Hampton University vs. ACPE Lawsuit!!!

[FAMUPharmD09]

Looks like Hampton is trying to follow the route Xavier University went to have its probation rescinded. Wish 'em luck.

http://www.hamptonu.edu/news/030909_acpe_suit.html

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[dempsie5688]

Looks like Hampton is trying to follow the route Xavier University went to have its probation rescinded. Wish 'em luck.

http://www.hamptonu.edu/news/030909_acpe_suit.html

Good for Hampton, The ACPE has over reached, they have set an unrealistic time line and they will loose or settle this as they did with Xavier, it is unfortunate that the ACPE cannot set the same standards for every program. It is the bias of the ACPE that must be restructured and reorganized for it to continue to be a valid organization

 

[WVUPharm2007]

Hahaha. They are actually playing the race card. If ACPE folded against the other school, they will fold against this school, too.

Isn't this great? Our profession's gatekeeper as to which schools allow people into our profession is too pussified to enforce its own rules. Hire a lawyer and you can keep your subpar school open. It's apparently that easy.

Frankly, there are too many schools, not enough educators, and the quality of education is being diluted as such. Some schools probably need shut down...yet every year another one opens up.

 

[PumpkinSmasher]

Hopefully the school burns down and no one gets hurt.

 

[FAMUPharmD09]

Frankly, there are too many schools, not enough educators, and the quality of education is being diluted as such. Some schools probably need shut down...yet every year another one opens up.

100% agree, but I believe Hampton may have a case, especially with the precedence set with XULA decision. ACPE will cave.

 

[dempsie5688]

Hahaha. They are actually playing the race card. If ACPE folded against the other school, they will fold against this school, too.

Isn't this great? Our profession's gatekeeper as to which schools allow people into our profession is too pussified to enforce its own rules. Hire a lawyer and you can keep your subpar school open. It's apparently that easy.

Frankly, there are too many schools, not enough educators, and the quality of education is being diluted as such. Some schools probably need shut down...yet every year another one opens up.

It's not about race, it's about fairness. People go to different schools for different reasons. I have attended predominately white University's my whole school career. I could attend University of Mississipp a to 30 school if I wanted but I would like to attend a HBCU because I think they are more socially conscience and I want to make a difference not only in Health care but on social issues also. I think that there is an established network of people who share these interests at HBCU's and of course you want the most qualified teachers but you don't want to strip away the culture of the HBCU. Again it is not about race it is about fairness and applying the same standard. Due process should be accessible to all people and all organizations the ACPE did not do this and the probation status should be reversed.

 

[BMBiology]

It is the bias of the ACPE that must be restructured and reorganized for it to continue to be a valid organization

Due process should be accessible to all people and all organizations the ACPE did not do this and the probation status should be reversed.

How would you know? Because Hampton said so?

 

[dempsie5688]

How would you know? Because Hampton said so?

Well I think that if you go to the ACPE website and look at the history of programs that have been on probation you would see that they generally give a year's probation.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

It's not about race, it's about fairness. People go to different schools for different reasons. I have attended predominately white University's my whole school career. I could attend University of Mississipp a to 30 school if I wanted but I would like to attend a HBCU because I think they are more socially conscience and I want to make a difference not only in Health care but on social issues also. I think that there is an established network of people who share these interests at HBCU's and of course you want the most qualified teachers but you don't want to strip away the culture of the HBCU. Again it is not about race it is about fairness and applying the same standard. Due process should be accessible to all people and all organizations the ACPE did not do this and the probation status should be reversed.

Yet in their little .pdf document of their lawsuit filing, they made certain to note every traditionally black college that's ever been put on probation. There's no reason -at all - for it to even be a part of their court filings. Why do that?

 

[dempsie5688]

Yet in their little .pdf document of their lawsuit filing, they made certain to note every traditionally black college that's ever been put on probation. There's no reason -at all - for it to even be a part of their court filings. Why do that?

