EIS 2015

[Angiecou]

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Hi Angiecou,
Thanks a lot for your post. Being an International, I am more interested in the number of applicants invited for interview. During my day, we were 4 internationals!! Can anyone recall, how many international applicants appeared during there cohort?
Thanks

I am sure of at least 3 (one from Malawi, one from Aus, and one from China).

 

[nomy]

Thanks a lot!!!!

 

[coconut81]

I am sure of at least 3 (one from Malawi, one from Aus, and one from China).

Hi Angiecou. I also interviewed on Friday. There were definitely more than 3 internationals at our session. I met one guy from Taiwan, one from India, at least 2 from China, the Australian, and another European physician who for the life of me I can't remember her country of origin. Some of the internationals I met are working in the US so it's difficult remembering who was a citizen. I wouldn't be surprised if there were more, however, because I didn't get a chance to speak with everyone like the person from Malawi.

 

[Angiecou]

So generally speaking, of the 78 spots, 10 will internationals...leaving 68 spots. If 50% of the spots go to MDs, then there are 34 spots left for the rest of us. If we only knew the total number of our "true" competition 😉 If we just use the base number of 232 people interviewing:

Internationals > 10/ 232 = 4.3%
National MDs > 34/232 = 14.7%
National 'others' > 34/232 = 14.7%

 

[Angiecou]

Hi Angiecou. I also interviewed on Friday. There were definitely more than 3 internationals at our session. I met one guy from Taiwan, one from India, at least 2 from China, the Australian, and another European physician who for the life of me I can't remember her country of origin. Some of the internationals I met are working in the US so it's difficult remembering who was a citizen. I wouldn't be surprised if there were more, however, because I didn't get a chance to speak with everyone like the person from Malawi.

I know that the woman from AUS had quit her job to be completely available for the EIS program. She was traveling around until then...definitely wishing her luck!

 

[nomy]

Thanks Coconut81 and Angiecou.
Seems like its getting more competitive for Internationals!!!!
But its good to know that we will hear from them in the beginning of December and not near the Holidays!!!
Good Luck to all.

 

[mlkmnsgrl]

Thanks Coconut81 and Angiecou.
Seems like its getting more competitive for Internationals!!!!
But its good to know that we will hear from them in the beginning of December and not near the Holidays!!!
Gooid Luck to all.

Here's worth hoping you all get in and can have an sdn get together one of the conference days in April. 🙂 If things calm in Africa, I'll believe the early December estimate, but if not...51 days... 🙁

Anyone have insights into whether or not to do commissioned corps?

 

[nomy]

SDN Get Together is a great Idea!!

 

[JJ_epi]

Has anyone heard anything on the number of current 2nd years or recent officers who were able to find a corps job after EIS? I got the impression that even if you pass the physical and join the corps you are not guaranteed that you will remain in the corps at the end of the first two years.

 

[jrmwx]

Thanks a lot JJ!
Does anyone have details on International Applicants (number, interviewed ...etc)???

SDN Get Together is a great Idea!!

Hi nomy, good to know you, and good luck for your application. Just wonder if you were interviewed by the CGH Interviewer 1 at 3:00~5:30PM, 11/03/2014. If yes, would you please tell me her name and email. Thanks!

 

[mlkmnsgrl]

I asked and from what my husband remembers, there weren't any international applicants the first interview day. But he mostly just talked to the other candidates from his school, so there may have been some. Sorry that's not much help for figuring the international interviews.

 

[nomy]

Hi JRMWX,
I was interviewed by CGH#2 during that time slot.
Thanks

 

[nomy]

Hello mlkmnsgrl,
Thanks a lot. Discussing with a few people, I am estimating about 30-40 international candidates interviewing for 10 positions.

 

[jrmwx]

Hi JRMWX,
I was interviewed by CGH#2 during that time slot.
Thanks

Thanks a lot anyway.

 

[mlkmnsgrl]

So, then run the probabilities, and once you get an interview whether international, md, phd, or whatever, the odds work out to approximately 1:3.

