Be ahead of the curve

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The four most expensive words in English: This time is different.
Nothing is different. Technology advances, there are early, middle, and late adapters just like always. It happens over and over and everything is the same.

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I just hope my bitcoin doesn’t go the same way my JDSU stock went 20 years ago. Google it for those who are younger.

Tesla will go the same way JDSU did back then because electric cars are a commodity based product deserving a multiple of 15 not 1900.
 
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This attitude held by many of the classic investors that still dominate the market is what allows me to keep buying bitcoin at low cost and as those people cycle out of the market and we move into a completely digital future with people who don't resist the change I'll cash in and then cash out. Easiest long term play there is.
Does this digital future also have a single United people with no government? Remind us did intel or Facebook render the fed obsolete and threaten the national economy?
 
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Does this digital future also have a single United people with no government? Remind us did intel or Facebook render the fed obsolete and threaten the national economy?
Well now I’ve suffered an injury because my eyes rolled too far back into my head.
 
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Cryptocurrency is an interesting topic but I keep having pause at some of the issues related to it.

From what I understand, it's meant to be a digital currency. How useful can it be when it is so volatile? 1 year ago, 1 bitcoin was ~$8,000 and 5 years ago ~$300. How is this even useful other than to some of the lucky speculators?

Some people say a bitcoin will be worth $100k while others say it will be worth in the $1k to $5k range. Again this is all random hearsay from anonymous online people who may have ulterior motives of pumping up the value of bitcoin etc. This degree of volatility gives me and others pause.

And I laugh when people say bitcoin is undervalued. One bitcoin is more than 1 months salary for me. Feels like a lot of money.

I went from being able to buy a Playstation with 1 bitcoin to buying a new car. Sucks if you bought the Playstation.

There are only 21 million bitcoin and 20% are lost and probably won't be recovered. How does this help if it's supposed to be currency?

Similarly, I keep reading that a significant number of bitcoin are owned by a small amount of people leading to the ability to manipulate the market. I know this happens with the regular market but at least it's illegal and the SEC can do something about it. With bitcoin, it's the wild west and not illegal to tank the market.

I will happily admit that my ignorance of cryptocurrency/bitcoin caused me to miss the boat but I'm still scratching my head at cryptocurrency in general. I have missed the boat on plenty of other things due to my ignorance and/or lack of available funds to invest/gamble in high risk investments.

Oh well, VTSAX and chill for me.
 
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Bitcoin is just like all other volatile assets in that by the time my grandpa and all the guys at work who aren't market junkies are asking about it....the easy money has been made. Could it be Amazon at $5 a share? Sure. But just remember that investing and trading are about *risk-adjusted* total return, not just total return.
 
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In many ways, Bitcoin functions primarily as a proof of concept rather than the definitive cryptocurrency of the future. It proves that blockchain technology is viable for a variety of applications, including as an alternative, decentralized currency solution. Other platforms, like Ethereum, aim to improve blockchain technology and offer additional solutions not strictly limited to currency.

There’s simply too much money in bitcoin for traditional investors to ignore it at the moment. That being said, Ethereum is likely the crypto platform that has greater application for a future that embraces blockchain tech.
 

The HODL crowd was right about the institutional surge but will they also be right about the government adoption or will the world governments freeze their fiat out of the crypto space? If that happens will it still have value like the true believers think or will it end up being worthless?
 
The majority of bitcoins are still held in online investments wallets. If the US govt can shutdown online poker and the associated wire and credit card transactions essentially overnight, they can probably do the same with online wallets through various regulatory processes or new legislation. I suspect that for a long time BTC will only have value in as much as it can be converted to fiat currency, so if this process is halted by a number of major countries forcing people to hold BTC offline instead of in convenient places like Coinbase where one can store, transact, convert, and withdraw, the value is gonna collapse.
 
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The majority of bitcoins are still held in online investments wallets. If the US govt can shutdown online poker and the associated wire and credit card transactions essentially overnight, they can probably do the same with online wallets through various regulatory processes or new legislation. I suspect that for a long time BTC will only have value in as much as it can be converted to fiat currency, so if this process is halted by a number of major countries forcing people to hold BTC offline instead of in convenient places like Coinbase where one can store, transact, convert, and withdraw, the value is gonna collapse.

