How do you guys fly business/first class?

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gasresident1

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Any way around paying $5-6k for a Polaris business class ticket to Europe? Any international meetings I can write off lol? We have 170k points each in Amex but unsurprisingly there is no Polaris saver tickets available for the dates. Do summer time saver tickets every even exist. I figured at least someone here was an expert. Those flyer forums are way above my head. This all seems like dumb luck.

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Buy an economy class ticket next to the bathroom like the rest of us peons. If you’ve been a disciplined investor over the past year, you can maybe consider treating yourself to some extra leg room.
 
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How much would it cost to use your points to get regular seats and then pay for an upgrade
 
Any way around paying $5-6k for a Polaris business class ticket to Europe? Any international meetings I can write off lol? We have 170k points each in Amex but unsurprisingly there is no Polaris saver tickets available for the dates. Do summer time saver tickets every even exist. I figured at least someone here was an expert. Those flyer forums are way above my head. This all seems like dumb luck.
why are you trying to fly polaris? You can use Virgin Atlantic points on Delta to fly Delta One Suites for 50k each way. United is trash
 
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Any way around paying $5-6k for a Polaris business class ticket to Europe? Any international meetings I can write off lol? We have 170k points each in Amex but unsurprisingly there is no Polaris saver tickets available for the dates. Do summer time saver tickets every even exist. I figured at least someone here was an expert. Those flyer forums are way above my head. This all seems like dumb luck.
Managed a round trip to Italy with Polaris. We did it buy getting normal seats then upgrading with united points. Worth it IMO. Never once touched my points until that trip but felt appropriate after finally paying off student loans
 
If u are anesthesiologists u can afford to pay for 2 business class tickets.

It gets tricky once there are kids involved. I stopped flying first/business back in 2012 with second kid. Just too expensive.

For Europe back in 2018. I did get 4 business seats one way (overnight) so kids (ages 5/7) could sleep overnight. But it was $2k each way x 4. That’s 8k for one way.

I got economy plus extra leg on trip home to save a little.

But if it’s just two of u. Splurge. Ticket prices are way up these days unfortunately especially peak season. If u don’t have kids. Fly off peak.
 
You can tough out a cramped airline seat for 8 hours.
 
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I found a round-trip ticket from Indianapolis to Seoul in AA flagship business for $2800 (the price is normally > $4000) last year and Boston to Funchal (Madeira, PT) for $2200 on TAP (had to buy a separate domestic first class ticket from Indy to Boston to make this one work) for later this month.

I honestly think the trick is just to google flights to destinations you’re interested in a few times per week. I find this fun, but could see how it’s kind of annoying strategy if you don’t enjoy it. The other thing I would say, is that if you’re trying to make it work with membership benefits programs, it’s a lot harder.
 
It's hard and you need to be flexible with your dates. They have limited seating for points and you pretty much have to book the seats as soon as they become available...usually like a year in advance. But if you're patient and lucky, you can get RT business class for like 60k points
 
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I don’t think any doctor with children can afford first class unless they are really balling, first class last time I checked is insane like 15k a ticket international..who the hell can afford that?
 
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Get to be an American Airlines executive member (pretty sure you get like 50k miles just for signing up for their Mastercard). More likely to get upgraded. Not sure how this would work for that airline but most do similar things.sometimes they will also allow you to pay for an upgrade that is cheaper
 
I try to use points, but it’s becoming increasingly more difficult as more folks pile into the game. It was so much easier 10 years ago when I started.

These days it’s probably best to be flexible and keep an eye out for mistake or discount fares. Business class is significantly cheaper ex-Europe to USA (under $2k sometimes), so a trick is to book flights that will cover flights on two separate trips.
 
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It’s just not worth it for marginally increased comfort for a couple of hours.
 
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On united, you can buy the coach seat with a “mileage upgrade award.” Usually there is an extra fee and a mileage amount. You do this through the advanced search on united.com. Of course, you have to have a lot of United miles to use for the upgrades, and it sounds like your points are locked into American Express. What happens then, is that you end up on a wait list for the upgrade and whether or not you get it depends on your pecking order. The pecking order is determined by your level of status, and how much you paid for the ticket. So if you don’t have any status with United, you’re not likely to get upgraded in any case. I am gold and I probably get upgraded with miles 60 or 70% of the time.
 