For me the more interesting aspect of the document was the probation period given to the schools. I don't know if Hampton is making the case the ACPE is harder on HBCU's but my big thing is being fair. They generally give 1 year for probation status

 

[WVUPharm2007]

For me the more interesting aspect of the document was the probation period given to the schools. I don't know if Hampton is making the case the ACPE is harder on HBCU's but my big thing is being fair. They generally give 1 year for probation status

Ok...so why didn't they bring up other, just regular-ass colleges that have even been given probation? I dunno...it just exudes opportunistic lawyer-speak to me...

 

[BMBiology]

Well I think that if you go to the ACPE website and look at the history of programs that have been on probation you would see that they generally give a year's probation.

Does that mean they have to give every substandard program only a year of probation or else they are being unfair? The logical in your post is embarrassing.

 

[dempsie5688]

Does that mean they have to give every program only a year of probation or they are being unfair? The logical in your post is embarrassing.

Well, If you want to throw insults that is fine, I could point out that the word logical should actually be logic, but I won't. I'm just stating, if you are an accrediting agency in order to be fair you have to be consistent, being that they reversed the decision to put Xavier on probation demonstrates that further investigation might be necessary. The school has an obigation to vigirously defend itself and the ACPE did not afford them the opportunity to do this, so they are in court. Thats the way the system works. If you were personally wronged you would act in the same way.

 

[BMBiology]

I'm just stating, if you are an accrediting agency in order to be fair you have to be consistent, being that they reversed the decision to put Xavier on probation demonstrates that further investigation might be necessary.

Again, how would you know they are not being fair? So now every decision the ACPE makes need to be investigated? Your LOGIC is embarrassing.

 

[dempsie5688]

Again, how would you know they are not being fair? So now every decision the ACPE makes need to be investigated? Your LOGIC is embarrassing.

Well, honestly this debate is silly. Logic by definition means to be consistent and orderly. I think that logic also means to be reasonable and to know what is expected. I'm not sure if you understand that the ACPE has to apply the same principles across the board. If you look at probationary status of different schools and if you look at the reasons they are on probation you would see that it seems illogical to impose a 6 month probation on Hampton. That being said I don't have a personal stake I don't attend Hampton, I would like to, but I'm not a student. I suggest that we just let system work and see what happens, ultimately I think we want to see the right thing happen and a court will decide that

 

[BMBiology]

Hampton has the 3rd lowest pass rate (88.24%) on the Naplex in 2008, barely beating Xavier (83.64%) and Florida A&M (87.59%). Even the University of Puerto Rico had a higher pass rate (88.45%)! Puerto Rico for God's sake!

http://www.nabp.net/ftpfiles/bulletins/NaplexSPR.pdf

 

[WVUPharm2007]

88% ain't THAT bad. At least its not like 53%...like Howard that one year. (Dayum.)

That school in Lebanon has a good pass rate, too. Huh.

 

[iphetamine]

That school in Lebanon has a good pass rate, too. Huh.

ya, i just looked at that pdf, wow, the Lebanese American almost has a 100% pass rate, but they average on 20 candidates compared to the other schools. But again, it's still very good.

 

[Jooks]

BMBiology, do u have a personal vendetta against Hampton University students....Im a student in Hampton and have a fairly high GPA (3.86), 19 years old and fnished all pre-reqs in two year easily and scored over 83 % (92 chem, 90 biology) on all parts of the pcats last year, Might I add I was accepted to UB, and offered interviews at Purdue and Duquesne but chose Hampton because I completed my undergraduate work and enjoy being in the company of the students ...I wouldnt be surprised if I was more qualified to be enrolled in your school than you no matter what major u are. You saying that our school shouldnt be able to give out pharmd's is a huge problem to not only my career path but to the other 55 students in my P1 class. You should watch what say/type before your career is in the hands of a Hampton Unversity graduate because thats how funny life is. As for the school burning down remark from "pumpkinsmasher", u must look for the fire extinguisher everytime u step into a building.

 

[bacillus1]

Yes the lawyer is trying to play the race card, which may help or hurt this case, but it is true that the ACPE does need to quantify and standardize its standards.

 

[BMBiology]

BMBiology, do u have a personal vendetta against Hampton University students

Sorry to say but I dont even know where is Hampton University.

