High stat applicant with no interview invites, just rejections/holds in November

[AlejandroRojas]

Hey everyone,

I'm looking for some guidance on how I should proceed at this point in the cycle. I'm a white male with a LizzyM score of 78 (3.89/522), disadvantaged applicant (grew up poor, single mother physically and mentally ill, full-time job since age 13) with a full-time (40+hr/wk) job in college (medical scribe/trainer/chief scribe), no community service whatsoever during college (but started a pre-med club on campus, organized a community service project, and volunteering as a mentor/tutor at local high schools since graduation), no publications but several semesters of lab research and a few poster presentations. I applied to the following schools, submitting secondaries on the dates given.

1. Jefferson University: 8/3
2. University of Michigan: 8/8
3. Emory University: 8/10
4. University of Maryland: 8/13
5. University of Pittsburgh: 8/16
6. University of North Carolina: 8/15
7. Brown University: 8/18
8. Harvard University: 8/21
9. University of Virginia: 8/21
10. Dartmouth University: 8/24
11. University of Connecticut: 8/27

At this point, I've been rejected from Pitt and put on pre-II hold at Maryland (my in-state school). I'm starting to get worried about whether there may be a red flag in my application. I talked to my adviser and he said my letters of recommendation were "glowing," and all were from people whom I worked with closely for several years. My questions at this point are:

1. Is it late enough that I should not expect any interview invites to come?
2. Given that my in-state school put me on hold, does that mean that other schools will probably all shut me down as well? Or is it possible that I just didn't fit their mission, and I still have a chance?
3. Should I be worried about a red flag in my application? Or is it safe to assume that there isn't a red flag there given that Maryland put me on hold rather than rejecting me as they have for many other applicants this cycle.

Disclaimer: I know this is totally pathetic, but I would really appreciate some advice because I'm going crazy from the lack of good news.

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[Goro]

Hey everyone,

I'm looking for some guidance on how I should proceed at this point in the cycle. I'm a white male with a LizzyM score of 78 (3.89/522), disadvantaged applicant (grew up poor, single mother physically and mentally ill, full-time job since age 13) with a full-time (40+hr/wk) job in college (medical scribe/trainer/chief scribe), no community service whatsoever during college (but started a pre-med club on campus, organized a community service project, and volunteering as a mentor/tutor at local high schools since graduation), no publications but several semesters of lab research and a few poster presentations. I applied to the following schools, submitting secondaries on the dates given.

1. Jefferson University: 8/3
2. University of Michigan: 8/8
3. Emory University: 8/10
4. University of Maryland: 8/13
5. University of Pittsburgh: 8/16
6. University of North Carolina: 8/15
7. Brown University: 8/18
8. Harvard University: 8/21
9. University of Virginia: 8/21
10. Dartmouth University: 8/24
11. University of Connecticut: 8/27

At this point, I've been rejected from Pitt and put on pre-II hold at Maryland (my in-state school). I'm starting to get worried about whether there may be a red flag in my application. I talked to my adviser and he said my letters of recommendation were "glowing," and all were from people whom I worked with closely for several years. My questions at this point are:

1. Is it late enough that I should not expect any interview invites to come?
2. Given that my in-state school put me on hold, does that mean that other schools will probably all shut me down as well? Or is it possible that I just didn't fit their mission, and I still have a chance?
3. Should I be worried about a red flag in my application? Or is it safe to assume that there isn't a red flag there given that Maryland put me on hold rather than rejecting me as they have for many other applicants this cycle.

Disclaimer: I know this is totally pathetic, but I would really appreciate some advice because I'm going crazy from the lack of good news.

You might get an II on Monday, or in March. Patience is a virtue.

Your chances are always best with your state school.

I think instead of worrying about a red flag, you should at least reconsider your essays.

 

[NYCVillain]

How do you say you don’t have community service but then list community service activities like starting a service club/mentoring young kids.... also just be patient. The application season hasn’t end yet and you finished all your apps in August. Just be patient man you’ll get some interviews

 

[Ultimakey]

How do you say you don’t have community service but then list community service activities like starting a service club/mentoring young kids.... also just be patient. The application season hasn’t end yet and you finished all your apps in August. Just be patient man you’ll get some interviews

He said no community service during college, he has been doing community service after graduation.

