Ask LizzyM (Almost) Anything 2012 edition

[LizzyM]

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Generally, are teaching experiences, such as private tutoring and teaching assistant classified under Teaching or Employment, Paid?

You make the call. You can choose either of those or "volunteer, non-clinical" depending on whether it was paid or unpaid. I prefer "employment" or "volunteer" because from the decription I can tell if it was teaching but I suppose some schools are specifically looking for that "teaching" label and hence it is included in the ACMAS application as a choice.

 

[member10358]

I have applied to a few research-heavy schools with March notification dates, and my first publication (first-authored) should be coming out in February or March. Should I notify adcoms of this before it is actually published? I am concerned because I don't have anything tangible other than this for my 2.5 years of research so far.

Thank you for doing this! It is very helpful.

 

[LizzyM]

If I don't get in this year. Just if, should I do a Masters (I want to end up with an MD/PhD, so if I do an MSc now then an MD/PhD, the MSc would be unnecessary) or simply research without a degree for one year only? or a PhD then an MD (although I'd prefer getting acquainted to areas through an MD before specializing)?

Thanks

How should I know what is the best choice for you? Talk to a real person who knows you and who is familiar with the academic programs you are considering.

 

[NotYou20]

I have no idea how those are handled by the subcommittee that deals with that. Even a warning is an institutional action and should be reported. A IA that has been "wiped away" must be reported.

Thank you for doing this. I'm a freshman and just completed my first semester, which went pretty well. However, I was involved in an incident with noise violation and alcohol, although I was not drinking. After meeting with the Residence Director at my school, she decided that I was drinking and therefore also broke the law in addition to being in the presence of alcohol and the noise violation. I now have the option to further challenge this ruling. I will have a warning for a year whether or not I successfully appeal the two violations I did not commit.

Would the charges of being under the influence and law violations be a significant red flag to medical schools? Would just the noise violation and dry room policy violation be a big problem?

Thanks again, I appreciate your help.

 

[LizzyM]

What happens to update letters or letters of intent when you send them in? Who reads them? If the admissions committee has already met and "scored" your file, then will these letters have no/minimal effect?

Thanks LizzyM!

They get added to the file. Someone in the office might read them, the person making decisions about taking people off the waitlist might read them if you end up on the waitlist.

Once a final decision has been made on your file, it is final so the only time it really helps is when you are waitlisted and then it is not the adcom but "the big boss" who is making decisions.

 

[LizzyM]

Hello! My GPA is just slightly over (.06ish lol) The average GPA at my top choice school. Does that make me above average or average? My MCAT score is pretty much dead on for that school and I thought my interview went well.

I'm really just asking how much above an average do you have to be to be above average?

So your LizzyM score is 0.6 points above the school's score (uncorrected). That's about a 2% difference. I'd say that's average.

 

[lobo.solo]

You could have a very good case for combining a career in medicine and advocacy with a focus on environmental health. You might have a good shot at schools that have a strong program in occupational medicine. google residency occupational medicine and you'll find some good links. I think that you can make a good story that is unusual if not unique and that holds together in an interesting way.

Excellent!! thank you and have a happy holidays. 🙂

 

[LizzyM]

I have applied to a few research-heavy schools with March notification dates, and my first publication (first-authored) should be coming out in February or March. Should I notify adcoms of this before it is actually published? I am concerned because I don't have anything tangible other than this for my 2.5 years of research so far.

Thank you for doing this! It is very helpful.

Send an update letter with the good news that [citation] is "in press" with an expected publication date in early 2013. It can't hurt & might help.

 

[LizzyM]

Thank you for doing this. I'm a freshman and just completed my first semester, which went pretty well. However, I was involved in an incident with noise violation and alcohol, although I was not drinking. After meeting with the Residence Director at my school, she decided that I was drinking and therefore also broke the law in addition to being in the presence of alcohol and the noise violation. I now have the option to further challenge this ruling. I will have a warning for a year whether or not I successfully appeal the two violations I did not commit.