 

[ItsOverZyvox]

 

[Glycerin]

Sorry to say but I dont even know where is Hampton University.

You're a smart enough guy. Surely you can find that out in about 2 seconds. You don't even have to google it; just read the entire link in the first post. 😉

Is that kettle corn?

 

[FAMUPharmD09]

Wow, this thread didn't go where I expected it to. The point was not to down Hampton or any other schools. The point was to show the inadequacies of the ACPE. ACPE has seen an exponential growth of pharmacy schools in the last 10 years, leading to decreased qualified professors. Let's not make this a bashfest! In the end it doesn't matter what school you go to, it's the student's responsibility to learn and become a competent pharmacist.

 

[ItsOverZyvox]

Is that kettle corn?

No, it's microwaved.

 

[SpirivaSunrise]

No, it's microwaved.

dork.



















😛

 

[RutgersEMSOP10]

i dunno. i don't, by any means, want to bash any specific school, but you have to admit that the rate of opening of new schools is alarming. to say that it's the ACPE's fault that they can't keep up is missing the point - that they shouldn't be opening at this rate anyway. I have no clue where hampton is and I had never heard about it before checking this forum out...which in and of itself points to the problem.

I've been checking out the forum over the past couple of weeks and noticed something unreal. Students are being accepted into 'no name' schools with GPAs under 3.0 (not just on the cusp either, like 2.4-2.6 range) and PCATs in the 70s or below. That does not make me feel good about the future of my profession as a whole.

I know as well as everything that grades are not the only measure, but I am passionate about Pharmacy and I really feel as though certain standards should be upheld. Hell, I transferred into RU pharmacy school as a P3 with only about a 3.4 GPA - which is not the norm...so obviously there was something else about me that made the admissions comittee feel as though this was a good career for me. But let's face it, had that 3.4 been even a tiny but lower there's no way Rutgers would have even looked in my direction.

The more supply goes up for places in pharmacy schools, obviously, the quality of student (and, by extension, future pharmacists) goes down - there is no way you can argue that...it is a fact.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

Hell, I got in with a 3.27 overall...3.4 science...and I barely got in. There are seriously people getting in with 2.4s? Damn. 😱

 

[FAMUPharmD09]

Students are being accepted into 'no name' schools with GPAs under 3.0 (not just on the cusp either, like 2.4-2.6 range) and PCATs in the 70s or below

😱

 

[KuMzZ]

haha its funny how people consider themselves so smart because they do not attend "black school." the ACPE did not cite Hampton for its "dumb" students but because they have less faculty than required. I dont know how you guys figured out that the problem is that they let ppl in with 2.5 GPAs.
Hampton is not denying this accusation but just wants enough or at least a fair amount of time to hire new members which the ACPE denies to give. I mean seriously who would come work at your place if you were going to close down in six months? This leaves Hampton with no choice but to sue ACPE. I know that Hampton cited many black-schools in its lawsuit but Hampton does not want the government to give it free accreditation b/c its a black school but b/c it has established itself as a great pharmacy school since 2002 but now it gets a notice to be shutdown in 6 months if not able to hire new employees.
botton line: they want to hire new employees as the ACPE requires but the dead-line is impossible to meet.

 

[BMBiology]

haha its funny how people consider themselves so smart because they do not attend "black school." the ACPE did not cite

Get over yourself. This has nothing to do with Hampton students. Blame it on the Hampton administration for accepting more students than it can handle. Instead of wasting its money on lawsuits, why not put that money into hiring new faculty?

ACPE has strict student per faculty guidelines that is applied every pharmacy school. What is the point of having rules if they are going to make exceptions?

 

[WVUPharm2007]

haha its funny how people consider themselves so smart because they do not attend "black school." the ACPE did not cite Hampton for its "dumb" students but because they have less faculty than required. I dont know how you guys figured out that the problem is that they let ppl in with 2.5 GPAs.
Hampton is not denying this accusation but just wants enough or at least a fair amount of time to hire new members which the ACPE denies to give. I mean seriously who would come work at your place if you were going to close down in six months? This leaves Hampton with no choice but to sue ACPE. I know that Hampton cited many black-schools in its lawsuit but Hampton does not want the government to give it free accreditation b/c its a black school but b/c it has established itself as a great pharmacy school since 2002 but now it gets a notice to be shutdown in 6 months if not able to hire new employees.
botton line: they want to hire new employees as the ACPE requires but the dead-line is impossible to meet.

