Are anesthesia residents too stressed out these days?

[aneftp]

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I don't. If I'm in the hospital for 12 or 16 hours busting my butt, that's not the same as sleeping like a baby at home with a tiny chance of getting called back in. Although the degree of "intensity" of the call depends on the likelihood of getting called back. I sleep great when it's <5% chance of getting called in. I sleep far less well when it is 50-60% chance of coming back.

Old style of thinking.

Your time is very valuable and time on beeper on call is extremely valuable.

If I were an administrator I’d love to hire more guys like you.

Here be on beeper for 7 days (5p-7a) I show u the spread sheet the average running time for the OR is 5p-8am with a 10% chance going past 8pm. And 5-% going past 12a

I than tell since it’s a low call back rare and u really only work around 24-28 hrs. Than it counts as a regular week. Since your value of beeper is so low.

Than I throw u a small bone if u average more than 35 hrs inside the hospital. I give u $300-hr w2 extra on ur beepe week if it’s a bad week.

 

[Mman]

Old style of thinking.

Your time is very valuable and time on beeper on call is extremely valuable.

If I were an administrator I’d love to hire more guys like you.

Here be on beeper for 7 days (5p-7a) I show u the spread sheet the average running time for the OR is 5p-8am with a 10% chance going past 8pm. And 5-% going past 12a

I than tell since it’s a low call back rare and u really only work around 24-28 hrs. Than it counts as a regular week. Since your value of beeper is so low.

Than I throw u a small bone if u average more than 35 hrs inside the hospital. I give u $300-hr w2 extra on ur beepe week if it’s a bad week.

I'm not asking what you sell to a hospital administrator. I'm referring to how we internally value things as a private group. You can tell someone else how painful it is to sleep in your own bed but between our own physicians we know it isn't the same.

 

[aneftp]

I'm not asking what you sell to a hospital administrator. I'm referring to how we internally value things as a private group. You can tell someone else how painful it is to sleep in your own bed but between our own physicians we know it isn't the same.

Alrighty. I hope the hospital is subsidizing u for ur private group for ur time on beeper. If u even have beeper.

The beeper call value is the most under valued in almost any physician practice regardless of speciality.

 

[zaitoun]

Boomer here. Reading this thread of folks whining about stress and how difficult residency programs are is laughable. These were the pre Libby Zion, no limit to working hours. Base year IM internship was 120 hour weeks with q 4 call that got down to 90 hour weeks by the Spring as you got more efficient. No days off after 24 hour call during residency. Yup, we walked 3 miles through the snow to get to the hospital lol. Fortunately, no CRNA's anywhere so the experience gained was great. The motto among residents was that there were two things they had for us during residency, hard dick and bubblegum and they were fresh out of bubblegum.

We knew that we were the cheapest piece of equipment in the OR. I was making $24,000 my internship year in a high COL state. Now as was true then, you enter residency with an economic value that will be exponentially increased after you complete your training. Were the hours worked and demands made upon us crazy? They were but we survived, could handle the stress and thrived in private practice.

The 99% boredom, 1% sheer terror is real. Patients survived because I could handle the stress of the 1%. If they can't handle stress, perhaps this is the wrong field for them. End of rant.

BTW, a 1% story. Patient being induced for true cut breathing biopsy. As I'm inducing the surgeon is prepping the chest. I go to intubate the patient and I see blood welling up from the trachea. Puzzled, I tell the surgeon, looking down my laryngoscope, that I'm seeing blood here. He says that he may have hit something. I look up and he had started the biopsy and put the true cut through the pulmonary vein. I call out to him and the nurses that he will need to crack her chest now. I can't see anything as her mouth is filled with blood. She is exsanguinating. We turn her on her left side as the nurses rush to get instruments. I managed to intubate her as blood empties out of her airway onto the table and isolate her left lung. He actually happened to be a good surgeon, got her chest opened quickly, performed Pringle maneuver and she survived.

My boomer attending told me it's because of the complacent boomer attendings that anesthesiologists have lost so much respect and bargaining power. Because they'd rather sip their coffee than actually be present and now you have midlevels demand same level of autonomy, respect and also salary for a fraction of training. They sold to PE after seeing some $$ and have become cogs in an administrative machine with no legislative standing whatsoever.

 

[pastafan]

My boomer attending told me it's because of the complacent boomer attendings that anesthesiologists have lost so much respect and bargaining power. Because they'd rather sip their coffee than actually be present and now you have midlevels demand same level of autonomy, respect and also salary for a fraction of training. They sold to PE after seeing some $$ and have become cogs in an administrative machine with no legislative standing whatsoever.

The is truth to this statement. I spent the majority of my career in a group of 13 physicians with 1-2 CRNA's so we took care of the patients directly, not supervising others. I know the quality difference between the two models.

 

[2019medstudent]

Yeah I don’t want to hear any hate towards this current gen of anesthesiologists. Boomer docs are the ones that screwed over this profession

 

[pastafan]

“Hate”, wow. It’s not hate to make notice that physicians today, in most specialties, expect to be given the same compensation as those who put in the hours to earn it yet will only accept a low work hour schedule with better work/life balance.

Choosing to work less is fine but don’t expect that you are entitled to the same rewards.