For BTC to truly go to zero, you will need 100% consensus from all governments on the planet to ban it at the same time. I see that as highly unlikely because although the US is the the “world leader” there are nations that will not because of past or current policies.

We’re already seeing municipalities attract talent in the crypto industry. Just look at what’s going on in Miami. Once a city fully embraces crypto with incentives (taxation, crypto services and friendly legislation) crypto, other cities in the country will follow and we may see an “industrial revolution” in the form of crypto adoption and development. We are closer than a lot of people realize. It’s still so early. 2nd or 3rd inning imo.
 
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/to...vestment-to-create-crypto-hotbed/ar-BB1cL3ol

The mayor of Miami wants to make his city more appealing to Big Tech by embracing bitcoin and even investing some government funds in the cryptocurrency.

“If I would have done it last year, I would have made 200 plus percent,” Mayor Francis Suarez said on FOX Business' “Varney and Co.” “So I would have looked like a genius.”

MARK CUBAN PREDICTS BITCOIN, TOP CRYPTOS TO THRIVE LIKE TECH-BUBBLE SURVIVORS

The mayor told host Stuart Varney that Miami is looking into allowing citizens to pay taxes and fees to the city in bitcoin.

“We want to be one of the most crypto-forward and technological cities in the country,” he said. “So we're looking at … creating a regulatory framework that makes us the easiest place in the United States to do business if you're doing it in cryptocurrencies.”

LOSING A BITCOIN PASSWORD CAN COST HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS

Bitcoin surged by as much as 284% from the beginning of October through its record high of $40,797 on Jan. 7. After significant losses earlier this week, the cryptocurrency has bounced back, with the price hitting above $40,000 for a certain period of time on Thursday morning, according to CoinDesk.

Suarez is hoping the move toward bitcoin may appeal to the tech industry and lead more high-tech companies to move to Miami.

CLICK HERE TO READ MORE ON FOX BUSINESS

“I want the creative and the innovative class to come here and create high-paying jobs for my residents,” he said.

Suarez said bitcoin is “a very attractive investment” and that the city of Miami is considering “diversifying our investment portfolio” and holding a percentage of investments in bitcoin.

He believes the price of bitcoin will increase as the currency becomes more mainstream.

“It's only going to go up,” Suarez said.

GET FOX BUSINESS ON THE GO BY CLICKING HERE

FOX Business’ Jonathan Garber contributed to this article.
 
The majority of bitcoins are still held in online investments wallets. If the US govt can shutdown online poker and the associated wire and credit card transactions essentially overnight, they can probably do the same with online wallets through various regulatory processes or new legislation. I suspect that for a long time BTC will only have value in as much as it can be converted to fiat currency, so if this process is halted by a number of major countries forcing people to hold BTC offline instead of in convenient places like Coinbase where one can store, transact, convert, and withdraw, the value is gonna collapse.
Precisely. The value of a bitcoin in another country's currency is irrelevant to me if I can't convert it to usd and use it to pay for things I want locally. It is far too volatile to be used as a primary medium of exchange (the same way I can't pay for my groceries in tesla shares) and if the us government makes it illegal or very difficult to convert to usd then all this investor money that drove the price to the stratosphere will evaporate.
 
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Yellen had some things to say about bitcoin today.

It's just fantasy to think governments won't crush it when it gets to be sufficiently inconvenient. No idea when that'll be. Speculators gonna speculate.
 
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Yellen had some things to say about bitcoin today.

It's just fantasy to think governments won't crush it when it gets to be sufficiently inconvenient. No idea when that'll be. Speculators gonna speculate.

Well you can turn off the internet, but we’ll have bigger issues to deal with. This is a decentralized project. The ideas and development is occurring everywhere. You have to start thinking about this as a a global money and way to transact and trade. All of the luxuries we’ve been afforded by having the world reserve currency has let a lot of Americans guard down. I agree that some governments will wage war on a decentralized global phenomenon, but those that believe this will lead to self-sovereignty will continue to develop and make this technology user friendly in a non-custodial way.

This thread isn’t here for a I told you so. I’m here to wake folks up, challenge me and do the knowledge about what I’m talking about. Good luck to you.
 