I think its just sad that they even brought it up in the first place. WTF does being a traditionally black school have to do with pharmacy accreditation? Nothing. Yet they sure as hell included that within their lawsuit filings against the ACPE. They need to stop using racist tactics in court. Either your school is legit or it isn't. If it is, cool...if it isn't, it isn't.

 

[KuMzZ]

I think its just sad that they even brought it up in the first place. WTF does being a traditionally black school have to do with pharmacy accreditation? Nothing. Yet they sure as hell included that within their lawsuit filings against the ACPE. They need to stop using racist tactics in court. Either your school is legit or it isn't. If it is, cool...if it isn't, it isn't.

trust me man...i completely understand what you mean. ACPE is for the good of our community and to ensure we get the best pharmacist serving patients.
but why do you look at it as if they are playing the racist card?
All the schools that they mentioned were black schools...YES its true... but what they are trying to get across is that given enough time they all were finally back on track on producing good pharmacists. Look at it socially man...you would only associate yourself with the same ppl that have same interest or background.
So from only mentioning black school they are not playing the racist card but are proving that they are similar to these schools and given enough time they CAN hire new employees and satisfy the requirements of the ACPE.
what bothered me most is that ppl thinking the problem was that they were accepting students who were not fit to be pharmacists.

 

[genesis09]

Side note, I know as a fact one of the ACPE reviewers for Hampton was black.

 

[Quiksilver]

BMBiology, do u have a personal vendetta against Hampton University students....Im a student in Hampton and have a fairly high GPA (3.86), 19 years old and fnished all pre-reqs in two year easily and scored over 83 % (92 chem, 90 biology) on all parts of the pcats last year, Might I add I was accepted to UB, and offered interviews at Purdue and Duquesne but chose Hampton because I completed my undergraduate work and enjoy being in the company of the students ...I wouldnt be surprised if I was more qualified to be enrolled in your school than you no matter what major u are. You saying that our school shouldnt be able to give out pharmd's is a huge problem to not only my career path but to the other 55 students in my P1 class. You should watch what say/type before your career is in the hands of a Hampton Unversity graduate because thats how funny life is. As for the school burning down remark from "pumpkinsmasher", u must look for the fire extinguisher everytime u step into a building.

Not to rain on your parade, this argument is not very good. Stats are irrelevant here, 1 student with good stats does not make a program awesome, and they unfortunately do not dictate where you or for that matter any of the graduates end your career either. Even in pharmacy school grades don't mean much. That being said, if you read the background of the case, you will see the issue is based on recruiting faculty, it certainly isn't a racial issue. It is not like they didn't know that this was an issue, its not like Hampton was blindsided with this ruling, there is a history where this has been an issue. Hampton is guilty on that regard. They know this is on going, and the importance in getting qualified faculty to come to their school.

ACPE is guilty in not setting specific numbers, that is true. More importantly they allow too many schools to be built, and then these schools then need to find qualified instructors. This is a hard thing to do as Hampton is experiencing. By limiting the number of schools, you don't have to worry about having to find pharmacists who aren't as qualified to teach in a program. Limit the number of schools, will limit the quantity of practitioners but will improve the quality no doubt.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

So from only mentioning black school they are not playing the racist card but are proving that they are similar to these schools and given enough time they CAN hire new employees and satisfy the requirements of the ACPE.
what bothered me most is that ppl thinking the problem was that they were accepting students who were not fit to be pharmacists.

Why not compare themselves to other schools that are in rocky patches right now? I just don't understand why the HBCUs are a unique category. It's a pharmacy school...I don't care about the demographics...either its in line with what the ACPE wants or it isn't.

