Lived in a car. MD achievable?

[j4079]

I began my college career as a child, getting kicked out my university for a year, and wound up living in a car for a few months. I left my university with a 2.488 GPA (mostly due to living in a car, but no excuses). The year away from my University I went to a community college and took 34 credits, all of which were As except for 4 credits in physics. Bummer. Now I am back at my university and am getting straight As. I calculated that if I continue to get As, with the wiggle room of 12 credits of Bs, I will end up with a 3.6. I am now currently a part of several university clubs and will begin volunteering at the ER by next month. (Obviously need to do well on the MCAT)

Is that good enough for decent MD schools? What else can I do to maximize my chances? Really wish I had a mentor, all advice is appreciated.

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[Pagan FutureDoc]

if I can do it you can do it. It's not easy but it's possible.
On the plus side you have an interesting story and the possibility of a strong rising trend. If you can't maintain near straight As, then DO schools would be a much better bet with their typically lower stats and grade replacement.

Best of luck

 

[LizzyM]

Google AAMC Table 24. Look at the table that pertains to your racial group. You'll see what your chances are for a given GPA. With a 3.6 and a strong upward trend and an interesting back story you might have odds that are better than average (which is about 43% of applicants getting admitted somewhere).

 

[Goro]

Very doable. You have what I call a compelling story, and we all love a comeback story as well. It's in our DNA. I've had several students over the years who have been homeless for a time prior to med school.

I began my college career as a child, getting kicked out my university for a year, and wound up living in a car for a few months. I left my university with a 2.488 GPA (mostly due to living in a car, but no excuses). The year away from my University I went to a community college and took 34 credits, all of which were As except for 4 credits in physics. Bummer. Now I am back at my university and am getting straight As. I calculated that if I continue to get As, with the wiggle room of 12 credits of Bs, I will end up with a 3.6. I am now currently a part of several university clubs and will begin volunteering at the ER by next month. (Obviously need to do well on the MCAT)

Is that good enough for decent MD schools? What else can I do to maximize my chances? Really wish I had a mentor, all advice is appreciated.

 

[j4079]

Thank you everyone for the motivation! Some of you say that it's a compelling story.. But I figured that I would leave it out of my application? I figured the whole "getting kicked out of school" thing is something that I should shy away from.

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[j4079]

Oh and not to mention I'm a white male

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[j4079]

if I can do it you can do it. It's not easy but it's possible.
On the plus side you have an interesting story and the possibility of a strong rising trend. If you can't maintain near straight As, then DO schools would be a much better bet with their typically lower stats and grade replacement.

Best of luck

In humbleness, I will be able to maintain the grades. Do you have any other advice to increase my chances? I am applying for research, and am going to try to go on a medical mission trip to Haiti over spring break.

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[LoveBeingHuman:)]

In humbleness, I will be able to maintain the grades. Do you have any other advice to increase my chances? I am applying for research, and am going to try to go on a medical mission trip to Haiti over spring break.

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You've had an opportunity to increase your grades, make sure you can handle it! Don't overburden yourself. Your story is amazing and you just have to push through to make it

 

[candbgirl]

Skip the medical mission trip to Haiti and find some humanitarian groups right in your own backyard. Much more impressive than a seven day gig in Haiti.and besides ADCOMS look at these trips with a jaded eye. Good luck to you!


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[LizzyM]

You will be obligated to report that you were kicked out of school as that is what is called an "institututional action" and there is a special place on the application to report and explain it.

If you believe you have any particular insights into the living conditions of specific subgroups of patients based on your own experiences or you have an interest to serve in underserved areas or to take a particular interest in underserved groups such as the homeless (e.g. see Santa Barbara Street Medicine for a voluntary effort toward that population), then it belongs in your personal statement which is an essay describing your path toward medicine and why you have chosen it as a career goal.

 

[j4079]

You will be obligated to report that you were kicked out of school as that is what is called an "institututional action" and there is a special place on the application to report and explain it.

