LUCOM: Pros and Cons from current students

[MsCritique]

Hello,

I would like to start a candid critique of Liberty University School of Osteopathic Medicine (LUCOM) from current students. LUCOM's first student body is now approaching the end of their first year and I'd like their opinions. Here are some of my pros and cons.

Pros:
1) a new, very big, state of the art medical building complete with Simulation (SIM) lab rooms.

2) their anatomy and OMM labs are amazing, complete with an entire windowed wall that overlooks the mountains (these labs are all located on the 4th floor).

3) Anatomy lab has a great vent system which reduces the smell of the cadavers (compared to other schools).

4) The SIM lab seems very advanced, but I have not had enough exposure to it to comment on its full potential. The models are decent, their model of a female giving birth was impressive, as well as their new born baby in clinical distress.


5) most of the faculty are very nice, patient, very experienced with impressive backgrounds. Most of them teach very well and are very approachable for questions, tips and extra help.

6) Our executive Dean (Dr. Martin) is wonderful, He seems very down to earth and cares about the students in a very father like way... translation... he cares about our success. He also seems very practical. He is aware of the anxieties from his students, as well as the issues that come up in LUCOM and tries to be as transparent as possible. He keeps students informed as best as he can with a bimonthly "Dean's hour". This is basically a one hour meeting with the students to discuss issues and other topics and to answer student question. He has an open door policy (appointments with him are fairly easy to get, unless he is away on meetings, out of town etc). He is very swift to investigate and respond to issues. Dean Martin also has an impressive resume. He has tremendous experience, as he was on the board for the COCA committee (the committee that oversees and critiques all the DO schools).

7) Dean Martin recognizes that his student body is diverse, with students of different religions. Because of this, the weekly convocation meetings (which is a Christian prayer like session in the large auditiorium) is not mandatory. He also recognizes that his students can choose to use this hour however they want...to either attend the meeting, study, eat something, take a nap ...etc.

Note: Yes, the student body is diverse... we have students from different religions such as Islam, Buddism, and Hinduism.

8) Our first patient simulation practical went very well. This was our first touch with real live patients (albeit not a real situation, since the patients were actors). The professors who were responsible for organizing and executing this patient simulation did a great job. One professor in particular was amazing, Dr. Weigner. He walked us through everything step by step... almost holding our hands, easing our anxiety. He answered every single question to the best of his ability (no matter how silly or simple the question sounded). He made us fully aware of what to expect.

9) we have opportunities to engage in health projects/ volunteer opportunities with the community...such as in schools and in the local senior residence (like a private nursing home) .

10) We also have opportunities to do "mission trips" which are more like health care trips to other countries. This summer, students will be going to Guatemala. I doubt that the medical students will be talking about anything religious, even though it is called a "mission trip".

Cons:

1) the grading for the patient simulation practicals need to be more transparent. Students need to be given their individual scored sheet as the correct answers are being discussed. Currently they are only given their SOAP note (the typed up clinical note) to following along. Students need to see exactly what they got wrong to track their progress.

2) there are very conservative/ religious professors here at LUCOM. So far, I have not seen this conservative personality to affect the quality of our education, however, it's just something to be aware of. We do have one professor who does not believe in evolution. We also have students who do not believe in evolution. Bear in mind that many of the students are also conservative and religiously Christian (This is not a bad thing, but something that you should keep in mind)

3) Audio- Visual issues: This is one of the biggest issues to plague LUCOM students. the lecture capture system (that records some of the lectures) always has issues...either the lectures are not recorded (some of them being very important lectures such as anatomy dissection demonstrations), the recordings have no sound, or the sound does not match up to the right video. Also, during the actual lectures, many times, the digital black boards will malfunction, thus stopping the lecture, or severely shortening the lecture. There has also been a few times where the auditoriums have lost power. LUCOM bragged to it's first incoming body that they spent millions on their state of the art technology, and yet the audio visual continues to be a huge disappointment.

4) Some of the lectures cannot be recorded. Eg, case based discussions which the students and the professors discuss cases and practice exam questions. Some professors are even sticklers about this, and they do not allow students to personally record/ take pics of the discussion. One can possibly get in trouble for doing this. I am personally against this because it is counter intuitive to my learning. There are some slides that contain pictures that I'd like to review again, especially when I am studying for board exams.

5) the anatomy practicals are the bane of my existence. They are such grade sinkers and the anatomists are very secretive about the average for the practicals. The average for the practicals are pretty low. The first anatomy practicals were rife with issues... tagged structures not being in anatomical position, being very ambiguous etc ...and we are NOT allowed to touch the tagged structures. It does seem like the practicals are getting better, however, this progress is slow.

