MD co ‘20 Residency Panic Thread

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I had an interview in psych the other day where one interviewer spent all 20 minutes ripping to shreds my career plans and poking holes in everything I said. Needless to say, this interviewer made it clear that he believed I did not want to go to his program and that he was discouraging me. I answered the questions with tact (I believe), and hopefully articulated my responses well.

I have to say though, he did what he sought out to do. Why on earth would I want to go to this program when this is a leader of their department? Won’t name the program - I enjoyed many aspects of potentially training there. It was pretty jarring though, so it negatively impacted my ranking excel score.

Job well done, guy.
 
mistafab said:
I had an interview in psych the other day where one interviewer spent all 20 minutes ripping to shreds my career plans and poking holes in everything I said. Needless to say, this interviewer made it clear that he believed I did not want to go to his program and that he was discouraging me. I answered the questions with tact (I believe), and hopefully articulated my responses well.

I have to say though, he did what he sought out to do. Why on earth would I want to go to this program when this is a leader of their department? Won’t name the program - I enjoyed many aspects of potentially training there. It was pretty jarring though, so it negatively impacted my ranking excel score.

Job well done, guy.
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This makes me wonder, just how important will the PD be to your happiness? I know the residents you work with can make a huge difference, but I could see the PD having a big role (which seems obvious) or a surprisingly small role in your day to day life.
 
I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around how having a longer rank list improves your ability to match? For example, what if you are a poor interviewer, and all programs rank you between 15-20? How would having a longer rank list benefit this applicant? Any insight would be helpful! 🙂
 
BigJaySon said:
I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around how having a longer rank list improves your ability to match? For example, what if you are a poor interviewer, and all programs rank you between 15-20? How would having a longer rank list benefit this applicant? Any insight would be helpful! 🙂
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Here's a video explaining how the Match algorithm works and why it would be to your advantage to have a longer rank list if possible: How the Matching Algorithm Works - The Match, National Resident Matching Program

Hope this helps!
 
BigJaySon said:
Thanks Rukia! I understand how the match generally works. I also understand the drawbacks of a small rank list. But what if you're a middle-of-the-pack applicant/interviewee. How would a longer (>15) benefit such an applicant?
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I'm not an expert on the matter since I'm also applying for residency this cycle but my guess would be that if you have enough programs on your rank list, you would hope that the "more desirable"/higher ranked candidates matched into other programs and therefore the program would have to match candidates lower on their list so it's that many more chances to secure a spot. Hopefully that makes sense? Like, if 10 programs rank the same 5 candidates for positions 1-5, that's a total of 50 positions: 5 will be filled, leaving 45 open spots for other candidates. If you ranked those 10 programs, you have a chance at 45 of those spots vs. if you only ranked 2 programs, there's a chance at 5 of the remaining spots.

At least, that's a very general idea of how I imagine it but if anyone has better insight, please feel free to correct me!
 
So i have an upcoming pre interview dinner this week, but you were supposed to RSVP last week.. and i didnt, smh. Do i contact them to let them know if I can still rsvp or do I not show up? Which is worse lol .. so many interview dinners to attend
 
camng11 said:
So i have an upcoming pre interview dinner this week, but you were supposed to RSVP last week.. and i didnt, smh. Do i contact them to let them know if I can still rsvp or do I not show up? Which is worse lol .. so many interview dinners to attend
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I don't think it hurts to reach out and ask if it's ok to attend now that you know you are able to make it--plans can change and the worst case scenario is that they say no due to planning logistics. You don't have to go into detail about why you didn't rsvp in the first place and I don't think it hurts to show interest in attending the dinner.
 
Sitting on 4 interviews at the moment. Really hoping a new wave of interviews arrive this week. According to the matching outcomes on the NRMP website 91 percent of USMD applicants with 4 interviews matched in 2016 and 85 percent in 2018. Once you reach about 10 interviews your chances are about 99%. I like looking at the glass half way full and I understand there are other factors to take in to consideration besides the numbers. Anyways, do you guys think I should send some LOI now that we are in November? or should I just wait a little longer for maybe another wave?
 
