Caribbean Medical Schools

[JackD]

Now a quick glance at my status under my name will indicate that i do not plan to go to medical school. I would make a terrible medical doctor. Looking at people's insides is not my thing. However, all over my school, there are posters for medical schools that are based in places like Grenada or the Dominican Republic.

I honestly have never been to either of these countries, so i can't say for sure but i don't think these are the greatest countries to study abroad in. Are doctors coming out of these countries taken seriously by their peers? If an american goes to Grenada to study medicine, is it safe to assume that person was rejected from just about every medical school in the united states or are these credible medical schools?

Now judging my the tone of my thread here, i would assume that you have picked up on my skepticism of these universities but that isn't based on much and i don't like to be a person who is judges things before i know about them. So in all honesty, are these credible schools?

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[mj6969]

This is the wrong thread for this question. I am moving this to the Caribbean thread.

 

[searun]

I think it depends on whether or not you like Dominican food. Personally, I think it is wonderful. And there is a new Broadway show in New York, called, "The Heights", near Columbia. So yeah, it makes sense to me.

 

[Toohotinvegas33]

Ross is on Dominica not the Dominican Republic. In fact if you look at the map, just about everyone of the micro-island countries have a med school catering to the US

 

[lisichka]

,

 

[Proteinpowda]

There are a lot of students who were accepted to DO schools and instead went to Caribbean MD Schools; particulary Grenanda.
There are 4 good ones SGU, ROSS, and AUC. Saba is up there but will present licensing issues for California.
A lot of people like St. Matthews but it's having it's share of problems (see valuemd.com for more info on that) and Ross is having clinical issues.
Grenada's an interesting place... the students love it..you do your clinicals either in the US or England and the residency match list is pretty darn impressive for an offshore school. Their board scores are also amazing for an offshore program (pretty much equivelant to US schools; one year they were higher). Students also love the school; all you have to do is google or youtube it.
Now I've worked with a bunch of docs...and I don't know why but I've never met an IMG with bad bedside manner.
And there are perks to going..the broad cultural experience...all clinicals are in the US or England (and for SGU all are AGME approved). You can also choose to start either in January, or August and many of the schools offer a summer term also so you can graduate a little quicker.
And it is a bit easier to get in; although SGU in particular is more competitive than some US schools (primarily DO). So you can save a lot of money in application fees...secondaries..traveling for interviews etc. And you can start sooner if you got a late start.
So there are perks.

 

[JackD]

So they are good?

 

[Proteinpowda]

So they are good?

3 or 4 out of 20 are good. Put it like this: I only applied to one of them.

 

[DeadCactus]

So they are good?

From the student perspective: It beats the **** out of finding a new dream.

From a quality of the physician perspective: Irrelevant. Real medicine is learned in residency and all physicians practicing in the US have to pass the same license requirements.

The difference is effectively the difference between doing your first two years of undergrad at a University or a Community College. Once you move onto the next step, no one gives a damn...

 

[JackD]

From a quality of the physician perspective: Irrelevant.

That is what i am concerned about. I don't care if the medical school has no desks and is missing large chunks of the roof, as long as the doctors coming out are competent. That is what i was curious about. If some are of acceptable, then great, enjoy the weather

 

[eight sat up]

I shadowed an anesthesiologist who went to Ross, did his residency in anesthesia at UCSF, and then did a pedi anesthesia fellowship at Stanford. He seemed pretty competent...at least the kiddies he was anesthetizing seemed to like him .

 

[coffeebythelake]

That is what i am concerned about. I don't care if the medical school has no desks and is missing large chunks of the roof, as long as the doctors coming out are competent. That is what i was curious about. If some are of acceptable, then great, enjoy the weather

I'm sure the learning environment will have an impact on attaining competence.

 

[186321]

That is what i am concerned about. I don't care if the medical school has no desks and is missing large chunks of the roof, as long as the doctors coming out are competent. That is what i was curious about. If some are of acceptable, then great, enjoy the weather

haha, I don't know about others, but I know SGU isn't "missing large chunks of roof". They have a very nice campus, probably better than many in the US. And it makes sense because they charge a fortune for tuition.