Get to be an American Airlines executive member (pretty sure you get like 50k miles just for signing up for their Mastercard). More likely to get upgraded. Not sure how this would work for that airline but most do similar things.sometimes they will also allow you to pay for an upgrade that is cheaper
That won't get you upgraded into business for international flights though. Executive platinum and platinum pro on American you can choose system wide upgrades, but they can be difficult to use to upgrade from economy to business. I just buy the tickets because it makes my life more comfortable, and I can hit the ground running after sleeping most of the night. I have no kids, so I upgrade travel. If it's super expensive I look for different days/airlines. I have found deals before, but I usually fly American. I like Delta now, but they are typically more expensive.
 
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That won't get you upgraded into business for international flights though. Executive platinum and platinum pro on American you can choose system wide upgrades, but they can be difficult to use to upgrade from economy to business. I just buy the tickets because it makes my life more comfortable, and I can hit the ground running after sleeping most of the night. I have no kids, so I upgrade travel. If it's super expensive I look for different days/airlines. I have found deals before, but I usually fly American. I like Delta now, but they are typically more expensive.
Interesting. I saw that a first class ticket from Chicago to Beijing was 27k. I feel like if one can afford that, they can just get a private jet or something
 
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Interesting. I saw that a first class ticket from Chicago to Beijing was 27k. I feel like if one can afford that, they can just get a private jet or something
First class is often a different animal than business. Although, there are sometimes sales; I got a first to go to Europe for $200 more than business before covid. But the flight I just bought to the UK was 3300 and some first class fairs were 12000. There isn't enough difference for me to fly first after trying it that one trip before covid.. I got free pajamas.
 
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Any way around paying $5-6k for a Polaris business class ticket to Europe? Any international meetings I can write off lol? We have 170k points each in Amex but unsurprisingly there is no Polaris saver tickets available for the dates. Do summer time saver tickets every even exist. I figured at least someone here was an expert. Those flyer forums are way above my head. This all seems like dumb luck.


Learning the credit card game takes a bit of time, but a lot of people do it as you can see. Otherwise there are paid online services that can help you find award flights and make itineraries for you.

To answer your specific question, everyone is looking to travel now that covid restrictions have mostly lifted. And everyone has tons of points to burn. You need to be ideally looking for award seats a year out as soon as they are released byt the airline.
 
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Exit row seats are the sweet spot for waaaaay more legroom than business class, comparable to first class. Not as much elbow room obviously. But a great option for tall people.

I always ask about first class upgrades at the gate. Sometimes you get lucky and can move up for a few hundred. Sometimes they're $thousands. Seems like it's harder to get reasonably priced upgrades now, compared to 20 years ago.
 
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Exit row seats are the sweet spot for waaaaay more legroom than business class, comparable to first class. Not as much elbow room obviously. But a great option for tall people.

I always ask about first class upgrades at the gate. Sometimes you get lucky and can move up for a few hundred. Sometimes they're $thousands. Seems like it's harder to get reasonably priced upgrades now, compared to 20 years ago.
Not equivalent if they are the lay flat seats for international red eyes!

I play credit card games, and I do locums. I book my own flights, so I get the credit card points and flight miles. I got executive platinum on American - it makes their customer service a lot better.
 
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Exit row seats are the sweet spot for waaaaay more legroom than business class, comparable to first class. Not as much elbow room obviously. But a great option for tall people.

I always ask about first class upgrades at the gate. Sometimes you get lucky and can move up for a few hundred. Sometimes they're $thousands. Seems like it's harder to get reasonably priced upgrades now, compared to 20 years ago.

Exit row definitely doesn’t have more leg room than business on most international flights. If I’m flying over an ocean, give me a lie flat seat, a pillow/blanket, and free alcohol over an exit row every single time.
 