RHL ONE said:
Sitting on 4 interviews at the moment. Really hoping a new wave of interviews arrive this week. According to the matching outcomes on the NRMP website 91 percent of USMD applicants with 4 interviews matched in 2016 and 85 percent in 2018. Once you reach about 10 interviews your chances are about 99%. I like looking at the glass half way full and I understand there are other factors to take in to consideration besides the numbers. Anyways, do you guys think I should send some LOI now that we are in November? or should I just wait a little longer for maybe another wave?
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Send LOI. One I just sent came back with waitlist only.
 
MerYangBey said:
Anyone feeling how financially draining this process is?
I thought the flights were gonna be the expensive part but the transport, hotels, and food add up real quick...
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One spot where regional limitations is a good thing... but also, regional limitations....

So thankful for the programs that pay for hotels
 
ciestar said:
One spot where regional limitations is a good thing... but also, regional limitations....

So thankful for the programs that pay for hotels
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I mean 4/5 for me is within a 4 hour driving distance. It’s nice that I’ve only been out once for a big trip.
But psych is not as nice as family. Only 1 gave me a place to stay 🙁
 
samac said:
I mean 4/5 for me is within a 4 hour driving distance. It’s nice that I’ve only been out once for a big trip.
But psych is not as nice as family. Only 1 gave me a place to stay 🙁
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None of the ones super close to me provide it, which sucks for people far away.

Family is all about fit, so they try and lure you in many different ways
 
MerYangBey said:
Are you joking? Or is this a real answer? Because if it’s real I don’t like it one bit.
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A lot of people on SDN are the classic “smart on tests but dumb with people” group. Certain specialties just want scores, but all the super clinical ones (FM, IM, Peds, EM) would MUCH rather have an average applicant that was a decent person and people liked versus a jerk with high scores. Was told this several times by residents and attendings. I think the best thing is to sit down with someone that you really trust, and have them spell out all your annoying/obnoxious traits. Be open and not defensive so that you don’t carry it into residency and end up being a target there.

Epilepsy365 said:
The word “grilling” means different things to diff people. In my opinion, if you did an away rotation for four weeks and then interviewed there, I define grilling as being too traditional in which they gone through the cutter cookie questions instead of being an informal chat.

In my opinion, grilling is defined as the following questions for example:
1) What are your strengths and weaknesses?
2) Why are you a fit for our program?

These questions are perfectly fine if you have never done an away rotation. It’s a huge red flag if you are being asked these questions especially when you have worked with the team for four weeks and have been evaluated by multiple attendings and residents. It means you bomb on your away rotation.

No ifs or buts about it. Therefore, the student misinterprets as the interviewers not reading their applications when their fate has already been decided by his or her four week performance. I will also say that if you are killing your aways, you will get excellent feedbacks whether you ask for it or not. When you’re being kept in the dark, it means you are bombing it.
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True, but sometimes places just ask generic questions to everyone. IMO grilling is something like “I’m looking at your app now, why should we pick you?” or “I see in the MSPE you got a comment on your surgery rotation that you need to read more and be more motivated, what steps will you take to stay on top of the reading needed in residency” or some other such question. To me if you did an away and they say that it means the interview you’re doing is simply a curtesy interview that they do for all rotators and they would have never picked you. If you didn’t rotate there it could mean you were on their waitlist/maybe pile and they want you to sell yourself. I agree with the feedback thing. If anyone ever says “so how do you think you did” it almost always means you did poorly.
 
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CidHighwind said:
If anyone ever says “so how do you think you did” it almost always means you did poorly.
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I literally have been asked this question every single time I have asked residents and attendings for feedback, and across the board that has been before getting great evaluations and honors in that rotation. I definitely would not make that a blanket statement-no need to worry those who are already reading too much into everything that is said during this process.
 
njtrimed said:
I literally have been asked this question every single time I have asked residents and attendings for feedback, and across the board that has been before getting great evaluations and honors in that rotation. I definitely would not make that a blanket statement-no need to worry those who are already reading too much into everything that is said during this process.
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Are you saying that because that’s actually true or because you don’t want people to worry? Didn’t mean for it to come across as judgemental, but usually if someone is going to give someone a bad critique/eval, they want to get an idea on if the person has insight to their performance. Also not everyone is honest to your face, hence the stories you hear about the people that were told they were doing great on a rotation and end up SOAPing because they got a bad LOR or SLOE.
 