 

[bodonid]

haha, I don't know about others, but I know SGU isn't "missing large chunks of roof". They have a very nice campus, probably better than many in the US. And it makes sense because they charge a fortune for tuition.

lol. Yes, it looks nice. The only downside of the physical location is probably the crime rates, but even that wouldn't really mean more than a change in habits.

 

[bodonid]

I shadowed an anesthesiologist who went to Ross, did his residency in anesthesia at UCSF, and then did a pedi anesthesia fellowship at Stanford. He seemed pretty competent...at least the kiddies he was anesthetizing seemed to like him .

!!! This is the kind of thing I didn't expect to be possible at carib., except maybe at SGU. Nice to know that you can even start there and work hard/ work your way up.

 

[MossPoh]

If you look at sites like valuemd and then sites like sdn, you tend to see vastly contrasting opinions. I'm surprised this has stayed as civil as it has already. People that go there will swear it is the same or better and people who don't say you will wind up as a family practice doc in a town of 15 people unable to pass your boards.

In reality, it is in the middle. Just like all international med schools, it is a tougher road. While the matchlists always have nice residencies, there are MORE than the fair share of community hospital internal medicine and family practice. While that is perfectly fine, I have a tough time believing such a large percentage set out with that goal. There are plenty of people like me there. I tanked my first year and then did mediocre because I had no goals. As such, my gpa isn't so hot compared to a person who had the goal from the beginning. We aren't any dumber....(maybe a little) but we just messed up. Personally, I will probably apply to 1 Caribbean school, but I am applying to two israeli schools. If I have to be stuck anywhere, I rather be practicing in Israel....but that is a personal thing. There are a ton of fly by night schools down there. If you stick with SGU, Ross, SABA and AUC you'll probably be fine...other ones I wouldn't make any guarantees. Those 4 schools are essentially giving you a second chance...the attrition rates might be higher, but that is inevitable with the level of students. Some are just bad students and others just had tough times. You are faced with the same curriculum. Medschool isn't for everyone, and some people get their a$$ handed to them when they get there. It is much more likely with a person who never performed well during college.

 

[Doublecortin]

If you look at sites like valuemd and then sites like sdn, you tend to see vastly contrasting opinions. I'm surprised this has stayed as civil as it has already. People that go there will swear it is the same or better and people who don't say you will wind up as a family practice doc in a town of 15 people unable to pass your boards.

In reality, it is in the middle. Just like all international med schools, it is a tougher road. While the matchlists always have nice residencies, there are MORE than the fair share of community hospital internal medicine and family practice. While that is perfectly fine, I have a tough time believing such a large percentage set out with that goal. There are plenty of people like me there. I tanked my first year and then did mediocre because I had no goals. As such, my gpa isn't so hot compared to a person who had the goal from the beginning. We aren't any dumber....(maybe a little) but we just messed up. Personally, I will probably apply to 1 Caribbean school, but I am applying to two israeli schools. If I have to be stuck anywhere, I rather be practicing in Israel....but that is a personal thing. There are a ton of fly by night schools down there. If you stick with SGU, Ross, SABA and AUC you'll probably be fine...other ones I wouldn't make any guarantees. Those 4 schools are essentially giving you a second chance...the attrition rates might be higher, but that is inevitable with the level of students. Some are just bad students and others just had tough times. You are faced with the same curriculum. Medschool isn't for everyone, and some people get their a$$ handed to them when they get there. It is much more likely with a person who never performed well during college.

well, you have to look at trends, and the trend right now is that many schools are increasing enrollment, while most residencies, especially the competitive ones aren't increasing the number training positions (I know derm sure as hell ain't increasing ). That means it will become even more difficult to match into a competitive specialty for US grads, and we all know that US grads get priority consideration over any FMG.

While some stellar carib grads were able to squeak by and land a competitive specialty in the past, I believe it will become next to impossible in the future, and virtually all carib grads will have to settle for careers in primary care.

I love how folks like to point to that one guy who was able to match plastics, ortho, or rad onc out of carib some years ago, thinking that if he could do it, than it's possible.

And I really don't get what's the whole deal with kids in their early twenties not wanting to wait a year, or two, maybe get a job, retake MCAT, volunteer, whatever to bolster their application, reapply and get into a US school???? Seriously, that just shows immaturity, poor judgement, and perhaps not so stellar reasoning abilities on their part.

