How much do we really need to worry?

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eberge3 said:
a 513 is a good score, but def no IVY's. The top DO programs usually average around a 507. There are a lot of reasons why students with that mcat could not have success with MD cycle. It really depends if OP is willing to take more time off and spend more money re-applying and improving his app. At some point it just gets exhaustion and might be better to put his energy into doing well in Med School even if it is a DO. The better end DO programs match 4-6 orthos a year + 1 derm + 1ENT hand full of Rads, maybe even a few urology/vascualr surg. There is no reason why YOU cannot be those people!
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Dartmouth is an Ivy and a 513 is competitive there, but other than that, likely not.
 
eberge3 said:
a 513 is a good score, but def no IVY's. The top DO programs usually average around a 507. There are a lot of reasons why students with that mcat could not have success with MD cycle. It really depends if OP is willing to take more time off and spend more money re-applying and improving his app. At some point it just gets exhaustion and might be better to put his energy into doing well in Med School even if it is a DO. The better end DO programs match 4-6 orthos a year + 1 derm + 1ENT hand full of Rads, maybe even a few urology/vascualr surg. There is no reason why YOU cannot be those people!
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Yeah 513 isn't going to get you any Ivys lol. Great score but not ivy league status
 
Angus Avagadro said:
I think @Black Coffee 24/7 said it very well. You scored in the 89%tile on the mcat and you aren't in an MD school? I am missing something here. That score should get you a look by some Ivys, IF, the rest of your app is competetive.For sure the MCAT and Step score isn't guaranteed acceptance, but it should give you a look by the school or residency program. I think having preconditions about medicine or specialties is a mistake and a set up for disappointment. Keep an open mind. Was your med school list not broad and diverse enough? If a competetive specialty is still your mindset, I'd find out what was weak about my app and apply to an MD school. I think beating your head against the wall as a DO to get a competetive residency,(improbable but not impossible), will be lower yield than improving your app and going to an MD school where your chances at matching your residency will improve. This is my opinion after reading your OP and your responses to other posters. Good luck and best wishes!
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513 with a <3.4 gpa.
 
Drbench said:
And at this point I'm hardly convinced that waiting a year or more to get into an MD school is worth it considering how much of a crap shoot it seems to be. I'd rather take my acceptance and make the most of it than hope that I can get into a random MD school within the next few years (which might not happen). Also motivation is a huge factor here. I'm very motivated to start medical school and build connections and publishing research with the good resources that I have, whereas the idea of "possibly improving my application enough for MD acceptance" is extremely unappealing considering how hard it is to get things published and any meaningful research experience as an undergrad. The proccess of imoroving your app for medical school acceptance seems less fruitful than doing the same for building yourself up for residency. The work put in:meaningful results ratio seems to be much better as a medical student. Correct me if I'm wrong.
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I would say that getting into an MD school isnt as much about improving your application as much as it is about improving your odds. Applying broadly and applying early go VERY VERY far. Also keep in mind that a significantly large portion of any MD class are at least 2 time applicants that got in after a year in which they didnt. Being a DO absolutely makes matching any competitive specialty harder if not impossible at some programs. I think you need to consider if trying again for 1 more year is worth the lifetime of career speedbumps that going to a DO school brings. The hardest part is being an objectively better applicant to residencies than some of your MD counterparts and still seeing them get twice as many interviews applying to half as many places. I say try again for MD because even though it's not gonna make you a better physician, it will help you immensely to get that competitive specialty you know you want.
 
Drbench said:
Yea I'm considering it. This puts me 2 years behind though :/
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It's worth it if you're truly set on one of those marquee subspecialties. Before I enter medical school, my plan was to finish school on time and do a 3 year residency as FM, general IM, or EM and bank dollar rolls. Now, I'm planning to enter a field where there's a total of 6 years in training, where my first 2-3 years are going to be pure hell.
 
Black Coffee 24/7 said:
It's worth it if you're truly set on one of those marquee subspecialties. Before I enter medical school, my plan was to finish school on time and do a 3 year residency as FM, general IM, or EM and bank dollar rolls. Now, I'm planning to enter a field where there's a total of 6 years in training, where my first 2-3 years are going to be pure hell.
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What field is that?
 