CidHighwind said:
Are you saying that because that’s actually true or because you don’t want people to worry? Didn’t mean for it to come across as judgemental, but usually if someone is going to give someone a bad critique/eval, they want to get an idea on if the person has insight to their performance. Also not everyone is honest to your face, hence the stories you hear about the people that were told they were doing great on a rotation and end up SOAPing because they got a bad LOR or SLOE.
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I’m saying this because it’s the truth, and it seems pretty standard for people to ask for your insight into your performance. It’s also a question I was asked (and asked) during performance evaluations in my prior career. I have never received less than a 90 on any aspect of a clinical evaluation throughout third & fourth year (including 4 sub-Is) and my evals have matched exactly what I was told when I asked for feedback. Whether or not you did well, I imagine this is a normal question to ask, and doesn’t imply that you did well OR poorly- it’s just a question. That being said, the question is usually followed by a conversation about what the reviewer thinks about the person being asked, so it seems odd that someone would bother to ask and have that conversation and not be honest about any criticism they have. Unless, of course, it’s just that the student hands someone their eval and is asked that question, but does not actually ask for feedback and later finds out what the reviewer actually thought; I would not be surprised if that was the case for some students.
 
God. This board is full of miserable people sometimes. The dude got grilled (whatever that means) during an interview in which he thought he did a fantastic job at his site away. Then, he proceeded to ask for opinions for possible perspectives on why that was the case. It's a rare phenomenon and even he knows it. Otherwise, that person wouldn't be posting on the Internet asking for opinions.

I tried to offer an alternative opinion that may be helpful. Instead, we have a bunch of social justice warriors here yapping their gums about me being mean. Well, slapping the fellow on the back and telling him that it means nothing isn't helpful. I wouldn't appreciate it if I was in his position.

End rant. Let's get back on track instead of chest thumping ourselves about our Honors during third year.
 
Epilepsy365 said:
God. This board is full of miserable people sometimes. The dude got grilled (whatever that means) during an interview in which he thought he did a fantastic job at his site away. Then, he proceeded to ask for opinions for possible perspectives on why that was the case. It's a rare phenomenon and even he knows it. Otherwise, that person wouldn't be posting on the Internet asking for opinions.

I tried to offer an alternative opinion that may be helpful. Instead, we have a bunch of social justice warriors here yapping their gums about me being mean. Well, slapping the fellow on the back and telling him that it means nothing isn't helpful. I wouldn't appreciate it if I was in his position.

End rant. Let's get back on track instead of chest thumping ourselves about our Honors during third year.
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The correct buzzword you were looking for was “snowflake”.
 
Epilepsy365 said:
God. This board is full of miserable people sometimes. The dude got grilled (whatever that means) during an interview in which he thought he did a fantastic job at his site away. Then, he proceeded to ask for opinions for possible perspectives on why that was the case. It's a rare phenomenon and even he knows it. Otherwise, that person wouldn't be posting on the Internet asking for opinions.

I tried to offer an alternative opinion that may be helpful. Instead, we have a bunch of social justice warriors here yapping their gums about me being mean. Well, slapping the fellow on the back and telling him that it means nothing isn't helpful. I wouldn't appreciate it if I was in his position.

End rant. Let's get back on track instead of chest thumping ourselves about our Honors during third year.
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Dude. Calm down.
I think people were making the point that things couldn’t be changed anyway, it’s all just speculation, so why make people worry more than they already are. You’re better off saying “who knows?” than going on a pessimistic rant.
 
Okay for real annoyance..
I over applied due to panic and neurosis..
And my top pick program now is a program in a location that does NOT work for my husband.
 
ciestar said:
Okay for real annoyance..
I over applied due to panic and neurosis..
And my top pick program now is a program in a location that does NOT work for my husband.
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Then unfortunately it’s no longer your top pick.

Everything about a program are secondary to family.

This is coming from someone who will rank a less known program over more prestigious ones due to family factors and location.
 
Epilepsy365 said:
Then unfortunately it’s no longer your top pick.

Everything about a program are secondary to family.

This is coming from someone who will rank a less known program over more prestigious ones due to family factors and location.
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Yeah, i know. Still makes me sad. It’s an ideal location for me and it would be my pick if it were just me.

