josebiwasabi

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lollll what just happened

I felt like that test was a good opportunity to prove what I didn't learn over the past two years. Oh well whatever, it's over now.

Why hello there 3rd year!
 

shenanigans327

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lollll what just happened

I felt like that test was a good opportunity to prove what I didn't learn over the past two years. Oh well whatever, it's over now.

Why hello there 3rd year!
seriously...........


where was any of this even taught??? :mad:
 
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Long time reader, first time posting. I just felt inclined to say, or rather ask...what on god's earth was THAT?
 

OhEmGee

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so lets take bets on the national average.

I wanna say high 70s, maybe 77%
 

bellasees

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Did anyone feel like they had a lot upper anatomy questions? I had a lot of questions on the ligaments of the foot but hardly any on major innervation, blood supply or action on the muscles of the lower extremity. The exam did not follow the breakdown that was presented to us.
 
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i think i had 2 questions on the hip... most of my LEA questions was about facets, joints, specific attachment of ligament questions and names of structures on the surfaces of bones that i never heard of before. I had about 5 questions on ossification dates.

I was really thrown off by histology... i had several questions with slides where i had to identify the cells.
 

shenanigans327

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Look on the bright side... Now you know what to do if you happen to go swimming in the Nile and get itchy...:D
 

jellybean2020

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For those who just took it, what would you estimate the % split of the different subjects was? I take it from your reactions it didn't follow the "official" %'s?
 

shadesofgrey

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I'm not sure what the split was, but the test was not what I was expecting...

The questions seemed to focus on things that I would say were not generally important. It just didn't represent the knowledge base of a "minimally competent" healthcare worker/podiatrist, rather it felt like a random assortment of odd facts and mixed generalities.

It will be interesting to see how its scored...
 
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I'm not sure what the split was, but the test was not what I was expecting...

The questions seemed to focus on things that I would say were not generally important. It just didn't represent the knowledge base of a "minimally competent" healthcare worker/podiatrist, rather it felt like a random assortment of odd facts and mixed generalities.

It will be interesting to see how its scored...
That was a joke. They preach studying from USMLE, then give us an exam on lab values, innermost intercostal muscles, and how to sterilize plastic tubing. This exam is NOT an indicator of who is minimally competent or not. I would say the APMLE is minimally competent.
 

Podiatry1

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Hey guys. Dont post here often at all but read occasionally. I go to one of the pod schools.
Took part 1 yesterday. This exam is a disgrace and made we regret my decision to go to podiatry school over DO or PhD. I read through FA five times, did hundreds of practice USMLE questions, back test questions from my school, and everything else I could have possibly done. I studied 12 hours a day for over two months, missed spending countless hours with my wife and family, missed the fourth of july, missed memorial day, missed everything for this test. I felt like I was literally in jail for two months.

All for what.

We want parity with the MD/DOs? Give me a ****ing break. This will never happen in a million years if our board exam is like that. Who wrote these questions? How could whoever even wrote these questions be considered a doctor?

One of my question involved antibiotics to be given to someone who had MRSA and not a single answer was correct. I had five questions on CLEANING LABORATORY GEAR. We were told at my school that the LEA was minimal competency LEA. Every single LEA question I had with no exception was on random osteological features and ligaments, not a single question was about muscles, innervation, blood supply, origins or insertions. Not to mention... since we are supposed to be.. you know.. Doctors, you would think that they would put some clinically relevant LEA on there. No unhappy triad, no anterior drawer sign... Nothing.

Biochem was at LEAST 15% of the test when they stated it was going to be 7%.
I probably had 5-10 TOTAL pharmacology questions which was supposed to be a great deal more on the test (and I put in countless hours learning all the drugs).. Probably had 15-20 Immunology questions, none of which were clinically relevant and were near impossible to solve (way way more immuno than pharm or path)... Everyone in the class above us said to know gram + and gram - bacteria cold.. I am pretty sure I had no more than two questions on gram + and gram - bacteria. The majority of my micro questions were on Fungi that were nowhere to be found in first aid.
And I could go on and on.

If I do not pass, I am done with this profession. I refuse to put myself through that and take this test a second time, knowing that once again, nothing I studied could be on the exam. I could have easily passed the USMLE with all the hours I put in studying. There is something seriously wrong with the APMLE.
 
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pacpod

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The materials of the APMLE, and NBPME subject examinations are copyrighted. Publishing any ‘remembered’ materials or replicas of these materials on SDN (or any other forum) is an unauthorized reproduction of NBPME’s materials, constitutes copyright infringement and is strictly prohibited. Any violation of NBPME’s copyrights and trademarks can not only lead to legal sanctions, but can also have professional consequences. Podiatry students and podiatry school graduates, prospective students, examinees of the APMLE and NBPME self-assessment examinations and subject examinations are reminded that they are bound to the terms they agreed to follow regarding disclosure of intellectual property prior to the administration of one of these examinations. Failure to adhere to the terms of these policies will subject an individual to various penalties up to and including being barred from future APMLE examinations.
 

shenanigans327

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Is there a way for a bunch of students to petition the APMLE about the exam?

