Gross Anti-Islam Sentiment During AECOM Interview

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BeyondDriven said:
Pray tell, what do you mean by that? I hope it has nothing to do with the OP being African-American...
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Easy there, killer. It's a little comedy. 🙄
 
i didn't know he was African American when i posted. his post was so long that i didn't get there. but i grew up on the south side of Chi and live on the east side of Cleveland. didn't mean to offend anyone.
 
armybound said:
jesus christ people are overly sensitive around here.

oh I guess I shouldn't say the big JC or I might offend the christians.
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Dr. [interviewer's name removed] didn't disparage the OP because of his/her race, and I just didn't want SDN posters to pick up where he left off. I'm glad to see that isn't the case!

Oh, and David Chappelle has got to be the funniest man alive.🙂
 
Kudos to you for stepping up and voicing your concerns.

And this was definitely not a "stress interview." I've had one or two stress interviews and the rule of thumb has always been to not mention religion/sexuality/or anything personal. Either the guy was having a bad day and decided to lash out (which is no excuse) or he's a huge bigot. Easy as that.

on a side note, and pardon my ignorance on this but aren't the majority of the students at AECOM Jewish? I know the school, as a whole, doesn't discriminate against different people but the administration/student body are predominately Jewish, no?
 
Sorry guys--I admit that I am a little sensitive about these issues because I'm no stranger to them. You'd be surprised how much hate, subtle or otherwise, exists today. Again, I am pleased that this isn't the case on this thread.
 
BeyondDriven said:
Sorry guys--I admit that I am a little sensitive about these issues because I'm no stranger to them. You'd be surprised how much hate, subtle or otherwise, exists today. Again, I am pleased that this isn't the case on this thread.
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the only one drinking the hatorade is Dr. [interviewer's name removed]
 
nehcmij86 said:
i didn't know he was African American when i posted. his post was so long that i didn't get there. but i grew up on the south side of Chi and live on the east side of Cleveland. didn't mean to offend anyone.
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Oh wait, I was confused about who you were referring to. The OP is an African American female, and the interviewer is an African American male.

(by the way, definitely no offense taken)
 
there is a lot of hate. and if you overreact and get bent out of shape at all of it, you're going to live a miserable life. pick your battles.
 
Salam, you go GIRL! thats a very well written letter. I wish I could write half as well as that. This guy sounds like a total jerk, good job on calling him out. I hope they take your letter seriously and do something about it.
 
armybound said:
there is a lot of hate. and if you overreact and get bent out of shape at all of it, you're going to live a miserable life. pick your battles.
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That's great advice. Do you think the OP picked the wrong battle?

OP--was your study abroad in Cairo the ONLY thing which prompted him to say all those things?
 
armybound said:
there is a lot of hate. and if you overreact and get bent out of shape at all of it, you're going to live a miserable life. pick your battles.
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Surely there is a lot of hate, but when someone's actions reflect poorly on an institution don't you think someone should know about it? Especially when we're talking about someone in his position (office of diversity).
 
MDRus said:
and i'm a wasp/jew.
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Hah, it's funny you say this. At one of my interviews, the guy asked me what my favorite non-science class was so I said Cross-Cultural Psych. He asked me to explain it, and I did, and then he said "So, have you had much exposure to people of different culture?" And as I started to respond, he chimed in with "You know, cause there can be a lot of Wasps and Jews around here"

...I think my eyes doubled in size when he said that, as I'm Jewish. What's w/ some people...

And for the OP... good for you for standing up for yourself. At another interview I just had, my the guy was a complete jerk to me and at one point suggested that I wanted to go to their school since I've lived in my homestate my whole life and go to school there and by leaving it, I would "finally grow up and get away from mommy and daddy". I was super offended, wrote the dean an email today and she responded very apologetically saying she would be speaking w/ my interviewer and then offered to speak w/ me on the phone. Hopefully something good comes of your letter as well! Good luck!
 
LovelyMD said:
Surely there is a lot of hate, but when someone's actions reflect poorly on an institution don't you think someone should know about it? Especially when we're talking about someone in his position (office of diversity).
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he's not the one I was referring to, I was talking more about Beyond fishing for prejudice by insinuating that nehcmij's comment was supposed to be racially inflammatory.

of course the interviewer's comments are racially uncool. maybe it was a stress interview. maybe it wasn't. I think the OP should have addressed this interview on the interview day before she left. I think that's a better way to deal with it than making this all public before getting a response from the school.
 
MDRus said:
your letter is eloquent and right on the money. beautifully done. i am stunned and plan to withdraw my application from AECOM. and i'm a wasp/jew.
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Not sure how anyone can be a wasp and a jew. WASP stands for White Anglo Saxon Protestant. You can't really be a protestant and a jew at the same time, can you? Or maybe it's like a new age thing where people say they're a Hindu Buddist Shaman or something.
 