Not too terrible. And it was interesting when we were breaking things out in categories last night, granted these are all rough estimates, but basically however we split things each group had the same odds. 1:2 interview, 1:3 of those get an offer, so odds of an applicant getting in are 1:6 all told.

I'll take that guess...seems pretty doable. Love having a dh with a degree in statistics so we can play with numbers! Total nerds!

 

[Vaxn8]

I interviewed on the third day and at the time was told that there were 565 completed applications and 220 invited to interview. I think that I read that some people were invited to interview even after the third date (Angiecou mentioned 232). It is hard to imagine that for each one of us selected 2 will have to be rejected. As stated by others, the interviewees at my session were all very impressive with diverse experience and backgrounds!

Does anyone have thoughts about commissioned corps? During my session not much detail was provided except that as a corps member you have to wear a uniform every day (not just on Wednesday as in the past) and that you have to do a physical fitness test each year. The corps member who was at my session in the morning shared that the requirement is based on age and gender. She said that she had do do around 11 push ups and run 1 1/2 miles and other tasks that were not very difficult. She also shared that for her class (the cohort that started this past summer) only 10 people were accepted into the corps initially and that most of the other members of her class who wanted to join the corps were rejected and had to file for appeal. She said that almost everyone got in after the appeal but that it was a strange experience that apparently hadn't happened in the past (so many rejected initially). It was also mentioned that you lose your retirement if you choose to leave the corps before 20 years. My impression was that if you plan to stay in public health and work for CDC, NIH, etc. after the program rather than pursue a career in academia for example, then it would be best to join. Please share other thoughts about this, what have you learned about EIS as civilian vs. corps (should we be fortunate enough to be accepted)?

 

[mlkmnsgrl]

I interviewed on the third day and at the time was told that there were 565 completed applications and 220 invited to interview. I think that I read that some people were invited to interview even after the third date (Angiecou mentioned 232). It is hard to imagine that for each one of us selected 2 will have to be rejected. As stated by others, the interviewees at my session were all very impressive with diverse experience and backgrounds!

Does anyone have thoughts about commissioned corps? During my session not much detail was provided except that as a corps member you have to wear a uniform every day (not just on Wednesday as in the past) and that you have to do a physical fitness test each year. The corps member who was at my session in the morning shared that the requirement is based on age and gender. She said that she had do do around 11 push ups and run 1 1/2 miles and other tasks that were not very difficult. She also shared that for her class (the cohort that started this past summer) only 10 people were accepted into the corps initially and that most of the other members of her class who wanted to join the corps were rejected and had to file for appeal. She said that almost everyone got in after the appeal but that it was a strange experience that apparently hadn't happened in the past (so many rejected initially). It was also mentioned that you lose your retirement if you choose to leave the corps before 20 years. My impression was that if you plan to stay in public health and work for CDC, NIH, etc. after the program rather than pursue a career in academia for example, then it would be best to join. Please share other thoughts about this, what have you learned about EIS as civilian vs. corps (should we be fortunate enough to be accepted)?

The one thing I would add from the first interview day was that the corps member my husband talked to said that initially you make more with the Corps, but that after a few years the civilians are making more. I'm still trying to figure out the math for how the Corps pays more at first...it looks to me like $5-6000 less per year after housing and subsistence (this is O-3, PhD). But it's hard to figure out how much you get in tax savings, insurance premiums, etc. Not clear whether it's enough to make it pay more. 1 month leave, though!

Oh, and I guess he said that the Corps pays $3000 relocation, but civilians don't get it. But the papers they handed out seems to indicate all officers will have relocation. Also, Corps may allow for federal student loan forgiveness whereas civilian officers and other federal post-docs don't have that option as far as we have seen. So, actually, those things could bump it clearly into a better deal.

I think you lose your pension accrual, but it says that you can make non-matched TSP contributions, and those stay with you if you leave the Corps (or federal service for that matter...I've got a couple of thousand in a TSP from years and years ago that just grows a teensy bit each year and sticks around even if I never work for the feds again).

