regardless, so why bother? You're entitled to yuor opinion, just know that if what we currently have isnt "outstanding" in your eyes that you have unrealistic expectations and I suspect nothing would ever convince you.
 
Phew you guys sure do like arguing huh? I've seen people I've never seen before coming out of the woodwork .
 
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