I mean, technically they violated the terms in the candidate bulletin by not adhering to the percentages of subject areas tested...not to mention the fact that MANY of the questions had more than one right answer.

It would be nice to get a large group of students to write letters to the board and see what can be done. Anyone interested??

If I'm one of those who failed, I will also strongly consider leaving this profession...I mean, to ask those types of questions on a MINIMAL COMPENTENCY board examination?? They should be ashamed of themselves...I don't know if they realize how bad it makes the profession look.
 

josebiwasabi

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i have no issues with taking challenging exams. but there's a difference between a hard test that really tests your understanding of the material vs an exam that's hard because it asks you random 1st order questions on minutiae. the apmle definitely falls under the latter category and it's really a shame for everyone involved. it's easily the most poorly written and constructed exam i've taken, and by far the most expensive, which just adds insult to injury. i would have scored considerably lower if i hadn't happened to look at random things from gross anatomy, biochem, immuno, etc the last two days before the exam. it felt like hardly any of the high yield material i studied appeared on the exam.

like another person posted, i studied my butt off for this test. i went through my first aid 4 times, memorized all the indications/CI/SE/mechanisms in lange's pharm flashcards, went through all of my LEAN notes 3x, memorized all of my infectious disease notes i used during class, read through micro made ridiculously simple twice, went over my class pathology notes, read BRS physio twice and did solved the practice questions and much more. several of my classmates formed a study group and we quizzed each other for about a week before the test on everything we could think of, including lots of minor details. i was even a tutor for biochem and immuno so that material was relatively fresh in my head. i got a 96% on the easy 2008 practice exam that's posted on their website. and even with all of that, i felt like it didn't prepare me for this exam. many of my classmates have shared similar sentiments.

i don't feel like the apmle should be easy simply because it's a minimal competency exam. i'm all for raising the bar. but if you're going to make us take a difficult exam, make it difficult because you're really checking for breadth and depth in comprehension of what podiatry students learn during the first 2 years, not some disjointed agglomeration of questions that cover an array of low-yield topics.
 

ldsrmdude

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Ok, let me just say that if you go back and look at the similar threads that pop up after each time the boards (especially Part I) are offered, everyone that takes the test complains about it (myself included) and wonders what in the world they were thinking when they wrote the test. In the end, most people pass, even those who, like me, were convinced they had totally bombed.

Let me add that through all the threads that have discussed what to study, the consensus has been that 1st Aid isn't helpful and that there isn't a great way to study for the test, outside of doing well in classes and learning the material as you go through the classes, as it does often test minutiae.
 
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pacpod

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I concur. Not trying to add insult to injury but we talked about part 1 boards pretty thoroughly last year when pacpod, dtrack22, myself, dyk343 and many others took it. It was pretty much agreed upon that first aid is worthless for this test. I understand its pretty hard to NOT use it because we see our medical school colleagues live and die by it year after year. It's really unfortunate that medical school's "gold standard" is worthless to us for our board exam...or whatever you want to call "that".
Yeah, this is the same question and argument that comes up every year.
However, dtrack22 made a good point by saying although most people say they felt it didn't help, the majority of those that use it pass.
 

ldsrmdude

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Yeah, this is the same question and argument that comes up every year.
However, dtrack22 made a good point by saying although most people say they felt it didn't help, the majority of those that use it pass.
Well, I guess that's true, but really, the majority of all test takers pass ;)
 
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dtrack22

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The NBPME utilizes PhD's to maintain statistical integrity of the exam. I guarantee you the % breakdown of what they say is part of the "scored" exam and what you got is nearly identical. If you actually read the outline, most of what you all are complaining about (especially regarding LEA) is listed in the outline. If your instructors didn't hammer home osteology, facet shapes, ligamentous attachments, etc. they failed you. Not the exam. And who expected clinical pod type questions on a basic science, anatomy exam?

As far as study materials go, I found first aid to be helpful in the sense that it forced me to go through a majority of what was covered in the basic science courses, in a relatively short amount of time. It was efficient. I remember a handful of questions that I answered with one of those goofy mnemonics from first aid. It wasn't great due to the primary order questions that are largely utilized on the APMLE, but what else would you have used for (at least the 3 weeks I actually studied) that would have covered the same amount of material?