 

[NYCVillain]

He said no community service during college, he has been doing community service after graduation.

Ah yes I now see why my CARS was my lowest section on the MCAT

 

[ciestar]

UConn, UNC, and Brown (unless you attended their UG) were major longshots to begin with, which doesnt help.

Is your research experience the type that the top guys are looking for? They’re powerhouses for a reason.

 

[AlejandroRojas]

You might get an II on Monday, or in March. Patience is a virtue.

Your chances are always best with your state school.

I think instead of worrying about a red flag, you should at least reconsider your essays.

Thanks for the advice. I am certainly not the best writer, and while I don't see anything overtly off-putting in my essays, my PS certainly wasn't the best.

 

[AlejandroRojas]

UConn, UNC, and Brown (unless you attended their UG) were major longshots to begin with, which doesnt help.

Is your research experience the type that the top guys are looking for? They’re powerhouses for a reason.

I'm not really sure what they are looking for, but I had a couple semesters in organic synthesis research and a few independent literature review projects.

So probably not.

 

[AlejandroRojas]

And the fact the OP has no community service whatsoever in college. Needs to get some and skip a cycle

When you say skip a cycle, do you mean reapply next cycle with more volunteering/community service under my belt?

 

[MyOdyssey]

UConn, UNC, and Brown (unless you attended their UG) were major longshots to begin with, which doesnt help.

Is your research experience the type that the top guys are looking for? They’re powerhouses for a reason.

Why are UConn and UNC long shots? Because they heavily favor instate?

To the OP, I feel you have a very short list of schools.

@Goro @gonnif Is the OP being yield protected out of schools like Emory and U Maryland?

 

[Goro]

Why are UConn and UNC long shots? Because they heavily favor instate?

To the OP, I feel you have a very short list of schools.

@Goro @gonnif Is the OP being yield protected out of schools like Emory and U Maryland?

Yes to the bolded.
If OP is an MD resident, no, and definitely not resource protected at Emory.

OP's issues are probably in his/her app. NOTE: I am certainly not the best writer, and while I don't see anything overtly off-putting in my essays, my PS certainly wasn't the best.

 

[puahate]

Your school list kinda bad tbh

 

[Pharaoh95]

Your school list kinda bad tbh

This is an understatement.

 

[AlejandroRojas]

This is an understatement.

How should I improve for next cycle? I honestly ran out of money, and was getting to the point where I was just submitting as many secondaries as I could every two weeks when my check dropped. My adviser told me my list was totally fine and that I didn't need to apply to more schools than I did........looking back I should have asked around on here sooner.

 

[Goro]

How should I improve for next cycle? I honestly ran out of money, and was getting to the point where I was just submitting as many secondaries as I could every two weeks when my check dropped. My adviser told me my list was totally fine and that I didn't need to apply to more schools than I did........looking back I should have asked around on here sooner.

I suggest the following, but only after you save up enough money to apply to 20-25 schools. You can pre-write secondaries in order to save time. Get in over 200 hrs of service to others less fortunate than yourself as well.

Rewrite all essays and have multiple eyeballs vet them.

And stop listening to your advisor.

NYU
Vanderbilt
WashU
Yale
JHU
Northwestern
U Chicago
U Penn
Columbia
Duke
Harvard
Sinai
Cornell
Stanford
U MI
U VA
BU
Case
Mayo
Pitt
UCSD,
UCSF
Hofstra
Ohio State
U Cincy
USC/Keck
USF Morsani
Albert Einstein
Dartmouth
Emory
Rochester
Jefferson
Miami
U IA
U VM
Western MI
Your state school

 

[MyOdyssey]

Some thoughts assuming the OP wants to/needs to reapply:

1. Does Johns Hopkins favor Maryland natives? I've seen Hopkins' published list of matriculants and it's very skewed toward Johns Hopkins undergrads and U of Maryland undergrads as well as toward the usual high end undergrad suspects.

2. The OP's research productivity might not be up to par at the research heavy T20s in that he doesn't have publications, presentations, etc.

 

[AlejandroRojas]

^^This. That school list is...something. It seems to me to be a very short and very top-heavy list. You are a great applicant but great applicants get rejected from those schools all. the. time. You have a ton of schools in Michigan where you have a great shot (Michigan State, Wayne State, OUWB depending on how much community service you have, maybe Central or Western MI), which would be fine options - is there any particular reason you didn't apply to those? Or other OOS private schools that are less competitive maybe?

