Can you complete a PHD while in Medical school?

[ElliotStabler]

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I am aware that there are combined phd/md programs that allow you to complete a phd and a medical degree in eight years but none of these programs offer a degree in the field In which i am interested in (clinical psychology). I am interested in doing both medical school and earning a phd but my concern is, is it possible to work on both of them at the same time and would a university allow me to take courses at two graduate schools for two different degrees?

 

[NimbleNavigator]

Just be a psychiatrist and go to a residency that emphasizes psychotherapy

 

[ChrisMack390]

There are zero MD/PHD programs that will allow you to do a psych project as your research? I find that incredibly hard to believe.

 

[JustAPhD]

There's no way you'd have the time to complete both programs at once, and no way a program would even let you attempt that. Trying to do a MD and a PhD at the same time (and not in a MD/PhD program) is a recipe for failure at both.

 

[ElliotStabler]

There are zero MD/PHD programs that will allow you to do a psych project as your research? I find that incredibly hard to believe.

There is one program that I know of that will allow you to complete a MD/PHD in psychology but its Harvard university...

 

[JustAPhD]

There is one program that I know of that will allow you to complete a MD/PHD in psychology but its Harvard university...

These are the schools I applied to as a social science MD/PhD:

Harvard
Penn
Johns Hopkins
WashU
UCSF
Yale
Duke
U Mich
University of Chicago
UCLA
UCSD
Emory
Case

I recommend calling the MSTP offices or email the directors and explaining what you want to do and ask if the program would be open to your application.

This was in an SDN thread from 2012 about a person wanting to apply for MD/PhD programs in psychology. Obviously these are all highly ranked, but my point is that clearly you haven't researched this enough. If you spend some time with this I'm sure you'll find a lot of schools offer the option.

 

[ElliotStabler]

This was in an SDN thread from 2012 about a person wanting to apply for MD/PhD programs in psychology. Obviously these are all highly ranked, but my point is that clearly you haven't researched this enough. If you spend some time with this I'm sure you'll find a lot of schools offer the option.

Thanks. I've looked at some of these schools and on their websites they don't mention psychology as an option for MD/PhD so I wasn't really sure if they did psychology as part of the combined degree but I will look into these.

 

[ElliotStabler]

A psychiatrist can do everything a clinical psychologist can do, and more. What a waste of time.

I could do a psychiatry residency but I would be like 40 by the time I finished. Upon graduating medical school I want to get into a neurosurgery residency which is 7 years long. Thats why I was asking about completing both a phd and md before i get into residency. I know some might say my goals sound unrealistic but I would like to do both.

 

[21Rush12]

Can I just ask what the goal is and why you feel this path is what you need to do? If you're really a college freshman I feel like you have a lot of eye-opening that needs to happen before you worry about what you're going to do alongside your med school/neurosurg residency. I'm asking because it seems like you need to focus on what you hope to accomplish and spend real time talking with people who have accomplished similar goals.


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[ElliotStabler]

Can I just ask what the goal is and why you feel this path is what you need to do? If you're really a college freshman I feel like you have a lot of eye-opening that needs to happen before you worry about what you're going to do alongside your med school/neurosurg residency. I'm asking because it seems like you need to focus on what you hope to accomplish and spend real time talking with people who have accomplished similar goals.


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This fall I will be completing my second year. Next year I will be sending out applications to graduate programs and so I'm trying to figure out whats best for me. I want to be a surgeon but I also want to be a psychologist. I figured why not try to incorporate the two fields together.

 

[claduva94]

This fall I will be completing my second year. Next year I will be sending out applications to graduate programs and so I'm trying to figure out whats best for me. I want to be a surgeon but I also want to be a psychologist. I figured why not try to incorporate the two fields together.

I see that as a highly ineffective use of your time.

 

[ElliotStabler]

I see that as a highly ineffective use of your time.

Well, I have passion for both lines of work. I can't imagine choosing one over the other but I guess I have to start somewhere. I've seen some child psychiatry residencies that are only 2 years long. Maybe I can start of there and then after start my surgical residency. Or does that sound like a bad idea?

