Don't want to do independent research project

[isthisthereallife]

I am in a little bit of a unique position here. I joined a basic sciences lab at the very end of last school year (May 2016) and am currently working in the lab. I applied for a position as a "student researcher" as opposed to "student volunteer" with the expectation that I would be working closely with a postdoc or PhD student. So far, I've been doing exactly that (running reactions, collecting/analyzing data) with little say in the design or modification of the experiment. I basically do what I'm told, and I do it well.

I like it that way. I am involved in numerous other extracurricular activities and am OK with not getting a research publication from this lab. Just a couple of days ago, however, my postdoc approached me with an idea for my own individually designed and executed project. Granted, it is very much in line with the work I have been doing, but this project will require me perusing through literature and otherwise taking full responsibility of a project that I don't really want. I know many premed students are gungho about getting that pub but I don't have the time or the desire to commit to taking on my own project.

I'm looking for a diplomatic way to suggest to the postdoc that I just continue what I have been doing. I am asking for a letter of recommendation from the PI so I really don't want to offend my postdoc or PI by giving the impression that I'm lazy or unmotivated. I do enjoy the work I have been doing so I prefer not to quit and look for a different lab either. Advice is very much appreciated.

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[21Rush12]

Perhaps suggest that you want some more experience before you take on more responsibility/want to get more comfortable with things before taking on your own project?


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[Goro]

Just say that you like the current arrangement, and your schoolwork might not let you be able to branch out to be more independent.

 

[isthisthereallife]

Thank you for your responses @Goro and @21Rush12. However, the problem with saying that I would like some more experience is that I already have experience doing most of the protocols I would need to for this project. I just don't want to take on the "creative" aspect of experimentation, which is often times the most time-consuming part. My situation is kinda like spending the last several months learning how to put together a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. I can cut the bread in half perfectly, and I know exactly the amount of jam/jelly to put on it. I am happy when I see the sandwich I have made. And now suddenly, I'm asked to make a fancy eggplant parmesan sandwich. Theoretically, it's the same technique (two pieces of bread, protein in the middle), but the ingredients are different, and I would have to do additional research to figure out how to use these new ingredients. I hope that analogy wasn't too confusing.

Goro, just to clarify, you wouldn't think that I was being lazy for not wanting to put in research time outside of lab?

 

[aldol16]

Why are you doing research then? The idea of doing research is to learn to do science and to eventually do that science yourself. It's not to train you to do repetitive tasks that a monkey could do. If you don't like it, do yourself a favor and try another extracurricular pursuit you would enjoy more because you're just wasting your time.

If I was writing your letter and you had the resources and experience to carry out an independent project but refused to, that would not reflect well on you as a scientist and that letter won't be too strong.

 

[isthisthereallife]

@aldol16
Thank you for your response. I like learning how to do certain protocols (some of which are so advanced that I'm the only undergraduate being taught them). I like doing them over and over. I like mastering them and being able to say to myself that I know how to do X. Whether that's considered "research" is up to you. On my CV, I don't misrepresent my work. I write that I worked in PI's lab doing X, Y, and Z.

I'm a situation where a lot is uncertain about my life, both personally and professionally. I like going into lab, doing something, and knowing the end product. There's a strange sense of reassurance there, I suppose. Who knows? In the future I might grow to like the creative aspect of scientific experimentation. Currently though I have neither the time nor the inclination for it.

 

[aldol16]

@aldol16
Thank you for your response. I like learning how to do certain protocols (some of which are so advanced that I'm the only undergraduate being taught them). I like doing them over and over. I like mastering them and being able to say to myself that I know how to do X. Whether that's considered "research" is up to you. On my CV, I don't misrepresent my work. I write that I worked in PI's lab doing X, Y, and Z.

I'm a situation where a lot is uncertain about my life, both personally and professionally. I like going into lab, doing something, and knowing the end product. There's a strange sense of reassurance there, I suppose. Who knows? In the future I might grow to like the creative aspect of scientific experimentation. Currently though I have neither the time nor the inclination for it.

That's all jolly good for you. I'm not disputing that you did X, Y, and Z and probably got very good at specific protocols. I'm saying that if I had an undergrad who I invested time in teaching how to do all those protocols and procedures and then refused to do an independent project when I offered, I would question his or her motives for doing research in the first place. Furthermore, in my letter, I wouldn't be able to attest to that person's scientific ability at all - all I would be able to say is that the said undergrad is good at following orders.

 

[kb1900]

The whole point of research experience is to gain an appreciation for the scientific approach which includes experimental design

 

[efle]

I think you might really be kicking yourself during your app cycle, depending on the schools you're aiming for and/or the strengths of your other app components. If you can take the project at a relatively slow pace so it isn't much more work than the current arrangement, this is an opportunity you should take advantage of.

 

[isthisthereallife]

Ok I'm sensing some semantics issue here. What if I said that right now, I am not interested in the "research" aspect of it as much as gaining practical lab skills/techniques? I think part of the problem is that when I interviewed for the position I was explicitly told that I would be working under a post doc and that I was not expected to come up with my own project. Learning now that I will be working on my own project is disconcerting to say the least (though yes, technically I didn't "come up" with the project idea).