I'll defer to adcoms who will know more about your chances at this point, but if you can spare the cash and it's not past the due date I might consider tossing your app in at some of those places if you are desperate to avoid another cycle. It's very very late in the cycle and chances are very low but with your stats they might give you a look.

Thanks for replying. I realize I screwed up pretty badly on my list. I didn't do enough research and I just took what my adviser said without thinking about it. Can anyone weigh in regarding what schools I may still have a chance at if I apply now? I'm a Maryland resident.

 

[efle]

It's your school list. Short, full of pretty low yield state schools. If you had applied to 15-20 out of the top ~30 ranked schools you'd have several interviews right now.

 

[AlejandroRojas]

It's your school list. Short, full of pretty low yield state schools. If you had applied to 15-20 out of the top ~30 ranked schools you'd have several interviews right now.

Thanks for the advice.

Many medical schools offer specific pages of advice for reapplicants, something I find few students look into. This would be true whether or not you are a specific reapplicant to that school. Below are links to a few and please note most say the
most common mistake among reapplicants is applying again too soon

Should I do a Masters in my gap year / WAMC / advice please

University of Miami Miller School of Medicine
Reapplicants - Miller School of Medicine Admissions
Roughly 20% of the students who apply to the University of Miami Miller School of Medicine in any given year are reapplicants. Data that we have collected indicate they have a lower acceptance rate than do first time applicants

University of Wisconsin School of Medicine and Public Heath
http://www.med.wisc.edu/education/md/admissions/reapplying/31716
(emphasis in the original)
There should be significant improvements in your application before reapplying. This might mean not reapplying the very next year. The most common error made by reapplicants is that they submit their next application too soon.

The Ohio State University College of Medicine
The Ohio State University College of Medicine - Tips & Advice
To maximize the chances of giving off this perception, you must allow enough time before reapplying. This will undoubtedly be the hardest part of the process, but be patient; if you rush it, you may join the ranks of those who are applying for a third time.

University of Minnesota Medical School
Re-Applicant
Though you can submit a second application immediately after your first application, you may want to consider waiting a year if you feel you need more experiences that help you demonstrate the essential and desired qualities of an ideal medical student.

University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill
Reapplicants | Office of Admissions
http://www.med.unc.edu/admit/requirements/our-ideal-candidate/selection-criteria

Virginia Tech Carilion School of Medicine
http://medicine.vtc.vt.edu/admissions/re-applicants/

LSU Health Shreveport
Re-Applicants

University of Missouri
http://medicine.missouri.edu/admissions/nontraditional.html

East Carolina University, Brody School of Medicine
whatif

Texas College of Osteopathic Medicine (UNTHSC)
https://www.unthsc.edu/texas-colleg...ants-home/common-mistakes-made-by-applicants/

Michigan State University College of Osteopathic Medicine
http://www.com.msu.edu/Admissions/Guidelines_For_Success/Reapplication.htm

Thanks for the advice. Do you feel that it is necessary for me to wait a year before reapplying? If the problem is that I didn't apply to enough schools or the right schools, in addition to lack of community service and less-than-stellar written materials, then is there any reason to think that I can't get in next year if I get a large amount of meaningful community service (with LORs from supervisors), improve my essays, and apply early to all the right schools? I know it's competitive, but it has to mean something that I have over ten thousand hours spent in a clinical setting plus a 4.0 sGPA and a 522, right? Especially given that I worked full-time during college. I know people who have truly mediocre scores and maybe 1/20th the clinical experience I have, with no research whatsoever who have gotten interviews. This isn't me trying to tell you I know better, just an honest question about whether you think it's really necessary to wait any longer given that I already fixed/am working on fixing a lot of the major problems with my application.

 

[AlejandroRojas]

I suggest the following, but only after you save up enough money to apply to 20-254 schools. You can pre-write secondaries in order to save time. Get in over 200 hrs of service to others less fortunate than yourself as well.

Rewrite all essays and have multiple eyeballs vet them.

And stop listening to your advisor.