 

[Daniel312]

Another decent overseas one that I've heard of is UAG in Mexico... from what I understand, you can do your residency in NY...
however, the last two years of the school's curriculum is in Spanish- so you better become bi-lingual pretty darn quick down there.

 

[bodonid]

And I really don't get what's the whole deal with kids in their early twenties not wanting to wait a year, or two, maybe get a job, retake MCAT, volunteer, whatever to bolster their application, reapply and get into a US school???? Seriously, that just shows immaturity, poor judgement, and perhaps not so stellar reasoning abilities on their part.

If you were willing to go to Stewart University, I wouldn't criticize others for jumping the gun.

Go Stewart! GO HOBOS! c/o 2012!

 

[186321]

Also lets not forget that SGU's average MCAT is higher than two US schools and higher or even to all Osteopathic schools except 1 or 2.

 

[Daniel312]

Also lets not forget that SGU's average MCAT is higher than two US schools and higher or even to all Osteopathic schools except 1 or 2.

Now you've got me curious...

 

[Doublecortin]

If you were willing to go to Stewart University, I wouldn't criticize others for jumping the gun.

Go Stewart! GO HOBOS! c/o 2012!

1st, I ain't criticizing nobody. 2nd, I am planning to do my neurosurgery training at Stewie U , not med school, in case you haven't noticed.

 

[186321]

1st, I ain't criticizing nobody. 2nd, I am planning to do my neurosurgery training at Stewie U , not med school, in case you haven't noticed.

You go sista

 

[JackDanielMD]

Also lets not forget that SGU's average MCAT is higher than two US schools and higher or even to all Osteopathic schools except 1 or 2.

Lets also not forget that the USMLE step 1 failure is also higher than all US schools, Allo/Osteo.

 

[BigRedPremed]

Lets also not forget that the USMLE step 1 failure is also higher than all US schools, Allo/Osteo.

Actually, SGU's pass rate is pretty good (around 90% or so), which probably has something to do with the relatively high MCAT scores of its students. I personally believe any school with a 3.4+, 27+ average will have a 90%+ pass rate on the USMLE's. It's too bad a lot of applicants can't make it into US allopathic schools because I think many of them would be able to pass the boards and become licensed. But, yes, passing the USMLE's is an issue with lesser Carib schools.

The issue for Carib docs is attaining a residency position in the US. It's not impossible for them to match into ortho or derm, it's just ridiculously hard (as if those residencies weren't tough enough already). Not surprisingly, only 2-6% of residents in those competitive fields are IMG's/FMG's. The specialities with the highest percentage of international graduates (30-50%+) are gen surgery, primary care, psychiatry, pathology, etc (ie residencies that US graduates are shying away from).

 

[JackDanielMD]

Actually, SGU's pass rate is pretty good (around 90% or so), which probably has something to do with the relatively high MCAT scores of its students. I personally believe any school with a 3.4+, 27+ average will have a 90%+ pass rate on the USMLE's. It's too bad a lot of applicants can't make it into US allopathic schools because I think many of them would be able to pass the boards and become licensed. But, yes, passing the USMLE's is an issue with lesser Carib schools.

The issue for Carib docs is attaining a residency position in the US. It's not impossible for them to match into ortho or derm, it's just ridiculously hard (as if those residencies weren't tough enough already). Not surprisingly, only 2-6% of residents in those competitive fields are IMG's/FMG's. The specialities with the highest percentage of international graduates (30-50%+) are gen surgery, primary care, psychiatry, pathology, etc (ie residencies that US graduates are shying away from).

Yeah, that's something I'm not to sure of. Do they discourage or prohibit students from taking step 1 if they are not prepared to keep that stat up....I know some US schools do.

 

[dan1]

!!! This is the kind of thing I didn't expect to be possible at carib., except maybe at SGU. Nice to know that you can even start there and work hard/ work your way up.

I worked with a Cardiology fellow who came out of Ross and did his residency in the New York area. He is now in his fellowship at one of the best hospitals in AZ which happened to be ranked in US News top 100 hospitals for cardiology. So ya its definitely possible. I asked him how he did it and he just said it took a lot of work. He did say though that he had to put more effort forward than if he had gone to a US MD school...

 

[167649]

well, you have to look at trends, and the trend right now is that many schools are increasing enrollment, while most residencies, especially the competitive ones aren't increasing the number training positions (I know derm sure as hell ain't increasing ). That means it will become even more difficult to match into a competitive specialty for US grads, and we all know that US grads get priority consideration over any FMG.

