How have you dealt with group project partners who refuse to put in the work?

[odyssey2]

My anatomy group had people who refused to come in after hours since there was no grade for the quality of dissection and they spent their time studying for the exam instead, leaving the rest of us to do their work. When there’s no oversight for this kind of behavior, how have you dealt with group members who slack off or just don’t care?

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[OnePunchBiopsy]

You can’t really hold people accountable if they are not putting in EXTRA work.

If these people start not meeting the course requirements (i.e., stop showing up at all, completing the days dissection) then you have a reason to report them to admin.

 

[stickgirl390]

Don’t do their work, especially if it’s not for a grade.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Uh, not doing extra work is not slacking off. I wouldn’t come in after hours to work on dissections either if it wasn’t for a grade.

 

[Lawpy]

Uh, not doing extra work is not slacking off. I wouldn’t come in after hours to work on dissections either if it wasn’t for a grade.

Same here. Much better things to do with that time

 

[slowthai]

Yeah, I thought this was required or something. Screw that, lol. That is the definition of low yield haha

 

[ciestar]

Yeah... no. Not coming in after hours isn’t slacking.

 

[ciestar]

But to really answer the question at hand when it actually happened... speak to your course director if talking to your group members has failed.

 

[M&L]

better question, - why dont you all do it in the allotted time during classroom time?

 

[Osteosaur]

Why are you going in after hours to do dissections??? If its not for a grade or to meet a course requirement it is not important. Do you need to have everything nicely dissected out?

They didn't agree to be put in a group with people who want to do this.

Do it in class. This is not important stuff.

 

[deleted1079620]

Why are you going in after hours to do dissections??? If its not for a grade or to meet a course requirement it is not important. Do you need to have everything nicely dissected out?

They didn't agree to be put in a group with people who want to do this.

Do it in class. This is not important stuff.

Sometimes schools will tag structures in the state they’re dissected in at the time. If the dissection can’t be done in class, it would be in the best interest of everyone that all dissections are completed before tagging starts, so structures are clearly visible.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Sometimes schools will tag structures in the state they’re dissected in at the time. If the dissection can’t be done in class, it would be in the best interest of everyone that all dissections are completed before tagging starts, so structures are clearly visible.

If your anatomy faculty picks the cadaver with the structure barely visible, your faculty suck.

 

[Neopolymath]

Why is an M4 asking about an M1 problem???

 

[M&L]

Why is an M4 asking about an M1 problem???

Oh excellent point

 

[TelemarketingEnigma]

Sometimes schools will tag structures in the state they’re dissected in at the time. If the dissection can’t be done in class, it would be in the best interest of everyone that all dissections are completed before tagging starts, so structures are clearly visible.

If your anatomy faculty picks the cadaver with the structure barely visible, your faculty suck.

our anatomy faculty would sometimes do extra dissection before an exam just to expose the structure they wanted to tag - so as far as studying goes, it does benefit you to have well exposed structures because then you can actually see them yourself before they're tagged, rather than something the prof dissected out himself the day before the exam so no one's ever seen it. but they wouldn't purposefully tag bad structures

On the other hand, there was always a dark joke that if you do a terrible dissection and "accidentally" destroy tiny obscure structures along the way, they can't be tagged on the exam (as far as I know, people took things very seriously and never actually did this)

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

our anatomy faculty would sometimes do extra dissection before an exam just to expose the structure they wanted to tag - so as far as studying goes, it does benefit you to have well exposed structures because then you can actually see them yourself before they're tagged, rather than something the prof dissected out himself the day before the exam so no one's ever seen it. but they wouldn't purposefully tag bad structures

On the other hand, there was always a dark joke that if you do a terrible dissection and "accidentally" destroy tiny obscure structures along the way, they can't be tagged on the exam (as far as I know, people took things very seriously and never actually did this)

Yeah, but it benefits you more to spend time on things that matter. At least at my school, anatomy was worth like 50 points tops each module.