NYU
Vanderbilt
WashU
Yale
JHU
Northwestern
U Chicago
U Penn
Columbia
Duke
Harvard
Sinai
Cornell
Stanford
U MI
U VA
BU
Case
Mayo
Pitt
UCSD,
UCSF
Hofstra
Ohio State
U Cincy
USC/Keck
USF Morsani
Albert Einstein
Dartmouth
Emory
Rochester
Jefferson
Miami
U IA
U VM
Western MI
Your state school

Thanks for the advice; I definitely won't be listening to my advisor anymore. Do you feel that I should still be applying to all the research powerhouses given that I want to go into family medicine? Does that change anything about which schools I should apply to, or where I would be most competitive?

 

[efle]

^ I also saw people with 3.8/38+ and weak ECs that still got half a dozen interviews from the high ranked private schools. I really think the issue is that half the places on your list are going to yield protect against you and that leaves only 4-5 schools you're a match for, way too few.

I think you'll still get a couple interviews this cycle, but if you don't have luck, all you need to do in my opinion is reapply to a longer school list of mostly top ranked programs. There's a bunch of stats-focused places, e.g. WashU, NYU, U Chicago, Northwestern, Vandy, and Case, that are a sure bet for at least a couple interviews. Add another dozen of the ~25-30 schools that maintain the highest MCAT ranges and you should have plenty of IIs

 

[AlejandroRojas]

^ I also saw people with 3.8/38+ and weak ECs that still got half a dozen interviews from the high ranked private schools. I really think the issue is that half the places on your list are going to yield protect against you and that leaves only 4-5 schools you're a match for, way too few.

I think you'll still get a couple interviews this cycle, but if you don't have luck, all you need to do in my opinion is reapply to a longer school list of mostly top ranked programs. There's a bunch of stats-focused places, e.g. WashU, NYU, U Chicago, Northwestern, Vandy, and Case, that are a sure bet for at least a couple interviews. Add another dozen of the ~25-30 schools that maintain the highest MCAT ranges and you should have plenty of IIs

I really hope I get interviews, but I'm trying not to build myself up too much in case I don't. I'm really kicking myself over not applying to more schools. So you think my chances are actually better at a school with an average MCAT that's close to mine? As opposed to a place where I'm 5 points above the 90th percentile?

 

[efle]

I really hope I get interviews, but I'm trying not to build myself up too much in case I don't. I'm really kicking myself over not applying to more schools. So you think my chances are actually better at a school with an average MCAT that's close to mine? As opposed to a place where I'm 5 points above the 90th percentile?

Often times, yes. A place like U Connecticut with a 513 average isn't likely to spend an interview slot on someone from a different state with stats way above their medians - its too likely to be a wasted slot because you'd end up matriculating elsewhere. That's called "yield protection," they want to spend their interviews on people they can likely enroll.

Compare to a place like Wash U, that interviews a huge chunk of their applicants (~30%) and maintains an MCAT median in the top 1-2%. High stats is primarily how they decide who to interview. You are much more likely to be worth an interview spot to them.

 

[Goro]

Do you feel that I should still be applying to all the research powerhouses given that I want to go into family medicine? Does that change anything about which schools I should apply to, or where I would be most competitive?

As you can always change your mind, I'd leave the Powerhouses still on the table.

 

[Goro]

Thanks for the advice.

Thanks for the advice. Do you feel that it is necessary for me to wait a year before reapplying? If the problem is that I didn't apply to enough schools or the right schools, in addition to lack of community service and less-than-stellar written materials, then is there any reason to think that I can't get in next year if I get a large amount of meaningful community service (with LORs from supervisors), improve my essays, and apply early to all the right schools? I know it's competitive, but it has to mean something that I have over ten thousand hours spent in a clinical setting plus a 4.0 sGPA and a 522, right? Especially given that I worked full-time during college. I know people who have truly mediocre scores and maybe 1/20th the clinical experience I have, with no research whatsoever who have gotten interviews. This isn't me trying to tell you I know better, just an honest question about whether you think it's really necessary to wait any longer given that I already fixed/am working on fixing a lot of the major problems with my application.

Alex, the med schools themselves are telling you to wait a year and apply with the best possible app!

 

[AlejandroRojas]

Alex, the med schools themselves are telling you to wait a year and apply with the best possible app!

