Are you male or female?

[unicorn06]

I know that medical school applicants are pretty evenly split in terms of gender. I think that female applicants slightly outnumber male applicants and that acceptances are almost exactly 50% male 50% female overall (although some schools are pretty uneven). I know SDN is not necessarily representative of the entire applicant pool, and I was wondering if SDN posters are also evenly split.

The above explains my motivation for this poll. Now for the question:

ARE YOU MALE OR FEMALE?

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[justskipee]

I know that medical school applicants are pretty evenly split in terms of gender. I think that female applicants slightly outnumber male applicants and that acceptances are almost exactly 50% male 50% female overall (although some schools are pretty uneven). I know SDN is not necessarily representative of the entire applicant pool, and I was wondering if SDN posters are also evenly split. Thus explains my motivation for this poll.

ARE YOU MALE OR FEMALE?

post an actual poll, where people click male or female. that would be easier.

 

[unicorn06]

post an actual poll, where people click male or female. that would be easier.

There is a poll....

 

[WholeLottaGame7]

I protest the inability to vote "Other"

 

[unicorn06]

I protest the inability to vote "Other"

Until you can get AMCAS to include the other option on the med school apps, I refuse to include it in my poll

 

[WholeLottaGame7]

Until you can get AMCAS to include the other option on the med school apps, I refuse to include it in my poll

Touche

 

[TheMightyAngus]

I know that medical school applicants are pretty evenly split in terms of gender. I think that female applicants slightly outnumber male applicants and that acceptances are almost exactly 50% male 50% female overall (although some schools are pretty uneven). I know SDN is not necessarily representative of the entire applicant pool, and I was wondering if SDN posters are also evenly split.

The above explains my motivation for this poll. Now for the question:

ARE YOU MALE OR FEMALE?

Let's open a can of worms. Considering many elite med schools admit more women than men, why aren't competitive residencies more evenly represented? Take orthopedics. It is arguably the most competitive residency to match into, yet the vast majority of orthopods are males (white males specifically). Is this discrepency due to the old boys mentality? Glass ceiling? A failure to recruit women into the field? Lack of interest in strenuous residencies due to a desire to raise a family?

 

[odrade1]

Let's open a can of worms. Considering many elite med schools admit more women than men, why aren't competitive residencies more evenly represented? Take orthopedics. It is arguably the most competitive residency to match into, yet the vast majority of orthopods are males (white males specifically). Is this discrepency due to the old boys mentality? Glass ceiling? A failure to recruit women into the field? Lack of interest in strenuous residencies due to a desire to raise a family?

I would be surprised if there weren't a good handful of places where you still see persisitent sexism. However, I am also a firm believer that men and women (taken as populations) tend to have differences in what they find interesting. There are also specializations where many, many more women apply and are accepted each year than men. If I remember correctly, this is the case with ob, gyn, and psychiatry. Also, there have been studies that show that men and women tend to be competitive in different ways. It could be that much of the competitiveness behind getting into these "supercompetitive" male-dominated residencies may be of the sort of competitiveness that men favor & women find unsatisfying. (Note that this is not equivalent to saying that women wouldn't find orthopedics satisfying).

 

[unicorn06]

Let's open a can of worms. Considering many elite med schools admit more women than men, why aren't competitive residencies more evenly represented? Take orthopedics. It is arguably the most competitive residency to match into, yet the vast majority of orthopods are males (white males specifically). Is this discrepency due to the old boys mentality? Glass ceiling? A failure to recruit women into the field? Lack of interest in strenuous residencies due to a desire to raise a family?

Eh, you're generalizing unfairly with orthopedics. Derm is equally or even more competitive, and it is predominately female.

 

[WhatUpDoc!]

Let's open a can of worms. Considering many elite med schools admit more women than men, why aren't competitive residencies more evenly represented? Take orthopedics. It is arguably the most competitive residency to match into, yet the vast majority of orthopods are males (white males specifically). Is this discrepency due to the old boys mentality? Glass ceiling? A failure to recruit women into the field? Lack of interest in strenuous residencies due to a desire to raise a family?

Yesterday, I heard a fellow pre-med at my school bragging about how he wanted to go ortho and how much of a "medical fraternity" this specialty really is. It's funny because, yes he was a white male, and he also described the "good old boys" mentality through a story he gave about him shadowing an ortho doc. I think orthopedics is just one of those specialities that attracts people with characteristics just as hard as the bones that they know oh so much about. Just my opinion

 

[jebus]

When I was young I saw a pediatric orthapaedic surgeon. This guy was hilarious. Seriously, the funniest doctor & one of the nicest I ever met. To this day my mom remembers him - especially after she had orthapaedic surgery and her surgeon was an ass.
So, they aren't all bad....