 

[TelemarketingEnigma]

Yeah, but it benefits you more to spend time on things that matter. At least at my school, anatomy was worth like 50 points tops each module.

wasn't the case for us - I've already forgotten the details of our M1 grades at this point, but our anatomy practical exams were a pretty significant part of our grade so it was worth preparing well for. Still didn't usually require dissecting after hours or anything like OP is asking about - but people would often come in after hours to study, sometimes cleaning up structures while doing that for their own benefit (but not making other people come in who didn't want to). The actual primary dissection could usually be completed in class time

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

wasn't the case for us - I've already forgotten the details of our M1 grades at this point, but our anatomy practical exams were a pretty significant part of our grade so it was worth preparing well for. Still didn't usually require dissecting after hours or anything like OP is asking about - but people would often come in after hours to study, sometimes cleaning up structures while doing that for their own benefit (but not making other people come in who didn't want to). The actual primary dissection could usually be completed in class time

Yeah people came in after hours in my class too. I only did once and that was because covid made us basically not have any time in the lab.

 

[deleted1079620]

Yeah, but it benefits you more to spend time on things that matter. At least at my school, anatomy was worth like 50 points tops each module.

Ours are worth anywhere from 15-25% of each block. At least one practical per block.

 

[deleted1079620]

our anatomy faculty would sometimes do extra dissection before an exam just to expose the structure they wanted to tag - so as far as studying goes, it does benefit you to have well exposed structures because then you can actually see them yourself before they're tagged, rather than something the prof dissected out himself the day before the exam so no one's ever seen it. but they wouldn't purposefully tag bad structures

On the other hand, there was always a dark joke that if you do a terrible dissection and "accidentally" destroy tiny obscure structures along the way, they can't be tagged on the exam (as far as I know, people took things very seriously and never actually did this)

Our “dark joke” was that a tag could be placed there asking “what was here before it was destroyed?”. I never saw that actually happen, though.

Now that our lab time is pretty limited due to covid, dissections that aren’t finished get done by the staff. It just means maybe you didn’t see everything you should have before the exam, but there’s no “punishment” for not finishing. Our bodies are also shared by two groups, so if one group makes very little progress then that leaves the other group with fewer exposed structures to study as well.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Ours are worth anywhere from 15-25% of each block. At least one practical per block.

Ours were too. So basically as long as you passed, you’re good.

 

[deleted1079620]

Ours were too. So basically as long as you passed, you’re good.

Yep, I’m not in a P/F curriculum though, so I usually try to do really well. If you get a good system figured out for studying anatomy, it’s easy points.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Yep, I’m not in a P/F curriculum though, so I usually try to do really well. If you get a good system figured out for studying anatomy, it’s easy points.

Yeah, I aced almost every anatomy exam just using anki. There’s really no reason to regularly go in after hours. We have an H/P/F curriculum, not P/F. No one cares about preclinical grades. The response rate isn’t great, but every PD survey has preclinical grades as pretty unimportant as long as you’re passing.

 

[jscott34]

My anatomy group had people who refused to come in after hours since there was no grade for the quality of dissection and they spent their time studying for the exam instead, leaving the rest of us to do their work. When there’s no oversight for this kind of behavior, how have you dealt with group members who slack off or just don’t care?

The way I’ve dealt with this within my research group is to sit everyone in your group down and go over what is expected of everyone. Sometimes people may slack Bc they don’t know other people are expecting certain things from them. At the end of the day, you are learning something they aren’t putting you at an advantage. If this issue affects your leaning or grades I’d definitely speak about this further with your professor.

 

[emergentmd]

If it is extra, why would anyone care what someone else does?

This is a microcosm of life. You have to work with people. Compared to you, some will overachiever and some will underachieve. Do what is best for you and the high achievers will always come out ahead.

Put your head down, do what is best for you. You can't make someone do extra just b/c you want to have the best looking cadaver. This may mean alot to you, but not to others.

I absolutely hated anatomy class and did the bare minimum. I did my best to finish during class and almost never came back to the stinky lab to look for the nebulous nerve. I had better things to do like study, working out, sleeping. Sorry, but this is just not mine or many people's priority to have a pretty cadaver.

 

[jimmybee]

My anatomy group had people who refused to come in after hours since there was no grade for the quality of dissection and they spent their time studying for the exam instead, leaving the rest of us to do their work. When there’s no oversight for this kind of behavior, how have you dealt with group members who slack off or just don’t care?

 

[jimmybee]

My anatomy group had people who refused to come in after hours since there was no grade for the quality of dissection and they spent their time studying for the exam instead, leaving the rest of us to do their work. When there’s no oversight for this kind of behavior, how have you dealt with group members who slack off or just don’t care?

While I don't like you example, it is definitely relatable.

