Carrib School Stigmas

[yallwild]

Hi All,

Buckle up cause here we go.

I have a question. I chose to go to a carrib school and am scheduled to start in January. I won't get into the specific reasons as to why. Quite frankly most of my reasons are politically motivated. I know all carrib schools aren't creating equal so I will add that I am going to AUA. However, I haven't been able to understand why people bash these schools so much. I often hear stuff about their predatory nature but to me "predatory" is the AAMC creating a $385 test that's literally made to be taken more than once. Even more so, the MCAT minimally determines someone's readiness for medical school. I'm not 100% supportive of for-profit schools because the education prices are seriously outrageous as it is. But what makes carrib schools different from for-profit prisons in the US. At least we CHOSE to be there knowing their company structure. I could go on forever but I will digress.

I am highly impressed with AUA. Their ability to communicate with us incoming students and keep us up to date with COVID-19. ALL schools have downsides so that is unavoidable, I know things will come along that I don't like. I chose AUA b/c I don't need a perfect school, I just wanted a school that would give me a shot at pursing my dreams of medicine. No school is going to make me a physician. The only person capable of doing that is me cutting the bull**** and spending countless hours of studying to do well.

Here's my logic. No school is going to make or break me being a physician? Why do a lot of students fail out? Well because as we all know, they accept students with pitiful grades who have minimal effective study habits. I have seen this with my own two eyes based on the students in my class. People are already being lazy and complaining about studying 24/7. I don't wanna give a speech on how I'm different because that would be a subjective statement. Lastly I will add that, ultimately people will do what they feel is best for them so please don't go jumping down people's throats about them choosing to go carrib. It's hard to make it out but it's not impossible. Thousands and thousands of other people have done it. Why can't it be me, you, or any other person?

I also want to hear from other current or future carrib students about why they chose to go Carrib (and how'd you pick which one to go to).

(I WROTE THIS AT 4AM AFTER STUDYING FOR 8 HOURS SO PLS IGNORE ANY GRAMMAR MISTAKES)

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[Gambino.]

You seem steadfast and ready to commit so why bother posting on here? Asking why the schools get a bad rep when you are already committed to going and have already defended the shortcomings (e.g. attrition rate) make this post moot point.

Yes, you can go to AUA and be a successful physician in a primary care field. Yes, you can also fail out and be in debt.

I think rather than hearing student's generic reasons for going, it'd be a lot more interesting to hear what these "political" reasons are that you speak of.

 

[Emmet2301]

You're right thousands of people get through, but thousands have also dropped out and are tens of thousands of dollars in debt.

This is a problem and if Caribbeans schools cared about attrition rates they wouldn't take so many risky students.

 

[deleted1082375]

Hi All,

Buckle up cause here we go.

I have a question. I chose to go to a carrib school and am scheduled to start in January. I won't get into the specific reasons as to why. Quite frankly most of my reasons are politically motivated. I know all carrib schools aren't creating equal so I will add that I am going to AUA. However, I haven't been able to understand why people bash these schools so much. I often hear stuff about their predatory nature but to me "predatory" is the AAMC creating a $385 test that's literally made to be taken more than once. Even more so, the MCAT minimally determines someone's readiness for medical school. I'm not 100% supportive of for-profit schools because the education prices are seriously outrageous as it is. But what makes carrib schools different from for-profit prisons in the US. At least we CHOSE to be there knowing their company structure. I could go on forever but I will digress.

I am highly impressed with AUA. Their ability to communicate with us incoming students and keep us up to date with COVID-19. ALL schools have downsides so that is unavoidable, I know things will come along that I don't like. I chose AUA b/c I don't need a perfect school, I just wanted a school that would give me a shot at pursing my dreams of medicine. No school is going to make me a physician. The only person capable of doing that is me cutting the bull**** and spending countless hours of studying to do well.

Here's my logic. No school is going to make or break me being a physician? Why do a lot of students fail out? Well because as we all know, they accept students with pitiful grades who have minimal effective study habits. I have seen this with my own two eyes based on the students in my class. People are already being lazy and complaining about studying 24/7. I don't wanna give a speech on how I'm different because that would be a subjective statement. Lastly I will add that, ultimately people will do what they feel is best for them so please don't go jumping down people's throats about them choosing to go carrib. It's hard to make it out but it's not impossible. Thousands and thousands of other people have done it. Why can't it be me, you, or any other person?

