Is $130K worth a 4 year commitment?

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Pharmcdc

Pharmcdc

Troches & lollipops
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Hi everyone! I have not been around here much this semester. Hope everyone is doing well. Here is the scoop. I stumbled upon this deal with the VA. They will pay for my P3 and P4 tuition, books, and fees which my tuition is 25,500 a year. During my P3 year they will pay me $38,000. During P4, $40,000 I will be hired, and everything starts, full benefits, insur, retirement, etc. In return I must give them 3 years for each year. The clock starts upon getting hired. So essentially, I will owe them 4 years after I graduate in 2010 because two years will have been exhausted while Im in school. If I graduated today, my starting pay would be $97,000. After 1 year I would be stepped and it would go to $101,000. I graduate in 2 years so Im sure the starting pay will be over 100k.

Pros: Student loans cut 1/2, Salaried student, start out years ahead of where I would have finacially. The VA was a preference for me anyway.

Cons: I have to stay where I am, cannot transfer to another VA during my commitment, A residency is not included meaning I am expected to start working upon graduation. I will miss out on any other opportunities because I'll be locked into this one.

I was a little hesitant about posting this on a public forum but I do value many of your opinions. I talked with some professors that I respect and the only caution was to make sure that Im not missing out on something else that I really want to do. What do you guys think? Some of you guys that have been practicing for a while give really good advice, and I value your opinions. Thanks. Oh, and no I dont have to work during the semester, or even during the summer. My "JOB" is to go to school. Thanks.
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Absolutly 100% I would do it. I worked as a student at a VA hospital at it was a great experience. You must have selected one of those jobs designated as hard to fill. I was checking into the VA jobs around here in Dallas yesterday and there were several of them posted.

You can't beat the VA for working conditions. Usually it is Monday through Friday 8-430. No or little weekends and all federal holidays off. The VA is very progrssive as well since they are federal and not governed by the state. Pharmacists play a very big role in healthcare at the VA.
 
MountainPharmD said:
Absolutly 100% I would do it. I worked as a student at a VA hospital at it was a great experience. You must have selected one of those jobs designated as hard to fill. I was checking into the VA jobs around here in Dallas yesterday and there were several of them posted.

You can't beat the VA for working conditions. Usually it is Monday through Friday 8-430. No or little weekends and all federal holidays off. The VA is very progrssive as well since they are federal and not governed by the state. Pharmacists play a very big role in healthcare at the VA.
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Thanks for your comment Mountain. You are right on, the VA in SA I was told has 19 openings for pharmacists. I would fill one of those. I was also told that the VA in Harlingen TX has openings and a pharamcist was offered $135K/year as a staff pharmacist. I mean it is in Harlingen, but dang $135K in south Texas is like making almost twice as much elsewhere. Anyway, I hope you all dont think I am all about the money. However, we can't live without it(or without someone's) I just need to make sure that I am not making a mistake. I really can't find a reason NOT to do this though! Thus the posting.
 
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The only negative thing that I've noticed about VA pharmacists is that they are really, really slow in retail. I don't know why, but I have an inkling that they don't adjust to processing private insurance very well. If you can straddle in another branch of pharmacy to keep your feet wet (from the get-go), then I think your decision will be worthwhile.
 
PharmDstudent said:
The only negative thing that I've noticed about VA pharmacists is that they are really, really slow in retail. I don't know why, but I have an inkling that they don't adjust to processing private insurance very well. If you can straddle in another branch of pharmacy to keep your feet wet (from the get-go), then I think your decision will be worthwhile.
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Hey, that is exactly what I want to do. I currently work as a wal-mart intern(i dont work during school though), and plan on staying with them for now anyway since I know their computer system. Since I dont have a lot of tech/intern experience, insurance processing is an issue for me. So if I can handle it comfortably, I would like to continue to work part time in a retail setting. Everyone comments on how retail pharmacists cant go work in a hospital( i agree a complete over generalization), same can also be said about hospital pharmacists keeping up with the pace of a high volume retail setting. I guess you have to pick your strength, or what you like.
 
the VA is a really good place to get into from what I hear. I would take it if you like the job!
 