Sorry, would you please clarify what you mean by this?

 

[Ultimakey]

Sorry, would you please clarify what you mean by this?

I think that he’s trying to say that by not even sending you an interview invite (and no rejection either), they’re trying to make you realize that you can potentially enter their schools if you add a bit more to your application. The ones they reject instantly don’t have too much of a chance, even if they beef up their app a bit and reapply next cycle. They’re clearly spending time with your app, it’s just lacking a bit so the decision is tough.

 

[Goro]

Sorry, would you please clarify what you mean by this?

Did you bother to read gonnif's posts above????

 

[Ultimakey]

Did you bother to read gonnif's posts above????

I think he was just confused on the part where you said the med schools are telling him what to do.

 

[AlejandroRojas]

Did you bother to read gonnif's posts above????

Yes, of course! I just wanted to clarify what you meant when you said the med schools are telling me to wait a year before reapplying. I saw the quotes from the schools saying you MAY want to consider waiting a year but I didn't assume that applies to everyone. I didn't have community service in college but I've been volunteering a lot since graduating so in my mind if I reapply next year I will already have a large amount of meaningful volunteer experience. I'm just trying to make sure I fully understand your advice so that I can follow it.

 

[AlejandroRojas]

A few thoughts:
-Most adcoms look for LOR from academic settings: instructors, PI, and for nontrads who are employed, work supervisors
-With your high GPA/MCAT and research, but relatively little community service or other EC, you may have been seen as an academic "geek" implying lower social activity and lower people skills
-Your application from EC's (which are most important) to PS (least important) to secondaries must be able show your background well with all you went thru. Not only should this theme be present, it should interconnect at least in part through all these narratives to show what you have overcome to be a top student
-Your school list is so skewed and needs to be addressed
-can you apply for AMCAS Fee assistance

-So you need to add community service especially to disadvantage and underserved
-target schools now
-research these school fully so you can focus your story thru issues/factors that seem important to the school
-start looking at secondary prompts for this year to the new school list and start writing them early next year

This is very helpful. I think I could have done a better job tying my personal narrative into all my essays. I've been pursuing volunteer work that is related to my background (patient education, mentoring underprivileged kids with bad family situations, etc) so that will provide good material for my essays. I'm going to get started on the essay rewrites ASAP.

 

[AlejandroRojas]

Often times, yes. A place like U Connecticut with a 513 average isn't likely to spend an interview slot on someone from a different state with stats way above their medians - its too likely to be a wasted slot because you'd end up matriculating elsewhere. That's called "yield protection," they want to spend their interviews on people they can likely enroll.

Compare to a place like Wash U, that interviews a huge chunk of their applicants (~30%) and maintains an MCAT median in the top 1-2%. High stats is primarily how they decide who to interview. You are much more likely to be worth an interview spot to them.

Wow, I mean I understand why schools would do that, but it's just kind of funny to think of a school being worried that I would CHOOSE not to go there when in reality I would be so incredibly thrilled just to interview at any of the schools I applied to.

 

[MyOdyssey]

Many of my high stat reapplicants have this problem: poor school list way below target

@gonnif

Please define "high stat" in the context of those who don't aim high enough in their school lists.

 

[AlejandroRojas]

Hey, sorry to bring back a dead thread. I'm thinking of sending an update letter to all my schools, and I'm hoping to get some feedback on whether my recent activities are significant enough to warrant sending an update letter. I am also curious as to whether these update letters actually have the potential to yield an interview invite. Here's what I've been doing:

-Running with volunteer rescue squad x 3 months; currently enrolled in EMT-B class.
-Running with volunteer fire department x2 months; finished basic firefighter training, and will be enrolling in a more advanced training class in January that will lead to a national certification.
-Mentoring/tutoring at local high school alongside other pre-med club members; I'm working on paperwork to establish a formal mentorship program where students at the high school will be able to be paired with a college student mentor, but this isn't official yet so I probably won't mention it
-Volunteering with Communities in Schools once a week x 2 months (mentoring and tutoring at high school in very low-income urban community)
-Volunteering in special education classroom three times a week x3 months (helping teach organizational skills/coping skills to 3rd/4th/5th graders, and assisting in the classroom)
-Recently started volunteering at nearby homeless shelter close to the ED where I work; I will be working as a mentor.