Well you can turn off the internet, but we’ll have bigger issues to deal with. This is a decentralized project. The ideas and development is occurring everywhere. You have to start thinking about this as a a global money and way to transact and trade.
Thats just it, bitcoin itself is worthless as a medium of exchange for goods and services if it can't be exchanged into spendable currencies. And governments absolutely can control those choke points. Look at the effects that financial sanctions have on entire nations and their own currencies.

How are you going to buy a car, eat at a restaurant, or pay those guys in the Home Depot parking lot to build a fence for you, if your crypto currency can't be converted to local currencies that can actually be spent?
 
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Give it time brother, and I’ll tell you this; technology is deflationary like you mentioned earlier but it’s also exponential in development. The rails to spend your crypto is already here and being built out faster than any government can regulate. I can give examples of houses, cars and other goods and services paid for using crypto, but give it time for development to continue.

This is a long game and at this point BTC is a store of (long term) value. Mainstream use of transacting will be here before you know it.

Be ahead of the curve of adoption.
 
Give it time brother, and I’ll tell you this; technology is deflationary like you mentioned earlier but it’s also exponential in development. The rails to spend your crypto is already here and being built out faster than any government can regulate. I can give examples of houses, cars and other goods and services paid for using crypto, but give it time for development to continue.

This is a long game and at this point BTC is a store of (long term) value. Mainstream use of transacting will be here before you know it.

Be ahead of the curve of adoption.
Awesome--show us an example of a house in the United States being paid for with crypto and no usd in the transaction.
 
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Give it time brother, and I’ll tell you this; technology is deflationary like you mentioned earlier but it’s also exponential in development. The rails to spend your crypto is already here and being built out faster than any government can regulate. I can give examples of houses, cars and other goods and services paid for using crypto, but give it time for development to continue.

This is a long game and at this point BTC is a store of (long term) value. Mainstream use of transacting will be here before you know it.

Be ahead of the curve of adoption.

A contrarian view: BTC is based on artificial scarcity and has no real application other than speculation. Decentralization is an interesting concept, but it is energy and bandwidth intensive workaround for developing encryption technologies. It advertises itself as a digital currency although you would be hard pressed to find anyone actually believing this given its extreme volatility. Its business model is based on popularity. Few people understand what blockchain is. Your neighbor's grandma buying into it "because it can only go up" certainly doesn't. Get enough people to talk about BTC and put their money into it with the hope that it will appreciate in value. The early adopters make bank. The later adopters get screwed. Sound familiar? In 5 years something new will surpass bitcoin technology and it will be worthless.
 
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Give it time brother, and I’ll tell you this; technology is deflationary like you mentioned earlier but it’s also exponential in development. The rails to spend your crypto is already here and being built out faster than any government can regulate. I can give examples of houses, cars and other goods and services paid for using crypto, but give it time for development to continue.

This is a long game and at this point BTC is a store of (long term) value. Mainstream use of transacting will be here before you know it.

Be ahead of the curve of adoption.

Where is the final value of bitcoin going to land though?

That is my issue. It's supposed to be digital currency but it's volatility is like some high flying tech stock. At least a stock is upfront about being an investment with a chance at a loss.

As far as being a long term store of value, if I got in 5 years ago, then I would agree 100%. You have really nothing to lose then. But when 1 bitcoin can fluctuate between 20,000 to nearly 40,000 dollars nowadays, it would probably be prudent to be more conservative.
 
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I will personally take my attending salary in btc/ETH. Yellen is goin to yell until the market asks for the actual big stick instead of rhetorics to care
 
I will personally take my attending salary in btc/ETH. Yellen is goin to yell until the market asks for the actual big stick instead of rhetorics to care
If you are interested in joining our group, we have the latest blockchain technology incorporated into our very own gascoin (patent pending) that we would be thrilled to pay you in😉.
 
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If you are interested in joining our group, we have the latest blockchain technology incorporated into our very own gascoin (patent pending) that we would be thrilled to pay you in😉.
You're behind the curve.

That's what USAP "stock" is. Well, minus the blockchain buzzword, anyway. We should all start calling it Gascoin.
 
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Be fearful when others are greedy...


The article is about the stock market bubble, not crypto, still it applies very well. It's the speculative psychology of the market that makes it dangerous today for the inexperienced investor.

As a reminder, crypto crashed like everything else last March.