Would the charges of being under the influence and law violations be a significant red flag to medical schools? Would just the noise violation and dry room policy violation be a big problem?

Thanks again, I appreciate your help.

I have not seen underage drinking, noises violations and MIP (minor in possession) being treated harshly by the people at my school who make decisions about that portion of the application. However, if you think that you were adjustly accused of something you did not do, and you want to fight to clear your name of that false charge, then go for it.

 

[magicm]

They don't matter to me but might matter to some people.


We very, very seldom discuss applicants who have or who are pursing a MSc so I don't have any insights.

Hi LizzyM thanks for the insight. I was wondering if this was because you don't get a significant number of graduate applicants or do they just not go very far in the processes?

 

[Dick Jones]

Thanks for this thread LizzyM.

I was lucky enough to be invited to interview at two top 30 schools but my stats are mediocre at best. Can you give me an idea why I was invited?

 

[Si Se Puede]

Would you be willing to read the topic sentence of my personal statement (to see if it makes sense) if I sent you a PM? It involves a somewhat paradoxical viewpoint that makes sense to me but I am not sure it would to adcom members.

 

[BABSstudent]

Would you be willing to briefly read over my personal statement (to see if it makes sense) if I sent you a PM? It involves a somewhat paradoxical viewpoint that makes sense to me but I am not sure it would to adcom members.

Read her first post. You broke one of the three rules.

I think that means you are getting coal for Christmas.

 

[Hemorrage]

We see that straight away, before we even open the AMCAS application. We'll also look at the grades for that year to see if it was all Bs or if it was a D or F that dragged down mostly B+ grades and what classes the poorer grades were in.

No advice. What's done is done... do your best and hope for the best.

Hi LizzyM,

Thanks for the feedback.. i really appreciate it. When you said you "see that straight away before you even open the AMCAS" what does that mean? Is there some kind of a GPA trend graph or something on each AMCAS portfolio? Also, i've earned 3.6-3.9 GPAs since after freshman year while taking 18-22 credits a semester (killing myself) by taking 4-5 science classes with lab. Does this matter at all or are adcoms as cut and dry about numbers as everyone says they are?

 

[Ipsca]

Hi LizzyM!

What are your thoughts on retaking a prereq? Specifically, I completed the first semester of organic chemistry and did well. I still need to take the second semester. Would it be a good idea to retake the first semester at my postbac (it would be 4 years after I completed the course originally), so that I'm prepared for semester #2? Or would that be looked upon unfavorably?

I'm down for a challenge, but I worry that if I don't take the first semester at my postbac, I'll miss out on info that is specific to the way my professor teaches orgo, the way the lab runs, etc.

Thanks for your advice- I'm a longtime lurker, and your posts have been fantastic in helping me think about this process.

 

[argama]

Hi LizzyM! Thanks for doing this!! 😀

I got a silly question I guess: I spent 2.5ish years in a bench/basic sciences lab and got one publication out of it and I spent like 3 months in a clinical lab and got two more publications on it... are they all weighted equally? I definitely put a lot more effort, work, and time in my basic sciences pub (so I'm actually much more proud of that one) whereas the clinical one, I spent much less work and time. If I got a letter of rec from the first PI but not the second PI would that be awk?

As for rise in GPA trend, if i started freshman year 3.43 cGPA and now a senior i have 3.62 cGPA is that really noticeable, or is that just like "meh not much improvement he should have had higher to be noticeable"?

Thanks!

 

[Si Se Puede]

Is it true that publications are weighed only when you are the first or second author or possibly the third author if the paper has a plethora of authors on it? It would seem appropriate since the primary two authors are usually responsible for the bulk of the intellectual contributions to a publication, the rest having contributed ususally in smaller, technical aspects.

Also, is the number of publications taken into consideration? One could argue that it is an accomplishment to have more second author papers but one could also argue that each field of research is different in terms of time to produce a paper (e.g. electrophysiology vs. immunology vs clinical).

