Navy Is matching into a civilian residency difficult after completing a tour as a GMO?

[Beneath the marquee]

Background: I am applying for Navy HPSP. I would like to do a military residency in EM but I don't mind spending the 3-4 years as a GMO either.

After medical school, let's say I don't match into a military residency. If I serve my HPSP time as a GMO, how difficult will it be to match into a civilian residency after being discharged? What are some things I can do to improve my civilian match probability after my service? Thank you in advance.

Note: I realize my interests may change during medical school, but EM is something that has been on my mind for quite some time now.

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[orbitsurgMD]

Background: I am applying for Navy HPSP. I would like to do a military residency in EM but I don't mind spending the 3-4 years as a GMO either.

After medical school, let's say I don't match into a military residency. If I serve my HPSP time as a GMO, how difficult will it be to match into a civilian residency after being discharged? What are some things I can do to improve my civilian match probability after my service? Thank you in advance.

Note: I realize my interests may change during medical school, but EM is something that has been on my mind for quite some time now.

In general, no. GMO and out to residency is fairly common, sometimes by choice and other times by default.

Some specialties seem to prefer to take M4s directly, surgery specialties particularly. Others are quite happy to get military applicants. EM is typically one of those.

That said, EM is perenially in demand. You could easily get some kind of post-residency deal to pay off your loans if you didn't take HPSP and applied for commissioning after residency. You would also have a much broader choice of residencies and no interference in your timing of training by the military. You would also be paid much better as an EM specialist than as a GMO.

 

[Beneath the marquee]

In general, no. GMO and out to residency is fairly common, sometimes by choice and other times by default.

Some specialties seem to prefer to take M4s directly, surgery specialties particularly. Others are quite happy to get military applicants. EM is typically one of those.

That said, EM is perenially in demand. You could easily get some kind of post-residency deal to pay off your loans if you didn't take HPSP and applied for commissioning after residency. You would also have a much broader choice of residencies and no interference in your timing of training by the military. You would also be paid much better as an EM specialist than as a GMO.

Thank you very much

 

[DOswag]

Agree with orbitsurg. I’m USAF HPSP in first year out of residency psychiatry. When I was an MS4 I was interested in EM and doing a rotation at my home program at the time and had this discussion with the program director. He said they had taken several residents that had done GMO tours and completed their payback time before coming back to residency. Mind you this was in 2013 so a few years ago but I suspect it won’t hurt you but the experience you gain from having a year of training and then GMO time is probably beneficial to your application for residency.

 

[HighPriest]

It's a lot like asking if you'll be able to swim after you have knee surgery. As long as you could swim beforehand, you should be able to do it after too.

 

[pawprint]

Matching after GMO time isn't an issue at all, it is viewed as the opposite. Your military service as a GMO will place you far above other applicants coming straight out of med school regardless of specialty. This is assuming you are applying to start residency back at intern year and not trying to squeeze into a 2nd year slot somewhere.

Think about it, what benefit would someone coming straight out of med school have over you? You have already completed an intern year, so you already have experience doing many of the skills they are teaching everyone else for the first time. It will easier to learn this time around since you have already done it once. You have already passed step 3, so board exams don't matter at this point since you passed. You have spent several years taking care of patients on your own, honing your skills to develop your own differentials thousands of times. You have learned when it is important to reach out for help and how to do so effectively.

The only advantage a med student has is that maybe they have used the EMR system the hospital uses more recently. If you are going to a speciatly that requires research, do that while in med school and if you need to get stuff done while a GMO, you can do that too, so a med student shouldnt have an advantage there (if anything, they have 5 less years than you to do research). Doing a couple rotations in the specialty as a 4th year med student does not outweigh having already completed an intern year AND practicing general medicine on your own for 4 years. Even for surgical specialties, med students aren't walking in with anything you don't also have. Maybe they've been in the OR more recently, but so what? As a new surgical intern, your program isnt going to rely on what you did on a rotation in med school as your baseline. They are going to teach you how to do what they want you to do.

The only people I have heard who have had a hard time matching after GMO and out are people who had screwed up while in the military, or who had such significant issues in med school that their GMO time couldn't outweigh it.

 

[Gastrapathy]

Yeah...it’s not that simple. There are definitely programs that will not want someone who hasn’t followed a traditional track. There are probably others who like it. The idea that programs prefer experience isn’t always true. It’s sometimes harder to retrain a resident.

EM is probably a good specialty for this (although increasingly competitive). Just make sure you get some SLOEs as a MS4.

 

[Apollyon]

Just an anecdote: when I was a resident, there was a dude that had done GMO, and matched in ortho, when I don't think he would have been competitive, otherwise. If you know my history, you know where that is, but I don't want to skyline that guy. But, it was a quite highly powered place.

Anecdote, yes, and, I do not want to disagree with @Gastrapathy , but, just wanted to offer my little bit.

 

[j4pac]

Yeah...it’s not that simple. There are definitely programs that will not want someone who hasn’t followed a traditional track. There are probably others who like it. The idea that programs prefer experience isn’t always true. It’s sometimes harder to retrain a resident.

EM is probably a good specialty for this (although increasingly competitive). Just make sure you get some SLOEs as a MS4.

This is correct. Some may not like your experience, some may fear your time away from academics, some DON’T like military personnel, and some may demand an audition. But the truth is that you match to a program, not by everyone program liking you, but by having at least one program that really loves you. The likelihood of that happening as a military applicant is higher than average because the ability to stand apart.

I have also seen military service help applicants become significantly more competitive to match into elite programs that they would have never had a chance if they didn’t have their experience. The key is a decent match strategy and time available to pull it off.

 

[Serenity89]

For me... I matched this year after 4 year USAF GMO tour. I think I got filtered by some programs on ERAS due to being a COM2015 grad... (by my own med school, no less. No interview.)

I matched into a program I am perfectly happy with, and they seemed extremely happy during the interview that I was a military applicant! And I got a decent amount of interviews. I would say this is program dependent for sure, how strong you are as applicant, etc. But being a GMO and a while since you graduated will definitely cause you some anxiety... I know it did for me.

 

[Gastrapathy]

@Serenity89

congrats!

 

[navdoc47]

one of the joys of avoiding debt via HPSP is that there's a good chance you will have to repeat your intern year when you enter a civilian program

 

[Grade4BorBor]

It's doable, I did it. Now past my 8 year mark and leaving the IRR.

It's a good idea to get your SLOE early. Not impossible, but harder to do if you are on Active Duty stationed on Diego Garcia.

 

[DefinitelyNotMatt]

Following this thread. USAF flight surgeon separating and going EM this year too. Has anyone heard of any issues with funding residency because GMO's have already done a PGY-1 year? I did my PGY-1 as Active Duty, so maybe the payer is different than medicare funded spots.

 

[Grade4BorBor]

Following this thread. USAF flight surgeon separating and going EM this year too. Has anyone heard of any issues with funding residency because GMO's have already done a PGY-1 year? I did my PGY-1 as Active Duty, so maybe the payer is different than medicare funded spots.

I was in the same situation and, as far as I know, no problem with funding my intern year.