Other information about LUCOM that are neither pros nor cons... just general info.

1) Yes we have a dress code: to dress professionally...dress for the career ahead... a doctor. We are given the occasional "Friday Jean's day" and the dress down days ...like if there was snow that day.

2) yes, they are strict about alcohol and drugs. A reminder, you are entering the field of medicine where this is mandatory for every school.... I wouldn't want a doctor who drank a lot or used drugs while in any part of his medical career. That doesn't mean that I don't go to buffalo wild wings and have a beer or 2 (of course I do)... I just don't do it wearing a liberty T-shirt on.

3) Yes they do say prayers. Very frequently, short prayers are said before classes, before an exam etc. However, I find these prayers to be very calming and uplifting. Our professors pray for our success and thank us for our hard work...all the studying time that we put into. At first, I was a bit nervous about this, since religion is a very private thing for me. But, I listened to the prayers and it proved to be very helpful in calming my nerves before a very difficult exam.

4) yes, anatomy practicals are very difficult and can be a huge grade sinker for many students. Why? I have no idea.

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[67552931811]

In B4 lock.

 

[hse]

repent

 

[NontradCA]

I find the prayer thing to be ridiculous, but funny at the same time. That being said, most of these things seem like non issues. Both your pro and con list is typical at any school, it seems like. I think what matters the most is the quality of your clinical rotations and how long they let you study for boards. Other than that, reputation. That seems like the only downside, but I'm not even sure a lot of PDs across the country will know, or care. Medical school is an individual process and no one on this forum is going to schools where name brand brings an advantage.

But lol@praying.

Also:

 

[Kevin Baker]

Thanks for the critique. It's great to see this type of discussion. It can help the curriculum evolve.

 

[NurWollen]

To be honest it sounds a lot like... well, most DO schools. Minus the prayer in class part.

 

[xBODOMx]

.

 

[MsCritique]

Your pros.
1,2,3,4: Pre-med Gimmicks.
5: Subjective. This could be said for any schools.
6,7: This is a non-issue at every other school.
8,9: Normal.
10: More gimmicks.


The cons are all pretty significant. A lot of students rely on lecture recording and it sounds like yours are abysmal. Secretive and shady grading practices are not great, but probably present at a lot of schools. The prayer thing is absurd. Dress code is a dress code I guess.

If you're going to make a pros list for a school, the only things it should contain is: rotations, board scores, pass rates, research opportunities, lecture setup, and tuition. Anything else probably doesn't matter.

A Pros list is subjective... It can contain whatever the writer deems fit to include. You can ask professionally for more information if it was not acceptable for your standards. I didn't think my pros were gimmicks. These were some of the things that I paid attention to when I was applying and interviewing.

1) we are the first class, so we don't have board scores yet (we are only in our first year). Pass rates of what exactly? Med school Exams? Boards?

Tuition is on par with any private medical school roughly $53 K per year.

Research opportunities are preliminary, we do have webinars and seminars hosted by the PhDs and DO's.

Lecture set up: we have most of our lectures in the mornings (8am to 12 noon with a 10 min break after each lecture) , with labs in the afternoon (from 1-5pm ) We have 2 hours for OMM lab, and 2 hours of Patient Centered Medicine lab per week. Anatomy labs can vary depending on the course. We are currently taking neuro so we have more labs... 2 hour labs roughly 3X a week. We have 4 anatomists present at every anatomy lab and they circulate at every "tank" to answer questions, help us with dissections and to do group demonstrations.

We have rotations set up for us at Central Hospital (the largest hospital in lynchburg VA where LUCOM is located), in Danville hospital and I believe more locations are being established in Chicago.

we have the option to choose our own location for 4th year rotations. There are a few rules for this though. There must be more than 20 people wanting to go to that location, the academic co ordinator can establish the hospital location as a teaching location...basically they want to ensure that this hospital has a certain standard (I don't know what goes into that process).

 

[abolt18]

Praying in class should even be a non-issue. It's a privately owned Christian school. See BYU. Many classes start with a prayer. Being closed minded won't bring you anything in life. Having an open mind about things that you don't personally care for or understand will definitely benefit you in your life and help you build relationships with those of all walks of life.

 

[DocWinter]

Your pros.
1,2,3,4: Pre-med Gimmicks.
5: Subjective. This could be said for any schools.
6,7: This is a non-issue at every other school.
8,9: Normal.
10: More gimmicks.


The cons are all pretty significant. A lot of students rely on lecture recording and it sounds like yours are abysmal. Secretive and shady grading practices are not great, but probably present at a lot of schools. The prayer thing is absurd. Dress code is a dress code I guess.