If your single and the area is ok. Then go for it. Why not, lots of benefits in terms of loan reduction, good salary, VA benefits, etc.
 
How did you get this offer, you approached them, or did they find you?
 
ahhhh Harlingen... where DOPs get paid $160,000+.......
 
How many hours are you going to be required to work during your P3 and P4 year when you're making the $38 and $40K?
 
Another thing to think about- the VA may actually be on the cutting edge in new treatments and therapies, especially for Traumatic Brain Injuries. We have thousands and thousands of wounded servicemembers returning from the war, and most of them will be moved out of the military medical system and into the VA system. This could be a very, very interesting time to be a VA medical practitioner (including pharmacists).
 
eelo said:
Another thing to think about- the VA may actually be on the cutting edge in new treatments and therapies, especially for Traumatic Brain Injuries. We have thousands and thousands of wounded servicemembers returning from the war, and most of them will be moved out of the military medical system and into the VA system. This could be a very, very interesting time to be a VA medical practitioner (including pharmacists).
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So is not having residency training going to limit me? Is this something that I should ask to have the opportunity to have? I would like to complete a residency with the VA, although I know I would have to go through the match, but the question is should that be a deal breaker or not?
 
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Pharmcdc said:
So is not having residency training going to limit me? Is this something that I should ask to have the opportunity to have? I would like to complete a residency with the VA, although I know I would have to go through the match, but the question is should that be a deal breaker or not?
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I don't think the lack of a residency would limit you. In fact, if my suspiscions about the TBI research are true, I think that would be darn close to a residency program anyhow. It really depends on how you feel about wrking with the population of VA patients. Right now, the majority of VA patients are older, but I really believe (this is just me talking) that int he next 5 years or so, the population will shift and VA patients will be younger and have a different set of medical conditions.

Heck, if I had the opportunity to do this, I'd do it in a heartbeat.
 
eelo said:
I don't think the lack of a residency would limit you. In fact, if my suspiscions about the TBI research are true, I think that would be darn close to a residency program anyhow. It really depends on how you feel about wrking with the population of VA patients. Right now, the majority of VA patients are older, but I really believe (this is just me talking) that int he next 5 years or so, the population will shift and VA patients will be younger and have a different set of medical conditions.

Heck, if I had the opportunity to do this, I'd do it in a heartbeat.
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Cool eelo, thanks for the advice!
 
Found these:

http://www.vacareers.va.gov/l2_Salary_Support.cfm#Link1; click on General Programs, takes you to:
http://www.va.gov/oaa/fellowships/Trainee_support.doc

The info is kind of old, but the links and contact numbers should still be good.

From the first link, this might be the applicable program:
VA National Education for Employees Program (VANEEP): This program offers salary replacement money to VA employees who are enrolled full-time in an approved education program. VANEEP participants agree to work at their VA facility during academic breaks and, in return, receive full salary and payment for education costs, including tuition, books, and certain fees.
 
wow, this sounds like such a great opportunity!! which it was happening to me....

I would say go for it!! I think pharmacy residencies may be a little overrated anyways....
 
Gizmo said:
I want to know too.
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Well, first let me say that I did not get this deal because I am someone special. The VA here had a need and aquired the funding for pharmacist recruiting and this is a program they rolled out from what I gather. I am not the only student, from what I was told there were about 5 or 6 slots. The VA here did not extent this program to my school initially because it was originally only for P4 students. Since my school does not have P4's and we are here in town they considered/decided to open it up to P3's as well. I happened to be in the right place at the right time.

I had a couple of appointments at the VA back in Feb with a couple of hours between them. While waiting on my second appt I went down the cheif of pharmacy office to introduce myself and to inquire about student opportunities. I ended up having an extensive conversation with a gentlemen who worked just under the chief of pharmacy who told me about the program, however at that time he did not have literature on it. Fast forward to April, and I got assigned an IPPE at the VA for the end of this semester. As I was getting my paperwork completed with the VA HR, I asked about the program. I was given the application, turned it in, and guess who was going to interview me......................The guy I had the long conversation with two months earlier! Case closed. They told me if I would have waited another day I may not have gotten it because it was the last slot.