Kthanksbye said:
Not sure how anyone can be a wasp and a jew. WASP stands for White Anglo Saxon Protestant. You can't really be a protestant and a jew at the same time, can you? Or maybe it's like a new age thing where people say their a Hindu Buddist Shaman or something.
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maybe one parent was a wasp and the other was jewish?
 
Kthanksbye said:
Not sure how anyone can be a wasp and a jew. WASP stands for White Anglo Saxon Protestant. You can't really be a protestant and a jew at the same time, can you? Or maybe it's like a new age thing where people say their a Hindu Buddist Shaman or something.
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that's what I was wondering..
 
I am so sorry to hear about your awful experience. However, I object to two things:

1. The inclusion of the interviewer's name
2. The inclusion of the school's name

This event is horrible and deserves to be rectified, but the extremely public nature that it is being carried out both damages the schools name and your chances of acceptance.

Consider this: if you simply mailed this letter as written or posted it in an anonymous fashion on this site and the school responded favorably (disciplining/firing the doctor, issuing an apology, offering to fly you back for another interview etc.), what would be the point of shaming them so publicly? In this case, the doctor was acting on his own, and the school did not support him in any fashion. The matter was resolved.

If the school said: "We don't care, and we support this person's views." Then more public attention would be absolutely called for.

By drawing potentially unnecessary, negative attention to the school before they have a chance to appropriately respond, you place yourself in a situation where the school could rightly reject you.

Next time, I suggest being more careful before promoting scandal. You made a mistake here to. In no way am I equating it with the doctor's mistake. Totally different orders of magnitude, but yours is not insignificant.

I hope that they bend over backwards trying to right the wrong they committed against you, and that you post their response to clear their name. If they don't, GIVE THEM HELL.

Good luck with the rest of your interviews.
 
Ben1764 said:
I am so sorry to hear about your awful experience. However, I object to two things:

1. The inclusion of the interviewer's name
2. The inclusion of the school's name

This event is horrible and deserves to be rectified, but the extremely public nature that it is being carried out both damages the schools name and your chances of acceptance.

Consider this: if you simply mailed this letter as written or posted it in an anonymous fashion on this site and the school responded favorably (disciplining/firing the doctor, issuing an apology, offering to fly you back for another interview etc.), what would be the point of shaming them so publicly? In this case, the doctor was acting on his own, and the school did not support him in any fashion. The matter was resolved.

If the school said: "We don't care, and we support this person's views." Then more public attention would be absolutely called for.

By drawing potentially unnecessary, negative attention to the school before they have a chance to appropriately respond, you place yourself in a situation where the school could rightly reject you.

Next time, I suggest being more careful before promoting scandal. You made a mistake here to. In no way am I equating it with the doctor's mistake. Totally different orders of magnitude, but yours is not insignificant.

I hope that they bend over backwards trying to right the wrong they committed against you, and that you post their response to clear their name. If they don't, GIVE THEM HELL.

Good luck with the rest of your interviews.
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I agree that the OP should have been a little less reactionary in promoting scandal and the school itself is not to blame, but I don't see how the good doctor can explain himself out of this one. He probably deserves as much flak as possible.
 
No, that and the fact that I am identifiably Muslim. I wear hijab (the head covering worn by many Muslim women).
 
decision pending...but not terribly interested in the school anymore. like lovelymd, many of my interests would put me into contact with dr. [interviewer's name removed] on a regular basis. not too appealing a thought, honestly.
 
Kthanksbye said:
Not sure how anyone can be a wasp and a jew. WASP stands for White Anglo Saxon Protestant. You can't really be a protestant and a jew at the same time, can you? Or maybe it's like a new age thing where people say they're a Hindu Buddist Shaman or something.
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father -- Jewish

mother -- New England WASP (White Anglo Saxon Protestant)

me -- priceless
 
Newsom said:
on a side note, and pardon my ignorance on this but aren't the majority of the students at AECOM Jewish? I know the school, as a whole, doesn't discriminate against different people but the administration/student body are predominately Jewish, no?
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While that's true of Yeshiva U, I don't think it's true of its graduate schools, including AECOM. They do have a lot of Jewish students, but not a majority - check out their facebooks.
 
armybound said:
I didn't realize I said all of that. I'm pretty good at sending out unsaid information.

What I'm saying is that the guy may have overreacted. I wasn't there, so I don't know, but it sounds like the guy may be a little oversensitive about some of the comments that were made. The "hypocrites" comment was out of line, but everything else sounds rather tame to me. Again, I wasn't there though.