"Even with hindsight, it is seldom easy to point to the pin that burst the bubble. The main reason for this lack of clarity is that the great bull markets did not break when they were presented with a major unexpected negative. Those events, like the portfolio insurance fiasco of 1987, tend to give sharp down legs and quick recoveries. They are in the larger scheme of things unique and technical and are not part of the ebb and flow of the great bubbles. The great bull markets typically turn down when the market conditions are very favorable, just subtly less favorable than they were yesterday. And that is why they are always missed.

Either way, the market is now checking off all the touchy-feely characteristics of a major bubble. The most impressive features are the intensity and enthusiasm of bulls, the breadth of coverage of stocks and the market, and, above all, the rising hostility toward bears. In 1929, to be a bear was to risk physical attack and guarantee character assassination. For us, 1999 was the only experience we have had of clients reacting as if we were deliberately and maliciously depriving them of gains. In comparison, 2008 was nothing. But in the last few months the hostile tone has been rapidly ratcheting up. The irony for bears though is that it’s exactly what we want to hear. It’s a classic precursor of the ultimate break; together with stocks rising, not for their fundamentals, but simply because they are rising."

"What to Do?

As often happens at bubbly peaks like 1929, 2000, and the Nifty Fifty of 1972 (a second-tier bubble in the company of champions), today’s market features extreme disparities in value by asset class, sector, and company. Those at the very cheap end include traditional value stocks all over the world, relative to growth stocks. Value stocks have had their worst-ever relative decade ending December 2019, followed by the worst-ever year in 2020, with spreads between Growth and Value performance averaging between 20 and 30 percentage points for the single year! Similarly, Emerging Market equities are at 1 of their 3, more or less co-equal, relative lows against the U.S. of the last 50 years. Not surprisingly, we believe it is in the overlap of these two ideas, Value and Emerging, that your relative bets should go, along with the greatest avoidance of U.S. Growth stocks that your career and business risk will allow. Good luck!"
 
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More of the same:

"Risk assets rallying on vaccine prospects are getting fresh impetus this year from bets that a win for U.S. Democrats in the Senate will spur further fiscal stimulus, adding to Federal Reserve largesse. The S&P 500 Index has surged more than 70% since its low last March, while the Nasdaq 100 has almost doubled and Bitcoin has soared above $30,000.

Central-bank balance sheets have ballooned in 2020, growing to a record size for the Fed and the European Central Bank. BofA expects the Fed balance sheet to reach 42% of U.S gross domestic product this year, while predicting the country’s budget deficit will hit 33% of GDP."
 
One thing that hasn’t been discussed. Bitcoin is incredibly environmentally unfriendly thanks to energy use in mining. In 2019 Bitcoin mining used more energy then the country of Switzerland. In 2020 on track to catch Finland or the Philippines. While a chunk of that is renewable, it is still energy that could have been used for other purposes or to replace non renewable energy. This is mostly Bitcoin specific IIRC, less so for other digital currencies.

We have enough environmental problems. We don’t need to add to them by forcing millions of computers to spend time doing make work calculations.
 
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One thing that hasn’t been discussed. Bitcoin is incredibly environmentally unfriendly thanks to energy use in mining. In 2019 Bitcoin mining used more energy then the country of Switzerland. In 2020 on track to catch Finland or the Philippines. While a chunk of that is renewable, it is still energy that could have been used for other purposes or to replace non renewable energy. This is mostly Bitcoin specific IIRC, less so for other digital currencies.

We have enough environmental problems. We don’t need to add to them by forcing millions of computers to spend time doing make work calculations.

Proof of stake is the future.
 
Anybody getting in on this GME short squeeze stuff?
 
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https://www.coindesk.com/harvard-y...n-buying-bitcoin-for-at-least-a-year-sources

Yale’s endowment has been rumored to be into crypto for a few years.


Some of the largest university endowment funds in the U.S. have been quietly buying cryptocurrency for the past year or so through accounts held at Coinbase and other exchanges, CoinDesk has learned.

According to two sources familiar with the situation, Harvard, Yale, Brown and the University of Michigan as well as several other colleges have been buying crypto directly on exchanges. (Several Ivy League endowments took an interest in blockchain technology via crypto-focused venture capital funds back in 2018.)

“There are quite a few,” said a source who asked to remain unnamed. “A lot of endowments are allocating a little bit to crypto at the moment.”