 

[TheMightyAngus]

Eh, you're generalizing unfairly with orthopedics. Derm is equally or even more competitive, and it is predominately female.

Hence my qualified statement, "[orthopedic surgery] is arguably the most competitive residency to match into."

 

[unicorn06]

Hence my qualified statement, "[orthopedic surgery] is arguably the most competitive residency to match into."

A. I'm not sure if that is true.

B. Even if the most competitve residency were all male, that does not mean that the competitiveness of the residency is relevant to the lack of women. You would have to show that other competitive residencies have similar gender ratios, which I don't think is true. The way you phrased your statement made it sound like you were making the argument that women are underrepresented in competitive residencies in general and that orthopedics was just an example.

 

[CTSballer11]

Hence my qualified statement, "[orthopedic surgery] is arguably the most competitive residency to match into."

Your statement about white males going into ortho has some credibility. On the other hand a close family friend of mine is a female resident in orthopaedic surgery at Cornell. One of the most competetive places to match into for orthopaedic surgery.

 

[45408]

Let's open a can of worms. Considering many elite med schools admit more women than men, why aren't competitive residencies more evenly represented? Take orthopedics. It is arguably the most competitive residency to match into, yet the vast majority of orthopods are males (white males specifically). Is this discrepency due to the old boys mentality? Glass ceiling? A failure to recruit women into the field? Lack of interest in strenuous residencies due to a desire to raise a family?

It may be some of all of the above, but it'd be quite helpful to know whether or not women wanted to get into orthopedics and were being rejected, or if they simply are typically less interested in orthopedics. I don't suppose that there is any real difference in board scores between genders, so it's probably more attributable to a combination of many factors.

 

[TheMightyAngus]

Your statement about white males going into ortho has some credibility. On the other hand a close family friend of mine is a female resident in orthopaedic surgery at Cornell. One of the most competetive places to match into for orthopaedic surgery.

That's great. It seems that being a woman would standout, and many PD's may even try to actively recruit women into traditionally male-dominated specialties. But, why are women underrepresented in other intense specialties as well, neurosurgery, cardiology, CT-surgery, etc. There are plenty of women gunner pre-meds, doesn't this drive carry over to residency?

unicorn06, multiple interviewers/assistant deans have explicitly stated to me that orthopaedics has been the most competitive specialty the last few years, followed by rad onc. I'll try to post the NRMP data if I can find it on google.

 

[mdforlife]

That's great. It seems that being a woman would standout, and many PD's may even try to actively recruit women into traditionally male-dominated specialties. But, why are women underrepresented in other intense specialties as well, neurosurgery, cardiology, CT-surgery, etc. There are plenty of women gunner pre-meds, doesn't this drive carry over to residency?

unicorn06, multiple interviewers/assistant deans have explicitly stated to me that orthopaedics has been the most competitive specialty the last few years, followed by rad onc. I'll try to post the NRMP data if I can find it on google.

Not when it comes to surgery. Most of the male surgeons have a housewife at home; however, if a woman goes in a surgical residency, chances are if she's married she doesn't have a househusband at home. Hence, when she gets home from a night of operating she still has to be mommy, wifie, etc.
Believe, there are a lot of us, premed female gunners, who would love to become surgeons. I also know of several female non-surg. residnets who were interested in surgery during med school. However, I strongly believe that that it is different for women and men when it comes to their children. At the end of the day, many women realize that they'd rather spend that extra time with their children and stick to nonoperating residencies. I know your counterargument might be that if they want soemthing so bad they should get it and if they didn't go into surgery--they were weak. Once again, the feelings that a mother has towards her children are very different than those of a man.

 

[Messerschmitts]

Not when it comes to surgery. Most of the male surgeons have a housewife at home; however, if a woman goes in a surgical residency, chances are if she's married she doesn't have a househusband at home. Hence, when she gets home from a night of operating she still has to be mommy, wifie, etc.
Believe, there are a lot of us, premed female gunners, who would love to become surgeons. I also know of several female non-surg. residnets who were interested in surgery during med school. However, I strongly believe that that it is different for women and men when it comes to their children. At the end of the day, many women realize that they'd rather spend that extra time with their children and stick to nonoperating residencies. I know your counterargument might be that if they want soemthing so bad they should get it and if they didn't go into surgery--they were weak. Once again, the feelings that a mother has towards her children are very different than those of a man.

This does suck for women, the fact that they must choose. So what's the solution? More househusbands to support their surgeon wives?

