Empty thoughts..

[MadSci]

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Well Im trying to find Cytopath fellowship and trust me you have to start at least 2years in advance if you want to get something..so I submited to more that 20 programs and got 6 interviews and 6 middle fingers..the rest did not even bother to reply even to say "sorry pall you are not getting it..". I think this is dissrespectful..whats your expirience guys ?


PS..if anyone wants to check my forum welcome...just brush off the spider webs and the dust. The site has come to a halt after 500 img I have nothing more to offer its rare now to come across a good case and people dont want to donate..
And what is this bull..t about having copywrite on stupid image...it just shows a disease entity and yea mine will look as yours...its the same disese..anyway..just poring some poison off my heart..and my graduation is tomorrow for the 2 time in my life...I have anestesia background as well...
should I be happy.. 😕

 

[LADoc00]

Well Im trying to find Cytopath fellowship and trust me you have to start at least 2years in advance if you want to get something..so I submited to more that 20 programs and got 6 interviews and 6 middle fingers..the rest did not even bother to reply even to say "sorry pall you are not getting it..". I think this is dissrespectful..whats your expirience guys ?
:

I have a great story, a guy once applied to residency at a top ranked academic medical center and was told by the guy in charge that he wasnt competitive and forget it. The same guy reapplied for fellowship, this time wasnt even notified and when he called the guy in charge he was told they threw his application away shortly after receiving it.

Fast forward, this unnamed guy finishes his fellowship elsewhere, become one of the top guys in his field, is hired by this place that had twice dissed him and is so loved by everyone that he takes charge of everything in short order including the guy who tossed his fellowship application some 15 years prior.

This type of behaivor by fellowship directors is common and even I experienced when I toyed with the idea of going into dermpath. Trust me, I have a black book with names...and the day will come.

 

[djmd]

This type of behavior by fellowship directors is common ...

Common and being exacerbated by the double class year this year and the spill over to next year. (people who are seeking a certain fellowship, and didn't get it or are believing this neu-think of all must have 2+ fellowships)

They act as if they will have a never-ending surplus of residents.

 

[LADoc00]

Common and being exacerbated by the double class year this year and the spill over to next year. (people who are seeking a certain fellowship, and didn't get it or are believing this neu-think of all must have 2+ fellowships)

They act as if they will have a never-ending surplus of residents.

Many (including dare I say the CAP) are predicting the double class year will produce the worst job situation for outgoing housestaff in quite some time.

 

[yaah]

Well Im trying to find Cytopath fellowship and trust me you have to start at least 2years in advance if you want to get something..so I submited to more that 20 programs and got 6 interviews and 6 middle fingers..the rest did not even bother to reply even to say "sorry pall you are not getting it..". I think this is dissrespectful..whats your expirience guys ?

The general timeline seems to be you apply during your third year, early on, for a fellowship immediately after your fourth year. Thus, a little less than two years beforehand. Some you can apply a little more than a year beforehand and there will be openings. I wish it was more regulated and standard. For many people, midway through their second year they shouldn't be forced to choose a specialty.

 

[Anna Plastic]

Well Im trying to find Cytopath fellowship and trust me you have to start at least 2years in advance if you want to get something..so I submited to more that 20 programs and got 6 interviews and 6 middle fingers..the rest did not even bother to reply even to say "sorry pall you are not getting it..". I think this is dissrespectful..whats your expirience guys ?

I agree that to not even receive a letter acknowledging receipt of your application is poor business manners. I think it is a minimum of effort to send off a form letter saying "unfortunately, we are no longer looking..." blah blah BS BS. At least the person is let off the hook.

As LADoc00's story showed, this is a small field. Its just not very bright to be acting uppity to trainees. Or fellow colleagues in training, for that matter.

 

[yaah]

I agree that to not even receive a letter acknowledging receipt of your application is poor business manners. I think it is a minimum of effort to send off a form letter saying "unfortunately, we are no longer looking..." blah blah BS BS. At least the person is let off the hook.

The question is though, when did he apply? If it was only an application in the past year for a fellowship starting this July it may have just simply been too late. That being said though, it really doesn't take much effort to reply and say, "Sorry, the position has been filled," or something. It is particularly galling because there really aren't guidelines posted as to when applications are due, or when you can start submitting them, or even what they entail.

I will never understand the lack of responses from certain people in the medical field. It comes up in lots of ways. When I am on call, I return all my pages promptly (i.e. immediately, or as soon as possible if I am tied up with something else). You would be amazed at the number of times the person I call back says, "Thanks for calling me back," or "I appreciate you calling me back." Huh? It's my job! I can see why they say that though, because when I try to page clinical residents or nurses or whoever to get an answer to a question, I get about a 50% callback rate at 2 minutes, and another 25% within 5 minutes. It's pathetic. Do people page others when they don't need to know something?

