LatteColoredDO

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Our "beloved" osteopathic medical school insists that we complete three sub-Is as graduation requirements, yet they are discouraging us to travel and try to stay local as much as possible. Our program, however like most DO schools, is not affiliated with a residency and the local residency programs in the area will only be taking their students from their medical schools due to COVID-19. Is a PD from a program that we are interested for in residency (i.e. IM, Psych, OB/GYN, Peds) going to look down at our application for pursuing one or two sub-Is outside our or state because our school is not changing their requirements and we don't have any options?
 
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What penal colony is this????

I can only guess that they want to have some sort of oversight as to your sub-I,s but travelling far and wide is universal for DO students. Are they trying to lock you into your state???

Is this behavior universal among the clinical Deans? Are you forbidden to do away auditions?

Seek advise from graduates as to how they navigated this, IF this is a standing policy. IF it's a new policy, scream loud and hard to the Dean. THE Dean....no flunkies.
 
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AnatomyGrey12

What penal colony is this????

I can only guess that they want to have some sort of oversight as to your sub-I,s but travelling far and wide is universal for DO students. Are they trying to lock you into your state???

Is this behavior universal among the clinical Deans? Are you forbidden to do away auditions?

Seek advise from graduates as to how they navigated this, IF this is a standing policy. IF it's a new policy, scream loud and hard to the Dean. THE Dean....no flunkies.

Have you seen the new recommendations regarding audition rotations?
 

samac

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I'm afraid to ask...what are they? Are they COVID-influenced?
Yes.
recommending no more than 1 away and only for those that have home programs. A lot of hospitals are shutting down from away rotations totally and only taking their own students.
 
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LatteColoredDO

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Yes.
recommending no more than 1 away and only for those that have home programs. A lot of hospitals are shutting down from away rotations totally and only taking their own students.
Hence why it's ridiculous that our school wants us to complete 3 sub-I's for graduation requirements when it's gonna be hard to get even 1.
 
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AnatomyGrey12

I'm afraid to ask...what are they? Are they COVID-influenced?

There are also specialty organizations, neurosurgery/ENT/and OB I think, that have straight up said that they recommend that their programs discount any application that has evidence of away rotations if that applicant has a home program.

I'll tag you in the thread I made discussing the document above.
 
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LatteColoredDO

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There are also specialty organizations, neurosurgery/ENT/and OB I think, that have straight up said that they recommend that their programs discount any application that has evidence of away rotations if that applicant has a home program.

I'll tag you in the thread I made discussing the document above.
Okay so if we don't have a home program, then I guess I'm in the clear?
 

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There are also specialty organizations, neurosurgery/ENT/and OB I think, that have straight up said that they recommend that their programs discount any application that has evidence of away rotations if that applicant has a home program.

I'll tag you in the thread I made discussing the document above.

any program that is going to blackmail you for doing auditions can go to hell. Academic medicine is the worst cause these chronies just sit around and circle jerk to the dumbest ideas originating from some person pretending to be oppressed on Twitter
 
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full_rocker

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Okay so if we don't have a home program, then I guess I'm in the clear?

That is how I am understanding it. Students like us who do not have access to home programs should be "ok" to do an away rotation.

However programs would still have to be willing to accept visiting students. Just because we're allowed to do rotations doesn't mean programs are required to take students. I can definitely see many VSAS based programs going with a "no visiting student" policy for the 2020-2021 AY.
 
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Spectreman

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any program that is going to blackmail you for doing auditions can go to hell. Academic medicine is the worst cause these chronies just sit around and circle jerk to the dumbest ideas originating from some person pretending to be oppressed on Twitter
Oh Lord I felt that in my soooooull
 
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libertyyne

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any program that is going to blackmail you for doing auditions can go to hell. Academic medicine is the worst cause these chronies just sit around and circle jerk to the dumbest ideas originating from some person pretending to be oppressed on Twitter
They said they will penalize you if you have a home program and decide to attend an away in addition to that. For people without home programs they expected you to go do one away that as local as you can swing it.
 

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Is a PD from a program that we are interested for in residency (i.e. IM, Psych, OB/GYN, Peds) going to look down at our application for pursuing one or two sub-Is outside our or state because our school is not changing their requirements and we don't have any options?