If you're going to make a pros list for a school, the only things it should contain is: rotations, board scores, pass rates, research opportunities, lecture setup, and tuition. Anything else probably doesn't matter.

Kind of agree...every new school is nice, new, has to have good ventilation by OSHA standards...

Of course the dean wants you to succeed. You're the 1st class and your success will help gauge the future of the college (?)
And 9 and 10 are SUPPOSED to be present...

I hope all the students do well, and I hope you turn out to be great doctors. Have to say, the issues you express with the practicals doesn't speak well to the understanding of the professors...that, and the audio issues, stand out to me as issues to be addressed ASAP.

Good luck, curious how everone does on boards.

 

[touchpause13]

Wait it's basically the end of first year and you guys have only done 1 standardized patient? That's concerning.

 

[Mad Jack]

Wait it's basically the end of first year and you guys have only done 1 standardized patient? That's concerning.

There's a lot of schools that don't do any SPs in year 1. There were even some allo schools (I don't know if they're still like this) where you would do a quick course on H&P over the summer between MS2 and MS3, up until very recently. I appreciate having SPs and being graded on clinical skills in year 1, personally, but it wasn't something that was common until very recently in medical school education.

 

[touchpause13]

There's a lot of schools that don't do any SPs in year 1. There were even some allo schools (I don't know if they're still like this) where you would do a quick course on H&P over the summer between MS2 and MS3, up until very recently. I appreciate having SPs and being graded on clinical skills in year 1, personally, but it wasn't something that was common until very recently in medical school education.

Really? I didn't realize that. IMO it's best to get more experience with interacting with patients earlier rather than later. Just basic stuff like doing a history I've improved a great deal from the first time and going into 2nd year I'm glad I have some confidence with that.

 

[Anthonyweiner]

Wait it's basically the end of first year and you guys have only done 1 standardized patient? That's concerning.

We've had two standardized patients that are paid actors so far (1 per trimester) and will have another before the end of the year. In addition to the simulations with actors, we practice with each other and professors during our small group meetings every week or so.

 

[touchpause13]

We've had two standardized patients that are paid actors so far (1 per trimester) and will have another before the end of the year. In addition to the simulations with actors, we practice with each other and professors during our small group meetings every week or so.

OK that sounds much more reasonable

 

[Goro]

As a veteran medical educator, this is indicative of Faculty who simply do NOT know what they're doing.

5) the anatomy practicals are the bane of my existence. They are such grade sinkers and the anatomists are very secretive about the average for the practicals. The average for the practicals are pretty low. The first anatomy practicals were rife with issues... tagged structures not being in anatomical position, being very ambiguous etc ...and we are NOT allowed to touch the tagged structures. It does seem like the practicals are getting better, however, this progress is slow.

 

[Anthonyweiner]

As a veteran medical educator, this is indicative of Faculty who simply do NOT know what they're doing.

5) the anatomy practicals are the bane of my existence. They are such grade sinkers and the anatomists are very secretive about the average for the practicals. The average for the practicals are pretty low. The first anatomy practicals were rife with issues... tagged structures not being in anatomical position, being very ambiguous etc ...and we are NOT allowed to touch the tagged structures. It does seem like the practicals are getting better, however, this progress is slow.

From my experience, its been those that haven't done well on the practicals complaining of this. I think they are done fairly and usually help to raise my grade rather than sink it. Also, the rule about not being able to touch structures ensures we all see the same thing as we rotate through.

 

[MsCritique]

Praying in class should even be a non-issue. It's a privately owned Christian school. See BYU. Many classes start with a prayer. Being closed minded won't bring you anything in life. Having an open mind about things that you don't personally care for or understand will definitely benefit you in your life and help you build relationships with those of all walks of life.

I personally agree with this. Despite being in a secular environment for most of my life, I find the prayers before class to be helpful. It isn't mandatory, you can stare into space if you'd like. The prayers don't bother me at all....in fact, I find myself closing my eyes and listening to the one minute prayer. Our professors pray for our success. They acknowledge how hard we study, how much time we put into our work, the sacrifices that we've all made like leaving our families to come to Virginia to become a doctor (my class has students from almost every state)... It's comforting to know that our professors are so invested in our futures and they express this in so many ways...including prayer

 

[MsCritique]

From my experience, its been those that haven't done well on the practicals complaining of this. I think they are done fairly and usually help to raise my grade rather than sink it. Also, the rule about not being able to touch structures ensures we all see the same thing as we rotate through.

