MA/MS Has a Non-APA Accredited Internship Impacted Your Employment Prospects/Licensure?

[PX1985]

Hello all,

Long time reader, first time poster!

I have recently read some posts on this forum regarding the decision to rank non-APA accredited sites during the match process. I've had one interview at a non-accredited site and was wondering what other peoples' experience was with attending non accredited sites. Has it hampered your employment prospects/licensure (as is suggested in multiple forum threads)? Has it affected the process of joining an insurance panel?

To help clarify, I am in New York (city) and I aspire to open a private practice at some point. My training director has discouraged us from ranking non-accredited sites because it might negatively impact our ability to become employed in certain institutions.

Any thoughts from those who have gone through the process?

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[pediatric_psydoc]

I would strongly advise against ranking any non-APA site above an APA site. I attended an APA site that I was not too excited about at the time. Internship is only a year of your life. However, the label of “APA accredited” sticks with you during your career. When I became licensed in a midwestern state, I had no issue with the state accepting the hours earned at my internship because it was APA accredited. There were statements suggesting that if a candidate for licensure attended a non-APA site, the hours were under a lot more scrutiny and the licensure process actually takes longer due to the committee having to take such a close look at the quality of training. The quality of my training at internship was not questioned during the licensure process due to the fact it took place at an APA accredited site.

I am a pediatric psychologist and I very much wanted to do internship at a children’s medical hospital. Unfortunately my only interview at a children’s medical hospital was at a then-unaccredited site (it has since earned APA accreditation but it ended up being the year after I completed internship). The site seemed great but I had to rank it lowest due to the lack of accreditation. I ended up matching at an APA accredited inpatient psychiatric hospital and I was able to make arrangements so I worked only on the children and adolescent units during my year there; so I did get a child clinical internship. I don’t regret my choice in ranking; in fact, the TD later hired me as a postdoc at a pediatric integrative clinic that he was starting affiliated with an AMC about two hours away and then as a licensed psychologist at the same clinic. Now I run the behavioral health clinic within the pediatric primary care clinic; I am the only psychologist in the building, I have my name on the front doors with those of the pediatricians, and I have a great deal of autonomy. And yes, my internship TD is technically my boss still

Point is, internship is what you make it (to some extent) and you don’t know the positive outcomes that may occur as a result of your ranking and subsequent match. It got me the postdoc and on the trajectory for the post licensure career I wanted.

Also, I agree with your TD in that a lot of employers do not consider psychologists who interned at non-accredited sites. I hear that NY licensure is one of the more difficult due to the requirements but I can’t attest to it personally. It is also of note that attending a non-accredited internship will close the door forever in regards to employment by a VA.

 

[psych.meout]

This reminds me a bit of the other recent thread about leaving internship early without the permission of the supervisors and APPIC. I get that there are many factors involved in internship (e.g., moving costs, quality and relationships with supervisors, being separated from friends and family), but the exorbitant costs of attending an unaccredited internship, or leaving internship early and being unable to obtain another, far outweigh the benefits. Regardless of your aspirations of going into private practice, it would be awful to forever be locked out of many other employers. It's easy to say that it doesn't matter if your internship is accredited, because you're so committed to PP in that specific area and it wouldn't be expressly required for your aspirations, but it's impossible to see into the future. I've known providers from different disciplines who were set to be in their own PPs for their whole careers, but who ended up working for AMCs, VAs, health networks, and other large organizations for various reasons. They wouldn't have been able to make these transitions if their training deviated from the standards of their respective fields.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Now that internships are easier to attain, I can't see a reason to risk am unacred site. It's a no upside, all downside setup. As a hiring person, unacred. aren't even considered. There are enough apps from APA programs and APA internships, so I don't have to roll the dice with anyone else.

 

[psyche27]

Now that internships are easier to attain, I can't see a reason to risk am unacred site. It's a no upside, all downside setup. As a hiring person, unacred. aren't even considered. There are enough apps from APA programs and APA internships, so I don't have to roll the dice with anyone else.

Especially now that sites can get accredited on contingency too which = full accreditation they just need to collect outcome data.

 

[PX1985]

I would strongly advise against ranking any non-APA site above an APA site. I attended an APA site that I was not too excited about at the time. Internship is only a year of your life. However, the label of “APA accredited” sticks with you during your career. When I became licensed in a midwestern state, I had no issue with the state accepting the hours earned at my internship because it was APA accredited. There were statements suggesting that if a candidate for licensure attended a non-APA site, the hours were under a lot more scrutiny and the licensure process actually takes longer due to the committee having to take such a close look at the quality of training. The quality of my training at internship was not questioned during the licensure process due to the fact it took place at an APA accredited site.

I am a pediatric psychologist and I very much wanted to do internship at a children’s medical hospital. Unfortunately my only interview at a children’s medical hospital was at a then-unaccredited site (it has since earned APA accreditation but it ended up being the year after I completed internship). The site seemed great but I had to rank it lowest due to the lack of accreditation. I ended up matching at an APA accredited inpatient psychiatric hospital and I was able to make arrangements so I worked only on the children and adolescent units during my year there; so I did get a child clinical internship. I don’t regret my choice in ranking; in fact, the TD later hired me as a postdoc at a pediatric integrative clinic that he was starting affiliated with an AMC about two hours away and then as a licensed psychologist at the same clinic. Now I run the behavioral health clinic within the pediatric primary care clinic; I am the only psychologist in the building, I have my name on the front doors with those of the pediatricians, and I have a great deal of autonomy. And yes, my internship TD is technically my boss still

Point is, internship is what you make it (to some extent) and you don’t know the positive outcomes that may occur as a result of your ranking and subsequent match. It got me the postdoc and on the trajectory for the post licensure career I wanted.

