Oh yes, I totally understand and I agree completely! Definitely understandable! I do not know why I had initially assumed that these misdemeanors would have such a big effect. Thank you so much for your reply!
Thank you so much for such a detailed reply! I really appreciate it!
Absolutely. Some people are horrible
Thank you so much! I am unsure about why everyone keeps telling me to wait until my charges are expunged/sealed though... What's the difference if I will have to discuss them regardless??
For your path to become a doctor to even be feasible, you have to get in to medical school first. If your charges aren't expunged, there's a zero chance you'll get in as you have to directly report your misdemeanors to AMCAS. Not to mention, given the severity of the charges, 2-4 years is not enough distance from your convictions for schools when they're viewing your application.
1. By the time I apply to medical school, it will be 3 years, and by the time I start, it'll be 4. When I would start residency, it would be 8 years. Also, how would expungement make a difference? I keep being told that I will have to admit to and explain my charges regardless of expungement... So what difference does it make for entry into medical school and residency?
In regards to number 3, state medical boards have different standards towards licensing. Some are more lenient and may be willing to overlook your past convictions. Others will never give you a license because of them. As they're government agencies, they will have access to much more powerful background checks, so it would be best to assume they will be able to see your charges if they aren't dismissed retroactively.
Exactly. Most states use NCIC which is managed by the FBI and is not available to comercial background check companies. Some states say they remove your charges from NCIC if they are expunged, but definitely check with a lawyer. Interestingly, some states appear to not even run a background check???
Crimes against persons are viewed very differently than crimes against property, or certain drugs, not all. Even then, there are Adcom members who believe in redemption, given significant evidence of sobriety. IF you can get all charges dropped, that's a totally different story.
Primary apps ask about convictions
Not blaming the OP, but jurisdictions do arrest both participants because at that moment, the cops don't know who is at fault. They'll only see injuries on both parties or both parties claiming the other assaulted them. Also, always remember that there are two sides to every story.
Thank you for your comment!
What advice were you given about matching and obtaining a medical license with a felony (although expunged)? Who gave the advice? I think your experience might provide the best perspective yet. The only person who could be more relevant in this thread is someone who has an expunged felony and has received a full medical license.
According to that document: If I were to be licensed in NY (which apparently does not require a criminal background check, fingerprints, and does not have access to NCIC), would I be able to practice in states that do require such things? Or would I be limited to the select few states that do not require these things--or only NY? Thank you for your help!
You would only be able to practice in NY. Each state's medical board is separate and you will have to go through their individual licensing procedures if you wanted to move.
So a lot of what everyone is saying is based on assumptions and their understanding of what they have read and heard.
Sadly, most admissions officers have been sued enough times that they tend to give generic and often overly optimistic advice in situations like this.
Were 17 or 18 when you received your drug conviction, perhaps, being a juvenile for one of the charges could help somehow??
I was 18 and 20, unfortunately.
I was never charged or convicted of any felonies--I was only charged and convicted of two misdemeanors.
This is horrible advice.
Do you have any recommendations on how/where to find a lawyer who would know much about any of this? I have spoken to my current lawyer, a random education lawyer in my city, and I've sent out probably a dozen emails to other lawyers with no replies yet. I also called the local board association and they couldn't direct me to a single person because they didn't know of anyone who'd have much input, I guess!
I had great success with my local bar association when I needed some quick advice on tenant law, so that’s disappointing yours couldn’t help. I would maybe see if the state bar has a tool to get you in touch with a lawyer based on your needs.
To clarify, I was charged but not convicted. Honestly I figured as long as I could make it into medical school it wouldn't present an issue. I didn't really understand that medical school and licensing may have separate standards before I applied. My attorney says some licensing boards can see the expunged charges but had no further advice. On another note, I have a friend with an expunged felony conviction who's a practicing attorney.
Only charged but I mentioned it on all of my apps. The verbiage on the secondary applications, in my interpretation, made it clear that not disclosing would be considered dishonesty.
I disclosed and took responsibility for my actions but always pivoted into how it was a wake up call for me and then detailed how I've matured since then. I try to give people evidence (without being obvious about it) that the person I was when I was charged is long in the past.
How does being charged but not convicted work? Did you plead down to a misdemeanor? Just curious how this works when explaining it since you aren’t a felon, and it seems pretty unfair to pay much attention to felonies if someone was never convicted. One overzealous cop or DA who files felony charges which instantly get thrown out in court could ruin someone’s life so easily.
Having to list and explain these convictions in AMCAS will make a world of difference in your odds of admission. If they are expunged you do not have to disclose them on the primary, which will benefit you significantly. You can opt not to complete secondaries that ask more probing questions.
It makes sense if you think about it as admissions taking bets on applicants.
Wait what? That is a really weird comparison to make. Do you know someone who dropped out of medical school and now you have a bone to pick with the system? How is that even relevant?
I take great offense to this. 50% of the time SDN gives great advice, even if the other 80% is absolutely horrible.
You would probably be surprised how many people around you have little charges and even convictions here and there. They affect professional life less than you might think. My (very expensive) lawyer presented a "good kid" narrative and the charges disappeared without me ever seeing a court room. The fact that I bought my way out of a felony conviction haunts me and is one of the reasons I feel so compelled to help people who aren't given the benefit of the doubt the way I was.
I think it's a mistake to judge someone's entire character based on whether they've been addicted to drugs at some point in their life (or whether they have dropped out of school for that matter). Although past actions can predict future actions, it's a huge and unfounded extrapolation that someone's past use of drugs can predict their response to any stressful circumstance or their coping abilities, especially without understanding the circumstances surrounding their drug use.
This is not true. You fail to take into account human beings are capable of change. Just because someone is a drug addict one day, does not doom them to a life of chasing the dragon.
Well, it's nuanced. You're going for someone that looks promising vs someone who was already tested in battle, and failed at it.
1) I didnt say any of the above.
I guarantee you that at my school, if you're were interviewing, we would privately ask you about your record and the circumstances behind it. If it's in your app, it's fair game to ask about.
One is a clinical disorder and the other a character defect. Sometimes clinical disorders are manageable under thoughtful conditions, but character defects are selected against. I don't see cheating as a DSM-V disorder yet.
Never happened at my school. If it did, it would happen prior to matriculation and we Faculty would not have heard about it.
Do you have any suggestions of alternate careers to pursue? I am not interested in therapy/psychology--I am far more interested in the medical aspect.
I feel that pharm might be as strict if not stricter given the clear access to meds
Glad it worked out for you since you were acting in self-defense. I think the huge thing here is that you got the charges dropped, and a lesser factor is that “simple battery”, as in a drunken bar fight where you defended yourself, does not have the same stigma as domestic violence (and heroin).