 

[pathstudent]

I know people who have lined up dermpath positions 3 years in advance (typically as an early 3rd year with a year of surg path or some other fellowship inbetween just to kill time until they do dermpath, but some people are selected while they are second years).

 

[yaah]

That's kind of odd. Most people I have talked to say doing surg path + derm or derm + anything else even is not really advisable nor is it looked upon fondly. That is, now that the credentialing year has been eliminated.

Getting any fellowship 3 years in advance is silly. The fact that programs actually fill their spots 3 years in advance is asinine. This selects against the people who may not know they are interested until they actually DO the rotation, which I find irritating. The best way to get a derm spot is to go to a dermpath on day one of residency, get a project, and then apply a year later? Total silliness.

 

[pathstudent]

That's kind of odd. Most people I have talked to say doing surg path + derm or derm + anything else even is not really advisable nor is it looked upon fondly. That is, now that the credentialing year has been eliminated.

Getting any fellowship 3 years in advance is silly. The fact that programs actually fill their spots 3 years in advance is asinine. This selects against the people who may not know they are interested until they actually DO the rotation, which I find irritating. The best way to get a derm spot is to go to a dermpath on day one of residency, get a project, and then apply a year later? Total silliness.

It is not that different than applying for fellowships in medicine. If you want to do Cards, or GI or heme/onc you must start shooting for it from day 1. They don't apply 3 years in advance as the application process is regulated and standardized, but they gotta know what they wanna be before they start if they want to get into a competitive field.

 

[torero]

That's kind of odd. Most people I have talked to say doing surg path + derm or derm + anything else even is not really advisable nor is it looked upon fondly. That is, now that the credentialing year has been eliminated.

People usually recommend what worked for them…
I did a surg path fellowship as my credentialing year, followed by a dermpath fellowship.
During dermpath fellowship interviews and later, during job interviews, I got the impression that the surgpath fellowship was looked upon as a definite plus.

People who did subspecialty training straight after residency will recommend that, and will say that a surgpath fellowship is not needed. That may make sense for people doing residency at programs with strong surgpath training -- UMich 🙂 . What doesn’t make much sense to me is taking that a step further and saying it doesn’t look good on your CV. I dunno.

 

[Logos']

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[yaah]

Yes, at UCSF many of us stick around for a surg path year ...

In the credentialing year era, yes. That was true here as well. But now there are more residency spots and fewer surg path fellowship spots. In fact, not enough for everyone to stay and do general surg path. And the subspecialty ones are competitive enough. And with the new chairman here, outside candidates have a great shot at fellowship spots if they are researchers.

Will that still be true at UCSF now?

 

[Logos']

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[yaah]

That is interesting, so part of your required residency is fulfilled with surg path fellowship like electives. We have an opportunity for some of that here, which I will take advantage of if I choose to not do a surg path fellowship.

It is true, employers do appreciate when people do a surg path fellowship, and look on it as a good thing. I don't think too many people will be marketable applicants with 4 years ap/cp without any extra training at all. I may be wrong though.

 

[LADoc00]

Certainly in the credentialing year era the surg path fellowship was a standard option.

I can’t remember how many SP fellowship spots we have, I think 7/year, and UCSF AP or AP/CP residents fill nearly all of them. One difference is that we have a number of AP-only residents who elect to complete their third year as surg path fellows. For AP/CP residents we complete 2 years in both pathology and laboratory medicine and this allows flexibility in scheduling such that residents can fit in fellowships before completing residency, if desired (eg CP, AP, AP, SP, CP, etc). I think there is no problem fitting everyone into a surg path fellowship that wants one.

My impression is that SP training is valued by residents and local employers for increasing independence and shortening the "hand-holding" period that most new pathologists go through. I also don’t see why you could not market yourself just as effectively with a surg path fellowship, from a well-known program, in which you devote elective time to a specific non-boarded subspecialty (GI, GU etc).

I think the SP year varies ALOT from place to place, please correct me if I wrong, but dont the SF fellows spend at least a few months just as glorified year 2 AP residents (meaning they cut in and then sign out the routines with an attending)? Do you write up the case and simply give your report to attendings to look over or do they sit down with you and tell you what to put in it??

 

[Logos']

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[LADoc00]

When looking at SP years, READ THE FINE PRINT, not all of them let you spend month long blocks doing dermpath, cyto or heme or any number of essential subspecialty services. that is all.