While some stellar carib grads were able to squeak by and land a competitive specialty in the past, I believe it will become next to impossible in the future, and virtually all carib grads will have to settle for careers in primary care.

This is correct, and the biggest drawback to the carribean. While US medical schools (MD and DO) are expanding, residency training programs haven't been. The recessive state of our economy ensures the last thing most acadeimc hospitals will do, which are all in the money hole as it is, is expand their training programs. This doesn't hurt US grads so much (although, as pointed out it remains to be seen if competition to get into the highly desirable specialties will increase), but foreign grads will simply be pushed further out of the match.

Already, in the allopathic match the pecking order is USMD>USDO>>>>ForeignMD. The number of foreign/carrib trained students succesfully matching, even into the less competitive fields, will be decreasing significantly. This is the biggest drawback to the carribean and will only worsen as time passes. I would always recommend going DO before carribean, in the long run the pastures are far greener regarding training opportunities .

 

[mellsworth21]

My girlfriends father went to San Perdo for medical school. He's now practicing anesthiology.

 

[Proteinpowda]

This is correct, and the biggest drawback to the carribean. While US medical schools (MD and DO) are expanding, residency training programs haven't been. The recessive state of our economy ensures the last thing most acadeimc hospitals will do, which are all in the money hole as it is, is expand their training programs. This doesn't hurt US grads so much (although, as pointed out it remains to be seen if competition to get into the highly desirable specialties will increase), but foreign grads will simply be pushed further out of the match.

Already, in the allopathic match the pecking order is USMD>USDO>>>>ForeignMD. The number of foreign/carrib trained students succesfully matching, even into the less competitive fields, will be decreasing significantly. This is the biggest drawback to the carribean and will only worsen as time passes. I would always recommend going DO before carribean, in the long run the pastures are far greener regarding training opportunities .

I think SGU is the exception to that pecking order...

 

[Perrotfish]

That is what i am concerned about. I don't care if the medical school has no desks and is missing large chunks of the roof, as long as the doctors coming out are competent. That is what i was curious about. If some are of acceptable, then great, enjoy the weather

Caribbean graduates are competent, Carribean matriculants generally are not. The difference be a Caribbean and a US school is that a Caribbean school takes a much wider range of students and, after a year or two, fails out more than 2/3rds of them. By the time they've whittled it down to a graduating class they have good doctors. So if you're going to the Caribbean what you're doing is risking a ton of money to prove that, despite not having the stats to get into a US medical school, you do have the competence to get out of a US medical school. Either things will go well and you'll be a doctor or they'll go badly and you'll be burried under debt for the rest of your life.

Of course, even that is only refering to the 'big 4' that are accredited in the US. As for the rest of them I have no earthly idea.

 

[Jolie South]

I think SGU is the exception to that pecking order...

I don't think so. They are not LCME accredited. Their grads are IMGs.

Puerto Rico schools are the only exception. I believe that there are several that have accreditation.

 

[XerxesMD]

If an american goes to Grenada to study medicine, is it safe to assume that person was rejected from just about every medical school in the united states

Yes. Well, every US MD school anyway. Some people elect to goto the Caribbean instead of studying DO, but I have never heard of anyone declining an offer of admission at any US MD school to goto the Caribbean.

 

[Proteinpowda]

Yes. Well, every US MD school anyway. Some people elect to goto the Caribbean instead of studying DO, but I have never heard of anyone declining an offer of admission at any US MD school to goto the Caribbean.

I take my former statement back...I just looked up the match lists for the one DO school I could find to make a quick comparison. It was...impressive..in comparison....Now I really need to think of what I'll do if I don't get in this year.
Actually before I really researched the whole issue in regards to residency I was only going to apply to SGU. Why? I spoke to graduates from the school who all did great; I haven't met a doctor who spoke poorly about the school..and primarily I could've started in January. And I really like the idea that I could travel while going to med school. Also as we all know the application process is not the most pleasant thing in the world. The campus is amazing; you can even spend a month or two in Prague doing rotations. And you can do some clinicals in England as well and have a large choice of where to do your clinicals in the US (which you will do alongside US med students). And their attrition rate is under 10%. Ross, AUC, and Saba have higher attrition rates (sorry but if you're average MCAT is 21-23..a lot of the students aren't ready for med school) and don't offer what SGU does. Personally I'm concerned with where I can become the best doctor and being that the clinicals are the same..and I don't see a difference between studying years one and two in the Caribb or somewhere in the US (they do have you see patients early on)....and they follow a more traditional format they have a lot to offer.