I also want to hear from other current or future carrib students about why they chose to go Carrib (and how'd you pick which one to go to).

(I WROTE THIS AT 4AM AFTER STUDYING FOR 8 HOURS SO PLS IGNORE ANY GRAMMAR MISTAKES)

Going to a Caribbean school before exhausting all your options says a few things about you:

1. you don't have the chops to play the game and improve yourself enough to get into an MD or DO program in the states
-getting in to a US school sucks but it's well worth it considering you'll very likely match by just passing your courses
-improving your grades builds a good foundation to survive medical school. it's crazy and hard, even for the best students
-you don't know how to sit for the MCAT and that performance will haunt you when it comes time to study and sit for boards
-you don't have the compassion to volunteer your time or actually care for sick patients

2. you lack patience and self-control
-you didn't want to wait and better yourself in all ways possible
-being a doctor and a medical student requires tons of patience and self-control. won't that come back and haunt you?

3. you may have had something seriously wrong with you that prevented you from even considering a US school
-felon
-misdemeanor
-weird personality
-personality disorder
-pervert

Medical school and medicine in general is political. You're in for a rude awakening. Carb schools get their reputation for a reason. You may be able to do well there and some of these things may not apply to you....but the stigma will sure follow you. I have friends and family who have warned me multiple times to only apply Caribbean after three cycles of failure.

And yes they are predatory. How are you sure you won't be one of the ones to fail?

 

[yallwild]

Going to a Caribbean school before exhausting all your options says a few things about you:

1. you don't have the chops to play the game and improve yourself enough to get into an MD or DO program in the states
-getting in to a US school sucks but it's well worth it considering you'll very likely match by just passing your courses
-improving your grades builds a good foundation to survive medical school. it's crazy and hard, even for the best students
-you don't know how to sit for the MCAT and that performance will haunt you when it comes time to study and sit for boards
-you don't have the compassion to volunteer your time or actually care for sick patients

2. you lack patience and self-control
-you didn't want to wait and better yourself in all ways possible
-being a doctor and a medical student requires tons of patience and self-control. won't that come back and haunt you?

3. you may have had something seriously wrong with you that prevented you from even considering a US school
-felon
-misdemeanor
-weird personality
-personality disorder
-pervert

Medical school and medicine in general is political. You're in for a rude awakening. Carb schools get their reputation for a reason. You may be able to do well there and some of these things may not apply to you....but the stigma will sure follow you. I have friends and family who have warned me multiple times to only apply Caribbean after three cycles of failure.

And yes they are predatory. How are you sure you won't be one of the ones to fail?

That statement but was full of assumptions but I will say I found it comical. I'm going carrib because I'm a felon😂 that is original, I'll give it to you. Other than that your post was useless, thanks for trying though 😬

I'm sad to know people who act like this on the internet are going to be someone's doctor. Medicine aside you have to know how to communicate to be a successful ANYTHING. Many people on SDN clerkly can't do that lol.

 

[yallwild]

You seem steadfast and ready to commit so why bother posting on here? Asking why the schools get a bad rep when you are already committed to going and have already defended the shortcomings (e.g. attrition rate) make this post moot point.

Yes, you can go to AUA and be a successful physician in a primary care field. Yes, you can also fail out and be in debt.

I think rather than hearing student's generic reasons for going, it'd be a lot more interesting to hear what these "political" reasons are that you speak of.

ohhhh you wanna get spicy early.

1. I DESPISE the American school system. From primary school all the way up to undergrad. We are taught to regurgitate info instead of thinking critically.

2. I despise our medical school system even more. It's all about money will no real benefit on your end regardless how hard you work. you'd mess up and welp you're done. Hasta la vista. That is just so stupid to me. It also allows these MS programs in "medical science" to prey on desperate students. Which I will admit carib schools due too but least they're not up playing your chance of getting into med school just to deny you. I know exactly what I'm getting into and I'm the only person that is in the way of me graduating.

3. I would be perfectly content not practicing in America. Will I apply to US residencies ofc bc thats what my family would want but if I ended up in the Europe, India or even Antigua. I would be still happy. I want to be a physician, not an American physician. btw yes im American born.

4. What my scholarships doesn't cover my parents are paying out of pocket. So other than "wasting money" I wouldn't be financially crippled if I "failed out".