I'm happy for you that the practicals improve your grade. I unfortunately do struggle with the practicals and it's not because I don't study for them. I spend countless hours in the anatomy lab with fellow students, teaching each other... with our atlas. I watch the recorded anatomy dissections supplied by LUCOM as well as any other videos that I can find on youtube/ medical websites and resources. Also, some students at LUCOM who do very well on the written exams (A students), also do poorly on the practicals. It's not just a couple of students who do poorly on the practicals... its more than 50%. I think this reflects on the way the practicals are set up, and not solely on the intelligence/ studying of the student.

I have also been advised by my friends who attend other med schools and they have similar issues. So, I think that this is fairly common (dare I say normal) at med schools.

 

[NontradCA]

Praying in class should even be a non-issue. It's a privately owned Christian school. See BYU. Many classes start with a prayer. Being closed minded won't bring you anything in life. Having an open mind about things that you don't personally care for or understand will definitely benefit you in your life and help you build relationships with those of all walks of life.

No new friends.

 

[touchpause13]

We can't touch structures either, that's fair. But not telling averages is bull****.
With practicals I think you should remember that the students are making the test - if you guys don't do dissections well, it's your own fault if things look ambiguous. The professors aren't going to take the time to clean up after people's mistakes.

 

[NurWollen]

This might be a bit of a tangent, but I'm curious as to what anatomy practicals are like your schools. We had about 75 questions on each. We all lined up, with everyone starting at a different cadaver, with two people at each cadaver. You had 1 minute at each cadaver. Then an alarm would go off and everyone would shift up to the next cadaver. We lost points for incorrect spelling. The anatomy faculty would pull crap like setting a heart upside down on top of a completely covered cadaver. By the time you figured out which way the heart was sitting, you had to move on, didn't even have time to figure out what was pinned.

The practicals brought my grades down, without exception. I'm 100% convinced that if I had had more time on each question, I would have been a whole letter grade higher for the course.

 

[Roxas]

This might be a bit of a tangent, but I'm curious as to what anatomy practicals are like your schools. We had about 75 questions on each. We all lined up, with everyone starting at a different cadaver, with two people at each cadaver. You had 1 minute at each cadaver. Then an alarm would go off and everyone would shift up to the next cadaver. We lost points for incorrect spelling. The anatomy faculty would pull crap like setting a heart upside down on top of a completely covered cadaver. By the time you figured out which way the heart was sitting, you had to move on, didn't even have time to figure out what was pinned.

The practicals brought my grades down, without exception. I'm 100% convinced that if I had had more time on each question, I would have been a whole letter grade higher for the course.

Ours seem nearly identical to yours, except ours were multiple choice 😛

The written exams were brutal enough that the practicals were my only saving grace. They were still tough and took a lot of prep, but spelling? Nah, I'm over that.

 

[Roxas]

We can't touch structures either, that's fair. But not telling averages is bull****.
With practicals I think you should remember that the students are making the test - if you guys don't do dissections well, it's your own fault if things look ambiguous. The professors aren't going to take the time to clean up after people's mistakes.

 

[touchpause13]

Haha it just drove me nuts on practicals on bodies that were like completely jacked up because people were stupid and didn't oil them down enough so everything was black. Like even if you don't do much during lab it's not that hard to take care of your body, it takes like 30 seconds and you won't f over the rest of the class during the practical. I always was an obsessive fat picker so our body was usually clean. Our group dicked around like 75% of the time and our body still looked way nicer than most.

 

[acapnial]

This might be a bit of a tangent, but I'm curious as to what anatomy practicals are like your schools. We had about 75 questions on each. We all lined up, with everyone starting at a different cadaver, with two people at each cadaver. You had 1 minute at each cadaver. Then an alarm would go off and everyone would shift up to the next cadaver. We lost points for incorrect spelling. The anatomy faculty would pull crap like setting a heart upside down on top of a completely covered cadaver. By the time you figured out which way the heart was sitting, you had to move on, didn't even have time to figure out what was pinned.

The practicals brought my grades down, without exception. I'm 100% convinced that if I had had more time on each question, I would have been a whole letter grade higher for the course.

Same thing at RVU except most practicals are shorter than 75 questions and spelling wrong is ok as long as it is at least spelled phonetically.

Your pros.
1,2,3,4: Pre-med Gimmicks.
5: Subjective. This could be said for any schools.
6,7: This is a non-issue at every other school.
8,9: Normal.
10: More gimmicks.


The cons are all pretty significant. A lot of students rely on lecture recording and it sounds like yours are abysmal. Secretive and shady grading practices are not great, but probably present at a lot of schools. The prayer thing is absurd. Dress code is a dress code I guess.

If you're going to make a pros list for a school, the only things it should contain is: rotations, board scores, pass rates, research opportunities, lecture setup, and tuition. Anything else probably doesn't matter.