Are publications of appropriate authorship weighed more than oral presentations, poster conferences, honors theses?

 

[ilikevegetables]

Hey LizzyM! Thanks a ton for doing this.

You've mentioned a couple times that when people took the MCAT/how much time they had to study for it can matter. I got an interview at a school where my MCAT is low, but I had quite a bit on my plate (working full time in a managerial position + taking classes) when I was studying for/taking it. Is this something I should bring up in the interview? Or should I avoid bringing their attention to my somewhat subpar score/will it already be obvious because both the job and the classes are listed on my AMCAS?

Thanks again!

 

[LizzyM]

Hi LizzyM thanks for the insight. I was wondering if this was because you don't get a significant number of graduate applicants or do they just not go very far in the processes?

We get some applicants who do an MS or MPH but very few who earn a degree that is granted when one has completed the coursework portion toward a PhD. It could be that they don't get far in the process due to poor grades in undergrad or in grad school.

 

[LizzyM]

Thanks for this thread LizzyM.

I was lucky enough to be invited to interview at two top 30 schools but my stats are mediocre at best. Can you give me an idea why I was invited?

You have some interesting life experiences and your stats are "good enough" to convince the schools that you can do the work??? Seems like a logical explanation to me. You've had quite a few IIs, I see.

 

[LizzyM]

Would you be willing to read the topic sentence of my personal statement (to see if it makes sense) if I sent you a PM? It involves a somewhat paradoxical viewpoint that makes sense to me but I am not sure it would to adcom members.

No puede, Si Se Puede.

 

[LizzyM]

Hi LizzyM,

Thanks for the feedback.. i really appreciate it. When you said you "see that straight away before you even open the AMCAS" what does that mean? Is there some kind of a GPA trend graph or something on each AMCAS portfolio? Also, i've earned 3.6-3.9 GPAs since after freshman year while taking 18-22 credits a semester (killing myself) by taking 4-5 science classes with lab. Does this matter at all or are adcoms as cut and dry about numbers as everyone says they are?

When we used paper applications, the folder had a pre-printed label with cGPA, sGPA, and gpa by academic year, school name and major, plus MCAT score. Now we have the same thing on a web page that pulls the data from the AMCAS. From that web page we can open the AMCAS which is a pdf. That's all I meant.

 

[LizzyM]

Hi LizzyM!

What are your thoughts on retaking a prereq? Specifically, I completed the first semester of organic chemistry and did well. I still need to take the second semester. Would it be a good idea to retake the first semester at my postbac (it would be 4 years after I completed the course originally), so that I'm prepared for semester #2? Or would that be looked upon unfavorably?

I'm down for a challenge, but I worry that if I don't take the first semester at my postbac, I'll miss out on info that is specific to the way my professor teaches orgo, the way the lab runs, etc.

Thanks for your advice- I'm a longtime lurker, and your posts have been fantastic in helping me think about this process.

I doubt I'd even notice that... If I did notice, I'd wonder if you were trying to boost your gpa by retaking a course in which you did well the first time around. It seems a bit suspicious. On the other hand, you've been away from it for 4 years. You make the call.

 

[LizzyM]

Hi LizzyM! Thanks for doing this!! 😀

I got a silly question I guess: I spent 2.5ish years in a bench/basic sciences lab and got one publication out of it and I spent like 3 months in a clinical lab and got two more publications on it... are they all weighted equally? I definitely put a lot more effort, work, and time in my basic sciences pub (so I'm actually much more proud of that one) whereas the clinical one, I spent much less work and time. If I got a letter of rec from the first PI but not the second PI would that be awk?

All the publications are good. A letter from each PI is ideal but take what you can get.

As for rise in GPA trend, if i started freshman year 3.43 cGPA and now a senior i have 3.62 cGPA is that really noticeable, or is that just like "meh not much improvement he should have had higher to be noticeable"?

Thanks!

