California Emory premed discusses successful application cycle

[voxveritatisetlucis]

Yup, my friend had 7 t20 IIs and rejected from all

Rejected or WL? Surely that would just signal horrible interviewer

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[DoctorFate]

Rejected or WL? Surely that would just signal horrible interviewer

A few Rs, mostly WL, but ultimately turned into a rejection.

 

[doomer_md]

This article popped up on my Facebook feed for some reason and it reminded me of the standardized test discussion in this thread. I’ve never seen any garbage like this until the last few years when eQuITy has suddenly become the end-all-be-all.

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

I don't really know for sure. But I guess it has a lot to do with their interviews.

Some people have cycles that parallel Tim Lincecum’s MLB career. First few years (few months of cycle, get a lot of interviews), you would’ve thought he was going to be one of the best pitchers ever step foot on the mound. Couple years later (towards end of cycle, lots of post-II WL/Rs), he crashes and burns, not even in consideration for the hall of fame

 

[srirachamayonnaise]

Some people have cycles that parallel Tim Lincecum’s MLB career. First few years (few months of cycle, get a lot of interviews), you would’ve thought he was going to be one of the best pitchers ever step foot on the mound. Couple years later (towards end of cycle, lots of post-II WL/Rs), he crashes and burns, not even in consideration for the hall of fame

Paper good vs in person good. I suspect that they might either come across as too nervous or too eager during the interviews.

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

The worst is when you start an interview day so smoothly, and then the last interview goes off the rails or is just “average.”

 

[MyOdyssey]

Some people have cycles that parallel Tim Lincecum’s MLB career. First few years (few months of cycle, get a lot of interviews), you would’ve thought he was going to be one of the best pitchers ever step foot on the mound. Couple years later (towards end of cycle, lots of post-II WL/Rs), he crashes and burns, not even in consideration for the hall of fame

Pitchers with straight overhead deliveries (Sandy Koufax & Tim Luncecum) tend to put a lot of stress on their arms which leads to brilliant but short careers.

Pitchers with 3/4 deliveries (Nolan Ryan, Pedro Martinez, etc) have longer careers.

 

[srirachamayonnaise]

The worst is when you start an interview day so smoothly, and then the last interview goes off the rails or is just “average.”

tbh, wall street interviews are a lot harder. I remember going through 4 rounds of full day interviews for my buy-side job, including two presentations to the whole firm, which needed to be prepared the day before the interview. That's after the headhunter selecting me out of 500 applications.

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

tbh, wall street interviews are a lot harder. I remember going through 4 rounds of full day interviews for my buy-side job, including two presentations to the whole firm, which needed to be prepared the day before the interview. That's after the headhunter selecting me out of 500 applications.

Yup these are definitely more brutal but there also tends to be more opportunities, so in a sense there is less pressure.

When I got my most recent job, I had to cancel like 10 interviews that I had pending. It was much easier to relax because I knew that there was a quasi-limitless supply of decent roles. In med school interviews, you know that if you don’t seize the opportunity; there may only be a few more chances. I’m not sure if it has always been like that or I was just applying during a labor-crunch.

 

[srirachamayonnaise]

Yup these are definitely more brutal but there also tends to be more opportunities, so in a sense there is less pressure.

When I got my most recent job, I had to cancel like 10 interviews that I had pending. It was much easier to relax because I knew that there was a quasi-limitless supply of decent roles. In med school interviews, you know that if you don’t seize the opportunity; there may only be a few more chances. I’m not sure if it has always been like that or I was just applying during a labor-crunch.

entry-level sell-side jobs tend to be a lot easier to get. The job I got is coveted because everyone wants one like that to retire from. (strictly 9 to 5, no weekend ever, good chunk of money to manage, yet, risk level is low since it's mostly fixed income and great pay)

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

entry-level sell-side jobs tend to be a lot easier to get. The job I got is coveted because everyone wants one like that to retire from. (strictly 9 to 5, no weekend ever, good chunk of money to manage, yet, risk level is low since it's mostly fixed income and great pay)

I’m guessing megafund or MM PE?

I would guess HFs, but I think that the environment is much more stressful these days. Ex. One pension fund recently dropped Dalio because of poor returns

 

[srirachamayonnaise]

I’m guessing megafund or MM PE?

I would guess HFs, but I think that the environment is much more stressful these days. Ex. One pension fund recently dropped Dalio because of poor returns

better than megafund or MM PE. in house IM in a huge insurance firm.