 

[2019medstudent]

“Hate”, wow. It’s not hate to make notice that physicians today, in most specialties, expect to be given the same compensation as those who put in the hours to earn it yet will only accept a low work hour schedule with better work/life balance.

Choosing to work less is fine but don’t expect that you are entitled to the same rewards.

No. Most newer docs do consider work life balance more than previous generations when choosing jobs but aren't expecting the same pay as someone who takes more call.

 

[dabears505]

Got a bunch of new grads at our place recently. All really well trained, good work ethic. It's maybe not as dire as we may be led to believe with the new Gen

 

[dannyboy1]

My boomer attending told me it's because of the complacent boomer attendings that anesthesiologists have lost so much respect and bargaining power. Because they'd rather sip their coffee than actually be present and now you have midlevels demand same level of autonomy, respect and also salary for a fraction of training. They sold to PE after seeing some $$ and have become cogs in an administrative machine with no legislative standing whatsoever.

Please. As if Gen Z would have done any different if they were around 25 years ago. Greed and laziness don’t know any generational boundaries. It’s part of the human condition. Boomers were in the right place at the right time.

 

[gunnershow]

Please. As if Gen Z would have done any different if they were around 25 years ago. Greed and laziness don’t know any generational boundaries. It’s part of the human condition. Boomers were in the right place at the right time.

Well the boomers are the only one signing up for 8:1 supervision jobs, trying to put the final nail in the coffin for the specialty.

 

[dannyboy1]

Well the boomers are the only one signing up for 8:1 supervision jobs, trying to put the final nail in the coffin for the specialty.

The closer you are to the end of your career, the less you worry about liability….

 

[TeslaCoil]

I was stressed af in residency. I did liver transplants, lots of ICU time, heart and lung transplants with a bunch of really malignant cardiac guys. 24 hr calls every other weekend. F yea I was stressed. If you went to a program like mine and say you werent stressed you are lying. I did three hurricanes stuck in a hospital for days. Covering the ICU. One time we had 3 codes simultaneously with no attending in sight. I did a 23 hour long peds heart transplant. If I could choose a residency program again I would literally choose one that does not do transplants and has less ICU coverage. It drove me out of anesthesia practice into pain.

 

[aneftp]

Please. As if Gen Z would have done any different if they were around 25 years ago. Greed and laziness don’t know any generational boundaries. It’s part of the human condition. Boomers were in the right place at the right time.

2025 is probably as lucrative per hour wages anesthesia has ever made (with no Ponzi scheme taking money from jr employees/crnas)

The last 3-4 years has also been right place right time.

 

[NPJR]

The closer you are to the end of your career, the less you worry about liability….

You still worry. The last thing you need at the end of your career is a 7 year lawsuit.

 

[aneftp]

You still worry. The last thing you need at the end of your career is a 7 year lawsuit.

Not unless u work for the Feds or the state near end of ur career. Than u don’t worry due to federal torts claims or state sovereign immunity laws.

 

[dannyboy1]

Not unless u work for the Feds or the state near end of ur career. Than u don’t worry due to federal torts claims or state sovereign immunity laws.

I don’t think people worry too much about actually losing their personal assets. Insurance has it covered. Usually the worry is if you get too many lawsuits it can be difficult to to get credentialed quickly. Not really a concern for those winding down their careers.

 

[pgg]

“Hate”, wow. It’s not hate to make notice that physicians today, in most specialties, expect to be given the same compensation as those who put in the hours to earn it yet will only accept a low work hour schedule with better work/life balance.

Choosing to work less is fine but don’t expect that you are entitled to the same rewards.

LOL

The market is what the market is. Supply and demand.

It's kind of funny to hear the generations that sold out the profession, a big chunk of whom were 90s grads who trained at the absolute nadir of applicant and graduate quality (seriously - over a 50% board fail rate from some years of that cohort!), lecture everyone about working hard and getting what they deserve.

The simple truths are that the hourly rate for this job have gone up due to undersupply of labor and oversupply of work, while there have been dramatic declines in local job security and other aspects of, let's say, professional fulfillment. It's totally reasonable for people to choose to work less and ALSO demand a market wage for the time they do work.

I say this with kindness, but you can take the shade you're throwing at the current crop of grads out to some park bench and feed it to the pigeons. 🙂

 

[pastafan]

LOL

The market is what the market is. Supply and demand.

It's kind of funny to hear the generations that sold out the profession, a big chunk of whom were 90s grads who trained at the absolute nadir of applicant and graduate quality (seriously - over a 50% board fail rate from some years of that cohort!), lecture everyone about working hard and getting what they deserve.

The simple truths are that the hourly rate for this job have gone up due to undersupply of labor and oversupply of work, while there have been dramatic declines in local job security and other aspects of, let's say, professional fulfillment. It's totally reasonable for people to choose to work less and ALSO demand a market wage for the time they do work.

I say this with kindness, but you can take the shade you're throwing at the current crop of grads out to some park bench and feed it to the pigeons. 🙂

That is not at all what I am referencing. Physicians join practices in multiple specialties where they expect to work less hours, see fewer patients per day and still make the same salary as the docs cranking the work out. I have no problem with eat what you kill practice models.

BTW, I trained in the 80's, easily passed my boards first time around and the board fail rate was not all due to quality of the docs. That's a whole other topic.