@NotAProgDirector is there any insight for why PDs would "look down" on applications for students who have to do aways this cycle?
 
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libertyyne

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Some of this could be mitigated by doing two SUb I's at the same institution.
 
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LatteColoredDO

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What was their response when you pointed this out to them? Do they have any solutions for you?
Yeah I don't think they understand the gravity of the situation and just want to be stubborn and not change the requirements for the academic year.
 
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Yeah I don't think they understand the gravity of the situation and just want to be stubborn and not change the requirements for the academic year.
So they refuse to answer your question? They give no helpful advice?

Complain to the dean en masse
 
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LatteColoredDO

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So they refuse to answer your question? They give no helpful advice?

Complain to the dean en masse
The problem is, the DEAN is the one making these requirements and not willing to change them.
 
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SurgDoc95

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Honestly as someone in your class, you're better off just finding any auditions that you can and ignoring the don't travel rule up to a point. The school isn't going to change the Sub-I requirement so just start looking at places outside VSAS and if you have to start cold emailing/calling program coordinators to ask if they offer Sub-I's and explain our circumstances. I understand the stress and anxiety associated with this, but waiting around for them to amend the policy isn't the best course of action.

Also, any program that would look down on you for meeting school requirements when you've explained the circumstances and have done your best to be considerate of the situation, isn't some place you want to be
 
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hallowmann

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Honestly as someone in your class, you're better off just finding any auditions that you can and ignoring the don't travel rule up to a point. The school isn't going to change the Sub-I requirement so just start looking at places outside VSAS and if you have to start cold emailing/calling program coordinators to ask if they offer Sub-I's and explain our circumstances. I understand the stress and anxiety associated with this, but waiting around for them to amend the policy isn't the best course of action.

Also, any program that would look down on you for meeting school requirements when you've explained the circumstances and have done your best to be considerate of the situation, isn't some place you want to be

I'd honestly recommend doing both. Plan and act as if it won't be changed, but as a class, advocate for change. It will undoubtedly help those in your class who simply can't find that third rotation and may help future classes as well.
 
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PorkChopsOG

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Hence why it's ridiculous that our school wants us to complete 3 sub-I's for graduation requirements when it's gonna be hard to get even 1.
As someone also in your class, you need to relax.
Just because the school requires 3 "sub-i's/auditions" does not mean you have to travel to do them. In fact, the school mentioned they are creating ONLINE courses that cover these requirements. You will graduate in time, and the school is not mandating you travel outside of the state to complete these requirements.
 
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SurgDoc95

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As someone also in your class, you need to relax.
Just because the school requires 3 "sub-i's/auditions" does not mean you have to travel to do them. In fact, the school mentioned they are creating ONLINE courses that cover these requirements. You will graduate in time, and the school is not mandating you travel outside of the state to complete these requirements.

While I agree to an extent, online sub-i's are a poor excuse for our 46K tuition and the lack of real clinical training and experiences. The necessity for online rotations at all highlights the need for the school to solidify current rotation sites and look to creating a more robust clinical training network moving forward.
 
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PorkChopsOG

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While I agree to an extent, online sub-i's are a poor excuse for our 46K tuition and the lack of real clinical training and experiences. The necessity for online rotations at all highlights the need for the school to solidify current rotation sites and look to creating a more robust clinical training network moving forward.
Oh for sure. I just think a lot of our class is freaking out because they see "3 auditions required" when we're being discouraged from traveling, and they think the school is saying "You have to do 3 auditions physically in person at different places" when they really mean "you need 3 'audition rotations' and if you can't get any we'll ensure you get the requirements online".

The tuition is another issue.
 
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LatteColoredDO

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Oh for sure. I just think a lot of our class is freaking out because they see "3 auditions required" when we're being discouraged from traveling, and they think the school is saying "You have to do 3 auditions physically in person at different places" when they really mean "you need 3 'audition rotations' and if you can't get any we'll ensure you get the requirements online".

The tuition is another issue.
You're right; I'm just angry that all of this is happening. Also I want to complete sub-Is at places that I might want to end up because the rest of my app looks meh.
 
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