Finalized 2007 Rank Order Lists

[Bitsy3221]

Thess message boards have proven useful in so many ways and at so many different points in my medical school career. All of the information that I've taken in has been from anonymous internet posters. To say that this thread is particularly useless is confusing. Why have an internet forum at all, unless you're willing to accept some suggestions from other users?

Seeing some rank lists different from yours may spark some interesting discussion that could prove useful to our successors next year. If we voiced our thoughts on why I ranked Program X highly, but you ranked it very low, it might help future applicants think about their priorities and make them focus a little more on interview day and their overall evaluations before their lists are due. Sure, we're all relatively anonymous on this board, and most info has to be taken with a grain of salt. But it's one more piece of information to help us get as clear a picture as possible when there's so much dubious garbage that we run into on interview day

Fair enough On with the discussion, then!

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[blackdiamond]

Any program can look good for one day. I interviewed at a program where I rotated at for 3 months (in various services) and I found out how horrible the program was and how miserable the residents were, yet they made it seem like heaven on earth on interview day by serving good food and telling lies. Now getting this piece of info off an internet forum may be the only way someone can get any decent advice because the other people on that interview with me that day were sure misled.

I agree that advice on the internet should be taken with a grain of salt, but there must be some kind of pattern when "great" programs are consistently ranked lower than where they should be on people's ROL. And that's the kind of info that helped me when I stumbled onto these forums.

 

[Bitsy3221]

If you felt that way, blackdiamond, then why did you not contribute to the threads about interview days? If you want to have a discussion about someone's list, fine--have at it. But if you are using this thread for future years to look at trends, you are not going to have enough replys (as you haven't this year) and responses will be self selected on people who choose to share their list--often, as SLUser alluded to, future MGH chairmen. Some people ranked Hopkins high, some ranked it at the bottom of their list--how is this useful?

Its one thing to ask about logisitics and questions that have answers, and it may be helpful to list places you interviewed at so others can ask you about your experiences and a discussion (as jihu mentioned) ensues, but I still stand by my original statement that using anonymous ROLs as anything useful to steer their applications is bad advice for underclassmen.

 

[TxMed]

any chance of ever returning to the original intent of the thread?...perhaps people can take their arguements to a new thread. I will even give that thread a name.....drum roll please ..............................................
......................"Let's argue with people on the internet about stuff that doesn't really matter!!!"


-tm

 

[blackdiamond]

bitsy, I didn't imply that posting people's ROLs should be an end-all be-all source for future applicants to apply or not to certain programs. However, we are here to gain a sense of what different programs' strengths and weakness, maybe not just by one person's ROL but by many. Maybe you would not use this info as such, but I did, and that is my opinion. Sure, some people post to show off, but it is still a valuable piece of info for me. I agree that underclassmen should not based their lives off these lists, but again, it's one part of a bigger picture. Again, if you did not find these lists to be useful, then you should ignore this thread altogether.

 

[Bitsy3221]

any chance of ever returning to the original intent of the thread?...perhaps people can take their arguements to a new thread. I will even give that thread a name.....drum roll please ..............................................
......................"Let's argue with people on the internet about stuff that doesn't really matter!!!"


-tm

THAT should be the subtitle of most of SDN! (I KID! I kid cause I love)

Besides, I hold Hank and his mini-freak out after seeing blackdiamond's list as the original derailer of the thread. (again...with the kidding....and the loving...)

Seriously, good luck to everyone. If you are as on edge as I am, I feel for you all.

 

[SLUser11]

SLU...with all due respect, what do you gain by seeing other people's rank lists? I wouldn't take the scant response to this subject as a decreased interest in surgery or an abundance of nervousness, but rather that it's a pretty worthless thread and most readers see it's lack of value.

Well, it's definitely not worthless. I do agree, however, with other posters that you shouldn't base your decisions on anonymous internet advice. I find the value to lay more in ROLs that include lesser known programs. Seeing a program at or near the top of someone's list may spark the interest of future applicants in a program that might otherwise go unnoticed, be it from geography or lack of reputation.