 

[deleted1082375]

That statement but was full of assumptions but I will say I found it comical. I'm going carrib because I'm a felon😂 that is original, I'll give it to you. Other than that your post was useless, thanks for trying though 😬

I'm sad to know people who act like this on the internet are going to be someone's doctor. Medicine aside you have to know how to communicate to be a successful ANYTHING. Many people on SDN clerkly can't do that lol.

You’ll see when you get there.

I have personally met Caribbean medical students with felony records.

You have disdain for the education system because you were likely outperformed by others, myself included.

I’m not baiting you. What I said is the truth like it or not. I clearly communicated to you why Caribbean medical school is bad, a kind gesture to type a lengthy reply.

 

[Gambino.]

ohhhh you wanna get spicy early.

1. I DESPISE the American school system. From primary school all the way up to undergrad. We are taught to regurgitate info instead of thinking critically.

2. I despise our medical school system even more. It's all about money will no real benefit on your end regardless how hard you work. you'd mess up and welp you're done. Hasta la vista. That is just so stupid to me. It also allows these MS programs in "medical science" to prey on desperate students. Which I will admit carib schools due too but least they're not up playing your chance of getting into med school just to deny you. I know exactly what I'm getting into and I'm the only person that is in the way of me graduating.

3. I would be perfectly content not practicing in America. Will I apply to US residencies ofc bc thats what my family would want but if I ended up in the Europe, India or even Antigua. I would be still happy. I want to be a physician, not an American physician. btw yes im American born.

4. What my scholarships doesn't cover my parents are paying out of pocket. So other than "wasting money" I wouldn't be financially crippled if I "failed out".

1. I don't see how this would change by going to AUA as these schools use the US model of teaching and form their curriculum to coincide with US schools. By all means avoid going through tertiary schooling again if you feel this way but the learning aspect of med school isn't going to change much at all by going to a Carib program as opposed to a US program.

2. Sounds like a personal experience rather than the "system" out to get you. No one should ever tell you to get a masters in med science, I agree they are rather worthless. There are plenty of ways for reinvention, including a DIY post-bacc at a local college. People choose the MS as it consolidates upper level courses together and they can pick a field that interests them somewhat but a DIY can prove just as beneficial for those that want it.

3. Non-natives typically are not eligible for a medical license on these islands. So while you can avoid the US, it isn't any easier to find a job abroad. The WDMS also shows that the latest data from 2019 shows a 58% attrition rate. Yes, you are responsible for yourself in these programs but you can't say that they aren't predatory if over half the students do not graduate. (Preventative rebuttal over denial over numbers ->)The figures are given to the directory by AUA btw out of requirement to hold their listing in the directory and FAIMER to be eligible for ECFMG certification so no, they aren't fake numbers.

4. Lucky to have parents with the means to pay your schooling but this typically isn't the case for the average person.


Again, you can go wherever you desire but your post comes off as a rant and being defensive off the get go which doesn't exactly foster discussion even from people like me that are Carib students.

 

[deleted1082375]

1. I don't see how this would change by going to AUA as these schools use the US model of teaching and form their curriculum to coincide with US schools. By all means avoid going through tertiary schooling again if you feel this way but the learning aspect of med school isn't going to change much at all by going to a Carib program as opposed to a US program.

2. Sounds like a personal experience rather than the "system" out to get you. No one should ever tell you to get a masters in med science, I agree they are rather worthless. There are plenty of ways for reinvention, including a DIY post-bacc at a local college. People choose the MS as it consolidates upper level courses together and they can pick a field that interests them somewhat but a DIY can prove just as beneficial for those that want it.

3. Non-natives typically are not eligible for a medical license on these islands. So while you can avoid the US, it isn't any easier to find a job abroad. The WDMS also shows that the latest data from 2019 shows a 58% attrition rate. Yes, you are responsible for yourself in these programs but you can't say that they aren't predatory if over half the students do not graduate. (Preventative rebuttal over denial over numbers ->)The figures are given to the directory by AUA btw out of requirement to hold their listing in the directory and FAIMER to be eligible for ECFMG certification so no, they aren't fake numbers.

4. Lucky to have parents with the means to pay your schooling but this typically isn't the case for the average person.


Again, you can go wherever you desire but your post comes off as a rant and being defensive off the get go which doesn't exactly foster discussion even from people like me that are Carib students.

OP truly is a miserable person.

OP, you're not a special snowflake and the world isn't out to get you. It's hard for everyone.