If I had to choose, I would much rather sit through a few minutes of prayer every morning than have a dress code.

 

[Roxas]

Haha it just drove me nuts on practicals on bodies that were like completely jacked up because people were stupid and didn't oil them down enough so everything was black. Like even if you don't do much during lab it's not that hard to take care of your body, it takes like 30 seconds and you won't f over the rest of the class during the practical. I always was an obsessive fat picker so our body was usually clean. Our group dicked around like 75% of the time and our body still looked way nicer than most.

Yeah those dried out ones were the worst. Our issue was mold. And our group was so special that we went through 3 different bodies by the time the class was over 😎

 

[NurWollen]

Ours seem nearly identical to yours, except ours were multiple choice 😛

The written exams were brutal enough that the practicals were my only saving grace. They were still tough and took a lot of prep, but spelling? Nah, I'm over that.

Multiple Choice would have been a lifesaver. So many times I knew what the structure was, what it did, associated pathology, but just couldn't remember the darn thing's name. It would invariably come to be as I was walking out to my car after the test.

 

[hallowmann]

Very glad I'm done with anatomy and essentially never have to worry about something like that again.

 

[MsCritique]

Ours seem nearly identical to yours, except ours were multiple choice 😛

The written exams were brutal enough that the practicals were my only saving grace. They were still tough and took a lot of prep, but spelling? Nah, I'm over that.

Hey. Not sure what school you go to, but our practicals at LUCOM are not multiple choice...it's straight from memory. I am very envious of you haha

 

[MsCritique]

love this... that's exactly what I thought... like excuse me Mr. Anatomy dissecting expert...let me just go n sit over here with my "dunce" hat on

 

[touchpause13]

love this... that's exactly what I thought... like excuse me Mr. Anatomy dissecting expert...let me just go n sit over here with my "dunce" hat on

Not a Mr....
It just bugs me when people do a crap job and screw over others.

 

[OMS1 Student]

Hello,

I would like to start a candid critique of Liberty University School of Osteopathic Medicine (LUCOM) from current students. LUCOM's first student body is now approaching the end of their first year and I'd like their opinions. Here are some of my pros and cons.

Pros:
1) a new, very big, state of the art medical building complete with Simulation (SIM) lab rooms.

2) their anatomy and OMM labs are amazing, complete with an entire windowed wall that overlooks the mountains (these labs are all located on the 4th floor).

3) Anatomy lab has a great vent system which reduces the smell of the cadavers (compared to other schools).

4) The SIM lab seems very advanced, but I have not had enough exposure to it to comment on its full potential. The models are decent, their model of a female giving birth was impressive, as well as their new born baby in clinical distress.


5) most of the faculty are very nice, patient, very experienced with impressive backgrounds. Most of them teach very well and are very approachable for questions, tips and extra help.

6) Our executive Dean (Dr. Martin) is wonderful, He seems very down to earth and cares about the students in a very father like way... translation... he cares about our success. He also seems very practical. He is aware of the anxieties from his students, as well as the issues that come up in LUCOM and tries to be as transparent as possible. He keeps students informed as best as he can with a bimonthly "Dean's hour". This is basically a one hour meeting with the students to discuss issues and other topics and to answer student question. He has an open door policy (appointments with him are fairly easy to get, unless he is away on meetings, out of town etc). He is very swift to investigate and respond to issues. Dean Martin also has an impressive resume. He has tremendous experience, as he was on the board for the COCA committee (the committee that oversees and critiques all the DO schools).

7) Dean Martin recognizes that his student body is diverse, with students of different religions. Because of this, the weekly convocation meetings (which is a Christian prayer like session in the large auditiorium) is not mandatory. He also recognizes that his students can choose to use this hour however they want...to either attend the meeting, study, eat something, take a nap ...etc.

Note: Yes, the student body is diverse... we have students from different religions such as Islam, Buddism, and Hinduism.

8) Our first patient simulation practical went very well. This was our first touch with real live patients (albeit not a real situation, since the patients were actors). The professors who were responsible for organizing and executing this patient simulation did a great job. One professor in particular was amazing, Dr. Weigner. He walked us through everything step by step... almost holding our hands, easing our anxiety. He answered every single question to the best of his ability (no matter how silly or simple the question sounded). He made us fully aware of what to expect.

9) we have opportunities to engage in health projects/ volunteer opportunities with the community...such as in schools and in the local senior residence (like a private nursing home) .

10) We also have opportunities to do "mission trips" which are more like health care trips to other countries. This summer, students will be going to Guatemala. I doubt that the medical students will be talking about anything religious, even though it is called a "mission trip".