 

[Lucca]

Well, I have passion for both lines of work. I can't imagine choosing one over the other but I guess I have to start somewhere. I've seen some child psychiatry residencies that are only 2 years long. Maybe I can start of there and then after start my surgical residency. Or does that sound like a bad idea?

So in would talk to some neurosurgeons and clinical psychologists. I think you'll find hat doing both will not be possible. I can understand having diverse interests and warning to carve out your own path by combining your interests but at some point you have to be practical and ask yourself: "why am I doing this", "do I need to do all of this" and, most importantly, "can I do all of these things well, together?". Sometimes the answer to all 3 is yes but I do not think trying to combine psychology and neurosurgery practices would fit the bill.

That being said, there is no way to earn a PhD while in medical school and only taking 5 years to do so. If there was, you would most likely be a mediocre medical student and a terrible PhD student and the person who would lose out the most in the end is you.

 

[eteshoe]

Sometimes in life one has to make sacrifices - it's part of growing up. OP it sounds like you haven't come to terms with this reality

 

[darkjedi]

Why would you want to do both neurosurgery and psychology? It would be absolute nonsense as there is practically zero overlap and synergy.

Not to mention neurosurgery is one of the most competitive residencies to get into. You are putting the chicken way before the egg. If you manage to make it that far, I guarantee your opinion about doing both neurosurg and psych will change.

 

[ChrisMack390]

You should considering looking into neuropsych. There are a couple residency programs and more fellowships in that field.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

I could do a psychiatry residency but I would be like 40 by the time I finished

I want to get into a neurosurgery residency which is 7 years long

First, what part of this make sense? Second, There is 0 overlap of these two fields. It's like the post I saw not too long ago about someone wanting to be a practicing dentist and a practicing orthopedic surgeon...

 

[deleted763299]

Well, I have passion for both lines of work.

How is it that you have come to be passionate about both neurosurgery and psychology? As others have stated, these seem wildly different. Any insight you can provide into your thoughts would be helpful to us.

I believe that being both a neurosurgeon and psychologist simultaneously is an unattainable goal.

 

[Goro]

No.

I am aware that there are combined phd/md programs that allow you to complete a phd and a medical degree in eight years but none of these programs offer a degree in the field In which i am interested in (clinical psychology). I am interested in doing both medical school and earning a phd but my concern is, is it possible to work on both of them at the same time and would a university allow me to take courses at two graduate schools for two different degrees?

 

[dboyhaaan]

Just get into medical school first then figure the rest out later.

 

[TheBiologist]

yes; to be admitted is often very competitive though. It would last 8 years (normally you do 2 years of med school, finish your phd, then do 2 more years).

most people do this if they want to go into research; although nothing is stopping a bright mind from doing research with only an M.D.

 

[ElliotStabler]

First, what part of this make sense? Second, There is 0 overlap of these two fields. It's like the post I saw not too long ago about someone wanting to be a practicing dentist and a practicing orthopedic surgeon...

Are you referring to the timing? 4 years for medical school + 3 years for psychiatry residency, + 7 years for neurosurgery residency..

 

[ElliotStabler]

How is it that you have come to be passionate about both neurosurgery and psychology? As others have stated, these seem wildly different. Any insight you can provide into your thoughts would be helpful to us.

I believe that being both a neurosurgeon and psychologist simultaneously is an unattainable goal.

I know a family doctor who is a psychiatrist and also practices in neurology. Both fields are actually not that different from each other. Counseling patients as a psychologist is something I've always wanted to do (along with research and teaching) but surgery is something is also something i've come to love. I would like to be certified in both fields even if i have to spend alot of time in school to do so.

 

[claduva94]

I know a family doctor who is a psychiatrist and also practices in neurology. Both fields are actually not that different from each other. Counseling patients as a psychologist is something I've always wanted to do (along with research and teaching) but surgery is something is also something i've come to love. I would like to be certified in both fields even if i have to spend alot of time in school to do so.

Neurology and neurosurgery are very different. The point is people are being JUST psychiatrists and JUST neurosurgeons and are great at it by putting in full work weeks. Trying to juggle both is a recipe for mediocrity at best, in addition to your training going well into your 40s.