My perspective here though is that your patients won't always be respectful of your race, gender, sexual orientation, religion, etc. How you react to people insulting you in the most personal ways may be interesting to an interviewer who's looking to push your buttons.

Just one guy's opinion, though.
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I see where armybound is coming from. Maybe he was playing the devil on purpose. Or maybe he wasn't and has ignorant opinions about race/religion. Hard to say, but from the amount of concern the OP has shown about this issue, I think the school, and possibly the interviewer as well, owes some kind of explanation. Keep us posted.
 
I've had my share of bad interviews (because of them, not me) and for most, it's better to move on just because I can't write that well! You can. Voice your opinion and send it to them (the sooner, the better).
 
I responded to a similar comment earlier about making the complaint public before hearing a response. Essentially I am for as much transparency as possible. If I spoke behind closed doors, I would have NO idea that this individual has a HISTORY of being reckless and offensive to not only applicants, but to his own staff. All too often institutions seek to cover their arses without regards to the impact on the public. When a person in a position of authority makes such a massive gaffe, they should be prepared to deal with the fallout. He is a proxy for the college. I feel that I'm doing the right thing. Instances of bigotry/racism need to be dealt with in the light of day...serves as a deterrent to repetition.
 
oh please? i think you blew this way out of proportion. Maybe the fact that you went to a jewish founded medical school you went into the interview with your own anti semitic expectations. At every interview there is someone who is going to be an dingus, and you just got to deal with it in a mature matter. Writing a nasty letter to the adcom isnt going to solve anything, and will probably earn you an instant rejection. In the medical world your going to meet patients that are not going to respect your religous views and that is a shame. But you have to learn how to deal with it appropriatley, and by getting overemotional is the wrong way to deal with it. I think they were testing you to see how you would react to a possible patient being anti semtic towards your own views, and although Dr. [interviewer's name removed] was wrong to say the things he did, the fact of the matter is that there are people out there that feel that way, and you have to learn how to deal with it accordingly, obviously that is something you have to work on if you want to interact with people on a regular basis.
 
belichek said:
oh please? i think you blew this way out of proportion. Maybe the fact that you went to a jewish founded medical school you went into the interview with your own anti semitic expectations. At every interview there is someone who is going to be an dingus, and you just got to deal with it in a mature matter. Writing a nasty letter to the adcom isnt going to solve anything, and will probably earn you an instant rejection. In the medical world your going to meet patients that are not going to respect your religous views and that is a shame. But you have to learn how to deal with it appropriatley, and by getting overemotional is the wrong way to deal with it. I think they were testing you to see how you would react to a possible patient being anti semtic towards your own views, and although Dr. [interviewer's name removed] was wrong to say the things he did, the fact of the matter is that there are people out there that feel that way, and you have to learn how to deal with it accordingly, obviously that is something you have to work on if you want to interact with people on a regular basis.
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I gotta agree here.
 
belichek said:
oh please? i think you blew this way out of proportion. Maybe the fact that you went to a jewish founded medical school you went into the interview with your own anti semitic expectations. At every interview there is someone who is going to be an dingus, and you just got to deal with it in a mature matter. Writing a nasty letter to the adcom isnt going to solve anything, and will probably earn you an instant rejection. In the medical world your going to meet patients that are not going to respect your religous views and that is a shame. But you have to learn how to deal with it appropriatley, and by getting overemotional is the wrong way to deal with it. I think they were testing you to see how you would react to a possible patient being anti semtic towards your own views, and although Dr. [interviewer's name removed] was wrong to say the things he did, the fact of the matter is that there are people out there that feel that way, and you have to learn how to deal with it accordingly, obviously that is something you have to work on if you want to interact with people on a regular basis.
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this is not just any patient, this is the head of DIVERSITY making insensitive statements. if any person shouldn't be making these statements, it's him. you can be a tool and take it up the ass and walk out of there like you've been on a horse saddle for 12 hours but some people have more dignity than that.
 
I honestly can't imagine a more "appropriate" response than writing a letter to voice my concerns. If you had read my letter, you'd see that I mentioned the realization that patients will certainly voice their opinions (whether founded or un-) without edit. However, in the context of an interview for a professional school, such opinions are completely out of line--particularly coming from the head of the diversity office!

We can agree to disagree on that point, my friend...
 