A 3.62 having started with a 3.43 is fine. Maybe not fine for top tier schools (those with average gpa of 3.75 or higher) but not horrible.

 

[Jas1360]

That was a good question, I had a similar situation where I took orgo I and had too easy of a teacher, to the point that I got an A and learned nothing. I ended up retaking at a different school with a better teacher and had to work for an A. I would have been screwed though, if I did not get an A the second time. I am very glad I retook with the btpetter instructor because I probably would have failed second semester if I had not retaken the first semester and actually learned the material.

To the person who asked, from a learning perspective, it might be best to take it again if you remember nothing from the last time you took it. But you better be sure that you do well the second time around.

 

[LizzyM]

Is it true that publications are weighed only when you are the first or second author or possibly the third author if the paper has a plethora of authors on it? It would seem appropriate since the primary two authors are usually responsible for the bulk of the intellectual contributions to a publication, the rest having contributed ususally in smaller, technical aspects.

Also, is the number of publications taken into consideration? One could argue that it is an accomplishment to have more second author papers but one could also argue that each field of research is different in terms of time to produce a paper (e.g. electrophysiology vs. immunology vs clinical).

Are publications of appropriate authorship weighed more than oral presentations, poster conferences, honors theses?

first author publications and doctoral dissertations are rated higher than other papers, senior theses, & presentations. Other than that, everything is about equal.

 

[LizzyM]

Hey LizzyM! Thanks a ton for doing this.

You've mentioned a couple times that when people took the MCAT/how much time they had to study for it can matter. I got an interview at a school where my MCAT is low, but I had quite a bit on my plate (working full time in a managerial position + taking classes) when I was studying for/taking it. Is this something I should bring up in the interview? Or should I avoid bringing their attention to my somewhat subpar score/will it already be obvious because both the job and the classes are listed on my AMCAS?

Thanks again!

If you are asked how you prepared for the MCAT, feel free to talk about it. If not, it may have been noted already and may be part of what got you the interview in the first place.

 

[areserine]

Hi Lizzy, thanks so much for all of the advice!

I have two somewhat specific questions, if you don't mind.

1) I understand the benefits of an upward GPA trend, but would a poor (3.1-3.3) GPA freshman year, then holding steady at about a 3.7-3.8 for the last three years ever be looked at more like the final three years? The overall average would be around a 3.6, but would the sustained 3.7-3.8 push the applicant into the next overall tier for consideration? I ask because there seems to be a major difference between a GPA of 3.6 and one of 3.75, but maybe this difference isn't as big as it seems when other factors are considered.

2) What sorts of non-clinical gap year activities are still impressive to adcoms? For example, for someone who is interested in medicine partially for the ability to know and teach people complicated science, would working in outdoor youth science education be comparable to someone interested in research working in a research lab? I also noticed that you didn't mention clinical research in your initial list of gap year activities, is clinical research not looked on as positively as bench research?

Thanks!

 

[nemo123]

Would a slightly lower sophomore and junior year GPA be negative in the ADCOM's eyes? I got a 4.0 freshman year, but then my sophomore was a 3.9 and it seems that this year (junior year), it's going to be about a 3.8. Is that bad or is it okay as long as the overall GPA is around or above a school's average (it seems like, according to MSAR that some schools have an average accepted GPA of 3.9 or higher)? And also, the MSAR lists 90th percentiles for average accepted GPAs... Should we take these with a grain of salt? Because some of those numbers are extremely high (ie over 3.95)...

 

[galaxyx]

You've mentioned that AMCAS shows grades by year. Does that mean that taking one full load semester and one semester off will look like taking two half load semesters or are all post-bacc classes on one line together? Does it look better for a postbacc applicant to have a recent full course load even if they did well under a full course load as an undergrad?

 

[argama]

Thanks! I'm just curious, but how much attention would an applicant garner if he/she really did start a stable & successful non-profit organization with some family resources (like say a wealthy aunt & uncle sponsored it)? Not saying I did that but just curious.