And fyi...I scored a 31R on the MCAT.

And yes I applied to US schools too...and I would definetly choose a US school over the Caribbean knowing what I know...b/c of residency issues. But you have to admit going to Grenada for two years and being able to do clinicals in other countries is tempting.

 

[MossPoh]

Seriously, that just shows immaturity, poor judgement, and perhaps not so stellar reasoning abilities on their part.

That might be a bit extreme. Believe it or not, a year or two just isn't enough for some people and then what happens to those people? They burned 2 years where they could've been making real money. I have over 170 credit hours. My current point, if I were to spend another 2 years in classes burning money it would do next to nothing for my gpa. Even if I had a 4.0 the entire time. Some people just don't care that much. Just try not to be so hasty to judge what kind of person they are. Undoubtedly, there will be doctors from there that showed "immature, poor judgement, and perhaps not so stellar reasoning abilities" that will kick both of our a$$es all over in medicine.

I'm weary to point towards evidence considering we're in what is starting to be an uncharted domain. If you have no aspiration of doing derm, plastics, etc. then it really doesn't matter much. If you do then your chances are pretty low no matter what. What's to say that in 4-6 years there won't be a major push to produce more residency spots? It isn't something I'd put money on, but weirder things have happened on this earth. There are always worse things in life than family practice. I'm rather indifferent towards the Caribbean schools. People are well aware what they are getting into when they go there. Heck, one of my friends considered it his purgatory and is doing awesome. I just wouldn't be so quick to pass judgement when you see them in the hall, one of them may take our residency spot one day.

 

[MossPoh]

Caribbean graduates are competent, Carribean matriculants generally are not. The difference be a Caribbean and a US school is that a Caribbean school takes a much wider range of students and, after a year or two, fails out more than 2/3rds of them. By the time they've whittled it down to a graduating class they have good doctors. So if you're going to the Caribbean what you're doing is risking a ton of money to prove that, despite not having the stats to get into a US medical school, you do have the competence to get out of a US medical school. Either things will go well and you'll be a doctor or they'll go badly and you'll be burried under debt for the rest of your life.

Of course, even that is only refering to the 'big 4' that are accredited in the US. As for the rest of them I have no earthly idea.

I agree with the sentiments but I've never seen the statistics that shows 2/3rds failing. That would entail what, like a 900 person class to begin with? That is large, even by Caribbean standards! The average US medical school is really low, like a few percent that drop out. The Caribbean schools, last time I saw, wound up being like 15-20% I think. I'm not going to look it up, but people tend to grossly inflate the numbers. There seems to be this idea around that they walk in and do the "look to your left, look to your right." speech when you set foot on the island. But yea, I agree with the part about the graduates versus matriculants. The ones that think it is a vacation getaway med school, or are just not the brightest do tank.

 

[TRAMD]

haha, I don't know about others, but I know SGU isn't "missing large chunks of roof". They have a very nice campus, probably better than many in the US. And it makes sense because they charge a fortune for tuition.

I think I could manage to go to med school here:

 

[TRAMD]

Actually, SGU's pass rate is pretty good (around 90% or so), which probably has something to do with the relatively high MCAT scores of its students. I personally believe any school with a 3.4+, 27+ average will have a 90%+ pass rate on the USMLE's. It's too bad a lot of applicants can't make it into US allopathic schools because I think many of them would be able to pass the boards and become licensed. But, yes, passing the USMLE's is an issue with lesser Carib schools.

The issue for Carib docs is attaining a residency position in the US. It's not impossible for them to match into ortho or derm, it's just ridiculously hard (as if those residencies weren't tough enough already). Not surprisingly, only 2-6% of residents in those competitive fields are IMG's/FMG's. The specialities with the highest percentage of international graduates (30-50%+) are gen surgery, primary care, psychiatry, pathology, etc (ie residencies that US graduates are shying away from).