 

[dboyhaaan]

I know a family doctor who is a psychiatrist and also practices in neurology. Both fields are actually not that different from each other. Counseling patients as a psychologist is something I've always wanted to do (along with research and teaching) but surgery is something is also something i've come to love. I would like to be certified in both fields even if i have to spend alot of time in school to do so.

There are combined neurology/psychiatry residencies if that's something you would be interested in. But who knows, you interest might change once you're in medical school.

 

[kavorca]

It's just a naive wish, "I will know everything about the brain and then how to fix it." That's not how real life works. It reminds me of that scene in Coming to America.
I want to be a rock singer and a pop singer and make videos and direct videos etc
Link for those interested. Starts at 1:30

 

[ElliotStabler]

Dude you are a second year.. You can't have a passion for these fields because you are neither a neurosurgeon not a psychiatrist. Your experiences thus far is these fields are likely surface level at best. Sounds like ambitious naïveté.

Some people know what they want to do since they have been kids. I have always known i've wanted to work with people who have mental illness and i have always been fascinated by the brain and behaviors which explains my love for psychology. As for neurosurgery that is also something i'm fascinated with. I love the late night shifts, long hours, fast pace of the job, the brain, the operations. After shadowing a neurosurgeon I have more of an idea of what a neurosurgeon actually does. Its not like this is some fantasy.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Some people know what they want to do since they have been kids. I have always known i've wanted to work with people who have mental illness and i have always been fascinated by the brain and behaviors which explains my love for psychology. As for neurosurgery that is also something i'm fascinated with. I love the late night shifts, long hours, fast pace of the job, the brain, the operations. After shadowing a neurosurgeon I have more of an idea of what a neurosurgeon actually does. Its not like this is some fantasy.

It is a fantasy because it literally isn't possible.. Not if you want to be good at either one. If you have such experience with neurosurgery then you would know there isn't time in a neurosurgeon's day for a second career that also takes extensive clinical time and a completely different knowledge base.

 

[Lucca]

Some people know what they want to do since they have been kids. I have always known i've wanted to work with people who have mental illness and i have always been fascinated by the brain and behaviors which explains my love for psychology. As for neurosurgery that is also something i'm fascinated with. I love the late night shifts, long hours, fast pace of the job, the brain, the operations. After shadowing a neurosurgeon I have more of an idea of what a neurosurgeon actually does. Its not like this is some fantasy.

A cynic might say you are interested in the brain but fascinated by the neurosurgeon's paycheck and prestige. If you understood what both did, you would know that combining both practices isn't doable.

This isn't the 19th or early 20th century. You can just be a surgeon-scientist-philosopher-family physician-apothecary. To be good at what you do and contribute to your field you have to narrow down your interests.as others have said., just get into medical school and the rest will sort itself out after clerkships and step and such

 

[deleted763299]

After shadowing a neurosurgeon I have more of an idea of what a neurosurgeon actually does.

I encourage you to discuss your aspirations with the neurosurgeon that you have worked with. Tell him/her about the kind of career you envision for yourself, and see if this surgeon thinks it is achievable. Most here seem to think that it is not, and I agree.

 

[JustAPhD]

I love the late night shifts, long hours, fast pace of the job

Much easier to say this when you're still young. You may have a very different opinion at age 40.

 

[ElliotStabler]

Much easier to say this when you're still young. You may have a very different opinion at age 40.

Well that is the benefit of having a phd. When i burned out from surgery I can transition to psych. Its not like I want to work as a psychologist and a surgeon at the same time. I want to have both degrees. There are tons of people who have a phd and a MD. why is it any different for me?

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Because your not asking about a PhD for research (which is what almost every MD/PhD have) you are asking about an entirely different career...

 

[ElliotStabler]

Because your not asking about a PhD for research (which is what almost every MD/PhD have) you are asking about an entirely different career...

I have stated above that counseling, research and teaching is the purpose of my phd but I have no problem reducing my expectations to something more realistic.

 

[DokterMom]

This fall I will be completing my second year. Next year I will be sending out applications to graduate programs and so I'm trying to figure out whats best for me. I want to be a surgeon but I also want to be a psychologist. I figured why not try to incorporate the two fields together.

Sounds like you want to do brain/personality transplants.

(You back Streampaw?)