Really, I think it's ego that keeps a lot of SDNers from sharing. They don't want to share in case they match low. But, I also think the sample bias that exists here is intimidating.

(key words in bold so you can skip through my preachy crap)

 

[BiliousVomit]

This thread, although "useless" to some people, is actually one of the most popular thread on the Surgery forum (with 4000+ views).

Also, just because some people have rank prestigious programs on their rank lists does not automatically qualify them as "superstars." This is just the beginning for all of us. Getting training at those places does not automatically guarantee success. Be secure about your talent and accomplishments, and don't let someone's ROL psych you out.

Let's take medical schools, for instance. On my interview trail, I've met many people from very well known institutions, as well as people from schools I've never heard of before. We were all interviewing for the same job.

I don't think the prestige will make a great surgeon. Rather, it's how much you put into your training. Ironically, I've yet to meet a MGH trained chairman on my interview trial besides at my MGH interview.
But I only had 10 interviews so the statistics might be skewed, oh well....

Again, good luck on match day!

 

[Skialta]

So, I listed my ROL not to brag, but I found it interesting to see what other people thought of programs. Your rank list is more about what you like to do outside of the hospital as much as it is what kind of name the program has. If I would have gone by name alone Mayo would have been my first choice.

Anyone applying next year should not use my list as a basis for where to apply. I thought most of the programs I interviewed at to be solid, it is more a matter of where you fit in and where you want to live.

 

[Dock In A Box]

1. UVA
2. U of Florida
3. Northwestern
4. Emory
5. UNC Chapel Hill
6. Brown
7. U of Chicago
8. U of Michigan
9. Boston U
10. MGH
11. BIDMC
12. Louisville
13. Wake
14. Dartmouth

 

[eastcoastyall]

Against my better judgement, here's my list. I found these interesting last year, so enjoy. I think that explanations are helpful with the lists -- Feel free to ask me any questions.

1. Northwestern -- gut feeling told me go here
2. University of Chicago -- liked chicago, liked program, love attendings
3. Penn -- amazing program, cool residents
4. Brigham -- amazing OR experience (high cases, high autonomy)
5. Baylor Clinical -- great autonomy, cool residents, friendly vibe
6. Baylor Research -- same as above
7. BU -- great residency director, residents cool
8. Hopkins -- traditional program, good OR experience
9. UTSW -- same as for Hopkins, huge program (12/yr)
10. Pitt -- liked the program the best of all, couldn't pull the trigger on city
11. Maryland -- high clinical volume, residents work very hard
12. Mount Sinai -- amazing program, happy residents
13. Columbia -- personable residents and attendings
14. Temple -- trauma heavy, great residency director
15. Mayo - Jax -- cushy program/easy call, early op, apprenticeship style
16. Oregon -- huge program (10/yr), many hospitals, rural focus
17. St. Luke's -- cushy community program, great attendings
18. Colorado -- not the place for me, high trauma

 

[GoLeafsGo!]

Heres my list... too lazy to type up reasons... sorry...

1 Mayo Rochester
2 U Michigan
3 Ohio State Univ
4 U Cincinnati
5 UT-SW
6 U Minnesota
7 UMDNJ-R W Johnson
8 U Rochester/Strong Mem-NY
9 Case Western
10 Med Coll Wisconsin
11 UT-Houston

 

[drunkduck9]

Well, I didn't have the arduous task of choosing between MGH, UVA, and UCSF..., but, in the interest of future generations (as exhaustively debated above), here is mine:

1. VCU
2. OHSU
3. UTSW
4. UT-Houston
5. Louisville
6. UT-MB
...and so on for a few more smaller programs I hope I won't need.

Mere days left to go...

 

[dynx]

Mere days left to go...

In that spirit I'll throw out my top 5:

1. UCSF
2. UVA
3. UCSD
4. UCD
5. Cottage SB

and last on my list just so people can ask if curious: UCLA

The rest are a mixed bag (as number 5 kinda gives away) and I don't really feel strong about them one way or another so I wouldnt be able to provide any good info if asked, so i won't post them.