A couple questions:

Anyone know about maternity/paternity leave? NIH post-docs apparently get 8 weeks paid! I was an FTE with the Forest Service and maternity was all unpaid once sick/annual ran out. =(

Does anyone know what the % retention of EISOs to CDC positions following the 2 years? We've heard it's really varied by center/area, but wondered if there's any kind of overall feel?

 

[Vaxn8]

The one thing I would add from the first interview day was that the corps member my husband talked to said that initially you make more with the Corps, but that after a few years the civilians are making more. I'm still trying to figure out the math for how the Corps pays more at first...it looks to me like $5-6000 less per year after housing and subsistence (this is O-3, PhD). But it's hard to figure out how much you get in tax savings, insurance premiums, etc. Not clear whether it's enough to make it pay more. 1 month leave, though!

Oh, and I guess he said that the Corps pays $3000 relocation, but civilians don't get it. But the papers they handed out seems to indicate all officers will have relocation. Also, Corps may allow for federal student loan forgiveness whereas civilian officers and other federal post-docs don't have that option as far as we have seen. So, actually, those things could bump it clearly into a better deal.

I think you lose your pension accrual, but it says that you can make non-matched TSP contributions, and those stay with you if you leave the Corps (or federal service for that matter...I've got a couple of thousand in a TSP from years and years ago that just grows a teensy bit each year and sticks around even if I never work for the feds again).


A couple questions:

Anyone know about maternity/paternity leave? NIH post-docs apparently get 8 weeks paid! I was an FTE with the Forest Service and maternity was all unpaid once sick/annual ran out. =(

Does anyone know what the % retention of EISOs to CDC positions following the 2 years? We've heard it's really varied by center/area, but wondered if there's any kind of overall feel?

Thank you so much for sharing your information and thoughts! At my session, the only paper that I was handed was a schedule of interviews for that day. I didn't receive any information about the corps or salary differences, etc. You mentioned housing and subsistence, is there an allowance for corps members but not for civilians in the EIS? Would the federal student loan forgiveness be during the 2 years as an EIS officer or if employed federally after?

The three people representing centers with whom I interviewed were all former EIS officers who were employed by their center after completing the 2 years. On the EIS website it says that 75% of EIS graduates remain at CDC or in state/local health departments after completion of the program. I don't know if that statement is representative of recent years or just overall.

 

[mlkmnsgrl]

Yeah, I guess what I meant to say is what's the chance of staying in the center you do EIS with, assuming you want to. We heard that NIOSH in Cincinnati is 90%, but they seemed to suggest that at other centers there's no potential to convert. It'd be nice to know who does/doesn't...but maybe they don't really want that to be common knowledge.

 

[nomy]

Hi Vaxn8 and Mlkmnsgrl,
After doing a lot of research, I can say that if you want to stay in the same center, it is highly possible. Center is divided into Divisions and each division into branches. I know an EIS officer who could not find a position and the branch offered him/her a position; since, she was looking for position outside of her division. If an EISO wants to say in the same center it is ~100% that he/she will get a position after finishing. Getting in the same branch could be difficult but the Center it is almost 100% possible. So, for instance in your case if you want to stay in NIOSH after finishing, you might end up working for a different division and/or branch but staying at NIOSH will be highly possible. Also, during the 2 years EISO work between different centers, so after the program one would like to work for another center. So, at the end people have more than 1 option to finally select.

 

[coconut81]

I thought everyone may be interested in seeing EIS over the past few years. The past 2 years have seen the lowest number of recruits overall. The proportion of US vs. international EIS recruits has been fairly consistent. Physicians consistently make up about 50% of each cohort except for in 2008 when there was actually a higher number of PhDs and a ton of vets. It'll be interesting to see if EIS really does diversify their recruits this year as some people have suggested because the past decade seems to indicate that they prefer to stick to a certain formula.

 

[nomy]

Awesome job, coconur81!!!!!

 

[tranc]

You guys are amazing!!! Can't wait to see you all at the SDN get-together (its a question of when, not if! lets make it happen! 😉).