If there were a stat that was figured (students passing Step 1 two years after matriculation)/(students matriculating the first week of classes) the carib schools would pale in comparison to US allo schools. There is a high rate of attrition at carib schools and many students are not allowed to take step 1 until the school feels they are ready (this may or may not be a good thing).

 

[TRAMD]

I am doing my first year at a family medicine residency and I can say that they definitely prefer to not have IMGs. There doesn't seem to be any prejudice towards DOs, however. Unless the 'MD' is really that important to you, you are better off going DO than IMG.

 

[JackDanielMD]

I am doing my first year at a family medicine residency and I can say that they definitely prefer to not have IMGs. There doesn't seem to be any prejudice towards DOs, however. Unless the 'MD' is really that important to you, you are better off going DO than IMG.

Excellent....I wanted to ask someone in Family Practice a few questions. I get the impressions, especially in the pre-allo forum, that family practice is generally not a pre-meds first choice, which is not surprising considering the nature of SDN (I.E. the ONLY worthwhile pursuit is the HIGHLY competitive residency in Neuro-Cardio-Thoratic-Plastic-radiation-oncology-surgery) . I shadowed a family practice doc once, and I was really impressed with his cases and his ability as a physician. Why did you decide to go into it, and what do you think of it? What's the difference between family practice and internal medicine?

 

[notdeadyet]

I think SGU is the exception to that pecking order...

No, SGU isn't any exception. If you wanted to get specific with Rooter's formula, you could probably make it:

USMD>USDO>>>SGU/AUC/Ross/Saba>ForeignMD

But if chips come down, all things being equal, a US DO program will have preference over any Carribean program, including the biggies.

 

[notdeadyet]

And I really like the idea that I could travel while going to med school. Also as we all know the application process is not the most pleasant thing in the world. The campus is amazing; you can even spend a month or two in Prague doing rotations. And you can do some clinicals in England as well and have a large choice of where to do your clinicals in the US (which you will do alongside US med students).

The reason you can do all these international rotations is that you have to travel to do your rotations because they do not have their own hospital in the U.S. that is yours. This "freedom" isn't really a selling point. with any US program, you can do all the travel you want in fourth year. The only difference is that you're not forced to.

This is not a criticism specifically of Ross or St. George, or any of the Carribs. I would give the same advice to folks going to U.S. schools: be sure your medical school has its own hospital where you are guaranteed rotations. Anything less and your clinical experience is going to suffer.

 

[tarheel21]

My sister is currently attending SGU and she is in her fourth year right now. She did really well on her Step 1, actually got in the 97th percentile, and had plenty of interviews for residency. She wants to do Oncology Hematology and she hasn't found any barriers to doing that because she is willing to work hard and dedicate herself.

And I really don't get what's the whole deal with kids in their early twenties not wanting to wait a year, or two, maybe get a job, retake MCAT, volunteer, whatever to bolster their application, reapply and get into a US school???? Seriously, that just shows immaturity, poor judgement, and perhaps not so stellar reasoning abilities on their part.

I don't think she's immature or has poor judgement. She knew if she took a year off she would have a hard time focusing on studying as hard as medical school requires her to, so she chose to do what was best for her, in her situation. I would never dare to make a judgement on people who make these decisions. As someone said, it is a tougher road, and if someone knows they want to go to medical school and nothing will dissuade them and they know for sure they are willing to put in the hours and dedication to being successful, there is nothing wrong with that. Everyone has the freedom to make their own decision for what is best for them, and for someone to come here and make such an offensive statement is just that--offensive. My sister has very good judgement, is successful, and is very mature. She was even mature when she entered SGU.

On a different note, I visited her during her second year when she was in St. Vincent, and we also went to Grenada, it was absolutely beautiful. There are cons, definitely, but I have sent in an app to SGU and Ross. If there's no alternative in the States this year, I might just follow in her footsteps.

*Tarheel21

 

[tarheel21]

Oh and in regards to rotations, all of hers are in two hospitals in NY. They are both very close to each other, too, close enough that she rented an apartment somewhere inbetween and has been taking the subway to them. If you want to do international rotations, that is an option. Or you could do rotations in California or Orlando, I think, and NJ, for SGU. But I know for sure that if you do them in NY you have two hospitals that provide all of the core rotations you need in close distance.