Since we all are at least pre-medical students, I would be shock if any of us have NOT had this situation occur. The reality is, most of us just suck it up and do the slacker's share of the work.

I remember in undergrad in a freshman, mandatory english class that all majors had to take, I was assigned a group project with three others. I went to a state university that was kind of a party school so mixing with non-science students was risky. Of course 2 of the three didn't do any work. The third put in a good effort. I did the most.

When the final grade came in, the other 3 got As and I got a B. I remember being so mad. I even discussed with the GA and it just made things worse. While I was calm and reasonable when I explained the situation, I go no where. As I walked out, I crumpled the paper with the grade on it and threw it away casually. The next day he asked to talk to me and said I was "behaving badly" because he saw me throw the paper away and took it as if I was trying to prove a point when in reality, I just didn't have any need for a sheet of paper!! Lol.

That was 20 years ago. I still remember it. There were more events like this that occurred later. I took those as just a part of life. It's not fair.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

While I don't like you example, it is definitely relatable.

Since we all are at least pre-medical students, I would be shock if any of us have NOT had this situation occur. The reality is, most of us just suck it up and do the slacker's share of the work.

I remember in undergrad in a freshman, mandatory english class that all majors had to take, I was assigned a group project with three others. I went to a state university that was kind of a party school so mixing with non-science students was risky. Of course 2 of the three didn't do any work. The third put in a good effort. I did the most.

When the final grade came in, the other 3 got As and I got a B. I remember being so mad. I even discussed with the GA and it just made things worse. While I was calm and reasonable when I explained the situation, I go no where. As I walked out, I crumpled the paper with the grade on it and threw it away casually. The next day he asked to talk to me and said I was "behaving badly" because he saw me throw the paper away and took it as if I was trying to prove a point when in reality, I just didn't have any need for a sheet of paper!! Lol.

That was 20 years ago. I still remember it. There were more events like this that occurred later. I took those as just a part of life. It's not fair.

1) why did different people in the group get different grades?
2) that TA was immature

 

[deleted917484]

My anatomy group had people who refused to come in after hours since there was no grade for the quality of dissection and they spent their time studying for the exam instead, leaving the rest of us to do their work. When there’s no oversight for this kind of behavior, how have you dealt with group members who slack off or just don’t car

So I'm a career-changer post-bacc and I can tell you that this is a great lesson for you. A large portion of your career day-in and day-out will involve compensating for slack. It's not necessarily b/c people don't give a crap, although that is sometimes the case, but more so b/c people are autonomous and prioritize differently. This is why being a leader is SO dang difficult.

In these situations, I tend to do a few things before just sucking it up.

1) I tend to just chat with the people and offer empathy in the form of "I understand this stuff is getting in the way of studying - I know I have a ton I need to catch-up on. If we could all just quickly sit down and crank this out, we can get to what's more important. Appreciate the help!". Even if only ONE of them decides to step up, then you've improved the situation and don't come off elitist. It's good practice to learn how to "sell" a situation and choose words wisely. You may be a "pre-med" (a term I've never liked b/c it promotes unjustified entitlement ha), but it's important to always conduct yourself like the professional you want to become. Now if they decide to not help, then:

2) You move on and crank out the work. The pro here is learning how to self-sustain. People won't always be there in difficult situations, so use it as a learning experience to walk away from an inconvenience and get the job done and done WELL. One thing you should remember is that professors [generally] know who is and isn't doing the work. When you have an answer to a question related to the assignment, it further validates this point. Now if these extra hours are merely for ensuring you submit quality work and is a personal desire, then you need to remember that you can't force your standard onto others. They aren't wrong for spending the extra time studying just as you aren't wrong for taking the extra hours to not study and focus on the dissection.

I know this may sound "grandiose" for a simple dissection assignment, but I ALWAYS hear undergrads go "I'm gonna leave their name off the assignment - screw them!" or "I'm gonna ream them out!" or "I'm gonna go chat with the professor and tell them they aren't doing s***". All of this is childish and PETTY, PETTY, PETTY. If you leave them off the assignment, then you're throwing someone under the bus and that's an AWFUL leadership decision that will only come to haunt you when you end up working together again in another class lol. Reaming them out only makes the reamer look terrible. Talking to the professor is only necessary under major circumstances and can be perceived as childish if not handled properly.

Sry for the long post lol, but I think there are some good learning opportunities here and want to see you do well!