Thank you so much for sharing your information and thoughts! At my session, the only paper that I was handed was a schedule of interviews for that day. I didn't receive any information about the corps or salary differences, etc. You mentioned housing and subsistence, is there an allowance for corps members but not for civilians in the EIS? Would the federal student loan forgiveness be during the 2 years as an EIS officer or if employed federally after?

The three people representing centers with whom I interviewed were all former EIS officers who were employed by their center after completing the 2 years. On the EIS website it says that 75% of EIS graduates remain at CDC or in state/local health departments after completion of the program. I don't know if that statement is representative of recent years or just overall.

I believe loan forgiveness follows you after (but there may be stipulations). I was at your session too, and wish they had more info about CC. Shame we didn't met in person! (Or maybe we had?)

3 weeks and counting!

 

[Angiecou]

Seeing the table really shows how hard it is to get in this program. Insane odds.

 

[mlkmnsgrl]

Commissioned Corps is full military benefits, though I think they put you on reserve or something during eis so you don't get deployed. The benefit includes housing and subsistence allowances that are tax free. For MDs and dentists, etc, there are also monthly allowances for being board certified. MDs start at O-4, so they're already paid better but then when you add in the allowances, they bank it. So that means that with the Corps they don't take quite such a hit to do eis instead of a medical practice.

 

[nomy]

Any updates??????
The wait is too long 🙁🙁🙁🙁

 

[mlkmnsgrl]

Any updates??????
The wait is too long 🙁🙁🙁🙁

Decision committee meets first week of December. I would imagine if you're chosen, you get a call pretty quickly. Then wait listed are contacted. Then rejections are sent before Jan 1. 44 days left in the year, so for good or bad we'll all know by then...but still probably 17-18 days until the first calls are made.

 

[nomy]

3 more weeks................All, please keep us updated as soon as you guys hear from them

 

[nomy]

Decision committee meets first week of December. I would imagine if you're chosen, you get a call pretty quickly. Then wait listed are contacted. Then rejections are sent before Jan 1. 44 days left in the year, so for good or bad we'll all know by then...but still probably 17-18 days until the first calls are made.

This is longest wait I have experienced. I interviewed On November 3rd. Can't imagine what the people interviewed in October have been thinking!!!!

 

[coconut81]

This is longest wait I have experienced. I interviewed On November 3rd. Can't imagine what the people interviewed in October have been thinking!!!!

Nomy, may I ask what your background is? I was just curious because most (although not all) of the internationals I met were MDs.

 

[nomy]

I am a Veterinarian with a Masters in Epidemiology and PhD in Microbiology and Epidemiology from the University of Tennessee!!!
If all international spots are taken by MDs, I have no chance🙁🙁🙁

 

[nomy]

Nomy, may I ask what your background is? I was just curious because most (although not all) of the internationals I met were MDs. My feeling is that the MD pool is larger because most of the 10 spots set aside for internationals are filled by MDs.

I am a Veterinarian with a Masters in Epidemiology and PhD in Microbiology and Epidemiology from the University of Tennessee!!!
If all international spots are taken by MDs, I have no chance🙁🙁🙁

 

[coconut81]

I am a Veterinarian with a Masters in Epidemiology and PhD in Microbiology and Epidemiology from the University of Tennessee!!!
If all international spots are taken by MDs, I have no chance🙁🙁🙁

I highly doubt they're all MDs. I just thought it was interesting that I didn't meet many non-MD internationals. Of the 6 internationals I met, 5 were MDs, and 1 was a PhD candidate still in graduate school... but that is just my session. I certainly did not meet every international. You're the first Vet/PhD international I know of, which I think works to your advantage... makes you stand out from the other internationals. I met a few US vets at my session. I think it would be a breath of fresh air if EIS considers more vets, and hopefully, persons with other, diverse backgrounds.

 

[nomy]

I highly doubt they're all MDs. I just thought it was interesting that I didn't meet many non-MD internationals. Of the 6 internationals I met, 5 were MDs, and 1 was a PhD candidate still in graduate school... but that is just my session. I certainly did not meet every international. You're the first Vet/PhD international I know of, which I think works to your advantage... makes you stand out from the other internationals. I met a few US vets at my session. I think it would be a breath of fresh air if EIS considers more vets, and hopefully, persons with other, diverse backgrounds.