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

Pitchers with straight overhead deliveries (Sandy Koufax & Tim Luncecum) tend to put a lot of stress on their arms which leads to brilliant but short careers.

Pitchers with 3/4 deliveries (Nolan Ryan, Pedro Martinez, etc) have longer careers.

Apparently some scouts warned about this when he was still in the minors. Great career but not enough for the HOF

 

[DoctorFate]

better than megafund or MM PE. in house IM in a huge insurance firm.

Why did you choose medicine after that? The whole "greater meaning in helping those in need" or something else?

 

[srirachamayonnaise]

Why did you choose medicine after that? The whole "greater meaning in helping those in need" or something else?

I like the science behind medicine.

 

[proudofmykids]

Yup, my friend had 7 t20 IIs and rejected from all

These examples of T20 rejection despite strong application II success are why people apply to 30, 40, and 50 schools; so why are people criticizing someone for having large amount of applications leading to high Acceptance success at T’20s when it isn’t the norm nor predictable especially for ORMs?

 

[deleted1114112]

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[MyOdyssey]

You have to be cognizant of your application and its strengths, though. Someone with extremely high stats or just an exceptional MCAT alone can get II's at multiple T10/T20s, only to get rejected for having no actual application...probably what happens to the upper bracket folks who don't get any A's.

I have friends with zero clinical hours and/or just a few shadowing hours ("COVID") and high stats who have II's at WashU, for example, while getting denied from state programs (their own state). Maybe they'll get in, maybe not, but just goes to show what type of values some schools want vs. others.

There are plenty of high stat ORMs, especially from CA or NY, who’ve checked all the boxes but get no As (and few IIs). Just check out the WAMC and Reapplicant boards.

 

[deleted1114112]

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[MyOdyssey]

There's really not. WAMC and reapplicant boards on this forum are literally like a few dozen people. Most people who get denied with above average stats either don't know how to present themselves (bad writing) or are bad interviewers. Some high(er) stat folk just slack on lower ranked school secondaries and get nothing in return, while also not lucking out on T20s. Most cases of a high stat rejection is usually avoidable and a product of overconfidence or carelessness.

Neither of us have access to the files of high stat applicants with no As. The data we can see - SDN WAMC and Reapplicant high stat applicant posts - doesn’t support your speculation.

You’re also leaving out issues like yield protection, home state of residence and poor school lists that clearly impact prospects.

 

[deleted1114112]

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[MyOdyssey]

Ah yes, the 'data' from sdn. Discounting selection bias, I would be a kidney 50% of those threads are just terrible misrepresentation of what actually happened or just lies. People love to stir fear around here. Honestly anything aside from school specific threads is just a disaster composed of 95% overanxious (and typically high achieving) premeds discussing and asking about completely futile topics coupled with a few medical students that think they're the next messiah. Some useful info exists (usually from AOs) but you can often find an old thread with that information, without the added nonsense.

Might not mean much coming from me, but I'll just say that 9 out of 10 topics I have seen on here recently never crossed my mind while applying/interviewing, and probably would have just made me stressed AF for absolutely no reason.

People aren't creating accounts on SDN to post very detailed, highly individualized, and often anguished, WAMC and Reapp threads in order to "stir fear." That's quite an astounding take.

The posts I see are obviously being posted by distinct individuals and include highly descriptive accounts of volunteering/ECs/school lists/motivations and are written in distinctly individualized voices.

There is a pattern in that many (most) are from ORMs who reside in CA.

There are certainly posters who are in the midst of very successful cycles and find it amusing to come on SDN to deride those who are struggling as "overanxious" or liars.

Let's continue this discussion after you've posted your "data."

 

[deleted1114112]

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[MyOdyssey]

For starters my school (T40, nothing insane though) publishes premed MD data (A's or zero A's) and the acceptance rate for those above a 515/3.8 is over 95%. With that being said, you can only apply with a verified school list from the advisor committee, which is loosely but still decently enforced.

Also I sieved through the reapplicant thread and literally 99% of the high stat folk amount to something like this: 526/4.0 Reapplicant as I said...just glaring weaknesses or errors

I think the CA high stats applicants face enormous competition at home as at least 5 CA schools are T30 (UCSF, UCLA, UCSD, Keck, Stanford), one UC-Riverside favors residents from a certain part of CA and one (Kaiser) is tuition free and so gets lots of applicants, are yield protected at mid tier out of state schools and potentially face competition from even higher stat/more research intensive candidates at those schools that really care about stats/research. There're only so many hours in a day and all that time spent on research means less time for clinical/nonclinical volunteering/leadership/etc. which the T20s also want to see.