Please let me know what you think!

 

[AlejandroRojas]

You need to show accumulation of hours, not simply starting all these activities. Indeed, starting too many activities and then updating can be seen as scattered and doing so only for how it will appear to admissions.

-getting certified in EMT and fire fighting are not the important piece; it is actually volunteering that matters. Are the rescue and fire squad 2 separate organizations?
-assisting in schools ok but again seem scattered across multiple organizations
-homeless shelter is new opportunity and few hours

You dont have enough completed hours to update. You make simply look pandering and desperate

Is there a better way for me to present this information in a way that will be looked upon favorably by an admissions committee? To clarify, I do have almost 200 hours in the special ed classroom, and more than that with the rescue squad/fire department (which are two different organizations). I have been volunteering at the local high school since August, with a significant time commitment there as well. I understand that I have volunteered at several different schools, but it's not like I haven't been doing the work and learning from it. At what point can I say I have enough hours? To be honest it's kind of disappointing to hear because I've been doing volunteer work almost every single day since I graduated college, and it's hard to hear that that means nothing to an admissions committee. I don't know what to do at this point - do I just give up, keep doing what I'm doing, and reapply next cycle with these activities on my application? Because if what you're saying is true, then won't it just look scattered when I reapply?

Also, I totally understand about the volunteering at the homeless shelter; it's too new to be meaningful.

 

[raiderette]

I think an update to your state school would be possible with your community service. They may review your app again and realize that you have genuine interest in the school.

 

[MyOdyssey]

Is there a better way for me to present this information in a way that will be looked upon favorably by an admissions committee? To clarify, I do have almost 200 hours in the special ed classroom, and more than that with the rescue squad/fire department (which are two different organizations). I have been volunteering at the local high school since August, with a significant time commitment there as well. I understand that I have volunteered at several different schools, but it's not like I haven't been doing the work and learning from it. At what point can I say I have enough hours? To be honest it's kind of disappointing to hear because I've been doing volunteer work almost every single day since I graduated college, and it's hard to hear that that means nothing to an admissions committee. I don't know what to do at this point - do I just give up, keep doing what I'm doing, and reapply next cycle with these activities on my application? Because if what you're saying is true, then won't it just look scattered when I reapply?

Also, I totally understand about the volunteering at the homeless shelter; it's too new to be meaningful.

Hey, sorry to bring back a dead thread. I'm thinking of sending an update letter to all my schools, and I'm hoping to get some feedback on whether my recent activities are significant enough to warrant sending an update letter. I am also curious as to whether these update letters actually have the potential to yield an interview invite. Here's what I've been doing:

-Running with volunteer rescue squad x 3 months; currently enrolled in EMT-B class.
-Running with volunteer fire department x2 months; finished basic firefighter training, and will be enrolling in a more advanced training class in January that will lead to a national certification.
-Mentoring/tutoring at local high school alongside other pre-med club members; I'm working on paperwork to establish a formal mentorship program where students at the high school will be able to be paired with a college student mentor, but this isn't official yet so I probably won't mention it
-Volunteering with Communities in Schools once a week x 2 months (mentoring and tutoring at high school in very low-income urban community)
-Volunteering in special education classroom three times a week x3 months (helping teach organizational skills/coping skills to 3rd/4th/5th graders, and assisting in the classroom)
-Recently started volunteering at nearby homeless shelter close to the ED where I work; I will be working as a mentor.


Please let me know what you think!

How much of this did you already report on your submitted application?

Specifically, how many hours for each did you report on your submitted application?

 

[AlejandroRojas]

Is there a better way for me to present this information in a way that will be looked upon favorably by an admissions committee? To clarify, I do have almost 200 hours in the special ed classroom, and more than that with the rescue squad/fire department (which are two different organizations). I have been volunteering at the local high school since August, with a significant time commitment there as well. I understand that I have volunteered at several different schools, but it's not like I haven't been doing the work and learning from it. At what point can I say I have enough hours? To be honest it's kind of disappointing to hear because I've been doing volunteer work almost every single day since I graduated college, and it's hard to hear that that means nothing to an admissions committee. I don't know what to do at this point - do I just give up, keep doing what I'm doing, and reapply next cycle with these activities on my application? Because if what you're saying is true, then won't it just look scattered when I reapply?