Thankfully I have all the philly programs and many of the surrounding areas in PA and NJ to pick from.
 
ciestar said:
Yeah, i know. Still makes me sad. It’s an ideal location for me and it would be my pick if it were just me.

Thankfully I have all the philly programs and many of the surrounding areas in PA and NJ to pick from.
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What makes this “dream” program so much better than the others? Is it how high it sits on Doximity? Have you done all of your interviews so far, you may have a “new #1” that’s close to where your husband works.

I guess a good compromise would be to live 1.5 hours in the middle and both of you have a 90 minute commute. I’ve heard that’s pretty common with a lot of Bay Area residents. Not ideal but something to think about.
 
CidHighwind said:
What makes this “dream” program so much better than the others? Is it how high it sits on Doximity? Have you done all of your interviews so far, you may have a “new #1” that’s close to where your husband works.

I guess a good compromise would be to live 1.5 hours in the middle and both of you have a 90 minute commute. I’ve heard that’s pretty common with a lot of Bay Area residents. Not ideal but something to think about.
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I havent even checked Doximity to be completely honest. FM is a lot less about rankings and more fit. I loved the curriculum, the hospital, it is unopposed, and a town i want to live in close to my own family. Also rare weekend shifts and minimal call.

But he’d never be cool with a commute like that, but, i dont think id like that either.
 
ciestar said:
I havent even checked Doximity to be completely honest. FM is a lot less about rankings and more fit. I loved the curriculum, the hospital, it is unopposed, and a town i want to live in close to my own family. Also rare weekend shifts and minimal call.

But he’d never be cool with a commute like that, but, i dont think id like that either.
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I think you know what to do. Besides, you may interview at a program closer to where your husband works and you end up liking it more than your #1.
 
CidHighwind said:
I think you know what to do. Besides, you may interview at a program closer to where your husband works and you end up liking it more than your #1.
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I have a few coming up closer to home, so i hope so.
 
Looking for some guidance here. What is the etiquette on declining interview? Is declining it a week/a little over a week before scheduled interview acceptable? Or will it get me blacklisted?
 
PhoenixAZ said:
Looking for some guidance here. What is the etiquette on declining interview? Is declining it a week/a little over a week before scheduled interview acceptable? Or will it get me blacklisted?
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My school said a week at a minimum.
 
ciestar said:
Okay for real annoyance..
I over applied due to panic and neurosis..
And my top pick program now is a program in a location that does NOT work for my husband.
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How essential is your husband’s immediate income? How persuasive can you be? Or how much are you willing to compromise?
 
marathonermedicinegal said:
I am also married and tbh my marriage has to come before my rank list. Telling someone to just drop their job and career for you (who knows what the job opportunities are like in a location) is recipe for resentment. Im sure there are going to be better/equivalent options that work for everyone 🙂
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I am also married with a 2 year old. Luckily for me my wife is a nurse and willing to relocate anywhere. So we are going to Alaska.jk.😀
I agree with all your points marathonermedicinegal.
 
Decline as soon as you know it won’t work. Hopefully this is more than a week or two out, so that the waitlisted student has time to prepare. Sometimes in life though, you gotta do what you gotta do. If it is last minute (less than a week), I would definitely give the program a call.

PhoenixAZ said:
Looking for some guidance here. What is the etiquette on declining interview? Is declining it a week/a little over a week before scheduled interview acceptable? Or will it get me blacklisted?
Click to expand...
 
PhoenixAZ said:
Looking for some guidance here. What is the etiquette on declining interview? Is declining it a week/a little over a week before scheduled interview acceptable? Or will it get me blacklisted?
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Aim for a minimum of 2 weeks to allow the program to find a replacement candidate (or even sooner once you know for sure). If you cancel without adequate time, you risk not only your own reputation but also your school and future applicants from your school applying to that program (this is what my school told us in an email re: residency interview etiquette). Also, depending on how small the program is (ie. MP), there can definitely be talk amongst PDs about problematic candidates.

Obviously if you have to cancel last minute due to unexpected happenings (family emergencies, etc.) you just have to communicate and explain the situation. But cancelling on a short notice just bc you don't feel like going anymore or changed your mind about the program is a big no.
 
rukia013 said:
Aim for a minimum of 2 weeks to allow the program to find a replacement candidate (or even sooner once you know for sure). If you cancel without adequate time, you risk not only your own reputation but also your school and future applicants from your school applying to that program (this is what my school told us in an email re: residency interview etiquette). Also, depending on how small the program is (ie. MP), there can definitely be talk amongst PDs about problematic candidates.