 

[ClearDay]

Not when it comes to surgery. Most of the male surgeons have a housewife at home; however, if a woman goes in a surgical residency, chances are if she's married she doesn't have a househusband at home. Hence, when she gets home from a night of operating she still has to be mommy, wifie, etc.
Believe, there are a lot of us, premed female gunners, who would love to become surgeons. I also know of several female non-surg. residnets who were interested in surgery during med school. However, I strongly believe that that it is different for women and men when it comes to their children. At the end of the day, many women realize that they'd rather spend that extra time with their children and stick to nonoperating residencies. I know your counterargument might be that if they want soemthing so bad they should get it and if they didn't go into surgery--they were weak. Once again, the feelings that a mother has towards her children are very different than those of a man.

I definitely agree. This is one of the reasons I'm not considering surgery, eventhough I would love to do some procedures. My solution is to find a specialty that allows some procedure like IR

 

[mdforlife]

This does suck for women, the fact that they must choose. So what's the solution? More househusbands to support their surgeon wives?

The solution is up to the women. I used to fantasize about being a surgeon, but I also know that I would never choose work over my family. I think when it comes to surgery, investment banking, etc.--those people have to choose work over the family.

 

[Anastasis]

This does suck for women, the fact that they must choose. So what's the solution? More househusbands to support their surgeon wives?

Heh - sounds nice. Know any interested guys? I'll be your sugar mamma.

Seriously though, my boyfriend said he wouldn't mind be the stay at home dad since he knows I'll end up making more (he'll be a college prof is all goes according to plan). Some guys are okay with that.

About the Ortho Surgeons - I shadow one and I swear he's the nicest doctor I've ever met. I wasn't even interested in surgery before I met him.

Someone else said there are plenty of gunner women pre-meds. Is this true? Maybe it's the culture of the area I live in but all the female premeds I know (with the exception of myself and one other) are all about meeting a guy in med school who will take care of them. I'm not kidding. Maybe it's different other places.

 

[Messerschmitts]

The solution is up to the women. I used to fantasize about being a surgeon, but I also know that I would never choose work over my family. I think when it comes to surgery, investment banking, etc.--those people have to choose work over the family.

That's true, but it's still having to make a choice. Many feel it's unfair that men don't have to make that choice. They can "have it all", having an all-consuming career whilst wifey holds down the home front and takes care of kids, etc., and all the things that surgeon-hubby is too busy to attend to. Of course from another perspective, the man made a choice too; by being a surgeon, he will never have enough time to spend time with and enjoy the family he works so hard to support, and his children will forever be strangers to him, to a certain degree.

Or do men even have a choice? Our society can tolerate either a housewife or a successful career-woman, but generally ridicules a man who stays at home. He's "lost his balls" or is a "pansy". My mother strongly support womens' right to high-powered careers, but she ridicules her relatives/friends' husbands who are unable to bring home the money as "not real men". Men generally have only one acceptable role in society; breadwinner, just like men have one acceptable form of lower garment: pants (whereas women today can wear both pants or skirts).

I hope one day we as a society can tolerate a wide range of roles for both genders; that way future surgeons like Anastasis will be able to find quality househusbands, who will no longer have to be ashamed of their choice. And I will no longer have to be ashamed of my fondness for chick flicks like Titanic

 

[pagemmapants]

Someone else said there are plenty of gunner women pre-meds. Is this true? Maybe it's the culture of the area I live in but all the female premeds I know (with the exception of myself and one other) are all about meeting a guy in med school who will take care of them. I'm not kidding. Maybe it's different other places.

Girls like this make me sick. It's like a good 60% of the girls at my school who only go to get their "MRS." degree.



You'd think if they were going to put in the time and the effort to make it to med school they'd at least have enough of an interest in it and enough pride to follow through, even if it DOES end up being a 4 day/week career in a cooperative FP.

Me? I want my damn scalpels.

Don't get me wrong, I want my twin boys at some point, too, but Mr. Seilienne is gonna have to take care of the diapers.

 

[OwnageMobile]

I had the ratio as more like 3:1 guys:women
Aparently it isn't so. Good to know. Why can't more girls be internet savvy.

 

[TheMightyAngus]

Someone else said there are plenty of gunner women pre-meds. Is this true? Maybe it's the culture of the area I live in but all the female premeds I know (with the exception of myself and one other) are all about meeting a guy in med school who will take care of them. I'm not kidding. Maybe it's different other places.

If what you say is true, then why are there more female applicants than male, and why are most med schools over half women? I dont think adcoms would be sympathetic if women imparted a desire to leave the medical field or work part-time because they want to raise a family.