If your school has published such internal stats, then it would mean that your school's pool of candidates with 515/3.8+ substantially outperform the national pool of 518+/3.8+ applicants. I find that extremely implausible.

You seem obsessed with proving that getting into medical school's a piece of cake when everything shows otherwise.

 

[LadyDustyBlue]

Was like that. High stats, applied to 15 or 16, top heavy, several IIs, one acceptance.

However, back when I applied I had 0, count 'em, zero hours of shadowing. I guess I didn't get the memo on that one. Still got an A somehow.

I’ve definitely heard of people getting accepted without shadowing. But if you didn’t shadow, what did you have?

Also - I’m a California resident who is trying to transfer to a California school for undergrad. I’m confused by people saying that California schools (assuming: medical ones b/c this thread is about this “California Emory pre-med”) prefer getting California/in-state residents.

Was that an error? I thought that it’s tougher to get in a California medical school as a California resident, or so I’ve read on SDN. Because I’m over here already thinking about a list of medical schools I’ll eventually apply to as an OOS pre-med student. *shrugs*

As for the woman in the YT video, if she went to Emory and those are her stats, plus she has residency in California? Well, I’m not surprised, given she went to Emory.

 

[KnightDoc]

Also - I’m a California resident who is trying to transfer to a California school for undergrad. I’m confused by people saying that California schools (assuming: medical ones b/c this thread is about this “California Emory pre-med”) prefer getting California/in-state residents.

Was that an error? I thought that it’s tougher to get in a California medical school as a California resident, or so I’ve read on SDN. Because I’m over here already thinking about a list of medical schools I’ll eventually apply to as an OOS pre-med student. *shrugs*

CA applicants just have it rough. Period. You are correct in your understanding that it's tough to get into med school coming from CA. Their overall matriculation rate is below the national average even though their OOS success rate is significantly above the national average.

What you are confusing is the fact that CA applicants have a low IS matriculation rate, as compared to the national average, with the fact that CA applicants still have an advantage over OOS applicants when applying to CA schools. These are not mutually exclusive, and is explained by the fact that OOS applicants have an even lower matriculation rate into CA schools.

As a CA applicant, even though you will have an advantage over OOS applicants applying to CA schools, you will still be far more likely to attend an OOS school than one in CA. For the last cycle, CA had 7,940 applicants. 1,184 matriculated IS, 1,558 OOS, and 5,198 either nowhere, DO, or out of the country.

 

[LadyDustyBlue]

CA applicants just have it rough. Period. You are correct in your understanding that it's tough to get into med school coming from CA. Their overall matriculation rate is below the national average even though their OOS success rate is significantly above the national average.

What you are confusing is the fact that CA applicants have a low IS matriculation rate, as compared to the national average, with the fact that CA applicants still have an advantage over OOS applicants when applying to CA schools. These are not mutually exclusive, and is explained by the fact that OOS applicants have an even lower matriculation rate into CA schools.

As a CA applicant, even though you will have an advantage over OOS applicants applying to CA schools, you will still be far more likely to attend an OOS school than one in CA. For the last cycle, CA had 7,940 applicants. 1,184 matriculated IS, 1,558 OOS, and 5,198 either nowhere, DO, or out of the country.

Interesting. Thanks for the honest response! That definitely doesn’t change my future plans in any way, despite already being in California. I was mentally prepared to leave California for various reasons, including the potential outcome of ending up at an OOS school - for either undergrad & later med. Like many: keeping my mind open!

Best of luck on your journey as you’re much closer than I am, if I recall correctly!

 

[KnightDoc]

Interesting. Thanks for the honest response! That definitely doesn’t change my future plans in any way, despite already being in California. I was mentally prepared to leave California for various reasons, including the potential outcome of ending up at an OOS school - for either undergrad & later med. Like many: keeping my mind open!

Best of luck on your journey as you’re much closer than I am, if I recall correctly!

I'm in the middle of it right now, thankfully not coming from CA.

I have a feeling you are going to be fine. You are asking all the right questions, and you have a great start on the process.

FWIW, I hope you are trying to transfer to a CA UG for reasons other than med school. If not, you might want to reconsider, because you will already receive preference goes to CA IS applicants just by being a resident. Attending UG in another state, OTOH, will give you a tie to that state that could help you as an OOS applicant to med schools there. JMHO, but this strategy has benefited me so far, at least a little.