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I haven't taken an international flight (that the military didn't arrange) in many years - will take your word for it. :) I flew to Vietnam a few years ago in cattle class I wasn't allowed to upgrade, and if I'd had the option of getting out over the ocean I probably would've.

Domestic flights aren't long enough to get significant sleep on, so never occurred to me to consider lie-flat seats.
 
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I flew comfort plus on Delta once. Major flex/splurge... it was a treat yo' self day.

I also flew business class once... one way and one time only - due to a points opportunity. Otherwise I fly in regular steerage and spite those who turn left upon entering the plane. Who TF are those people? Probably they're hospital administrators going to a "meeting".
 
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I flew comfort plus on Delta once. Major flex/splurge... it was a treat yo' self day.

I also flew business class once... one way and one time only - due to a points opportunity. Otherwise I fly in regular steerage and spite those who turn left upon entering the plane. Who TF are those people? Probably they're hospital administrators going to a "meeting".
I think comfort+ on delta is more than enough for European travel. However, you're flying to Asia or have some other ungodly long flight then get business if you can.
 
How much would it cost to use your points to get regular seats and then pay for an upgrade

This is exactly what I have done with Lufthansa. Book an economy award flight through either Lifemiles or United, then either bid for upgrade or ask at counter. Last success this past summer flying direct from Frankfurt to Dallas. Cost me about 400 for the upgrade to business. Great deal especially considering the economy ticket (readily available) cost 30k points while the business ticket (much harder to find award space) costs around 70k points
 
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I think comfort+ on delta is more than enough for European travel. However, you're flying to Asia or have some other ungodly long flight then get business if you can.
For overseas travel I've become attached to Premium Economy (or whatever each airline calls it). Basically a domestic first-class seat.

I'm significantly taller than average and usually travel with kids so exit row is out.

We book the coach with more legroom tickets when traveling within the US as I physically can't get into a coach seat due to the ever shrinking leg room.
 
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In 1985 my bride and I flew JFK to Rome for honeymoon. I was a third year med student. Treated ourselves to nice flat beds. I should mention we were in coach in a 747 but plane was near empty. We each took a full row and slept like we were post call. Only one reason why it was better in the old days.
Back in the 80s the government airline subsidies were huge. I rememeber flying from San Diego to Hawaii several times as a kid in empty airplanes.

Exactly what you said - empty rows, pick one lay down.

Somewhere along the line the government stopped paying the airlines to fly empty planes over oceans.

The other thing that was "better" was the lack of baggage scrutiny by the pre-TSA people. When I was 8 or 9 I was in Hawaii for New Year's or maybe it was the 4th of July and had a bunch of extra fireworks. So I just put them in my suitcase without telling my parents and took them home.
 
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Economy class + x*bottles of cheap red = 1st class.

X=2
 
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Interesting. I saw that a first class ticket from Chicago to Beijing was 27k. I feel like if one can afford that, they can just get a private jet or something
Nah. Flying private is an hourly rate, like 10k, an hour when I looked into it years ago. Plus, you pay the hourly rate for the trip home when they fly empty. Plus, you pay travel expenses, meals, hotels.for the pilots who can only fly a restricted number of hours. First class is a grade above business so 27k sounds like a competitive price. Lay flat business seats are probably the best value for the long flight to China. BTW, severe travel warning re Covid right now. Don't go there.
 
As I was graduating from college a Fortune 100 company at the time flew me first class and put me up in the nicest hotel I'd ever stayed in at that point for a job interview. I didn't take the job. Many years later, after getting through medical school (on my second attempt) I was interviewing for residency positions where I'd sacrifice another 4 years earning far less than I would've had I taken the job out of college. The applications put me further into debt than I already was. Traveling for interviews put me even further into debt as no one covered expenses aside from maybe a couple places covering my hotel expenses. Had I thought of it at the time I would've recognized the disparity and considered it a sign. I've not flown first class since.
 
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On a related note, maybe I'm just a rube uncultured 'Merican but I don't look forward to international travel like I used to.