 

[EnergyDrink]

Thanks for doing this again, LizzyM.

Where do you see medical school tuition going in the next 5-10 years? At what point do the tuition increases cease?

Other than the recent changes, do you see the government doing anything more to offset the cost of attendance in terms of grants? What do you think should be done?

 

[Si Se Puede]

No puede, Si Se Puede.

Heehee 😀

 

[Ichiban88]

Dear LizzyM,
Do you know of any external scholarships applicants apply for before/during med school? I am looking for them but have been unsuccessful.

 

[EarthtoneJon]

Hi LizzyM,

Have you ever personally reviewed an applicant with university level teaching experience (e.g.an adjunct professor)? Would this be impressive to an admissions committee?

 

[LizzyM]

Hi Lizzy, thanks so much for all of the advice!

I have two somewhat specific questions, if you don't mind.

1) I understand the benefits of an upward GPA trend, but would a poor (3.1-3.3) GPA freshman year, then holding steady at about a 3.7-3.8 for the last three years ever be looked at more like the final three years? The overall average would be around a 3.6, but would the sustained 3.7-3.8 push the applicant into the next overall tier for consideration? I ask because there seems to be a major difference between a GPA of 3.6 and one of 3.75, but maybe this difference isn't as big as it seems when other factors are considered.

What you describes would look like this:

Year 1 3.10
Year 2 3.70
year 3 3.75
year 4 3.80
total 3.59

assuming each year has the same number of credits.

So that looks like a poor first year followed by better years. Sadly, the final gpa is less than what we want to see at the schools that put a big emphasis on numbers.

But, we'd look at the courses and grades from the first year and decide if there were things so bad that they cause concern, or if there are no worries.

2) What sorts of non-clinical gap year activities are still impressive to adcoms? For example, for someone who is interested in medicine partially for the ability to know and teach people complicated science, would working in outdoor youth science education be comparable to someone interested in research working in a research lab? I also noticed that you didn't mention clinical research in your initial list of gap year activities, is clinical research not looked on as positively as bench research?

Thanks!

Clinical research is often mostly clerical work in an office with, perhaps, some interaction with people who are participating in research studies (e.g. asking them to complete paperwork, scheduling their appointments). It isn't impressive to many people who highly value bench research but it can be impressive to some.

If you can make a good explanation about why you have chosen a specific gap year job and why it is meaningful to you, then you should be fine.

 

[LizzyM]

Would a slightly lower sophomore and junior year GPA be negative in the ADCOM's eyes? I got a 4.0 freshman year, but then my sophomore was a 3.9 and it seems that this year (junior year), it's going to be about a 3.8. Is that bad or is it okay as long as the overall GPA is around or above a school's average (it seems like, according to MSAR that some schools have an average accepted GPA of 3.9 or higher)? And also, the MSAR lists 90th percentiles for average accepted GPAs... Should we take these with a grain of salt? Because some of those numbers are extremely high (ie over 3.95)...

It is completely reasonable to think that 10% of the class has a gpa of 3.95 or higher so I would not take those 90th percentiles with a grain of salt.

A downward trend in gpa is not terrible if you bottom out at 3.8 and end up with a 3.85 or better. No worries.

 

[Josh7]

What are your opinions on professional societies like ACS or IEEE? Would involvement in these look bad since they focus on making connections in other field besides medicine?

Also I'm curious how admissions folk view people in pre-medical fraternities. Doesn't it look strange when a group of 100 students has 20 people in leadership roles? I assume these title-creating clubs are taken with a grain of salt? (Not putting people in these groups down, just an observation I made when I went to the pre med fraternity info meeting)

Thanks!

 

[LizzyM]

You've mentioned that AMCAS shows grades by year. Does that mean that taking one full load semester and one semester off will look like taking two half load semesters or are all post-bacc classes on one line together?

AMCAS counts each years worth of classes (somewhere between 24 and 36 credits as a year even if you do it over a number of years. So a semester off would be ignored and the next active semester would be counted as part of that "year".