Almost all of you are overreacting and passed. It's not normal to take a test, feel like you got half the questions right, and come out feeling good. But you really have to when you take boards. I put questions into 3 categories when I took the exam: I'm positive it's the right answer, 50-50 answers, and no idea answers. I tallied them up and had around 110-115 positives, 50 where I could narrow it down to 2 answers, and another 40 where I had no idea. I'm sure I missed some of the one's I was sure of, but also got some of the complete guesses right. I only felt real good on about 50% of my answers. I passed. So did 500 other students.
 
Jan 28, 2011
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Considering first aid, my opinion is it's a good guide to use. Memorizing that book word for word is pretty much useless if you don't understand the material. I would probably recommend using it as a guide, along with the list of broad topics provided on website to prepare for this.

The test is really a crapshoot though. I'm glad i didn't waste another month studying for it.
 
D

dyk343

This thread is a lot like last year's mass freak out. In the end, as others are saying, most people pass this exam. Just try to move on with 3rd year. If you have to re-take the exam that sucks... but it's not the end of the world and you know what you are getting into.
 
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i took the exam on wed as well...i studied by butt off and I honestly felt like i bombed BIG TIME!! i have no idea how to gauge my performance...everything was so random.. anyone have any thought as to how the exam is graded with the experimental/thrown out questions? also to any upperclassmen who have been thru the process before, is it normal to feel like **** after the exam?
 

pacpod

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i took the exam on wed as well...i studied by butt off and I honestly felt like i bombed BIG TIME!! i have no idea how to gauge my performance...everything was so random.. anyone have any thought as to how the exam is graded with the experimental/thrown out questions? also to any upperclassmen who have been thru the process before, is it normal to feel like **** after the exam?
Absolutely!
 

ldsrmdude

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Regarding first aid.. I havnt been active on this site in a very long time and as is such, did not read any threads saying that first aid was a bad way to study for boards. With no exception, at my school every single student used it to study so I assumed that was what I was supposed to use. I used BRS for Physio and did BRS practice questions for Pharm, Path, and Physio.

If I need to take this exam again, here are my concerns:
-It is a total crap shoot. I studied more than I ever had in my life studying for this test, gave it 110%, what is to say that the same exact thing wont happen again. It seems like my classmates and I had totally different exams, so I am doubting the same questions will be on the thing in the fall.

-If I fail this test once I am at a huge disadvantage with getting a residency. There is already a shortage. What am I supposed to do here? I am not in the top twenty of my class, I am somewhere in the middle. What if I take this test a second time, graduate, and not get a residency because I failed? Would be in a way worse situation than if I cut my losses and dropped out now.

-What if I failed twice? This could very possibly happen seeing as there, in my opinion, is absolutely no way to study for this test. There is nothing else I could have done to study for this test and I am pretty sure I failed it.

Most of all I am just blown away that a profession that I put so much blood sweat and tears working for could have done something like this to all of us. It makes me really want to give a big F U to the field and start over, which is horrifying in itself seeing as I am nearly 30, have a family, and am in debt.

What would I do for a second career? I have no idea. Im pretty much at a total daze and loss right now.
Failing Part I the first time isn't a death blow to your chances at a residency. Giving up would be a death blow to your chances at a residency. Freaking out about the test while you wait for the results will just drive you (and probably your family) crazy. If you go back and look at the threads from each year, you'll see that most people feel like they failed when they come out of the test. Still, most people pass. For those that don't, I would still recommend pushing through and sticking with it.

To those that took Part 1, good luck! Give it a couple of days for the initial shock to wear off, take a little break if you can, and get ready for the next phase - clinical medicine!
 

hematosis

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I predict this years pass rate will be about a 75%. This will open up 20 to 30 residency spots and part 2 will take care of the rest. Residency problems Solved!
Yeah, i'll stick to my prediction here. The test was probably like this for a reason. It's CPME way of solving the problem. I hope I am wrong.
 
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I know I bombed that exam and that there's a good chance I'll have to retake it. My problem with having to retake it is...I wouldn't know what to change in my studying. I studied a combination of FA/BRS physio/LEAN notes/some other class notes. FA wasn't detailed enough whereas class notes went into too many esoteric details; it was hard to find the right balance. I would have studied more class notes but that would mean going through piles and piles of notes that have accumulated over the past two years. I wouldn't have had time to study them all thoroughly enough to answer some of the minutia tested on the boards.

As others have already mentioned, another problem for me that would arise when re-studying would be confusion of the breakdown. Certainly what we got on the Boards didn't match their official breakdown. I wouldn't know how much to study for each subject now. I was expecting close to 30 questions on pharm and what I got was maybe 10, if that. Conversely, I had more histo/immuno/biochem questions than Pharm. What a joke! How much time I should devote to each subject matter when studying again would remain a mystery...