Obviously if you have to cancel last minute due to unexpected happenings (family emergencies, etc.) you just have to communicate and explain the situation. But cancelling on a short notice just bc you don't feel like going anymore or changed your mind about the program is a big no.
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Which is why ive interviewed at programs that i am no longer interested in attending. I feel like I am wasting their time knowing this, but i cannot cancel a few days out
 
ciestar said:
Which is why ive interviewed at programs that i am no longer interested in attending. I feel like I am wasting their time knowing this, but i cannot cancel a few days out
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Honestly, depending on the program you may be better off just going ahead and canceling. Those programs have waitlists for a reason, and someone that is hurting for interviews may not mind going there on short notice.
 
CidHighwind said:
Honestly, depending on the program you may be better off just going ahead and canceling. Those programs have waitlists for a reason, and someone that is hurting for interviews may not mind going there on short notice.
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I just cancelled three today, but they were scheduled a bit out. The other ones that fall into that I’ve already attended. Would i hate being at those programs? No. Location is the biggest problem for me now. Still a max 3 hours from where I live now, so it wouldnt be world ending
 
Was driving to an interview last week and was just thinking about a good program in the state I currently attend school in, wishing I had been a part of their main wave of interview invites and then after I reached I checked my phone and saw I got an invite there! The trickle is definitely real!
 
sharkbyte said:
Was driving to an interview last week and was just thinking about a good program in the state I currently attend school in, wishing I had been a part of their main wave of interview invites and then after I reached I checked my phone and saw I got an invite there! The trickle is definitely real!
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I got an invite from the most competitive program on my list last week, i was soo excited because i wasnt expecting it. I am also on an away/audition to one of my top picks and couldnt help but share my excitement which i feel badly about now, i feel like it looks bad.
 
samac said:
I got another interview today 🙂 The trickle is real, yo
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How do you feel about interviewing at a place where you weren't their clear "first choice". Serious question. If I were to get more interviews this late I'd be a little skeptical about spending my time and money flying out somewhere to be there rank 30 student. All of this assuming you don't blow the interview out of the park...
 
Giovanotto said:
How do you feel about interviewing at a place where you weren't their clear "first choice". Serious question. If I were to get more interviews this late I'd be a little skeptical about spending my time and money flying out somewhere to be there rank 30 student. All of this assuming you don't blow the interview out of the park...
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Rank 30 at a place that interviews 100–150 people is actually a really decent spot. I get your point though. Why waste time doing an interview at a place where you were most likely on a hidden waitlist for or that you had to beg for via LOI? I guess that depends on the applicant. If they got plenty of invites on the first round, why bother? If you’re the type that didn’t get many invites, you’d probably be estatic. We all know of people that got of a waitlist or sent a LOI and matched somewhere, it’s obvious that you’re not their first (or even second) choice, but who cares?
 
Giovanotto said:
How do you feel about interviewing at a place where you weren't their clear "first choice". Serious question. If I were to get more interviews this late I'd be a little skeptical about spending my time and money flying out somewhere to be there rank 30 student. All of this assuming you don't blow the interview out of the park...
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I know many people who have matched places that they received an interview invite from in November. From my understanding for most places once you’re to the interview they’re looking at the interview and less about the initial application.
I know I’m never going to be someone’s first choice for interview. I’ll just wow them with my dazzling personality.
 
Giovanotto said:
How do you feel about interviewing at a place where you weren't their clear "first choice". Serious question. If I were to get more interviews this late I'd be a little skeptical about spending my time and money flying out somewhere to be there rank 30 student. All of this assuming you don't blow the interview out of the park...
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Depends on the program in terms of how I *feel* about it. If my home program invited me in January two days before their last date, I would feel pretty bad. Regardless of feelings, I will go where I am invited until I reach a number I am comfortable at. It gives me more data to think about when making my rank list. This process has been super humbling, I’m not going to say no just because I’m not a first choice unless their invite explicitly said “Ugh I GUESS you can come waste our time you doink”.
 
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