I know the post was long, but I believe that you should always believe in who you are, dont be afraid to ask questions, or to meet people. There is a fine line between confidence and arrogance, always stay on the side of the former, the latter will make people dislike you. The former will make some people like you, and others envy. You cant control that. Confidence and humbleness goes a long way!!!!! You can wait on opportunities to come to you, but if you seek them, then you will be ahead of those who simply wait...........Sorry for the long post, just my two cents.:thumbup:
 
eelo said:
Found these:

http://www.vacareers.va.gov/l2_Salary_Support.cfm#Link1; click on General Programs, takes you to:
http://www.va.gov/oaa/fellowships/Trainee_support.doc

The info is kind of old, but the links and contact numbers should still be good.

From the first link, this might be the applicable program:
VA National Education for Employees Program (VANEEP): This program offers salary replacement money to VA employees who are enrolled full-time in an approved education program. VANEEP participants agree to work at their VA facility during academic breaks and, in return, receive full salary and payment for education costs, including tuition, books, and certain fees.
Click to expand...

Eelo is correct, however dont stop with what you find online, contact the VA that you are interested in working at and talk to their HR department. Each VA has autonomy with their programs, such as the one that I am in. If I would not have inquired about it I would not have found out about it. If there is a city that you would consider living in, find out if they have a VA, most do, and call the HR department to find out about student/pharmacist opportunities. I would do this with any company that I want to work for.
 
Epic said:
DOP is a thankless job..
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Epic said:
ahhhh Harlingen... where DOPs get paid $160,000+.......
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Way to go. Who wants to be a DOP after the first post? I thought you were a better strategist than that! Now it just looks like they throw a bunch of cash at the DOPs, but they don't actually give a crap about them. :rolleyes:
 
PharmDstudent said:
Way to go. Who wants to be a DOP after the first post? I thought you were a better strategist than that! Now it just looks like they throw a bunch of cash at the DOPs, but they don't actually give a crap about them. :rolleyes:
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No, you're missing the point.

Harlingen is so bad.. they have to pay bank to get someone down there..


Get off the internet and go study.
 
Epic said:
No, you're missing the point.

Harlingen is so bad.. they have to pay bank to get someone down there..


Get off the internet and go study.
Click to expand...
Maybe I didn't get your point, but somehow the VA can drag them in. :rolleyes:

I can't study. It's getting to that point. I started studying too early, and now I'm bored with it.
 
Epic said:
No it's not. Flyfishing is.
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I guess I could be a spectator.

brad.jpg



(Sorry for the threadjacking! If you can tour the VA facility, it might help you with your decision.)
 
PharmDstudent said:
I guess I could be a spectator.

brad.jpg



(Sorry for the threadjacking! If you can tour the VA facility, it might help you with your decision.)
Click to expand...

That's a funny looking trout.
 
Pharmcdc said:
Hi everyone! I have not been around here much this semester. Hope everyone is doing well. Here is the scoop. I stumbled upon this deal with the VA. They will pay for my P3 and P4 tuition, books, and fees which my tuition is 25,500 a year. During my P3 year they will pay me $38,000. During P4, $40,000 I will be hired, and everything starts, full benefits, insur, retirement, etc. In return I must give them 3 years for each year. The clock starts upon getting hired. So essentially, I will owe them 4 years after I graduate in 2010 because two years will have been exhausted while Im in school. If I graduated today, my starting pay would be $97,000. After 1 year I would be stepped and it would go to $101,000. I graduate in 2 years so Im sure the starting pay will be over 100k.

Pros: Student loans cut 1/2, Salaried student, start out years ahead of where I would have finacially. The VA was a preference for me anyway.

Cons: I have to stay where I am, cannot transfer to another VA during my commitment, A residency is not included meaning I am expected to start working upon graduation. I will miss out on any other opportunities because I'll be locked into this one.

I was a little hesitant about posting this on a public forum but I do value many of your opinions. I talked with some professors that I respect and the only caution was to make sure that Im not missing out on something else that I really want to do. What do you guys think? Some of you guys that have been practicing for a while give really good advice, and I value your opinions. Thanks. Oh, and no I dont have to work during the semester, or even during the summer. My "JOB" is to go to school. Thanks.
Click to expand...

so when you graduate and start working for the VA what exactly will you be doing?? Will it be a retail type of job or something else???
 
and where will you be located...or do you get to pick??
 