If you believe you have any particular insights into the living conditions of specific subgroups of patients based on your own experiences or you have an interest to serve in underserved areas or to take a particular interest in underserved groups such as the homeless (e.g. see Santa Barbara Street Medicine for a voluntary effort toward that population), then it belongs in your personal statement which is an essay describing your path toward medicine and why you have chosen it as a career goal.

As far as HAVING to report it, I don't think that it's on any record.. and I for sure didn't get in any legal trouble, though I was close. Would I still have to? Should I anyway? Could it be beneficial telling them?

Perhaps I could leave it at "I got in trouble and lived in a car for a few months." I'm just really worried the reason for me getting kicked out is detrimental and will make schools question if they really want to bring someone like me into their school.

 

[DokterMom]

As far as HAVING to report it, I don't think that it's on any record.. and I for sure didn't get in any legal trouble, though I was close. Would I still have to? Should I anyway? Could it be beneficial telling them?

Perhaps I could leave it at "I got in trouble and lived in a car for a few months." I'm just really worried the reason for me getting kicked out is detrimental and will make schools question if they really want to bring someone like me into their school.

Skip the 'kicked out of school and lived in my car' angle and you become an ordinary white guy competing on a level-but-boring playing field against all of the other ordinary white guys who didn't go through your particular gauntlets. Sure, your gauntlet was of your own making. But you grew from it, right?

If you were to focus your actions on serving the homeless, you'd have the potential for a very cohesive and compelling story.

 

[gyngyn]

As far as HAVING to report it, I don't think that it's on any record.. and I for sure didn't get in any legal trouble, though I was close. Would I still have to? Should I anyway? Could it be beneficial telling them?

Perhaps I could leave it at "I got in trouble and lived in a car for a few months." I'm just really worried the reason for me getting kicked out is detrimental and will make schools question if they really want to bring someone like me into their school.

"Institutional Action
You must answer Yes to this question if you were ever the recipient of any institutional action by any college or medical school for unacceptable academic performance or conduct violation, even if such action did not interrupt your enrollment or require you to withdraw. You must answer Yes even if the action does not appear on or has been deleted or expunged from your official transcripts due to institutional policy or personal petition. If you answer Yes, you must briefly explain each instance, along with the date(s) of occurrence (MM/YYYY)." (italics, mine)
https://aamc-orange.global.ssl.fast...c6de/2017_amcas_instruction_manual-_final.pdf

 

[j4079]

"Institutional Action
You must answer Yes to this question if you were ever the recipient of any institutional action by any college or medical school for unacceptable academic performance or conduct violation, even if such action did not interrupt your enrollment or require you to withdraw. You must answer Yes even if the action does not appear on or has been deleted or expunged from your official transcripts due to institutional policy or personal petition. If you answer Yes, you must briefly explain each instance, along with the date(s) of occurrence (MM/YYYY)." (italics, mine)
https://aamc-orange.global.ssl.fast...c6de/2017_amcas_instruction_manual-_final.pdf

Very useful! Thanks. So the verdict is that I will tell them about it. I mean I have to anyway.

I didn't want to say, but I'm going to go ahead and let you guys know it was due to childish decisions involving Marijuana. Wouldn't involvement with drugs keep me out of medical school for good? I want you all to know that I haven't touched it since, and I did not get in any legal trouble.

 

[j4079]

Bump

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[LizzyM]

It is not an absolute deal breaker. If you have many years of being a solid citizen since then, you may be fine but you do need to report it. I thought you had been kicked out for a low GPA. MJ is not good but not as bad as being kicked out for stealing rare manuscripts from the library or hacking the computers and changing your grades. That's the really bad stuff.

 

[Goro]

Nope.

I didn't want to say, but I'm going to go ahead and let you guys know it was due to childish decisions involving Marijuana. Wouldn't involvement with drugs keep me out of medical school for good? I want you all to know that I haven't touched it since, and I did not get in any legal trouble.