Cons:

1) the grading for the patient simulation practicals need to be more transparent. Students need to be given their individual scored sheet as the correct answers are being discussed. Currently they are only given their SOAP note (the typed up clinical note) to following along. Students need to see exactly what they got wrong to track their progress.

2) there are very conservative/ religious professors here at LUCOM. So far, I have not seen this conservative personality to affect the quality of our education, however, it's just something to be aware of. We do have one professor who does not believe in evolution. We also have students who do not believe in evolution. Bear in mind that many of the students are also conservative and religiously Christian (This is not a bad thing, but something that you should keep in mind)

3) Audio- Visual issues: This is one of the biggest issues to plague LUCOM students. the lecture capture system (that records some of the lectures) always has issues...either the lectures are not recorded (some of them being very important lectures such as anatomy dissection demonstrations), the recordings have no sound, or the sound does not match up to the right video. Also, during the actual lectures, many times, the digital black boards will malfunction, thus stopping the lecture, or severely shortening the lecture. There has also been a few times where the auditoriums have lost power. LUCOM bragged to it's first incoming body that they spent millions on their state of the art technology, and yet the audio visual continues to be a huge disappointment.

4) Some of the lectures cannot be recorded. Eg, case based discussions which the students and the professors discuss cases and practice exam questions. Some professors are even sticklers about this, and they do not allow students to personally record/ take pics of the discussion. One can possibly get in trouble for doing this. I am personally against this because it is counter intuitive to my learning. There are some slides that contain pictures that I'd like to review again, especially when I am studying for board exams.

5) the anatomy practicals are the bane of my existence. They are such grade sinkers and the anatomists are very secretive about the average for the practicals. The average for the practicals are pretty low. The first anatomy practicals were rife with issues... tagged structures not being in anatomical position, being very ambiguous etc ...and we are NOT allowed to touch the tagged structures. It does seem like the practicals are getting better, however, this progress is slow.

Other information about LUCOM that are neither pros nor cons... just general info.

1) Yes we have a dress code: to dress professionally...dress for the career ahead... a doctor. We are given the occasional "Friday Jean's day" and the dress down days ...like if there was snow that day.

2) yes, they are strict about alcohol and drugs. A reminder, you are entering the field of medicine where this is mandatory for every school.... I wouldn't want a doctor who drank a lot or used drugs while in any part of his medical career. That doesn't mean that I don't go to buffalo wild wings and have a beer or 2 (of course I do)... I just don't do it wearing a liberty T-shirt on.

3) Yes they do say prayers. Very frequently, short prayers are said before classes, before an exam etc. However, I find these prayers to be very calming and uplifting. Our professors pray for our success and thank us for our hard work...all the studying time that we put into. At first, I was a bit nervous about this, since religion is a very private thing for me. But, I listened to the prayers and it proved to be very helpful in calming my nerves before a very difficult exam.

4) yes, anatomy practicals are very difficult and can be a huge grade sinker for many students. Why? I have no idea.

I am a student in the Inaugural class...thought I would throw my 2 cents in. I was hesitant to attend LUCOM for the reasons stated above: it's extremely conservative. Upon beginning school, there was definitely adjustment for me however, I have found VERY little that I don't love about this school. Our dean is amazing, this is not his first rodeo. Are there creationists on staff? Yes. Are there people who are extremely Christen? Definitely. Has it negatively impacted my education? I don't think so. Along with some differences in ideology for sure, comes a genuine feeling of not being "just a number" at my medical school which is something I was looking for. Our faculty is great, there are of course professors that I learn better from than others but that would be the case no matter where I go. I am in constant contact with friends who are OMS 1 students elsewhere and we have the same issues with school. Our administration has done an amazing job at collecting student impressions, suggestion and complaints and implementing change for the greater good of the class. We have a WIDE variety of faiths in our class and for the most part, everyone respects each other more-so than personal experiences at undergraduate campuses. Does Liberty have a reputation, no doubt about it, but I can honestly say I am one of the most liberal people you will probably meet and I love it here. As physicians we will come up against differing opinions indefinitely, I feel that interacting with such a wide range of opinions and beliefs has helped me (in just my few short months) develop tools that I will use with patients and colleges in the future. If anyone has any personal questions feel free to ask I'm happy to share my experiences.