You are actually 100% correct. Most of the internationals are MDs. I know an international dentist with MPH who recently completed the program. During my session the other 3 internationals (all 3 were MDs!!!!).

 

[nomy]

Just noticed about the update on the EIS application page. It suggests
"The EIS Selection Committee meets in early December. You will be notified by January 1 of the committee's decision."

 

[Angiecou]

Last year, I was notified a few days before Christmas that I was not selected. I actually preferred knowing before the holidays, so I could relax and digest it all. Best of luck to everyone and have a wonderful holiday season!

 

[Angiecou]

Only 2-4 weeks, and we shall know! Ahhhhhh!

 

[nomy]

Its been a long wait!!

 

[ERSCA]

It looked like last year, it was late this week (1st week of Dec.) that the first notices went out. Hoping good thoughts for us all. 🙂

 

[nomy]

Thanks a lot....

 

[JJ_epi]

Yes happy December and good luck everyone. Glad to hear they may call as early as this week, I was expecting more like late next week or the week after... Does anyone else's stomach jump into their throat every time the phone rings?

 

[nomy]

Yes happy December and good luck everyone. Glad to hear they may call as early as this week, I was expecting more like late next week or the week after... Does anyone else's stomach jump into their throat every time the phone rings?

If we hear back from them this week..........That will be awesome......I have been checking this page also every couple of hours!!!!

 

[tranc]

This document may be useful for those trying to figure their entry level with the Commissioned Corps http://dcp.psc.gov/PDF_docs/ccpmtransmittal663_2.pdf.

 

[mlkmnsgrl]

Oh man, it's so close its getting painful! I'm so excited to finally know!

Has anyone decided whether to go commissioned corps or civilian? What sold you one way or another? We think we'll go for corps and hope they'll take him even though he's a only a PhD. We have friends in the navy as a dentist and they've said it's super family friendly. Not sure what will vary since we won't be on base, like them, but she shared a couple things about military benefits.

If you're lucky enough to be close to a commissary, it's great for things like cereal and shelf goods. Much cheaper. The meat and fresh items are about comparable to Wal-Mart.

Tri care health care is wonderful and since you're not near a military hospital, you can basically see anyone and its free. She said ppl seem to hear horror stories about it, but they've been very happy with it. She did say it helps when you're an officer, they definitely get some preference.

The military discounts like at restaurants, stores, and places like Disney are seriously awesome and help your money go so much farther.

The leave is a little deceiving. Definitely more than the federal civilian leave. But where you'd use 5 days of annual to take a week off (7 days, 5 working), with the military you have to take 7 days off.

Space Available free flights are really tricky and she said their friends once used Space A to go to Hawaii, but when they couldn't get a free flight back they had to pay a fortune for last minute airline tickets to get back before their leave ended and they would have been considered awol.

I think the only other thing she thought was that it looked to her like promotion to O-4 from 3 would probably be 2-6 years after the 2 years in eis, so if that's part of your calculations, plan on staying at the level you're brought in at for the program and a bit beyond, assuming you stay military.

Obviously their experience is different since its not eis and they've been on base all the time, but it was still helpful to talk to them since they've been in for 2 1/2 years.

Anyway, for what it's worth.

I hope we hear soon!

 

[nomy]

Did anyone get a phone call?

 

[Vaxn8]

I came across an overview of the physical fitness/BMI requirements for Commissioned Corps.
http://dcp.psc.gov/pdf_docs/mc_on_readiness_standards_fy2004.pdf

 

[Vaxn8]

To help with the decision, the following link provides an introduction and general overview of the Commissioned Corps program including benefits and expectations.
http://www.usphs.gov/corpslinks/JOAG/documents/JOAG_New_Officer_Guide.pdf

 

[mlkmnsgrl]

Continuing to talk to different ppl about cc vs civ. We were just told that in the branch/center we're most interested in, if you go cc it's probably 99% that they can hire you on as a Fellow or FTE (tenured) because the hiring process through the corps is easier. So, if you're looking to stay cdc, you may want to go military.