Does anyone know of any bridge programs where you are essentially "gaurunteed" MD acceptance upon completion with certain grade criteria?
 
Drbench said:
513 with a <3.4 gpa.
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Notice I wrote, "Am I missing something here?" The GPA could be one of the things why you might not be getting love from MD schools. As far as DO schools, I have a non trad advisee with 3 top 10 interviews, but not for competetive residencies you seek. It's possible if you hit the ground running in pre clinical, arrange research and intelligently plan your rotation schedule. Do your homework, and prepare like you are getting elected. Good luck and best wishes!
 
Angus Avagadro said:
I think @Black Coffee 24/7 said it very well. You scored in the 89%tile on the mcat and you aren't in an MD school? I am missing something here. That score should get you a look by some Ivys, IF, the rest of your app is competetive.For sure the MCAT and Step score isn't guaranteed acceptance, but it should give you a look by the school or residency program. I think having preconditions about medicine or specialties is a mistake and a set up for disappointment. Keep an open mind. Was your med school list not broad and diverse enough? If a competetive specialty is still your mindset, I'd find out what was weak about my app and apply to an MD school. I think beating your head against the wall as a DO to get a competetive residency,(improbable but not impossible), will be lower yield than improving your app and going to an MD school where your chances at matching your residency will improve. This is my opinion after reading your OP and your responses to other posters. Good luck and best wishes!
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He is probably part of the cohort of DO students that did well on the MCAT but did poorly first year or two of undergrad. That GPA hit follows you forever even if you clearly are smart enough to stomp the MCAT. There are many of us who did even better on the mcat than OP but did not pursue a post-bacc for whatever reason. I regret not doing it all the time in hindsight. I would suggest to the OP to absolutely do a post-bacc if he is making a thread like this. I wish I did. Unfortunately admissions committees think how you did in freshmen year matters more than these other things thus DO.

That said, there is no guarantee that he will be good enough in an MD school. It's all about maximizing your chances though.
 
Black Coffee 24/7 said:
A 513 with multiple pubs and tons of volunteer hours will get plenty of MD love if OP demonstrates an upward trend.
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...and has stellar letters and is working with “underserved people” and has some really convincing personal experience/struggle that translates into excellent essays and then when op gets one or maybe 2 interviews op crushes them. Coolest cat in the building.
Or
OP is black and transgender, leading to Multiple MD acceptances with no interview required.
 
TheRealCookieMonster said:
...and has stellar letters and is working with “underserved people” and has some really convincing personal experience/struggle that translates into excellent essays and then when op gets one or maybe 2 interviews op crushes them. Coolest cat in the building.
Or
OP is black and transgender, leading to Multiple MD acceptances with no interview required.
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What was the point of your post?
 
Bump. Any MD bridge programs that essentially guarantee acceptance? Like drexel's?
 
Drbench said:
Bump. Any MD bridge programs that essentially guarantee acceptance? Like drexel's?
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google is a hell of a thing, for many of these questions. You aren't gonna get a specific answer because there are a ton of variables, with your future performance, interests, etc. Everyone comes in wanting competitive stuff and thinks they'll work hard enough to get there. Statistically, that's impossible
 
Chibucks15 said:
google is a hell of a thing, for many of these questions. You aren't gonna get a specific answer because there are a ton of variables, with your future performance, interests, etc. Everyone comes in wanting competitive stuff and thinks they'll work hard enough to get there. Statistically, that's impossible
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"Statistically that's impossible"
Provide your calculations please
I'm not being sarcastic, genuinely curious
 
Drbench said:
"Statistically that's impossible"
Provide your calculations please
I'm not being sarcastic, genuinely curious
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Basic statistics. Half the class will be at the bottom of the class. Half of all people who take boards will be below average. There's not any calculations, its basic logic.

We are all high achieving people who have (mostly) been at the top of the class for everything. We all come in thinking that we're gonna hit the ground running and kill it. Most of us dont. It is what it is.
 
DO2015CA said:
What was the point of your post?
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Reiterating the fact that a 513 means very little. Especially, with the shift away from applicant metrics and towards "Holistic Review". Your identity means just as much as your metrics.
 
alprazoslam said:
Maybe your school isn’t infested w the SJW crowd as mine is
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MD schools prioritize this kind of thing >> DO schools. DO schools are obviously a little behind the curve. Which is why when applying to a DO school a 513 MCAT, > 3.0gpa, and a pulse usually gets you an acceptance. No identity politics because they just need warm bodies.
 