 

[rilte4]

Very useful! Thanks. So the verdict is that I will tell them about it. I mean I have to anyway.

I didn't want to say, but I'm going to go ahead and let you guys know it was due to childish decisions involving Marijuana. Wouldn't involvement with drugs keep me out of medical school for good? I want you all to know that I haven't touched it since, and I did not get in any legal trouble.

Isn't this just "life experience" by now?

 

[j4079]

It is not an absolute deal breaker. If you have many years of being a solid citizen since then, you may be fine but you do need to report it. I thought you had been kicked out for a low GPA. MJ is not good but not as bad as being kicked out for stealing rare manuscripts from the library or hacking the computers and changing your grades. That's the really bad stuff.

So it will make it harder for me to get in to an MD school then.. :/

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[Sardinia]

So it will make it harder for me to get in to an MD school then.. :/ Sent from my SM-N910V using SDN mobile

Might have a more successful career working as an internet correspondent for Fox 5 or Gawker.

 

[OchemOficionado]

Oh and not to mention I'm a white male

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Literally the only time I ever see people be :/ about not being a minority. GORO just said you have a compelling story! You're fine. Keep working hard .

 

[Sardinia]

@OchemOficionado I would be sincerely disappointed if scores become such a large frame of contextualizing the individual that a tag line is now sufficient enough to count as being a compelling story.

 

[j4079]

Literally the only time I ever see people be :/ about not being a minority. GORO just said you have a compelling story! You're fine. Keep working hard .

GORO said that without knowing that I was kicked out for Marijuana though..

 

[Sardinia]

@j4079 So do you attribute your 2.4 to living out of a car or the marijuana? If you could afford to take 34 credits of community college, then why didn't you try to get yourself better living conditions, no co-signer? If you only spent a few months living in the car during your undergraduate years, then where were you living the other months of that same calendar year? There is a line between having to live in a car and choosing to live in a car. And most people who've been forced into the prior situation understand that the latter situation requires you to either be really SOL or an idiot who basically chooses to live in a car.

 

[j4079]

@j4079 So do you attribute your 2.4 to living out of a car or the marijuana? If you could afford to take 34 credits of community college, then why didn't you try to get yourself better living conditions, no co-signer? If you only spent a few months living in the car during your undergraduate years, then where were you living the other months of that same calendar year? There is a line between having to live in a car and choosing to live in a car. And most people who've been forced into the prior situation understand that the latter situation requires you to either be really SOL or an idiot who basically chooses to live in a car.

Wow. I really hope that you were one of the few people taking my post that way. To answer your question, I'm blaming myself. I want to make it clear I'm not claiming to be some hero who lived in my car for a year. I really hope that's not how everyone took it. I was going to a university away from home, and got kicked out because of marijuana. They allowed me to finish my classes for that semester but said that I could no longer live on campus, or utilize any University resources. I could go to my classes and that was it. So instead of withdrawing from my classes, I lived in my car for a little over 3 months. Once again, I'm not claiming to be some crazy underdog. I just made a stupid mistake and hope that I can still be redeemed. Though it was only a short period, those few months were the hardest months of my life. I was afraid to go to sleep because I was worried someone would mess with me, or that the police would tell me I couldn't be there. I spent many nights going to places like Walmart or McDonald's because I had nowhere else to go. Then the next day when class came around I would doze off. That's where the GPA comes in. I would 'bathe' in public restrooms where I could only wash my hair, face and armpits. This difficult experience led to a lot of personal growth. Once finishing the semester, I went back home to my parents. That summer I worked and paid for my first semester at community college, and the next semester I got a scholarship for. That was the 34 credits. Now I'm currently back at the University I got kicked out of getting straight As and doing as much as I can to help my application, like volunteer and student organizations.

 

[j4079]

Also worth noting, I was separated for a year. I could not attend the University for at least one year. I had to write a letter and prove to the Dean that I was fit to come back, and he now has a lot of respect for me and is rooting for me to succeed.