It's not fair for CPME to make such a ridiculous exam to make up for something that is obviously not our fault (residency shortage).
 

air bud

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I love this thread, brings back memories. Just remember, this too shall pass. I remember thinking there is no way I passed and I was near the top of my class.
 
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shenanigans327

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.

The whole point is...I get that it's normal to feel like you failed after taking Part I. After speaking with upperclassmen, it seemed like the jist of last years exam was that the questions were poorly written, but you could at least make an intelligible response to most of them. This year, it seemed like they more or less just pulled questions out of thin air...testing on things that maybe were only taught at a few schools. The breakdown was awful, mistakes throughout the exam.

At least for me, if I screw up an exam, let it be MY fault that I screwed up. It's a pretty crappy feeling to have no control over your own destiny and more or less leaving your future up to a council of people that can ask you questions as they see fit, with little to no oversight...especially when we're in a time of such residency flux. Agree or not, if you blow boards your first time out, I find it VERY difficult to believe that it doesn't affect your chances at matching.
 
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that1guyfromFL

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I'll go ahead and take a crack at this one....

I don't want to name names...but one of the APMLE committee members is also on the Council for the CPME...
Just be perfectly clear though, the CPME has nothing to do with creation, oversight or scoring of the APMLE exams.

The NBPME and CPME are distinct and separate organizations.

(As noted, there is an individual who is serving concurrently on both boards for a period of time.)
 

dtrack22

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...not trying to imply anything inappropriate happened. Merely answering Dtrack's post...
Well, except for the fact that your reply is an implication of CPME having control over the APMLE and NBPME's composition and administration process. The above part of your post is just like when Ricky Bobby says, "With all due respect..."
 
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still freaking out about boards.....anyone else in the same boat??

anyone have an idea on how questions are graded and thrown out
 

OhEmGee

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Someone posted a flow chart on how the exam is graded a little while back. I looked at it briefly and really couldnt make much sense of it.

I literally was about to "lose my ****" after boards. After talking to my colleagues I found out its a universal thing. We all feel like crap but somehow 90% or so of us pass. Then third year got into full swing and I have put my boards frustration on the back burner. I am just glad to be out of the classroom and finally in the hospitals and clinics working with patients.
 

dtrack22

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MCAT. But I might be one of the few who wasn't worried after boards. Of course I went into boards with the mindset that if I felt good about 50% of the questions I was going to pass
 
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There is no convuluted scoring process to this exam. You have to answer 75% of the questions they score correctly. That number depends on how many questions are not scored/given back. Also all the matching questions are worth more points. Each correctly match item counts as one question so the actual number of questions on the test is more than 205 (more like 220 to 240).
 
D

dyk343

There is no convuluted scoring process to this exam. You have to answer 75% of the questions they score correctly. That number depends on how many questions are not scored/given back. Also all the matching questions are worth more points. Each correctly match item counts as one question so the actual number of questions on the test is more than 205 (more like 220 to 240).
Source?
 

ldsrmdude

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There is no convuluted scoring process to this exam. You have to answer 75% of the questions they score correctly. That number depends on how many questions are not scored/given back. Also all the matching questions are worth more points. Each correctly match item counts as one question so the actual number of questions on the test is more than 205 (more like 220 to 240).
Did you read the link posted earlier in the thread about the Angoff method and how the test is scored? Go to the APMLE website and look it up there. It has the scoring method listed.
 
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You don't have to believe me! I was just tired of all the hearsay and went and asked someone who knows. Maybe they weren't telling me the truth?
 
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D

dyk343

You don't have to believe me! I was just tired of all the hearsay and went and asked someone who knows. Maybe they weren't telling me the truth?
I never said I didnt believe you, because I dont know how it is scored. I just asked for a source.
 
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If I understand the angoff method! The panel rates each question by whether or not a minimally competent practioner would answer that question correctly. Each question is given a rating based on this standard by the panel. The panel members ratings for each question are added and averaged. A number is generated and converted to a %. That % is the % of the number of questions a minimally competent practioner should be able to answer for that test. For our test that is 75%. Now after the test is over they flag all those questions that performed poorly and determine if they should keep or drop and I suppose the number of questions that 75% represents is revised.
 

ldsrmdude

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If I understand the angoff method! The panel rates each question by whether or not a minimally competent practioner would answer that question correctly. Each question is given a rating based on this standard by the panel. The panel members ratings for each question are added and averaged. A number is generated and converted to a %. That % is the % of the number of questions a minimally competent practioner should be able to answer for that test. For our test that is 75%. Now after the test is over they flag all those questions that performed poorly and determine if they should keep or drop and I suppose the number of questions that 75% represents is revised.
That sounds about right from my reading of it. It's not that you are graded just based on the number of questions you get right, but it's all based on the probability that a minimally competent practitioner will get the question right. It's a little more convoluted than just a straightforward test.
 
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