In October I spent a little over a week camping and off roading in Utah and Arizona. In that span, off the top of my head, we visited

Zion
Bryce
Patuixhi (not sure if I spelled that right)
Canyonlands island in the sky, dead horse point, Needles
Shafers trail - would love to take a week+ to do just this, we only did a short stretch of it
Capital reef
Ling canyon
Kodachrome basin
Moab
Monument valley
Valley of the gods
Gooseneck state park
Oak creek canyon
Jerome

And really could've spent at least a day or two in every one of those places and not seen everything. It reminded me that there's a whole lot of amazing stuff to do and see in the USA that doesn't require flying over oceans.
 
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I haven't taken an international flight (that the military didn't arrange) in many years - will take your word for it. :) I flew to Vietnam a few years ago in cattle class I wasn't allowed to upgrade, and if I'd had the option of getting out over the ocean I probably would've.

Domestic flights aren't long enough to get significant sleep on, so never occurred to me to consider lie-flat seats.
Fair!

I grew up in Hawai'i, so if fly coach growing up as 1 of 4 kids in the family. We would often offer to be bumped when flying TWA to HNL from STL with the condition that we got put in first class the next day. It worked, we also got tickets (coach) to anywhere TWA flew for 3 years in row. We figured we put TWA out of business in the early 2000s. 🤣 We got quite a few free tickets between the whole family over the years. (Before lay flat seats.) I also grew up in the days of smoking sections on planes and even you could go steal a whole row. I did that in my first intentional flight in 1992. I've also done the Hawaii to ATL sitting in coach in college. Back then I could fall asleep as soon as I sat down. My longest flight was LAX to Auckland. 14 hours in the middle of the 5 of 747. Then I took nyquil and went insane with boredom.

Back then I'd offer to be bumped on many flights if I didn't have to be back at college.

When I worked at home after fellowship, I'd buy first class, and sleeping, evening sitting up was easier. The better customer service made it nicer too.

But all my experiences made me adept at finding deals.
 
More leftist indoctrination;)

dumb-dumb-dumb-dumb.gif
 
Interesting. I saw that a first class ticket from Chicago to Beijing was 27k. I feel like if one can afford that, they can just get a private jet or something

My FIL is a corporate pilot, but they do a bunch of charters. Those planes don’t lift off the ground for less than $10k. Shoot, they pay like $10k/month for wifi.

And you really need a larger plane to go across the ponds. My wife used to go on a lot of their flights, got to go on their touch and goes at night during the summer.. . Until the feds required that free ride alongs were considered income.
 
On a related note, maybe I'm just a rube uncultured 'Merican but I don't look forward to international travel like I used to.

In October I spent a little over a week camping and off roading in Utah and Arizona. In that span, off the top of my head, we visited

Zion
Bryce
Patuixhi (not sure if I spelled that right)
Canyonlands island in the sky, dead horse point, Needles
Shafers trail - would love to take a week+ to do just this, we only did a short stretch of it
Capital reef
Ling canyon
Kodachrome basin
Moab
Monument valley
Valley of the gods
Gooseneck state park
Oak creek canyon
Jerome

And really could've spent at least a day or two in every one of those places and not seen everything. It reminded me that there's a whole lot of amazing stuff to do and see in the USA that doesn't require flying over oceans.
Could have spent a week or more at most of those locations!

Source: grew up in UT.
 
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I fly economy domestic, but will pay more for direct flights.

I don’t travel internationally much, but last time I did, I bid for business class upgrade. It was much less than buying it. It was a red eye so the lay flat was very nice for sleeping. Otherwise, I think premium economy would be fine. Regular economy would be a bit cramped for a long flight.
 
I buy premium economy or main cabin+ or whatever the airlines call it since I can afford it now. I find it ridiculous that capitalism has turned the single coolest thing about living in the 20th-21st century into what basically amounts to inner city busses.
 
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Learning the credit card game takes a bit of time, but a lot of people do it as you can see. Otherwise there are paid online services that can help you find award flights and make itineraries for you.

To answer your specific question, everyone is looking to travel now that covid restrictions have mostly lifted. And everyone has tons of points to burn. You need to be ideally looking for award seats a year out as soon as they are released byt the airline.
This is the only high value post in answering OP so far.