Yale and Brown did not respond to requests for comment by press time. When reached by CoinDesk, the Harvard and University of Michigan endowments declined to comment. Coinbase also declined to comment. University endowments got a single mention in Coinbase’s annual report for 2020, but without naming any names.

Some of the university endowment funds in question may have held accounts with Coinbase for as long as 18 months, according to one source.

“It could be since mid-2019,” the source said. “Most have been in at least a year. I would think they will probably discuss it publicly at some point this year. I suspect they would be sitting on some pretty nice chunks of return.”

University endowments are pools of capital accumulated by academic institutions, often in the form of charitable donations. These funds, which support teaching and research, can be allocated into various assets for investment purposes.

Harvard’s is the largest university endowment with over $40 billion in assets. Yale has over $30 billion, Michigan has about $12.5 billion, while Brown holds $4.7 billion. It is unknown how much each fund has allocated in crypto but it is likely a fraction of percent of their total assets.

Long road

Back in 2018, Yale University Chief Investment Officer David Swensen made headlines by backing two crypto-focused venture funds, one run by Andreessen Horowitz and another launched by Coinbase co-founder Fred Ehrsam and former Sequoia Capital partner Matt Huang.

Several other universities followed Yale in backing crypto VCs, including Harvard, Stanford, Dartmouth College, MIT, University of North Carolina and Michigan. Clearly, some of those schools appear to be taking the next step by investing directly in crypto assets.

The second source, who is involved in the crypto hedge fund world, pointed to “a big change” over the past few months. “We are seeing defined benefit pension plans getting close to making allocations. We are seeing public pension plans getting close to making allocations,” the person said.

“If I had heard that three years ago, I would have said it was wrong,” said Ari Paul, co-founder of BlockTower Capital and previously an investment manager for the University of Chicago. “But a lot of institutions are now comfortable with bitcoin. They understand it and can just buy it directly, as long as it’s from a regulated entity like Coinbase, Fidelity or Anchorage.”
 
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wallstreetbets bros still hammering the big boys...

Robinhood Accounts living up to their moniker.

Melvin Capital crying for the SEC to step in. F these guys.

What is there for SEC to do. Nothing illegal going on. Melvin and other hedge funds should be investigated for some of their shady ass manipulations these last few days
 
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What is there for SEC to do. Nothing illegal going on. Melvin and other hedge funds should be investigated for some of their shady ass manipulations these last few days
It is an exploitable "loophole" Nobody weeps for the pain of the hedge funds. Lots of schadenfreude in fact. But, I do expect the rules to change. Most likely to prevent ordinary investors doing what was just done, but preserving the ability of the hedge to keep doing what they have been.
 

wallstreetbets bros still hammering the big boys...

Robinhood Accounts living up to their moniker.

Melvin Capital crying for the SEC to step in. F these guys.

They were such dicks. They were able to get places like tdameritrade to stop letting people buy the stock, shut down the trading apps for some time today and put out fake news articles on cnbc to try to rattle the investors. They deserve to lose every penny they bet.
 
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They were such dicks. They were able to get places like tdameritrade to stop letting people buy the stock, shut down the trading apps for some time today and put out fake news articles on cnbc to try to rattle the investors. They deserve to lose every penny they bet.

Agree. I forget who said it, but these schmucks mistook leverage for genius and/or relied on their ability to exercise some control of the markets. Leverage sucks when it works against you and your level of control is less than you thought. I hope they are personally bankrupted, but I doubt that will happen. From my very little understanding of this corner of the financial markets there is still a lot of **** to unwind and a lot that can happen.
 
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Webull Etrade Fidelity havent sold out to the titans yet...I believe I can buy on my Vanguard app too.

Taking all my cash and stocks away from Robinhood now. Unreal Robinhood of all companies would bow to the Masters of the Universe. Probably would pay to know who owns them...
 
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whats up with this doge coin pump and dump
 
Webull Etrade Fidelity havent sold out to the titans yet...I believe I can buy on my Vanguard app too.

Taking all my cash and stocks away from Robinhood now. Unreal Robinhood of all companies would bow to the Masters of the Universe. Probably would pay to know who owns them...
Citadel
 
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12D7434E-DC13-4D2B-9307-3A030195E63A.jpeg
 
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