 

[isthisthereallife]

@efle

Thank you for the reply. My MCAT and GPA are above average for my target schools, and I feel like my other extracurriculars are strong enough to hold up to scrutiny. I'm not gunning for a top medical school, but rather my local state institution.

 

[efle]

Ok I'm sensing some semantics issue here. What if I said that right now, I am not interested in the "research" aspect of it as much as gaining practical lab skills/techniques? I think part of the problem is that when I interviewed for the position I was explicitly told that I would be working under a post doc and that I was not expected to come up with my own project. Learning now that I will be working on my own project is disconcerting to say the least (though yes, technically I didn't "come up" with the project idea).

@efle

Thank you for the reply. My MCAT and GPA are above average for my target schools, and I feel like my other extracurriculars are strong enough to hold up to scrutiny. I'm not gunning for a top medical school, but rather my local state institution.

As long as you are OK without a letter of rec from this then you are probably fine keeping more of a tech role.

 

[isthisthereallife]

As long as you are OK without a letter of rec from this then you are probably fine keeping more of a tech role.

Which brings us full circle to my original question. Gathering from the responses on this thread, there is no way to gracefully bow out of this project.

 

[efle]

Which brings us full circle to my original question. Gathering from the responses on this thread, there is no way to gracefully bow out of this project.

I mean, they probably aren't going to write a BAD letter.

It's just likely to be a whole lot stronger if you do show interest in contributing to the design as well as execution

 

[aldol16]

I mean, they probably aren't going to write a BAD letter.

It's just likely to be a whole lot stronger if you do show interest in contributing to the design as well as execution

There's vague and there's strong. Contributing to the design and contributing to the execution is the difference between doing science and cooking from a cookbook.

 

[Frogger27]

I would just say that due to your classes/other ECs, you do not think you would have enough time to commit to the project and don't want to do it unless you are 100% committed. Say you will continue contributing to the lab in your current role though

 

[isthisthereallife]

Thank you, that is another alternative for me.

I would just say that due to your classes/other ECs, you do not think you would have enough time to commit to the project and don't want to do it unless you are 100% committed. Say you will continue contributing to the lab in your current role though

 

[flip_08]

I've had research experiences that were both repetitive and original. The ones where I had to design and execute my own experiments made for interesting essay and interview topics while the repetitive ones did not. Once you've got the lab techniques down there isn't really a point to repeating them over and over again unless you're getting paid to do so. Your time would be better spent on an EC that you are passionate about.

 

[Goro]

Agree 100%. Also suggest not asking the PI for a LOR, as this will be the safest route for you.

I would just say that due to your classes/other ECs, you do not think you would have enough time to commit to the project and don't want to do it unless you are 100% committed. Say you will continue contributing to the lab in your current role though

 

[NeedACar]

I would suggest, before bowing out, to talk to your PI or supervisor candidly and express your apprehensions.

I debated dropping my research project this year, after some VERY frustrating months upon months of failing to get results that satisfied my PI. But after talking it over with a lot of people in lab, I decided to give it one last try.

That was the run where everything went right (finally haha) and I am now very passionate about my work!

If you express your hesitation and fear at having total control, maybe you can come to a solution. For example maybe you sit down once a week or once every two weeks and brainstorm ideas together of what/how to execute your experiments

 

[Sheiko]

Why are you doing research then? The idea of doing research is to learn to do science and to eventually do that science yourself. It's not to train you to do repetitive tasks that a monkey could do. If you don't like it, do yourself a favor and try another extracurricular pursuit you would enjoy more because you're just wasting your time.

If I was writing your letter and you had the resources and experience to carry out an independent project but refused to, that would not reflect well on you as a scientist and that letter won't be too strong.

This, honestly seems like you're only doing research to check the box

 

[coffeeandcodeine]

I have to second the opinions of those who suggest not asking for a research letter. I have a few students myself, and I don't feel I could write a strong letter for those who lack initiative/enthusiasm for the experimental design aspect of science. I would write them a very kind letter, speaking to their other abilities, but it would not be anywhere near as strong as the letters I write for my independent/highly motivated students. Anyone (with basic motor skills) can carry out protocols, no matter how technically complex they become. This ability does not, in my opinion, speak to their aptitude for science.

That's not to say that you couldn't have a great aptitude for research science -- but you'll never know if you don't give it a shot!

 

[SydSing]

The only part of my research that medical schools seemed to care about this application cycle was the experimental design, and my understanding of the design and contributions to that design (and the resulting manuscript). Sure, I am pretty boss at western blots and I like spacing out and setting up qPCR plates, but that is not hard and anyone can be a robot. My boss would probably fire me if I refused to let go of my post-doc's hand after a while but I also knew that going in.

Anyway, a letter will be pretty meh if all it will say is that you followed directions well. But you can say that you experienced bench research which is cool I guess (box checked). If your PI ends up being okay with you limiting your contribution, cool, but you have already reached the peak of any benefit it will afford you when applying to school.

Side Note: As an undergrad, the postdoc will likely be guiding you anyway while taking your suggestions into consideration and they are typically open to meeting if that would alleviate some of your worry. I was not looking forward to starting my first independent project when it happened, but it turned out to be a lot of fun and my post-doc was very involved.