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[LizzyM]

OK, you've put this in much more context and that is helpful.

Your three months of "homelessness" (that's what living in your car is) does give you some insights into the lives of people who live that way for years and that personal experience is not a common one in medical school communities and it can be valuable in helping to understand how some patients are getting by.

You'll report it and it could help. Getting an institutional action (IA) for pot is fairly common but it is not common to see someone kicked out of school and living in their car for an infraction. Was it a huge amount? were you dealing? were you at a super-conservative school that had strict penalties for infractions? Provide as many details as you can in your application so that nothing is left to the adcom's imagination.

What I've objected to in this whole thread has been the use of the word "child" and "childish". When you said you went to college a child I pictured some 12 year old child prodigy who wasn't emotionally ready for college. Obviously, not accurate. You also called your behavior "childish". Having pot on campus is not childish. Own that your behavior reflected immaturity and a failure to think through the potential consequences of your choices but don't chalk it up to being childish. That will get you tossed out of the admission process far more quickly that the pot IA.

/rant.

 

[kb1900]

You got kicked out of school for possession of marijuana? Is that really the full story?

 

[Lawpy]

OK, you've put this in much more context and that is helpful.

I think every SDNer should provide sufficient and thorough context in their original post to have best advice early on, rather than stringing the community along by adding more facts as the discussion grows. Dealing with incomplete and misleading information helps no one and becomes tiresome rather quickly.

Unfortunately, this method is done regularly in threads pertaining to crimes, institutional actions, cheating/fraud, dismissals/terminations etc and it makes the original poster look and act worse off than otherwise.

Just my $0.02

 

[j4079]

OK, you've put this in much more context and that is helpful.

Your three months of "homelessness" (that's what living in your car is) does give you some insights into the lives of people who live that way for years and that personal experience is not a common one in medical school communities and it can be valuable in helping to understand how some patients are getting by.

You'll report it and it could help. Getting an institutional action (IA) for pot is fairly common but it is not common to see someone kicked out of school and living in their car for an infraction. Was it a huge amount? were you dealing? were you at a super-conservative school that had strict penalties for infractions? Provide as many details as you can in your application so that nothing is left to the adcom's imagination.

What I've objected to in this whole thread has been the use of the word "child" and "childish". When you said you went to college a child I pictured some 12 year old child prodigy who wasn't emotionally ready for college. Obviously, not accurate. You also called your behavior "childish". Having pot on campus is not childish. Own that your behavior reflected immaturity and a failure to think through the potential consequences of your choices but don't chalk it up to being childish. That will get you tossed out of the admission process far more quickly that the pot IA.

/rant.

Okay perhaps my use of synonyms confused you? I was not trying to pass the blame or make excuses. I clearly said that I blame myself, and I'm aware that it was due to my immaturity. I own that. I just want to know if getting in somewhere is still going to be possible with my poor academic start and disciplinary background. Can I be redeemed?

 

[LizzyM]

I think every SDNer should provide sufficient and thorough context in their original post to have best advice early on, rather than stringing the community along by adding more facts as the discussion grows. Dealing with incomplete and misleading information helps no one and becomes tiresome rather quickly.

Unfortunately, this method is done regularly in threads pertaining to crimes, institutional actions, cheating/fraud, dismissals/terminations etc and it makes the original poster look and act worse off than otherwise.

Just my $0.02

It takes time to build rapport. The OP just joined 2 days ago and wasn't ready to share all the details at once, as helpful as that might have been. Most of us have had patients or clients who were similar.

Very few situations are the end of the world for an applicant. Dealing drugs might be and Medicaid fraud (e.g. you worked in an office where this was going on), stealing valuables from patients rooms, child sex abuse, those would be deal breakers as far as I am concerned. In the end, your whole application is under review.

 

[Sardinia]

@j4079 Thank you. Sorry for being accusatory. Will edit this post with a more substantial response later.