How much of this did you already report on your submitted application?

Specifically, how many hours for each did you report on your submitted application?

None of this was reported on my application.

 

[MyOdyssey]

None of this was reported on my application.

So it appears that an update now could help but my concern is that if you update now and still get no offers, and you reapply the very next cycle, would you be able to report in your reapplication that is all new stuff since your first application?

I don’t know the answer. Perhaps others might? @gonnif. @Goro

 

[AlejandroRojas]

So it appears that an update now could help but my concern is that if you update now and still get no offers, and you reapply the very next cycle, would you be able to report in your reapplication that is all new stuff since your first application?

I don’t know the answer. Perhaps others might? @gonnif. @Goro

That was my concern as well - Do I try and push it now, or cut my losses? I feel like these experiences may be more impactful if I reportthem on a new application next year, along with applying to more schools and the right schools. That way I can present them in such a way that they tie into my overall narrative rather than just throwing them out there. But, on the other hand, I also have absolutely no idea what I'm doing.

 

[Goro]

So it appears that an update now could help but my concern is that if you update now and still get no offers, and you reapply the very next cycle, would you be able to report in your reapplication that is all new stuff since your first application?

I don’t know the answer. Perhaps others might? @gonnif. @Goro

Obviously, the OP would include those new activities in the next app.

At this point in time, I suspect OP will be crowded out by stronger candidates.

This is yet another illustration that peoe should not apply until they have the best possible apo, and not rely solely on high stats.

 

[AlejandroRojas]

Obviously, the OP would include those new activities in the next app.

At this point in time, I suspect OP will be crowded out by stronger candidates.

This is yet another illustration that peoe should not apply until they have the best possible apo, and not rely solely on high stats.

So I guess my question at this point is whether my application is bad enough that I need to wait an entire year to gain boost it, or whether I can apply next cycle with what I will have by May. Honestly, I didn't feel that I was relying only on my stats when I applied. As I said, I worked full-time as a scribe all throughout college and was promoted to chief scribe, where I have worked since March. I tutored all throughout college, including both college students and students at the local high school. I started the first and only pre-med club on campus and organized/oversaw all activities. I also have approximately 240 hours of physician shadowing. I did perform lab research for a couple semesters, along with independent lit review projects (topics were clinically related). Not to mention I graduated first in my class, despite working full-time and facing significant hardship in college. And since applying I've continued to work as chief scribe and have done a significant amount of volunteering, and I will have accumulated a lot of hours by the time May rolls around.

I realize I'm not an uber-qualified applicant, but it's almost hard to believe that if I applied to 30 schools with MCAT scores close to mine, and with a mission that aligns with my narrative, along with making significant improvements to my written materials (which were not poorly written, but were not necessarily tailored to support my overall narrative), I would be unlikely to at least be offered an interview at a good medical school. Again, I could be totally wrong and my application could actually be mediocre. I just don't know what I would do if that was the case. I could pursue a research job, but honestly I'm not that interested in research, and I love my job and continue to learn more from it every day. Plus, I feel like unless I got some high-tier research job it wouldn't really do all that much for my application at the big name schools where people apply with a ton of meaningful, impressive research experience - in fact, I was thinking it would end up looking like I was checking a box, given that research is not a big part of my application/motivation for pursuing medicine. But beyond that, I've been doing tons of volunteering that I'm interested in, serving the underserved in whatever way I can, and diversifying my clinical experience, so I don't know what else to do. If you have any ideas, I would greatly appreciate hearing them.

 

[bigeman101]

The only real problem is school list. You might just have to shell out a little bit more next cycle and apply to more schools and a broader range.

 

[Goro]

The only real problem is school list. You might just have to shell out a little bit more next cycle and apply to more schools and a broader range.

This

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

but only after you save up enough money to apply to 20-254 schools.

I dunno... that's a lot of dough for 254 schools..... I'm thinking at that point OP should get a loan.

OP in case the horse hasn't been beaten enough, your list is bad. WashU should have been the first school on your list with those stats and you didn't even apply to any of the stat centric schools. You need 20+ schools and focused on stat hungry ones like WashU, UChicago, Vandy, etc. You'll get in, you just need a way better app strategy.