Also, I agree with your TD in that a lot of employers do not consider psychologists who interned at non-accredited sites. I hear that NY licensure is one of the more difficult due to the requirements but I can’t attest to it personally. It is also of note that attending a non-accredited internship will close the door forever in regards to employment by a VA.

This reminds me a bit of the other recent thread about leaving internship early without the permission of the supervisors and APPIC. I get that there are many factors involved in internship (e.g., moving costs, quality and relationships with supervisors, being separated from friends and family), but the exorbitant costs of attending an unaccredited internship, or leaving internship early and being unable to obtain another, far outweigh the benefits. Regardless of your aspirations of going into private practice, it would be awful to forever be locked out of many other employers. It's easy to say that it doesn't matter if your internship is accredited, because you're so committed to PP in that specific area and it wouldn't be expressly required for your aspirations, but it's impossible to see into the future. I've known providers from different disciplines who were set to be in their own PPs for their whole careers, but who ended up working for AMCs, VAs, health networks, and other large organizations for various reasons. They wouldn't have been able to make these transitions if their training deviated from the standards of their respective fields.

Thank you both for your replies. As it stands, I might not even rank the unacred sites, despite me really enjoying the interviews. I cannot say for certain where I will end up, or how I will get there, but wouldn't want to preemptively close doors that have yet to open.

Would still like to hear from anyone who has gone through the process of attending non-accredited internships to see how they fared.

 

[ExecutiveDysfunction]

Would still like to hear from anyone who has gone through the process of attending non-accredited internships to see how they fared.

I imagine you won’t get many responses on here for people from non-accredited internships. I know of a few people I’ve come across that did the non-accredited route. They have jobs, private practice and/or university counseling centers. But as others have said, the latter is even unlikely especially at this point given the number of accredited sites and employers that require accreditation to even be considered.

Theoretically, if you work at an unaccredited internship at a VA, you can still have a VA career. But you will likely have limited flexibility for your career, and there’s no guarantee you won’t be passed over for other people with accredited internships, even if the job will consider you. With the bar being low for even accredited-on-contingency sites, you’re only hurting your future flexibility.

Long story short, you’re better off taking something accredited even if it’s not ideal. You’d only be selling yourself short. Worst case scenario, I know of people who have reapplied the following year.

 

[Seven_Costanza]

Thank you both for your replies. As it stands, I might not even rank the unacred sites, despite me really enjoying the interviews. I cannot say for certain where I will end up, or how I will get there, but wouldn't want to preemptively close doors that have yet to open.

Would still like to hear from anyone who has gone through the process of attending non-accredited internships to see how they fared.

Seriously, don’t do this. You won’t be able to take it back. You have so many better options. There’s Phase II, there’s post-match, and there’s next year if those don’t work out for you. I’ve had friends who’ve matched in Phase II and in the post-match and both were very grateful for their internship experiences. Don’t rank the site. It’ll likely end up being a major regret of yours if you end up matching there.

 

[deleted1003601]

Hello all,

Long time reader, first time poster!

I have recently read some posts on this forum regarding the decision to rank non-APA accredited sites during the match process. I've had one interview at a non-accredited site and was wondering what other peoples' experience was with attending non accredited sites. Has it hampered your employment prospects/licensure (as is suggested in multiple forum threads)? Has it affected the process of joining an insurance panel?

To help clarify, I am in New York (city) and I aspire to open a private practice at some point. My training director has discouraged us from ranking non-accredited sites because it might negatively impact our ability to become employed in certain institutions.

Any thoughts from those who have gone through the process?

DON'T....just DON'T.

 

[Justanothergrad]

In the age of sites being unfilled as frequently as they are, it would look very strange to many for you to opt for an unaccredited site. Heck, phase 2 has consistently had great programs open at increasing rates during the past years, including Brown, UNC, Minneapolis VA, etc. I can't think of a reason to do this. The cons and potential problems so far outweigh the positives here that there is not a good reason to go further down this line of thinking.

Certainly there are cases of folks who have gone to unaccredited and achieved their career goals. There will be more who have had to adapt their goals or who have had to go through additional work because of this choice. This is simply the nature of employment eligibility preference (e.g., VA, AMCs, etc) and licensure verification.

 

[PX1985]

DON'T....just DON'T.

Not helpful.

I imagine you won’t get many responses on here for people from non-accredited internships. I know of a few people I’ve come across that did the non-accredited route. They have jobs, private practice and/or university counseling centers. But as others have said, the latter is even unlikely especially at this point given the number of accredited sites and employers that require accreditation to even be considered.

Theoretically, if you work at an unaccredited internship at a VA, you can still have a VA career. But you will likely have limited flexibility for your career, and there’s no guarantee you won’t be passed over for other people with accredited internships, even if the job will consider you. With the bar being low for even accredited-on-contingency sites, you’re only hurting your future flexibility.

Long story short, you’re better off taking something accredited even if it’s not ideal. You’d only be selling yourself short. Worst case scenario, I know of people who have reapplied the following year.

Yeah, at this point I have heard enough people singing the same song to inform my decision. Likely wont even rank unacred sites during Phase I (even if it lessens my chances of matching). Thank you for the feedback!

 

[deleted1003601]

Not helpful.



Yeah, at this point I have heard enough people singing the same song to inform my decision. Likely wont even rank unacred sites during Phase I (even if it lessens my chances of matching). Thank you for the feedback!

I figured it would be helpful. Everything that needed to be said has been said by previous posters. Don't want to re-invent the wheel here. Goodluck.

 

[WisNeuro]

Just to pile on, the 3 largest hospital systems in this state, which account for the vast majority of institutional patient care, will not hire psychologists from unaccredited internships.