Read on if you are interested:

This is where I've been for the past year instead of SDN. I've gone full dive into churning and award booking.

I have not traveled and paid cash in about 2 years, mostly I have done domestic travel, but I have some international trips planned:

Two round trip tickets SFO -TPE on EVA airline biz class with ANA points (95k per person round trip of Amex points). Booked in August 2022 for April - May 2023 travel dates. ($14k cash value at time of booking)

Booked my in laws on the same route. 95k Amex points for one (ANA), and 100k chase points for the other (air Canada with transfer bonus). (14k cash value at time of booking $7k for each round trip).

Also booked round trip for my wife's birthday DFW-CDG biz class Air France for 150k chase points +$800 round trip per person (transferred to flying blue/air France) $10k cash value at time of booking. Booked in Oct 2022 for Oct 2023 travel. And we plan to stay at Park Hyatt Paris using 40k chase points per night transferred to Hyatt. Cash price of $1500ish per night.


Here are some tips to playing/understanding the game of points and miles:
-NEVER pay late fees on your credit card.
- you will not be a profitable customer for the credit card companies, but the pool you belong to will be profitable for the company (high income, high spender).
- this takes some discipline, but it's easy mode because of how much money the average anesthesiologist earns.
- you're essentially taking advantage of price discrimination in the airline redemption.
-The way the airline view the customers hierarchy: cash paying customers >>>>> award space customers >> upgrades due to status > empty seat on the plane.

-two sides of the equation: earning points and finding availability, optimizing both is needed it you really want to make this worth your time.
-Earning points: relatively easy as an attending. Just have a system to keep track of the credit cards annual fees. Don't pay late fees. Your attending salary and profession makes you a very low risk customer, a very low risk for yourself, and conversely very easy task to earn points.
-Award availability: a little more difficult, the key is flexibility. Flexibility in the way your points can be used and flexibility in travel dates. The farther out you look, the easier the booking will be. Noticed I booked a lot of these tickets a year out.


It really isn't worth the hassle for a lot of people. But if you optimized it, I did the math and I'm at a higher per hour rate than my day job.
 
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As I was graduating from college a Fortune 100 company at the time flew me first class and put me up in the nicest hotel I'd ever stayed in at that point for a job interview. I didn't take the job. Many years later, after getting through medical school (on my second attempt) I was interviewing for residency positions where I'd sacrifice another 4 years earning far less than I would've had I taken the job out of college. The applications put me further into debt than I already was. Traveling for interviews put me even further into debt as no one covered expenses aside from maybe a couple places covering my hotel expenses. Had I thought of it at the time I would've recognized the disparity and considered it a sign. I've not flown first class since.
A friend of mine used to work for our hospital as a “development director”. The hospital always flew her business class and put her up at fancy places, she had a huge hospital slush fund, and a highly flexible work schedule (mostly from home). She didn’t actually appear to be great at her job but recently got hired by another hospital for the same job for even more money. Her benefits were fantastic too - she had a cash benefit plan and everything else maxed out.

Ironic when I see coworkers sharing a hotel room to give a talk at a national meeting on their own dime (we have no cme/academic fund).
 
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This is the only high value post in answering OP so far.

Read on if you are interested:

This is where I've been for the past year instead of SDN. I've gone full dive into churning and award booking.

I have not traveled and paid cash in about 2 years, mostly I have done domestic travel, but I have some international trips planned:

Two round trip tickets SFO -TPE on EVA airline biz class with ANA points (95k per person round trip of Amex points). Booked in August 2022 for April - May 2023 travel dates. ($14k cash value at time of booking)

Booked my in laws on the same route. 95k Amex points for one (ANA), and 100k chase points for the other (air Canada with transfer bonus). (14k cash value at time of booking $7k for each round trip).

Also booked round trip for my wife's birthday DFW-CDG biz class Air France for 150k chase points +$800 round trip per person (transferred to flying blue/air France) $10k cash value at time of booking. Booked in Oct 2022 for Oct 2023 travel. And we plan to stay at Park Hyatt Paris using 40k chase points per night transferred to Hyatt. Cash price of $1500ish per night.


