Application Advice/Thoughts

[lightoflegend]

Dear SDN,

I would be receptive to feedback or advice on my current application. I am fairly set on MD (rather than DO) because I want to work internationally. I applied this cycle (2015-2016) as a third time re-applicant and had 3 interviews: one rejection and two wait-lists.

I applied to 21 MD schools (fairly evenly distributed to lower tier programs with a couple higher tier) this cycle as a Virginia resident with the following stats:
3.67 cGPA, 3.50 sGPA, 516 MCAT

EC’s:
-2 Years medical technician work.
-1 Year undergrad psychology research ( no pubs ).
-Short summer Haiti mission trip / several relatively short (less than 1 month) medical shadowing experiences.
-Undergrad philosophy conference paper presentation.
-1.5 Years Free Clinic volunteering.

1. At this point I am not convinced that an SMP or certificate program is worth the money or risk based on what I’ve read on this forum - you have to work really hard to "prove" yourself and if you don't get good grades you are probably screwed. My GPA is slightly below average but its not too low?

2. I think published lab/clinical research is a big weakness of my application so I am looking into obtaining some additional research experience. I am looking into the NIH - does anyone know of any other reputable biomedical research programs that take post-bacc students?

3. I am thinking of reaching out to some of these schools for advice/feedback on my application / why they rejected me. Any advice as to how I should go about it?

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[TexasSurgeon]

Dear SDN,

I would be receptive to feedback or advice on my current application. I am fairly set on MD (rather than DO) because I want to work internationally. I applied this cycle (2015-2016) as a third time re-applicant and had 3 interviews: one rejection and two wait-lists.

I applied to 21 MD schools (fairly evenly distributed to lower tier programs with a couple higher tier) this cycle as a Virginia resident with the following stats:
3.67 cGPA, 3.50 sGPA, 516 MCAT

EC’s:
-2 Years medical technician work.
-1 Year undergrad psychology research ( no pubs ).
-Short summer Haiti mission trip / several relatively short (less than 1 month) medical shadowing experiences.
-Undergrad philosophy conference paper presentation.
-1.5 Years Free Clinic volunteering.

1. At this point I am not convinced that an SMP or certificate program is worth the money or risk based on what I’ve read on this forum - you have to work really hard to "prove" yourself and if you don't get good grades you are probably screwed. My GPA is slightly below average but its not too low?

2. I think published lab/clinical research is a big weakness of my application so I am looking into obtaining some additional research experience. I am looking into the NIH - does anyone know of any other reputable biomedical research programs that take post-bacc students?

3. I am thinking of reaching out to some of these schools for advice/feedback on my application / why they rejected me. Any advice as to how I should go about it?

Consider the Postbac IRTA program at the NIH.

 

[GrapesofRath]

Dear SDN,

I would be receptive to feedback or advice on my current application. I am fairly set on MD (rather than DO) because I want to work internationally. I applied this cycle (2015-2016) as a third time re-applicant and had 3 interviews: one rejection and two wait-lists.

These are often the trickiest situations to give advice to. Your biggest issue is that you are a 3rd time applicant. Many schools wont really consider 3rd time applicants in many cases. Even more wont consider 4th time applicants if it comes to it.

Your ECs are fine. Note this is not at all a research issue or lack of pubs. Your stats are fine. There is a bigger issue to your app you might not be realizing. Below are the reasons I could see as most likely tanking you from most likely to least.

1) Flawed written components of your application. How you are presenting yourself, presenting your strengths and creating a theme to your app likely can be better. 3.6/35 on the surface is plenty for medical school and competitive for the vast majority of programs in the US. But if you dont present yourself well and present your application with a clear theme and clear strengths, everything starts falling apart.

2) Bad interviewing skills: Youve had at least 3 interviews by now and cant get an acceptance with good stats and solid ECs. Your interviewing skills arent helping your case.

3) Multiple MCAT scores. In fact this is guaranteed. If you are a 3rd time applicant, you applied in two previous cycles where hte new MCAT wasnt existent. What were your previous scores and how many times have you taken the MCAT? If you had say a 29 and 30 before the 516, that changes the discussion considerably.

4) Poorly chosen school list. Pay attention to median MCAT's of schools and % OOS/IS.

5) Either LORs that arent helping you at all or could perhaps be actively hurting you. Mediocre LORs can tank apps.

6) Downward grade trend or very inconsistent academic performance. If your last year of college you had say a 3.2, or your performance was very up and down throughout college, that could definitely be affecting your app.

7) Red flags: ie IAs/criminal history.

Many schools are going to look at someone with a 3.6/35 as a 3rd/4th time applicant as a very risky candidate. You are in a number of cases/schools going to be presumed to have flaws that might not be immeadiately evident on paper. This puts you behind the eight ball. Ordinarily a 3.6/35 shouldnt be near an SMP. But things are different for a 4th time applicant. In your case, you need some kind of push/boost to put you over the top a 1st time applicant wouldnt. An extra pub or two isnt going to do it. A good SMP showing could be just that; it could get you the type of special consideration you need at the host institution or at schools that SMP is a "feeder" to. If not an SMP, you need something compelling to your app and something to change(and it wont be a new pub). Dont just keep throwing the same thing out there and expecting a different result. Either that, or start applying to DO programs.