 

[Ezangjen]

1. UCSF Eastbay
2. UCD
3. UCI
4. Loma Linda
5. Loyola
6. Minnesota
7. Methodist Houston
8. USC
9. UT Houston
10. UIC
11. CWRU
12. Indiana

Good luck everybody!

 

[Dock In A Box]

1. UVA
2. U of Florida
3. Northwestern
4. Emory
5. UNC Chapel Hill
6. Brown
7. U of Chicago
8. U of Michigan
9. Boston U
10. MGH
11. BIDMC
12. Louisville
13. Wake
14. Dartmouth

I'm not sure if I posted my reasons it would help anyone much because for the most part, I made my list based upon 1) How much I thought I would personally fit in with the ideology of the program and the residents and 2) location. With that said, I felt like the training at UVA was probably the best I saw on the interview trail, great attendings, friendly residents, great research, nice place to live. Impressive place. Florida and NW had a very similar vibe to UVA and I loved both places...in the end it was a tough decision. Places like Wake and Dartmouth were not bad programs for me, but I just couldn't see myself in those cities. That's why they were so low on my list. Feel free to send me an e-mail if you have specific questions.

 

[beefballs]

to those of you who post your list thanks-I like lists

 

[imtiaz]

i matched.

PRIMARY RANK ORDER LIST

Rank Prog Code Description Status Supp List
1 1147440C0 General Surgery
Rush University Med Ctr-IL
2 1376440C0 General Surgery
U Nebraska Affil Hosp
3 1426440C0 General Surgery
SUNY HSC Brooklyn-NY
4 1295440C0 General Surgery
WSU/Detroit Med Ctr-MI
5 1224440C0 General Surgery
LSU SOM-New Orleans-LA
6 1579440C0 General Surgery
The University of Toledo-OH
7 1516440C0 General Surgery
SUNY Upstate Med University
8 1837440C0 General Surgery
West Virginia University SOM
9 2727440C0 General Surgery
U Oklahoma COM-Tulsa
10 1962440C0 General Surgery
U New Mexico SOM
11 1286440C0 General Surgery
Baystate Med Ctr-MA
12 1539440C0 General Surgery
U North Dakota SOM

 

[Samoa]

Congrats, imtiaz! I know it was a rough road for you. You must be on top of the world right now.

 

[sig55]

Applied to 50, got 30 or so interviews, did 20. Avg Step I, great Step II, top 1/3 in class @ Nebraska, honors in most clinicals, and did 3 yrs of research with pubs.

Dallas-Baylor (great residents, pleasant atmosphere, 66 OR's running daily)
Utah (some of the best surgical/ICU training in the country, post-call skiing)
Loyola-Chicago (loved every aspect of the program and the city)
Florida (good training, most down-to-earth residents I met)
UT-Houston (old-school atmosphere, malignant? but I could thrive there)
UNMC (home institution, great training and volume, incredible staff)
Iowa (most personable PD I can imagine, friendly residents, great gen surg)
Indiana (fairly academic, loved the PD and most residents, some staff "stuffy")
Oklahoma (lots of autonomy, good HPB training, friendly all around)
Minnesota (very academic, great chairman, OK residents, good training)
Dallas Methodist (cushy, good trauma exposure, great residents)
UNLV (Vegas, baby!; good PD, residents, and trauma/ICU training)
Columbus-Riverside (great staff, training, and facilities)
Missouri (the new Laparoscopic capital of the world)
Maricopa-Phoenix (wow, very different, could have put them anywhere...)
UMKC (nothing too bad or great; PD very involved)
UT-San Antonio (military affiliation, somewhat old-school)
KUMC (argued with the PD about adequate surgical autonomy for chiefs)
Wichita (GREAT if you're married with kids; I'm not and hate Wichita)

Good luck to all on Thursday. I'd be very happy anywhere in my top 12-13.

 

[sig55]

sorry, it posted twice.

 

[Guile]

So any chance that you guys would post a stats thread for a student interested in surgery? (i.e. I matched here and my step I was x, I go to a top 10/25/50/unranked med school, pertinent research/publications, etc.) It would be very helpful.

Thanks to everyone who posted their lists, and especially to those who included reasons.