Does it look better for a postbacc applicant to have a recent full course load even if they did well under a full course load as an undergrad?

It depends. In some cases, it is clear that a person doesn't have the luxury of quitting their job and going back full time. In other cases, it provides additional evidence that the student can handle the full time load.

 

[LizzyM]

Thanks! I'm just curious, but how much attention would an applicant garner if he/she really did start a stable & successful non-profit organization with some family resources (like say a wealthy aunt & uncle sponsored it)? Not saying I did that but just curious.

As I said last year, I don't answer hypotheticals.

 

[LizzyM]

Thanks for doing this again, LizzyM.

Where do you see medical school tuition going in the next 5-10 years?

Up.

At what point do the tuition increases cease?

Never

Other than the recent changes, do you see the government doing anything more to offset the cost of attendance in terms of grants?

No

What do you think should be done?

Provide loan forgiveness to physicians who are willing to serve long term (at least 5-10 years) in undesirable locations.

 

[LizzyM]

Dear LizzyM,
Do you know of any external scholarships applicants apply for before/during med school? I am looking for them but have been unsuccessful.

No.

 

[LizzyM]

Hi LizzyM,

Have you ever personally reviewed an applicant with university level teaching experience (e.g.an adjunct professor)? Would this be impressive to an admissions committee?

I don't recall seeing anything like that. Adjunct status isn't very impressive, anyway. What would be impressive would be the research, etc that lead to a PhD degree that preceeded the job as an adjunct.

 

[phikapdoctor]

Is moving out of your parents house across town a "good" excuse for a grade dip? I had a 3.7 now I'm graduating the CC with a 3.6.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN Mobile app please excuse punctuation and spelling

 

[LizzyM]

What are your opinions on professional societies like ACS or IEEE? Would involvement in these look bad since they focus on making connections in other field besides medicine?

Meh. Only that it shows that you are not a loner. Are you talking about the student chapters of these organizations or participation during a time when you were employed in a profession outside of medicine?

Also I'm curious how admissions folk view people in pre-medical fraternities. Doesn't it look strange when a group of 100 students has 20 people in leadership roles? I assume these title-creating clubs are taken with a grain of salt? (Not putting people in these groups down, just an observation I made when I went to the pre med fraternity info meeting)

Thanks!

Of course, we don't know that there are 20 leaders because we see just one application at a time unless we go to the web site of the group and see how it is organized. I looked once at the clubs active on our undergrad campus and I was rather surprised at how many of them there are. I think that's why club membership and leadershp is not very impressive unless it is a group that is exceptionally well known (e.g. some of the best a capella groups and marching bands).

 

[Dick Jones]

Thanks again LizzyM! I have another question. Is working to support yourself during undergrad a valid excuse for not doing research? Also, I've done "research" for my university that would influence changes in the current curriculum. Is this looked upon favorably?

 

[LizzyM]

Is moving out of your parents house across town a "good" excuse for a grade dip? I had a 3.7 now I'm graduating the CC with a 3.6.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN Mobile app please excuse punctuation and spelling

😕

No. Breaking seven bones and being hospitalized for 3 weeks in mid semeser is a good excuse. Moving, not so much.

 

[LizzyM]

Thanks again LizzyM! I have another question. Is working to support yourself during undergrad a valid excuse for not doing research? Also, I've done "research" for my university that would influence changes in the current curriculum. Is this looked upon favorably?

Don't you have seven interviews? Clearly, you did ok without having done traditional research and your application has been looked upon favorably. 👍

 

[Si Se Puede]

If club/organization officers are not seen as good sources of leadership, then what would be seen as good leadership? What about SI "leaders" and housing resident assistants? I can't think of anything more outside clubs/organizations.

 

[Dick Jones]

Don't you have seven interviews? Clearly, you did ok without having done traditional research and your application has been looked upon favorably. 👍

You're definitely right...I think it's just nerves at this point. I haven't gotten any acceptances so I'm kind of worried.