 

[FAMUPharmD09]

Why not compare themselves to other schools that are in rocky patches right now? I just don't understand why the HBCUs are a unique category. It's a pharmacy school...I don't care about the demographics...either its in line with what the ACPE wants or it isn't.

There are 5 HBCU Pharmacy schools in the country. I think it is fair that they compare themselves to other HBCUs with similiar population size and resources just as it would be fair for any school in the ACC, BIG 10, BIG 12, BIG EAST, SEC etc. to compare themselves to similiar institutions. I honestly don't think it was the attempt of Hampton to make it a race issue, but to show that the length of probation was inappropriate. (I do agree however that if they were going list other schools that were on probation why not list them all, it might strengthen their arguement)

 

[WVUPharm2007]

There are 5 HBCU Pharmacy schools in the country. I think it is fair that they compare themselves to other HBCUs with similiar population size and resources just as it would be fair for any school in the ACC, BIG 10, BIG 12, BIG EAST, SEC etc. to compare themselves to similiar institutions. I honestly don't think it was the attempt of Hampton to make it a race issue, but to show that the length of probation was inappropriate. (I do agree however that if they were going list other schools that were on probation why not list them all, it might strengthen their arguement)

Uh...yeah...comparing pharmacy schools based upon which athletic conference their mother university plays under is even more insane than grouping then together based upon their status as a HBCU...

 

[FAMUPharmD09]

Uh...yeah...comparing pharmacy schools based upon which athletic conference their mother university plays under is even more insane than grouping then together based upon their status as a HBCU...

Why is it insane? You're missing the point, schools in the same conference have similar population sizes and resources, thus making it a better comparison. Hampton comparing itself to other HBCUs with similar stats is a fair comparison.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

Why is it insane? You're missing the point, schools in the same conference have similar population sizes and resources, thus making it a better comparison. Hampton comparing itself to other schools with similar stats is a fair comparison.

Yeah...I'll disagree and leave it at that...

 

[ValeRx]

You can't compare a black school with only other black schools, otherwise it doesn't hold any credibility. Compare that school with all other schools with the same student population, not based on race/ethnicity/creed,etc. It creates the impression that they are playing the race card.

 

[jvanewportnews]

So when Exavier was on probation and sued the ACPE, was it the same issue of not enough time to recruit faculty as with Hampton University?

btw I hope HU does keep it's accreditation but gets enough faculty members too so they can be running a 100% legit operation. I also agree that it can't compare itself with only black schools...especially seeing as it's ranked 3rd in the nation I think, but it should be compared with all pharmacy schools...

 

[aboveliquidice]

You can't compare a black school with only other black schools, otherwise it doesn't hold any credibility. Compare that school with all other schools with the same student population, not based on race/ethnicity/creed,etc. It creates the impression that they are playing the race card.

To be fair - with the exception of two schools... I do believe most of the recent probations have been given to historically black schools. It could just be a coincidence...

Everyone should read at least paragraph 30 - If it is true that ACPE has not defined an actual Faculty to student ratio - ACPE is without a doubt going to lose this fight. You cannot be an entity that holds people to standards if you do not define the standards.

I am placing my bet on Hampton ftw... and hoping they get their *hit together if they want to remain relevant.

~above~

 

[rxdoc2b]

So, I'm sorry to hear that some of you in this fourm are going to be doctors of some sort. Not just because of the spelling and grammatical errors, or the errors in tense (MY GOD MAN!) but more so the idiocy that I'm reading. I thought reading comprehension was part of the PCAT.....?

haha its funny how people consider themselves so smart because they do not attend "black school." the ACPE did not cite Hampton for its "dumb" students but because they have less faculty than required. I dont know how you guys figured out that the problem is that they let ppl in with 2.5 GPAs.

Who said anything about Black Students? Get off the race issue and try debating something without crying wolf.

Uh...yeah...comparing pharmacy schools based upon which athletic conference their mother university plays under is even more insane than grouping then together based upon their status as a HBCU...