 

[Mad Jack]

Hi All,

Buckle up cause here we go.

I have a question. I chose to go to a carrib school and am scheduled to start in January. I won't get into the specific reasons as to why. Quite frankly most of my reasons are politically motivated. I know all carrib schools aren't creating equal so I will add that I am going to AUA. However, I haven't been able to understand why people bash these schools so much. I often hear stuff about their predatory nature but to me "predatory" is the AAMC creating a $385 test that's literally made to be taken more than once. Even more so, the MCAT minimally determines someone's readiness for medical school. I'm not 100% supportive of for-profit schools because the education prices are seriously outrageous as it is. But what makes carrib schools different from for-profit prisons in the US. At least we CHOSE to be there knowing their company structure. I could go on forever but I will digress.

I am highly impressed with AUA. Their ability to communicate with us incoming students and keep us up to date with COVID-19. ALL schools have downsides so that is unavoidable, I know things will come along that I don't like. I chose AUA b/c I don't need a perfect school, I just wanted a school that would give me a shot at pursing my dreams of medicine. No school is going to make me a physician. The only person capable of doing that is me cutting the bull**** and spending countless hours of studying to do well.

Here's my logic. No school is going to make or break me being a physician? Why do a lot of students fail out? Well because as we all know, they accept students with pitiful grades who have minimal effective study habits. I have seen this with my own two eyes based on the students in my class. People are already being lazy and complaining about studying 24/7. I don't wanna give a speech on how I'm different because that would be a subjective statement. Lastly I will add that, ultimately people will do what they feel is best for them so please don't go jumping down people's throats about them choosing to go carrib. It's hard to make it out but it's not impossible. Thousands and thousands of other people have done it. Why can't it be me, you, or any other person?

I also want to hear from other current or future carrib students about why they chose to go Carrib (and how'd you pick which one to go to).

(I WROTE THIS AT 4AM AFTER STUDYING FOR 8 HOURS SO PLS IGNORE ANY GRAMMAR MISTAKES)

You really need to buckle up if you think medical school is some walk in the park. I'm a damn good student, and I was just shy of average on the USMLE, despite a 96th percentile MCAT and great preclinical and clinical grades. I crushed the COMLEX, thankfully, which has helped my career a lot, but the USMLE is the most fair but challenging exam you will ever take in your life. The sheer quantity of information and the strong critical thinking required on top of that base level of knowledge is simply unfathomable until you have to do it. An average score for a Carib grad is a death sentence for your career, whereas as a DO I still matched my moderately competitive specialty of choice. If you go to the Carib, you have to be a superstar, and if you are capable of being a superstar, why would you go to the Carib? Use that same level of effort to get into a US-based school (MD or DO) from the start and you create a lot greater room for error for yourself and you can increase your ceiling substantially with regard to specialty choice and program location.

Your school does make or break you to some extent. Most programs in more competitive specialties will be completely closed to you and you will likely end up in less than desirable geographic areas. As a DO, this improves somewhat but still leaves much to be desired.

 

[ThrowawayShmoaway]

I genuinely wish you luck in med school, but I think it’s disengenuous to pretend like you are only attending AUA because you want to make some sort of philosophical stand against the American medical school system. You have a low GPA and a low MCAT for American allopathic schools, and it looks like you applied last cycle and did not get in, and are reapplying this year, as well. So it seems like you only began to “despise” our medical school system after they rejected you, no? I think the other poster’s comment about the general reasons people go to Caribbean schools before exhausting all their other options (and specifically the part about not having the “chops” to play the game and improve one’s app) is probably spot on in this case.

 

[yallwild]

1. I don't see how this would change by going to AUA as these schools use the US model of teaching and form their curriculum to coincide with US schools. By all means avoid going through tertiary schooling again if you feel this way but the learning aspect of med school isn't going to change much at all by going to a Carib program as opposed to a US program.

2. Sounds like a personal experience rather than the "system" out to get you. No one should ever tell you to get a masters in med science, I agree they are rather worthless. There are plenty of ways for reinvention, including a DIY post-bacc at a local college. People choose the MS as it consolidates upper level courses together and they can pick a field that interests them somewhat but a DIY can prove just as beneficial for those that want it.