 

[DrMidlife]

OP you've been misled that DOs don't work internationally. It's no easier or harder to be a US MD vs a US DO in an aid organization.

If what you want is to live & work in a particular country other than the US, then you have to compete for a residency spot just like an FMG does in the US, and jump through the same series of immigration hoops.

See https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctor_of_Osteopathic_Medicine


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[lightoflegend]

These are often the trickiest situations to give advice to. Your biggest issue is that you are a 3rd time applicant. Many schools wont really consider 3rd time applicants in many cases. Even more wont consider 4th time applicants if it comes to it.

Your ECs are fine. Note this is not at all a research issue or lack of pubs. Your stats are fine. There is a bigger issue to your app you might not be realizing. Below are the reasons I could see as most likely tanking you from most likely to least.

1) Flawed written components of your application. How you are presenting yourself, presenting your strengths and creating a theme to your app likely can be better. 3.6/35 on the surface is plenty for medical school and competitive for the vast majority of programs in the US. But if you dont present yourself well and present your application with a clear theme and clear strengths, everything starts falling apart.

2) Bad interviewing skills: Youve had at least 3 interviews by now and cant get an acceptance with good stats and solid ECs. Your interviewing skills arent helping your case.

3) Multiple MCAT scores. In fact this is guaranteed. If you are a 3rd time applicant, you applied in two previous cycles where hte new MCAT wasnt existent. What were your previous scores and how many times have you taken the MCAT? If you had say a 29 and 30 before the 516, that changes the discussion considerably.

4) Poorly chosen school list. Pay attention to median MCAT's of schools and % OOS/IS.

5) Either LORs that arent helping you at all or could perhaps be actively hurting you. Mediocre LORs can tank apps.

6) Downward grade trend or very inconsistent academic performance. If your last year of college you had say a 3.2, or your performance was very up and down throughout college, that could definitely be affecting your app.

7) Red flags: ie IAs/criminal history.

Many schools are going to look at someone with a 3.6/35 as a 3rd/4th time applicant as a very risky candidate. You are in a number of cases/schools going to be presumed to have flaws that might not be immeadiately evident on paper. This puts you behind the eight ball. Ordinarily a 3.6/35 shouldnt be near an SMP. But things are different for a 4th time applicant. In your case, you need some kind of push/boost to put you over the top a 1st time applicant wouldnt. An extra pub or two isnt going to do it. A good SMP showing could be just that; it could get you the type of special consideration you need at the host institution or at schools that SMP is a "feeder" to. If not an SMP, you need something compelling to your app and something to change(and it wont be a new pub). Dont just keep throwing the same thing out there and expecting a different result. Either that, or start applying to DO programs.

Thanks for the reply. My first two MCAT scores were both 30's. - the 516 was a significant improvement. Regarding the theme/written portion of my application, this I will need to discuss with some admissions committee members to see what they think. I plan to meet with some advisers about this and speak with them directly.

Regarding interview skills, I got somewhat tense during the interviews. I believe this was a problem. I think my school list is okay - my major considerations were MCAT median and %OOS/IS that you mentioned. Academic performance started strong then suffered mid way, then got stronger towards the end. I addressed this in several applications secondaries well I believe. No criminal history except a reckless speeding ticket (22mph) in 2011 and I have been clean since then. LOR's might have been medicore from college- used premed advisory committee but I got two additional letters from doctors I know personally that are more recent - I am sure they put in a good word.

My plan is to talk to ADCOMS directly and consider SMP or DO.

 

[GrapesofRath]

Thanks for the reply. My first two MCAT scores were both 30's. - the 516 was a significant improvement. Regarding the theme/written portion of my application, this I will need to discuss with some admissions committee members to see what they think. I plan to meet with some advisers about this and speak with them directly.

Regarding interview skills, I got somewhat tense during the interviews. I believe this was a problem. I think my school list is okay - my major considerations were MCAT median and %OOS/IS that you mentioned. Academic performance started strong then suffered mid way, then got stronger towards the end. I addressed this in several applications secondaries well I believe. No criminal history except a reckless speeding ticket (22mph) in 2011 and I have been clean since then. LOR's might have been medicore from college- used premed advisory committee but I got two additional letters from doctors I know personally that are more recent - I am sure they put in a good word.

My plan is to talk to ADCOMS directly and consider SMP or DO.

Sounds like a good plan. I think you can start to see the issues your application has which is the first crucial step here.

Some of the issues like the 3 MCAT attempts or the fact youll be a 4th time reapplicant you cant fix. Other things such as iffy interviews, problems with presentation and organization of yourself in the application, bland LORs(doctor LORs 99% are complete garbage that are ignored, particularly if they are docs you shadowed or just happen to know personally) can be fixed. Work on the things that can be fixed. You have to at some point apply to DO programs given where you are at and youll be a very good candidate for any. That's your easiest way into medicine. DrMidLife talked about earlier how you need to further look into DO opportunities internationallly. If you want to give MD one last try, something bold that can make a real difference like an SMP is the type of thing I would consider. Good luck.