Um, ok WVU guy, if you would please take the time to read the post once more, you would see that the individual you were replying to was using the sports analogy as, well, just that. He/she didn't say group them up because of their athletics program, but to use that sort of logic. Even though that idea is beyond horrible, your interpretation of it was even worse

So when Exavier was on [........] I also agree that it can't compare itself with only black schools...especially seeing as it's ranked 3rd in the nation I think, but it should be compared with all pharmacy schools...

3rd in the nation????? NO! it's ranked 3rd lowest, as the post earlier stated... Definitely NOT top 3..


Bottom line, ACPE gave HU probation because of the faculty size. Not because the students are dumb, not because they aren't learning as well (even though their pass rate sorta sucks), not because they are black. It's not the students fault, or the faculty's fault. It's the Dean's fault for not hiring or keeping teachers. End of story.

 

[Charlottefromca]

Um, ok WVU guy, if you would please take the time to read the post once more, you would see that the individual you were replying to was using the sports analogy as, well, just that. He/she didn't say group them up because of their athletics program, but to use that sort of logic. Even though that idea is beyond horrible, your interpretation of it was even worse

I did not get that analogy, if that was the poster's intent it was not clear at all.

And I don't get how you can play grammar police with that post of yours. 😕

Sorry you just hit my pet peeve....

 

[rxdoc2b]

I did not get that analogy, if that was the poster's intent it was not clear at all.

And I don't get how you can play grammar police with that post of yours.

Sorry you just hit my pet peeve....

I'm sorry you didn't understand. Let's look at the original post, with emphasis added:

There are 5 HBCU Pharmacy schools in the country. I think it is fair that they compare themselves to other HBCUs with similiar population size and resources just as it would be fair for any school [in the ACC, BIG 10, BIG 12, BIG EAST, SEC etc.] to compare themselves to similiar institutions. I honestly don't think it was the attempt of Hampton to make it a race issue, but to show that the length of probation was inappropriate. (I do agree however that if they were going list other schools that were on probation why not list them all, it might strengthen their arguement)

First, we'll examine the definition of "analogy" from dictionary.com, once again with emphasis added:

a⋅nal⋅o⋅gy
–noun, plural -gies.
1. a similarity between like features of two things, on which a comparison may be based: the analogy between the heart and a pump.
2. similarity or comparability: I see no analogy between your problem and mine.
3. Biology. an analogous relationship.
4. Linguistics. a. the process by which words or phrases are created or re-formed according to existing patterns in the language, as when shoon was re-formed as shoes, when -ize is added to nouns like winter to form verbs, or when a child says foots for feet.
b. a form resulting from such a process.

5. Logic. a form of reasoning in which one thing is inferred to be similar to another thing in a certain respect, on the basis of the known similarity between the things in other respects.

Synonyms:
1. comparison, likeness, resemblance, similitude, affinity. 2. correspondence.


So you see, the post was very clear. I hope this clears up any confusion. As to the part about my post vexing you with grammatical errors, to which errors were you refering to?

 

[WVUPharm2007]

I'm sorry you didn't understand. Let's look at the original post, with emphasis added:



First, we'll examine the definition of "analogy" from dictionary.com, once again with emphasis added:

a⋅nal⋅o⋅gy
–noun, plural -gies.
1. a similarity between like features of two things, on which a comparison may be based: the analogy between the heart and a pump.
2. similarity or comparability: I see no analogy between your problem and mine.
3. Biology. an analogous relationship.
4. Linguistics. a. the process by which words or phrases are created or re-formed according to existing patterns in the language, as when shoon was re-formed as shoes, when -ize is added to nouns like winter to form verbs, or when a child says foots for feet.
b. a form resulting from such a process.

5. Logic. a form of reasoning in which one thing is inferred to be similar to another thing in a certain respect, on the basis of the known similarity between the things in other respects.

Synonyms:
1. comparison, likeness, resemblance, similitude, affinity. 2. correspondence.


So you see, the post was very clear. I hope this clears up any confusion. As to the part about my post vexing you with grammatical errors, to which errors were you refering to?