If OP has a 513, he needs to apply MD more broadly. Someone will give you some love and probably scholarships. And you will match better per board/school performance just do to the letters behind your name. Go MD young man.

If there is one thing rotations has taught me its that primary care makes more than online surveys say, but specialists still double if not triple that. When I see a cardiologist pulling over 100k a month, sorry primary care ain't doing that. And while you could do it as a DO, its a whole lot easier to be a specialist from MD.
 
Drbench said:
URM =/= disadvantaged
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Ummm statistically yes it does. An URM is many times more likely to be disadvantaged socioeconomically. And I hate to break it to some of the butthurt SDNers but race isn’t looked at in a vacuum. I’m white and applied as disadvantaged status and got into a medical school with stats significantly below the class average. If you’re a “poor white kid” and think you didn’t get squat it’s probably bc you’re not as poor as you think you are or you’re not as likeable in an interview as you think you are.
 
BorntobeDO? said:
If OP has a 513, he needs to apply MD more broadly. Someone will give you some love and probably scholarships.
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I completely agree that you should go MD if you can.
But a 513 isn’t earning anyone an MD acceptance without some other very outstanding experiences and good gpa.
Scholarships for a 513?!?! Where?!?!
 
Dr.Bruh said:
Ummm statistically yes it does. An URM is many times more likely to be disadvantaged socioeconomically. And I hate to break it to some of the butthurt SDNers but race isn’t looked at in a vacuum. I’m white and applied as disadvantaged status and got into a medical school with stats significantly below the class average. If you’re a “poor white kid” and think you didn’t get squat it’s probably bc you’re not as poor as you think you are or you’re not as likeable in an interview as you think you are.
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By definition URM is not analogous to being disadvantaged.
Just because a URM is more likely to be disadvantaged does not warrant applicants to be favored for something as arbitrary as race without socioeconomic status being controlled for. The fact that you had to apply as a disadvantaged applicant and not just check a box is what these "butthurt" people are referring to.
But let's stay on topic here please.
 
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TheRealCookieMonster said:
MD schools prioritize this kind of thing >> DO schools. DO schools are obviously a little behind the curve. Which is why when applying to a DO school a 513 MCAT, > 3.0gpa, and a pulse usually gets you an acceptance. No identity politics because they just need warm bodies.
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I've had 10 DO interview invites. Not one MD. Pretty difficult to understand why, aside from gpa, which I didn't think would be such an issue considering my upward trend.
 
Drbench said:
I've had 10 DO interview invites. Not one MD. Pretty difficult to understand why, aside from gpa, which I didn't think would be such an issue considering my upward trend.
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You're essays might suck. They matter more than people think
 
Drbench said:
I've had 10 DO interview invites. Not one MD. Pretty difficult to understand why, aside from gpa, which I didn't think would be such an issue considering my upward trend.
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Feels weird right? DO schools are working like calculators rn and you can use your lizzy score and all that to basically find your likelyhood. Just a numbers game. And don’t be a jerk at the interview.
MD won’t touch you unless you have some special characteristic on top of being competitive metrically. Whether that is veteran status, your skin color, sexuality lol, or your income. Some schools don’t even care about your metrics as long as you’ve got one of those special cards. Long story short - it’s probably because you’re not special 🙁 but that’s what DO school is for 🙂 all the people who need a second chance or worked hard but are just regular people.
 
Honestly, IMO if you're not okay with doing FM, IM or Peds you shouldn't go to medical school at all, much less a DO school. The truth is a graduate from either an MD or DO school is much more likely to end up in one of those three fields than they are in any surgical subspecialty, derm, IR or rad onc - it just doesn't make sense to go to medical school strictly for the chance to match one of those vanishingly small specialties. The vast majority of medicine is, well, medicine and if you're not into it you probably should look into something else since that's probably what you will end up matching into.
 
Deecee2DO said:
that URM advantage is very very real
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Depends on your definition of advantage. If you mean a smaller proportion of URM applicants get admitted to medical school, then yes, advantage is real.
upload_2019-2-22_9-46-26.png
 
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