3. Non-natives typically are not eligible for a medical license on these islands. So while you can avoid the US, it isn't any easier to find a job abroad. The WDMS also shows that the latest data from 2019 shows a 58% attrition rate. Yes, you are responsible for yourself in these programs but you can't say that they aren't predatory if over half the students do not graduate. (Preventative rebuttal over denial over numbers ->)The figures are given to the directory by AUA btw out of requirement to hold their listing in the directory and FAIMER to be eligible for ECFMG certification so no, they aren't fake numbers.

4. Lucky to have parents with the means to pay your schooling but this typically isn't the case for the average person.


Again, you can go wherever you desire but your post comes off as a rant and being defensive off the get go which doesn't exactly foster discussion even from people like me that are Carib students.

1. Because I would have the availability to go to other countries. All countries have residency hoops to jump through
2. I don't have an MS so not a personal experience. I said I'm against MS in med science not master's degrees. But I agree a discipline applicable to the real world is probs better. Bio, Chem, etc.
3. The road less travelled is never easy. If I wanted easy I would be a stay at home wife. Never said they weren't predatory. They are.
4. Point taken and I am very grateful


I wasn't trying to be ranty. I was on SDN at 4am after spending 8 hours doing GI lol I have to get my entertainment from somewhere.

what part of "I also want to hear from other current or future carrib students about why they chose to go Carrib (and how'd you pick which one to go to)" isn't fostering a discussion?

 

[yallwild]

I genuinely wish you luck in med school, but I think it’s disengenuous to pretend like you are only attending AUA because you want to make some sort of philosophical stand against the American medical school system. You have a low GPA and a low MCAT for American allopathic schools, and it looks like you applied last cycle and did not get in, and are reapplying this year, as well. So it seems like you only began to “despise” our medical school system after they rejected you, no? I think the other poster’s comment about the general reasons people go to Caribbean schools before exhausting all their other options (and specifically the part about not having the “chops” to play the game and improve one’s app) is probably spot on in this case.

Does everyone just assume in this place??

1. I didn't apply last year. I graduated December 2020 aka like yesterday.

2. I don't want to make a "philisophical statement" to the US. LOL they don't care about me. I do genuine love the public health aspect and am seriously interested in medicine world wide.

3. Yeah, I had low UG GPA but I cant speak to if that would've got me accepted or not because I actually applied this year and pulled my apps from my US schools in August.

4. some stranger's opinion about me not having "chops" means 0 to me. Plenty people in US schools without "chops". Again, I choosey destiny by work and effort. Please don't follow up with the "well why didn't you do better in UG" because UG and grad school are starkly different. in the sense that I won't work & I won't be suffering through a political history class because it's deemed necessary lol

5. I didn't exhaust options here because I'm not deadset on being a US physician so going out the country wasn't an issue for me. The benefits of practicing in the US didn't outweigh the way I feel about POTENTIALLY not coming back here. I lowkey wish I was European to begin with. America has given me lots of opportunity but I'm ready to peace out.

I hate this place lol why am I here.

 

[yallwild]

You really need to buckle up if you think medical school is some walk in the park. I'm a damn good student, and I was just shy of average on the USMLE, despite a 96th percentile MCAT and great preclinical and clinical grades. I crushed the COMLEX, thankfully, which has helped my career a lot, but the USMLE is the most fair but challenging exam you will ever take in your life. The sheer quantity of information and the strong critical thinking required on top of that base level of knowledge is simply unfathomable until you have to do it. An average score for a Carib grad is a death sentence for your career, whereas as a DO I still matched my moderately competitive specialty of choice. If you go to the Carib, you have to be a superstar, and if you are capable of being a superstar, why would you go to the Carib? Use that same level of effort to get into a US-based school (MD or DO) from the start and you create a lot greater room for error for yourself and you can increase your ceiling substantially with regard to specialty choice and program location.

Your school does make or break you to some extent. Most programs in more competitive specialties will be completely closed to you and you will likely end up in less than desirable geographic areas. As a DO, this improves somewhat but still leaves much to be desired.

I think medical school is a walk in the park? Thanks for updating me on my thoughts and opinions. The residents I work with seems super busy idek how residents have time to surf SDN. I've mentioned already that location isn't a selling point for me.

 

[yallwild]

OP truly is a miserable person.

OP, you're not a special snowflake and the world isn't out to get you. It's hard for everyone.

I agree, I actually got the better end of the stick. I could be poor, homeless, or like you. I'm quite the opposite of miserable but go off *cue eye roll*

 

[DexterMorganSK]

I'm not seeing a point of this thread, closing.