Well, you see Mr. self proclaimed genius man....the way it was written implied that it's ok to compare schools that are all HCBUs as it is to compare schools that are all in the same athletic conference. Nothing about sports was mentioned. The way it was written, the reader would imply that he meant that it makes sense to compare, say, the schools of Sanford and Arizona State because they are in the same conference...and everyone knows that one is very prestigious...and the other isn't.

That's all I was saying.

 

[Farmercyst]

So, I'm sorry to hear that some of you in this fourm are going to be doctors of some sort. Not just because of the spelling and grammatical errors, or the errors in tense (MY GOD MAN!) but more so the idiocy that I'm reading. I thought reading comprehension was part of the PCAT.....?

Who said anything about Black Students? Get off the race issue and try debating something without crying wolf.

Um, ok WVU guy, if you would please take the time to read the post once more, you would see that the individual you were replying to was using the sports analogy as, well, just that. He/she didn't say group them up because of their athletics program, but to use that sort of logic. Even though that idea is beyond horrible, your interpretation of it was even worse

3rd in the nation????? NO! it's ranked 3rd lowest, as the post earlier stated... Definitely NOT top 3..


Bottom line, ACPE gave HU probation because of the faculty size. Not because the students are dumb, not because they aren't learning as well (even though their pass rate sorta sucks), not because they are black. It's not the students fault, or the faculty's fault. It's the Dean's fault for not hiring or keeping teachers. End of story.

I find it very suspicious that someone would regurgitate a 2 month old thread just to call out people for useless nonsense on his very first post and only belittle rather than actually contribute to the topic at hand.

Or perhaps we were supposed to glean something from the multi-quote rant.

 

[HUPharmDP4]

If you go to HUSOP you know it has issues. There were many problems with the ACPE site visit 3 years ago. Do you know when they began to work in those problems?...about 4 months before ACPE came back. Faculty aren't the only issue. Half of the school has been located in a shopping center across the street (w no crosswalk) for years. Ok, so the buildings are being put up slow.... but when the bathrooms are overflowing every 2 days because the shopping center wasnt meant to support 130+ people in it you begin to wonder where your $18,000+ a yr is going. Solution? "please use Burger King or The Chinese restaurant restrooms" Really?.... Whenever a big storm comes, we move the trash cans to catch the leaks. Computers... slowest ever. In a test against an Iphone it was lost in the dust everytime. Printers... no ink, broken.. oh and the day before came ACPE they added 2 1980"s printers to look like we had twice as many. So the facilities suck, you get the picture. But what really makes the students hate it to the point where we will never be proud alumni... everything is done at the last possible minute. Rotations were started to be scheduled mid-April to be begun in May. Many students still dont know where they are going for Blocks 2,3,4,5,6,7,8, and 9. When you show up on the first day, you have a decent chance that the school has given you the wrong rotation site and a "preceptor" is looking at you like who are you and what are you doing here? The list just goes on and on, and ACPE isnt stupid. They know these other things are going on. Im glad the school was put on probation. Maybe they will actually get their act together. Complaints from the students end have been ignored for years.

 

[powertoold]

So, I'm sorry to hear that some of you in this fourm are going to be doctors of some sort. Not just because of the spelling and grammatical errors, or the errors in tense (MY GOD MAN!) but more so the idiocy that I'm reading. I thought reading comprehension was part of the PCAT.....?

Who said anything about Black Students? Get off the race issue and try debating something without crying wolf.

Um, ok WVU guy, if you would please take the time to read the post once more, you would see that the individual you were replying to was using the sports analogy as, well, just that. He/she didn't say group them up because of their athletics program, but to use that sort of logic. Even though that idea is beyond horrible, your interpretation of it was even worse

3rd in the nation????? NO! it's ranked 3rd lowest, as the post earlier stated... Definitely NOT top 3..


Bottom line, ACPE gave HU probation because of the faculty size. Not because the students are dumb, not because they aren't learning as well (even though their pass rate sorta sucks), not because they are black. It's not the students fault, or the faculty's fault. It's the Dean's fault for not hiring or keeping teachers. End of story.

The bold font indicates bad grammar or wrong spelling. You can't complain about poor grammar with poor grammar. 😀