 

[touchpause13]

I am a student in the Inaugural class...thought I would throw my 2 cents in. I was hesitant to attend LUCOM for the reasons stated above: it's extremely conservative. Upon beginning school, there was definitely adjustment for me however, I have found VERY little that I don't love about this school. Our dean is amazing, this is not his first rodeo. Are there creationists on staff? Yes. Are there people who are extremely Christen? Definitely. Has it negatively impacted my education? I don't think so. Along with some differences in ideology for sure, comes a genuine feeling of not being "just a number" at my medical school which is something I was looking for. Our faculty is great, there are of course professors that I learn better from than others but that would be the case no matter where I go. I am in constant contact with friends who are OMS 1 students elsewhere and we have the same issues with school. Our administration has done an amazing job at collecting student impressions, suggestion and complaints and implementing change for the greater good of the class. We have a WIDE variety of faiths in our class and for the most part, everyone respects each other more-so than personal experiences at undergraduate campuses. Does Liberty have a reputation, no doubt about it, but I can honestly say I am one of the most liberal people you will probably meet and I love it here. As physicians we will come up against differing opinions indefinitely, I feel that interacting with such a wide range of opinions and beliefs has helped me (in just my few short months) develop tools that I will use with patients and colleges in the future. If anyone has any personal questions feel free to ask I'm happy to share my experiences.

I still want to know how the issues of students drinking/having sex/watching R rated movies are addressed as I know that is forbidden for the undergrads and the Dean had made in clear via email that living with a SO who you are not married to wouldn't be acceptable.

 

[OMS1 Student]

Well I can tell you that there are friends of mine in our class that live with their SO and did receive verbal "permission" to do so by the admissions director. They have had zero repercussions thus far. As for drinking, I personally e-mailed admissions prior to sending in my deposit with that questions seeing as I am an adult, also received a reply indicating that "I am an adult and will be treated as one." I have also had zero problems with this. The only time anything may or may not become a problem is if people are belligerent while wearing LU or LUCOM apparel. Other than that I don't now of anyone who has had issues. Our dean is a realist, he has been a dean at other campuses and thus, understands how med students work...meaning that while we operate under some LU rules and regulations (some of which I disagree with) honestly, we are professional students and up to this point have been treated as such. R rated movies...that's an undergrad thing too. In a nutshell, there are views that LU holds, that are technically" the views of LUCOM but are not necessarily enforced ....in order to function, we must verbalize LU's views. Like I said, no problems thus far, I am extremely liberal in pretty much everything. If you have specific questions feel free and PM me!

 

[touchpause13]

If you want to bash the school because you dislike their politics, you should probably just go for it. Couching your language as though you're genuinely interested isn't really fooling anybody.

Just sayin'

I've made my opinions on this matter VERY clear. I'm not trying to put on like I'm geniunely interested in attending or something silly like that seeing as I've said multiple times in multiple threads you couldn't pay me to go there. However that doesn't mean I'm obligated to be a jerk to every person here who says that they go there.

 

[OMS1 Student]

I know. That's why it's sort of strange that you're asking these questions about how they "handle" violations of their honor code. It's almost like you're searching for some sort of hidden subtext to make them sound more extreme. But I think Liberty has been pretty open about where they stand (they're not down with gays, they like to pray, and drugs/alcohol/sex/porn don't fit with their mission). It's not like they're banging down your door to try to get you (or anyone else) to attend.

These threads are just strange. People cite LUCOM's policies. Then current students point out that they seem to not be strictly enforcing all these policies, or at least doesn't search out violations when they aren't obvious (pretty par for the course at most institutions for many rules). Then people who disagree with LUCOM's policies say a lot of unpleasant things about them and try to figure out what's "really going on."

I just don't get it. It doesn't lead anywhere. If folks wanna have a flame war over who's banging who, just get to it.

Totally agree! Thanks for you statements. The only reason I even got on here was because I got so many questions from student interviewing while on tours around campus...I realized that there aren't many of us on here to speak to our experiences. Anyways take care.

 

[touchpause13]

I know. That's why it's sort of strange that you're asking these questions about how they "handle" violations of their honor code. It's almost like you're searching for some sort of hidden subtext to make them sound more extreme. But I think Liberty has been pretty open about where they stand (they're not down with gays, they like to pray, and drugs/alcohol/sex/porn don't fit with their mission). It's not like they're banging down your door to try to get you (or anyone else) to attend.

These threads are just strange. People cite LUCOM's policies. Then current students point out that they seem to not be strictly enforcing all these policies, or at least doesn't search out violations when they aren't obvious (pretty par for the course at most institutions for many rules). Then people who disagree with LUCOM's policies say a lot of unpleasant things about them and try to figure out what's "really going on."

I just don't get it. It doesn't lead anywhere. If folks wanna have a flame war over who's banging who, just get to it.