I disagree, there is absolutely no reason to be complacent about blatant intolerance in the admissions process. Kudos to the OP for keeping her head cool, I doubt I would be able to act with such restraint.
 
nehcmij86 said:
this is not just any patient, this is the head of DIVERSITY making insensitive statements. if any person shouldn't be making these statements, it's him. you can be a tool and take it up the ass and walk out of there like you've been on a horse saddle for 12 hours but some people have more dignity than that.
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do you just make this stuff up? wow.
 
belichek said:
oh please? i think you blew this way out of proportion. Maybe the fact that you went to a jewish founded medical school you went into the interview with your own anti semitic expectations. At every interview there is someone who is going to be an dingus, and you just got to deal with it in a mature matter. Writing a nasty letter to the adcom isnt going to solve anything, and will probably earn you an instant rejection. In the medical world your going to meet patients that are not going to respect your religous views and that is a shame. But you have to learn how to deal with it appropriatley, and by getting overemotional is the wrong way to deal with it. I think they were testing you to see how you would react to a possible patient being anti semtic towards your own views, and although Dr. [interviewer's name removed] was wrong to say the things he did, the fact of the matter is that there are people out there that feel that way, and you have to learn how to deal with it accordingly, obviously that is something you have to work on if you want to interact with people on a regular basis.
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Well yeah, you gotta deal with it on a daily basis with patients or whatnot (especially when wearing Muslim headcovering) but you shouldn't be getting that kind of discrimination from a professional school interviewer, let alone the associate dean of diversity.

At this point, I don't think she cares about getting rejected.
 
AustinBum said:
I disagree, there is absolutely no reason to be complacent about blatant intolerance in the admissions process. Kudos to the OP for keeping her head cool, I doubt I would be able to act with such restraint.
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you don't have to just accept it. but this is probably something that should have been mentioned in private with the dean of admissions on interview day.
 
i simply said that he was testing her to see how she would react to an anti semitic comment. You can't tell me that in this day and age, (especially in NYC) that anti semitism towards muslims is not prevalent. If she is going to go to Med school in the US, she has to learn how to deal with that sort of thing.
 
MDRus said:
do you just make this stuff up? wow.
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lol I'd like to know the same. Apparently, nehcmij86 is going to make a fine doctor, since laughter is touted to be the best medicine. 🙂
 
Anti-semitism (correct me if I'm wrong) is typically used only in connection with Jewish folk.
 
belichek said:
i simply said that he was testing her to see how she would react to an anti semitic comment. You can't tell me that in this day and age, (especially in NYC) that anti semitism towards muslims is not prevalent. If she is going to go to Med school in the US, she has to learn how to deal with that sort of thing.
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Even assuming what you say is correct, testing her in this context is highly inappropriate. There is no way for her in this situation to discern true racism and intolerance from a test. The school is trolling for a lawsuit if they believe they can subject any Muslim applicant to this disgusting display.
 
belichek said:
i simply said that he was testing her to see how she would react to an anti semitic comment. You can't tell me that in this day and age, (especially in NYC) that anti semitism towards muslims is not prevalent. If she is going to go to Med school in the US, she has to learn how to deal with that sort of thing.
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Riiight....because anti-semitism is directed against muslims. Try running your posts by a fact checker next time.

And honestly, you are wrong. The OP doesn't have to put up with crap at an interview. Maybe from a patient, but not from someone who is in a position of power and who theoretically is supposed to have a code of professional conduct.
 
Also, I can't imagine a day will go by when I feel like my best recourse is to just "deal" with discrimination or prejudice. Do you think Civil Rights made progress in this country because people just "dealt" with injustice? That comment hints at a background free and clear of such things...must be nice!
 
In context of daily life, itmay or may not be an overreaction. In the context of an interview, it's grossly unprofessional and the institution deserves to know it happened. Stress interview or not, the interviewer overstepped his bounds in a big way.
 
belichek said:
i simply said that he was testing her to see how she would react to an anti semitic comment. You can't tell me that in this day and age, (especially in NYC) that anti semitism towards muslims is not prevalent. If she is going to go to Med school in the US, she has to learn how to deal with that sort of thing.
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I think only the OP and the doctor are the only people who know for sure whether he was actually "testing" her (stress interview), but it's my humble opinion that the test itself (again, if it really was a test) was inappropriate. He should have probably been concerned about more important issues such as her fit with the school/desire to become a physician, but from reading her letter, it seems that he did not necessarily care about these things.
 
dcMDiva said:
Also, I can't imagine a day will go by when I feel like my best recourse is to just "deal" with discrimination or prejudice. Do you think Civil Rights made progress in this country because people just "dealt" with injustice? That comment hints at a background free and clear of such things...must be nice!
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is insensitivity the same as discrimination and prejudice?
 
Exactly. I'm not black or muslim myself, but I am indian and I'm sure that martin luther king's work affects my life integrally even today. Discrimination is discrimination, and shouldn't be tolerated OR accepted.
 
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