Thanks, Vaxn8. Looks like if we're in, I'm gonna get to drill sergeant my husband on pushups. That'll be too fun. Nice thing is that the 1.5 mile run can be done each year at the EIS Conference fun run. And you get a fun t-shirt. It was a fun time last April.

We have a tough dilemma. His dream faculty job out West just posted and they've asked him to apply. But it won't even close until January, with interviews sometime in the spring. We're sure they wouldn't hold it for him for 2 years, so we're really torn. We had decided that if he got EIS he'd turn down the NIH offers but one of them (much less desirable as far as location, prestige, etc) could be a six month or one year gig so we could then maybe delay the academic job of we got it whereas with EIS we'd be committed and out of luck. But then academics means far less of a nice 40 hour week option, even though this one won't require grant funding. Feeling a little torn, although we know we're blessed to have so many choices. We've had to keep asking ppl to hold off while we wait to hear from CDC so I'm sure they won't hold past January.

Anyone have advice?

 

[fyrebyrd3]

Hi mlkmnsgrl,
Isn't that just always the way? I come from an academic background (basic research though, so there may be some differences - if anybody has more specific knowledge please correct me!) so I can sympathize with your dilemma. I think it really depends on what your husband wants to end up doing at the end of the day. An academic professorship, particularly in research, is a bit like working at a start-up - you'll be looking at 80-90 hours a week for a good long while. It may be a bit different for epidemiology as compared to basic research, but generally the first 5-7 years are a hard core slog of all of the work in the world and stress and struggling for funding. And after that if you succeed, you're in a much better place.

It's also a highly political game as to who gets a professorship. Usually when a job is posted, it's because a university has a candidate in mind; it's not actually a search. With that in mind I guess my thoughts/advice would be two-fold.

1. Apply for the job; I mean, why not?
2. If your husband gets the EIS, he can always turn down the match come april and leave EIS if this other job is working out.

Hope that helps! Happy to chat more if it would be helpful!

 

[mlkmnsgrl]

Hi mlkmnsgrl,
Isn't that just always the way? I come from an academic background (basic research though, so there may be some differences - if anybody has more specific knowledge please correct me!) so I can sympathize with your dilemma. I think it really depends on what your husband wants to end up doing at the end of the day. An academic professorship, particularly in research, is a bit like working at a start-up - you'll be looking at 80-90 hours a week for a good long while. It may be a bit different for epidemiology as compared to basic research, but generally the first 5-7 years are a hard core slog of all of the work in the world and stress and struggling for funding. And after that if you succeed, you're in a much better place.

It's also a highly political game as to who gets a professorship. Usually when a job is posted, it's because a university has a candidate in mind; it's not actually a search. With that in mind I guess my thoughts/advice would be two-fold.

1. Apply for the job; I mean, why not?
2. If your husband gets the EIS, he can always turn down the match come april and leave EIS if this other job is working out.

Hope that helps! Happy to chat more if it would be helpful!

Thanks so much for your advice, fyrebyrd!

Yah, so it's his alma mater, so he's been able to speak candidly to several professors about the work-life balance. They had mixed reports, but in general, I would say that the feeling was that the first 5 years are a slog, but it's hard-funded ,and it's actually hard NOT to be tenured there, so it might be worth it. So we'll definitely apply.

But I guess your #2 comment is where my big question sits. Is it unethical to accept EIS and take that position when we know there's a chance we'd get a trumping offer and end up turning down the match? It seems wrong in a program with a wait list and so much interest to take that spot when it's too late for them to get a replacement. Aren't the wait lists killed in February? I know that they say there are more EIS positions available than new recruits, so that makes it even worse, right, because it means a potential recruit AND an agency miss out. Do I have that right? We don't want to do something that burns bridges with the CDC, although in some ways, if we get the university job, then we anticipate being there for 30+ years.

Anyway, just kinda trying to figure out what we're going to do and the time is really bad. Not to mention that it's adding to how hard this wait is getting. First interview day means we've waited for a long time. Ugh!