*Tarheel21

 

[Top Gun]

The reason you can do all these international rotations is that you have to travel to do your rotations because they do not have their own hospital in the U.S. that is yours. This "freedom" isn't really a selling point. with any US program, you can do all the travel you want in fourth year. The only difference is that you're not forced to.

This is not a criticism specifically of Ross or St. George, or any of the Carribs. I would give the same advice to folks going to U.S. schools: be sure your medical school has its own hospital where you are guaranteed rotations. Anything less and your clinical experience is going to suffer.

SGU does not have their own hospitals in the US, per se. But they have affiliations with a number of hospitals, particularly in New York, New Jersey, and California. SGU also has what are known as clinical centers, designated hospitals which allow you to complete all of your core rotations there, due to affiliation agreements with SGU. When you're in your second year, they give you a list of affiliated hospitals and clinical centers which you can choose from to complete your clinical rotations. You choose three in order of preference. Virtually everyone gets their hospital of choice or, at the very least, gets a hospital to complete their rotations in. In fact, we were warned not to contact the hospitals directly to arrange rotations. SGU does all of that for you. So SGU is pretty good about getting you clinical rotations.

 

[TRAMD]

Excellent....I wanted to ask someone in Family Practice a few questions. I get the impressions, especially in the pre-allo forum, that family practice is generally not a pre-meds first choice, which is not surprising considering the nature of SDN (I.E. the ONLY worthwhile pursuit is the HIGHLY competitive residency in Neuro-Cardio-Thoratic-Plastic-radiation-oncology-surgery) . I shadowed a family practice doc once, and I was really impressed with his cases and his ability as a physician. Why did you decide to go into it, and what do you think of it? What's the difference between family practice and internal medicine?

You would probably be better off going to the FM forum. I will try to answer your questions but realize that I am doing my prelim year in family before PM&R and I have a father that switched from FM to Occupational Medicine. I am personally not interested in family. The breadth of knowledge is cool but at the same time intimidating. Family deals with OB, pediatrics and acute care more than IM.

 

[toot45]

Md = Do >>>>>>>>>> Img

 

[Proteinpowda]

Here's the thing I don't get....
Everyone likes to go on and on about
US MD > US DO > IMG

Yet the people saying that are usually pre-meds and whenever you talk to an IMG they're doing what they wanted to do. Those that really wanted it worked for it. So statistically speaking the numbers and match lists look better but yet how come I have yet to speak to an unhappy IMG?

 

[Law2Doc]

My sister is currently attending SGU and she is in her fourth year right now. She did really well on her Step 1, actually got in the 97th percentile, and had plenty of interviews for residency. She wants to do Oncology Hematology and she hasn't found any barriers to doing that because she is willing to work hard and dedicate herself.

The difference though is she pretty much HAD to get 97th percentile to not hit barriers. Not so, coming from a US allo school. I assure you that some of her classmates are not sitting as pretty. And a much larger number of her first year classmates likely didn't even make it to 4th year (attrition tends to be pretty significant offshore). So looking at one success you know doesn't really discount the multitudes of not so happy campers. No matter how you slice it, Caribbean is a harder road. And one that's probably worth avoiding if the only issue is time. It's not an accident that people look at it as a "second chance" ad medical school rather than one's primary target. The whole cottage industry was created to capitalize on the folks who didn't get into US schools, not as an equal alternative.

 

[Law2Doc]

Yet the people saying that are usually pre-meds and whenever you talk to an IMG they're doing what they wanted to do. Those that really wanted it worked for it. So statistically speaking the numbers and match lists look better but yet how come I have yet to speak to an unhappy IMG?

You only come across those who make it.
Just look at match results. According to AAMC, 94% of US grads have matched for the last 25 years. Forty-five to 50 percent of IMGs typically match to a residency position. Of those that match, the targets are going to be different as well, with IMGs trending more heavilly toward more of the geographically less desirable and less competitive specialties. So it's a great second chance -- you still have a shot at doing well and matching someplace, even if your premed stats were not competitive for US med school. But not everybody is capable of maximizing this second chance and so it seems better than half crash and burn, and have to take chances in the scramble. By contrast only a very small percentage of US allo students don't match, and when you combine that with the equally low attrition rate in the US, it pretty much means everyone who goes to a US allo school will become a US allo physician if they just do the work, pass the tests and don't do anything stupid. No other path promises that.