They've been open with the emphasis on faith but they haven't been about their code of conduct and how it is enforced. My goal with asking about these things has always been because I want the information to be out for people who perhaps are more unfamiliar with their politics. I really don't want to see someone go there because that was their only option, or because they had one impression of it and then get kicked out over some stupid violation that they didn't know about when they applied. It's not about making them look more extreme, they are what they are - I just don't like the idea of someone getting effed over because of their nontransparent policies.

 

[OMS1 Student]

Well, I guess...thanks for looking out for people I guess...interesting that you to take it upon yourself to try and get answers but really, anyone who commits to a school, ought to contact the school with their own questions and concerns, it's no one elses responsibility to do so especially if that person has not actually attended said school.

 

[803]

Why is it always the "tolerant" type that are always the least tolerant .

 

[touchpause13]

Well, I guess...thanks for looking out for people I guess...interesting that you to take it upon yourself to try and get answers but really, anyone who commits to a school, ought to contact the school with their own questions and concerns, it's no one elses responsibility to do so especially if that person has not actually attended said school.

I'm old and have been here long enough where I feel like I have a responsibility to share the knowledge I suppose. You are welcome to think I'm just some hand holding douchebag or whatever if that's what you like.

 

[burritowithgreensauce]

ELI5: why does it matter that LUCOM has a religious association?

loma linda has a religious association, no one seems to mind.

 

[OMS1 Student]

I'm old and have been here long enough where I feel like I have a responsibility to share the knowledge I suppose. You are welcome to think I'm just some hand holding douchebag or whatever if that's what you like.

ok buddy calm down, my point was that instead of bashing one school or another...why not encourage "young" people to contact the schools and ask questions. Maybe provide them with the questions you apparently think they ought to ask and let them do as they please with those questions. But seriously dude don't get all defensive, I'm trying to simply give the opinion of a student who is there and living it. First hand experience from someone who has asked all of your questions already. PS being "old" does not necessrily make you wiser.

 

[touchpause13]

ok buddy calm down, my point was that instead of bashing one school or another...why not encourage "young" people to contact the schools and ask questions. Maybe provide them with the questions you apparently think they ought to ask and let them do as they please with those questions. But seriously dude don't get all defensive, I'm trying to simply give the opinion of a student who is there and living it. First hand experience from someone who has asked all of your questions already. PS being "old" does not necessrily make you wiser.

Not sure why you think I'm being defensive....
And I have absolutely said that people should call schools and ask, multiple times on multiple threads. You said it was okay to ask questions so that's what I did.

 

[hallowmann]

ok buddy calm down, my point was that instead of bashing one school or another...why not encourage "young" people to contact the schools and ask questions. Maybe provide them with the questions you apparently think they ought to ask and let them do as they please with those questions. But seriously dude don't get all defensive, I'm trying to simply give the opinion of a student who is there and living it. First hand experience from someone who has asked all of your questions already. PS being "old" does not necessrily make you wiser.

If anyone's post was defensive (and/or offensive) its yours here and the one above. This is a public forum, everyone has the right to question pretty much anything they want. You yourself invited those questions.

One of the biggest values of this forum is that people are willing to look out for others, especially when those other people are inundated with essentially propaganda that doesn't serve their best interests (not speaking specifically about your school, its something all schools do).

Rather than finding fault with "older" people or people who actually want to look out for others, maybe you should focus on your stated goal for bumping all these threads (i.e. answer questions about the school when you're asked). Or don't... whatever.. I've lost interest.

And just so we're clear, I am not making any statements about LUCOM, simply statements about the unproductive nature of your last 2 posts. No need to get defensive.

 

[chizledfrmstone]

Ours seem nearly identical to yours, except ours were multiple choice 😛

The written exams were brutal enough that the practicals were my only saving grace. They were still tough and took a lot of prep, but spelling? Nah, I'm over that.

What the hell! Our practicals require you to spell EXACTLY what's on the list.

Our averages would have been 95%+ if it was multiple choice.

 

[AnonymousD.O.]

I despise SP, especially after you present your first case (in an SP like / SOAP note manner) and the preceptor tells you, that you sound like an idiot. SPs are necessary to an extent, maybe doing a few of them, but then after this I feel like instead of SPs, it would be better to have 1st/2nd years follow a med student for a day a month or something. After a while SPs become a game of checkboxes, they are a joke.

 

[NontradCA]

ELI5: why does it matter that LUCOM has a religious association?

loma linda has a religious association, no one seems to mind.

Because religion is a joke.

 

[NurWollen]

Because religion is a joke.

Someone in another thread was just trying to tell me there is no animosity towards religion in modern society. Lol.

 

[cbrons]

Wait it's basically the end of first year and you guys have only done 1 standardized patient? That's concerning.

At my MD school we didnt have any SP during 1st year