Here are some tips to playing/understanding the game of points and miles:
-NEVER pay late fees on your credit card.
- you will not be a profitable customer for the credit card companies, but the pool you belong to will be profitable for the company (high income, high spender).
- this takes some discipline, but it's easy mode because of how much money the average anesthesiologist earns.
- you're essentially taking advantage of price discrimination in the airline redemption.
-The way the airline view the customers hierarchy: cash paying customers >>>>> award space customers >> upgrades due to status > empty seat on the plane.

-two sides of the equation: earning points and finding availability, optimizing both is needed it you really want to make this worth your time.
-Earning points: relatively easy as an attending. Just have a system to keep track of the credit cards annual fees. Don't pay late fees. Your attending salary and profession makes you a very low risk customer, a very low risk for yourself, and conversely very easy task to earn points.
-Award availability: a little more difficult, the key is flexibility. Flexibility in the way your points can be used and flexibility in travel dates. The farther out you look, the easier the booking will be. Noticed I booked a lot of these tickets a year out.


It really isn't worth the hassle for a lot of people. But if you optimized it, I did the math and I'm at a higher per hour rate than my day job.

If you've just now started, you're late to the game and missed the golden years.

I've manufactured spent well into the seven (maybe eight?) figures back when it was super profitable and worth my time. Millions of AA miles and didn't pay cash for travel for 6-8 years. Stopped a couple years ago when the real manufactured spending resources dried up.

Maybe I should dive back in...
 
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If you've just now started, you're late to the game and missed the golden years.

I've manufactured spent well into the seven (maybe eight?) figures back when it was super profitable and worth my time. Millions of AA miles and didn't pay cash for travel for 6-8 years. Stopped a couple years ago when the real manufactured spending resources dried up.

Maybe I should dive back in...

Now it is all about the sign up bonuses and retention perks
 
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This is the only high value post in answering OP so far.

Read on if you are interested:

This is where I've been for the past year instead of SDN. I've gone full dive into churning and award booking.

I have not traveled and paid cash in about 2 years, mostly I have done domestic travel, but I have some international trips planned:

Two round trip tickets SFO -TPE on EVA airline biz class with ANA points (95k per person round trip of Amex points). Booked in August 2022 for April - May 2023 travel dates. ($14k cash value at time of booking)

Booked my in laws on the same route. 95k Amex points for one (ANA), and 100k chase points for the other (air Canada with transfer bonus). (14k cash value at time of booking $7k for each round trip).

Also booked round trip for my wife's birthday DFW-CDG biz class Air France for 150k chase points +$800 round trip per person (transferred to flying blue/air France) $10k cash value at time of booking. Booked in Oct 2022 for Oct 2023 travel. And we plan to stay at Park Hyatt Paris using 40k chase points per night transferred to Hyatt. Cash price of $1500ish per night.


Here are some tips to playing/understanding the game of points and miles:
-NEVER pay late fees on your credit card.
- you will not be a profitable customer for the credit card companies, but the pool you belong to will be profitable for the company (high income, high spender).
- this takes some discipline, but it's easy mode because of how much money the average anesthesiologist earns.
- you're essentially taking advantage of price discrimination in the airline redemption.
-The way the airline view the customers hierarchy: cash paying customers >>>>> award space customers >> upgrades due to status > empty seat on the plane.

-two sides of the equation: earning points and finding availability, optimizing both is needed it you really want to make this worth your time.
-Earning points: relatively easy as an attending. Just have a system to keep track of the credit cards annual fees. Don't pay late fees. Your attending salary and profession makes you a very low risk customer, a very low risk for yourself, and conversely very easy task to earn points.
-Award availability: a little more difficult, the key is flexibility. Flexibility in the way your points can be used and flexibility in travel dates. The farther out you look, the easier the booking will be. Noticed I booked a lot of these tickets a year out.


It really isn't worth the hassle for a lot of people. But if you optimized it, I did the math and I'm at a higher per hour rate than my day job.
Very impressive. How do you have so many chase points?
 
Do you guys think it's worth it to purchase a subscription to one of those flight deal searching companies?
 
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