I know that he is not able to move, but when you sign up for this deal do you get to pick where you want to go...or is it where ever you do pharmacy school?
 
What is the name of the program?
 
This sounds like a very good deal. I went to the link though and it says you have to work during academic breaks. Pharmcdc, how did you manage to not have to do that? I'd also like to know if you can work at any VA hospital and how I can apply for this.
 
starsweet said:
This sounds like a very good deal. I went to the link though and it says you have to work during academic breaks. Pharmcdc, how did you manage to not have to do that? I'd also like to know if you can work at any VA hospital and how I can apply for this.
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Hey Starsweet! I must update you all. I spent the last week of IPPE at the VA, and let me tell you I LOVE IT!!!! Geriatrics rocks, that was by far the most interesting area, although I wouldnt mind working in any.

When I originally posted this thread, I was getting information about the program from individuals that where learning about the program as well. The individuals at the VA are not all experts on the program because it appears that myself along with another student from UH are the first to enter this. Two more students(from where, I dont know) are entering in the near future Yes, I have to work during summer breaks which is actually awesome because I wanted to work there to learn the system. An additional correction which made me question the decision even more is that the "clock" does not start for my repayment once in the program. Although everything (benefits, pay, retirement) else starts, the time repayment does not. This was mispoken, so it is a total of 6 years for 2 years in the program, or 3 years for 1, obviously. Now, one does have the option to pay back the money(thats a lot! about 22k per yr for me) and leave the VA if absolutely neccessary.

As for questions about location, well this program was created for the great shortage here in south Texas, so, this is the only VA system(the VA is broken up into regions called visons) that has this program and anyone in it must work in the south Tx area VA system to complete the contract. I was told that I am one of only 4 students in the program. I was also told that if we are successful, that is no academic issues, and we honor the commitment after graduation, that the program may continue to get funding in the future.

The VA does have some other programs, I honestly have not followed the link posted previously so I am not sure about them. The program Im in is simply called the Student Pharmacist Program. I believe it is unique to our area, but I would check with the HR department at your local VA, or any that you would not mind relocating to. If this program popped up here, maybe it will happen elsewhere.
 
Oh yeah, I have orientation tomorrow and Tues. So I may have some additional info then. The summer job does not, will not interfere with school, so if taking summer classes, well school comes first.
 
I hope you have visited Harlingen, and the rest of the South Texas region to know what you are in for. Personally, although the program sounds great, the location stinks. If that doesn't matter to you... go for it.
 
Alby said:
I hope you have visited Harlingen, and the rest of the South Texas region to know what you are in for. Personally, although the program sounds great, the location stinks. If that doesn't matter to you... go for it.
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Yep. I went for it, and I am so excited about it! I am not really concerned about the whole Harlingen valley thing. I was in the AF for 8+ years, so I think I can deal. Besides, the DOP is a very nice guy and I am developing a great relationship with he and the assistant DOP. I have been reassured that they are not into "mandating" someone to go to a job that they dont want. The need in SA is just as great as it is in the valley, and there are some new clinics, and additions being added to the VA in SA which is very encouraging.

Additionally, today the DOP told me that over the summer not only would I be able to spend time in the outpatient and inpatient pharmacies, but I would also be able to spend time with the clinical pharmacists, especially if there is an area of particular interest. I will have the oportunity to work with the residents, and rotation students with any projects/presentations that they may have. He even told me that now was the time to establish myself if in fact I am serious about a residency. They take 7 students. There are pharmacists who work soley in the ER, OR, and internal medicine. There is a spinal injury pharmacist, and three geriatric clinicians. Believe it or not, there is a pharmacist who is in charge of residency program and he is over the internal medical program the medical students rotate through. When he walks through the hospital, people greet him as Dr. so and so, hello Dr so and so. Not that it matters, but to me it just shows his level of respect in the hospital. He is retiring from the VA and was just hired as one of our faculty members!!! woohoo! Its all about connections!
 
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