 

[AlejandroRojas]

That's reassuring. Do you know off the top of your head of any schools that have a strong preference for high-stat applicants, but that do not place a huge emphasis on research like they do at the research giants?

 

[AlejandroRojas]

I dunno... that's a lot of dough for 254 schools..... I'm thinking at that point OP should get a loan.

OP in case the horse hasn't been beaten enough, your list is bad. WashU should have been the first school on your list with those stats and you didn't even apply to any of the stat centric schools. You need 20+ schools and focused on stat hungry ones like WashU, UChicago, Vandy, etc. You'll get in, you just need a way better app strategy.

I didn't see this before I posted the above. I'll definitely apply to those. Kind of bummed that I made that mistake in the first place, but its good to know that it's fixable.

 

[MyOdyssey]

So I guess my question at this point is whether my application is bad enough that I need to wait an entire year to gain boost it, or whether I can apply next cycle with what I will have by May. Honestly, I didn't feel that I was relying only on my stats when I applied. As I said, I worked full-time as a scribe all throughout college and was promoted to chief scribe, where I have worked since March. I tutored all throughout college, including both college students and students at the local high school. I started the first and only pre-med club on campus and organized/oversaw all activities. I also have approximately 240 hours of physician shadowing. I did perform lab research for a couple semesters, along with independent lit review projects (topics were clinically related). Not to mention I graduated first in my class, despite working full-time and facing significant hardship in college. And since applying I've continued to work as chief scribe and have done a significant amount of volunteering, and I will have accumulated a lot of hours by the time May rolls around.

I realize I'm not an uber-qualified applicant, but it's almost hard to believe that if I applied to 30 schools with MCAT scores close to mine, and with a mission that aligns with my narrative, along with making significant improvements to my written materials (which were not poorly written, but were not necessarily tailored to support my overall narrative), I would be unlikely to at least be offered an interview at a good medical school. Again, I could be totally wrong and my application could actually be mediocre. I just don't know what I would do if that was the case. I could pursue a research job, but honestly I'm not that interested in research, and I love my job and continue to learn more from it every day. Plus, I feel like unless I got some high-tier research job it wouldn't really do all that much for my application at the big name schools where people apply with a ton of meaningful, impressive research experience - in fact, I was thinking it would end up looking like I was checking a box, given that research is not a big part of my application/motivation for pursuing medicine. But beyond that, I've been doing tons of volunteering that I'm interested in, serving the underserved in whatever way I can, and diversifying my clinical experience, so I don't know what else to do. If you have any ideas, I would greatly appreciate hearing them.

I'm of the view that you should NOT skip a cycle if you don't get an acceptance this cycle. Your most likely "yes" this cycle is Univ of Maryland and that's still a possibility.

Your school list can be corrected next cycle and you have already vastly increased your commitment to nonclinical volunteering, which you should continue to do as you interview next cycle when you likely have to reapply.

Simply apply broadly to schools ranked in the top 35-40 excluding just those schools that are an obvious bad fit.

As a MD resident, low SES, and high stats applicant, you should apply to Johns Hopkins. Hopkins takes a very large number from U Maryland undergrad (which you can see on their bulletin found on Hopkins' website), which suggests an instate bias. Hopkins seems to favor low SES more so than many; at least that's what I saw in their summer research programs.

 

[MyOdyssey]

NYU is another stats hungry school and now tuition free. NYU has advertised that it's gone tuition free to help those who want to be primary care physicians ...

Yale is stats hungry (median MCAT = 521) and they like non-traditionals, which you qualify for given the low SES.

Among the top ranked schools are several that care about serving the underprivileged more so than many. UCSF and Georgetown come to mind. Your low SES and genuine interest in primary care come in handy here.

Emory isn't as stats oriented as the others but also not as research intensive.

 

[AlejandroRojas]

Thanks for your advice. I definitely would rather not skip another cycle if at all possible. Do you feel that it would benefit me to send an update to Maryland? My adviser got in contact with the associate dean of admissions there and she responded to him with an email saying I can contact her with any questions, but I don't really know what to say to her at this point. I feel like the only appropriate response would be to provide her with an update, because my only questions at this point would be "why didn't you interview me" and "what can I do to convince you to interview me," and I'm not sure whether either of those are questions that she would be allowed to answer.