misdemeanor

[green plastic]

my cousin just got a misdemeanor in the middle of the application cycle and she is freaking out. Her misdeanor is for petti-theft cuz she was caught stealing like $20 worth of some jewelry. I told her it probably won't be a problem unless some med schools screen right before matriculation. She doesn't have an acceptance yet, but probably will get one soon. Is this misdemeanor gonna be big problem regarding matriculation to med school?

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[Rendar5]

umm...WTF is wrong with her! what a silly time to shoplift.

No, this late it might not affect much.

 

[Spitting Camel]

Petty theft... that is crazy!! Don't think just because it is called petty that it is not serious. Why do people jeopardize their futures for the stupidest things? I think she has a duty to write to all the schools and update them on her situation. I think they also screen before entrance, and even if they don't, they could find out an kick her out anyways. Might as well have your bases covered.

Dude, she screwed up big time, and I bet she knows this. You have to prioritize in life. If she needs money, tell her to get a freaking job! You can explain away stupid acts of your youth, but we are adults now and we are expected to act like adults. Stealing was not a mistake, she made an active effort to steal, so the accident bull won't work.

 

[TTSD]

Not to add to condemnations.. but really, what the hell was she thinking? She's not a little kid, she's an adult trying to get into an institution where maturity and responsibility is supposedly prized. How is stealing going to show those traits that she probably proclaimed through her application cycle?

 

[Gleevec]

Originally posted by green plastic
my cousin just got a misdemeanor in the middle of the application cycle and she is freaking out. Her misdeanor is for petti-theft cuz she was caught stealing like $20 worth of some jewelry. I told her it probably won't be a problem unless some med schools screen right before matriculation. She doesn't have an acceptance yet, but probably will get one soon. Is this misdemeanor gonna be big problem regarding matriculation to med school?

Well, she will have to tell schools now or wait until the med schools find out themselves. If she informs them now, she would be better off because it shows she takes responsibility for her actions. If she tries to hide it, it will come out at some point. Its quite easy to find things on someones record and even if its not pre-matriculation, it might be during medical school, before residency, or before certification.

Its a bad situation, but its better to deal with it now than risk having it ruin everything later on.

 

[Kashue]

I'm curious to when schools do background checks. Anyone know when and how. I assume they have to fingerprint you to do that right?

 

[Lux Aeterna]

definitely do what Gleevec said. This stuff always comes out to the forefront when you least expect it.

 

[NE_Cornhusker1]

maybe just wait to see how it all works out. she could end up getting diversion if she' s got a clean record prior to this. maybe cut a deal in exchange for guilty to something like disturbing the peace. surprisingly most da's are not out to ruin someone's life [and usually are far too overworked anyways] over a minor error in judgement. but yeah, wtf was she thinking?

 

[Spitting Camel]

Originally posted by Kashue
I'm curious to when schools do background checks. Anyone know when and how. I assume they have to fingerprint you to do that right?

You don't need fingerprints to do a background check... They search using names and addresses

 

[green plastic]

well the thing is since she already sent back all her secondaries, she didn't lie on them by saying she wasn't convicted of anything. She still has to go to court regarding this and plead her case...who knows what will happen then.

 

[Kashue]

Originally posted by AlreadyInDebt
You don't need fingerprints to do a background check... They search using names and addresses

Hmm, that's kinda weak since identities can be forged and people have common names.

 

[Spitting Camel]

yeah, I had a background check for my hopital volunteering program and they asked us for all names we may have used and previous addresses for the last 10 years or so... I thought it was weak too. They should run our fingerprints throught the federal database. Who knows, they may find some secret psycho killer that has been eluding them for a while!

 

[Kashue]

Originally posted by AlreadyInDebt
yeah, I had a background check for my hopital volunteering program and they asked us for all names we may have used and previous addresses for the last 10 years or so... I thought it was weak too. They should run our fingerprints throught the federal database. Who knows, they may find some secret psycho killer that has been eluding them for a while!

Nod, especially for something as important as medical school. My current job required a background check, but they fingerprinted me.

 

[Spitting Camel]

So, what we're trying to say is: They will find out.! It's just a matter of time!

 

[green plastic]

Originally posted by NE_Cornhusker1
maybe just wait to see how it all works out. she could end up getting diversion if she' s got a clean record prior to this. maybe cut a deal in exchange for guilty to something like disturbing the peace. surprisingly most da's are not out to ruin someone's life [and usually are far too overworked anyways] over a minor error in judgement. but yeah, wtf was she thinking?

What's a diversion? She says she will probably just plead guilty at the court and say that she made a big mistake (she has a clean record), and hopefully she'll just get a probation. Anyone have insight on this?

 

[NE_Cornhusker1]

usually you pay a fine and restituion. maybe some community service. keep your nose clean for a while [90 days to 6 months or a year]. if you do this the charges get dropped. have her call the county attorney's office and check into it. usually the diversion place sends you something first though.

 

[NE_Cornhusker1]

it's like traffic/stop school for minor offenses of the law.

 

[DrBodacious]

ACK!

Why on earth would you tell the schools? She claimed on her secondaries and AMCAS that she had not gotten in trouble AT THAT TIME. Only by lying when answering that question could she get kicked out of Medical School, right? TO my knowledge, there was no fine print saying that you are required to report any future run in with the law in order to stay legit. Tell her to worry about it after she gets accepted, becauase they DO do background checks, often during the first year (as I've read from other recent misdemeanor posts in pre-allo and allo). So she will have to have an explanation, not to mention the offense may cause problems when she applys to residencies.

I think informing schools could only hurt her in the application process. You think that the schools, after hearing that she was stealing, are going to have much of any impression of, "Oh, what a responsible young woman for telling us!"?? I don't think so. Not unless you can know someone on each adcom, or are able to somehow get someone on each adcom to argue that case for you.

Not to mention if she was just recently caught, and not yet convicted, she should call a lawyer and find out if there are any ways to keep the offense off of her record. Definatley do not call up schools right away!

Obviously, she ****ed up big time! Ever since I've been seriously considering medical school I have been immensly careful about breaking the law. I admit I did a little underage drinking, but I was smart about it, to the point where I annoyed many of my friends with my paranoia. Stealing is a huge risk, stupid stupid stupid.

 

[ocean11]

I know someone who was caught 'vandalizing' property at my university (also a pre-med), and the charges were dropped, actually they weren't filed in the first place... the individual agreed to pay $100... to replace the 'item' that was destroyed and that was the end of that. This person has a clean record and is a current med school student (MS2) at a prestigious university here in Canada! They learned from their mistake and attributed it to 'stress' and 'immaturity' at the time!

Sometimes one makes a mistake... but before calling someone 'stupid' and berating them we should look into the circumstances surrounding the event. However, stealing $20 worth of jewlery does NOT sound worth it! still though....

Green Plastic... my advice is to tell your cousin to see if she can get the charges dropped... via some serious community service and perhaps offering to see a psychiatrist or a therapist. I'm pretty sure that for $20 ... the DA won't want to ruin her life ...

Good Luck

 

[Spitting Camel]

Originally posted by ocean11
I know someone who was caught 'vandalizing' property at my university (also a pre-med), and the charges were dropped, actually they weren't filed in the first place... the individual agreed to pay $100... to replace the 'item' that was destroyed and that was the end of that. This person has a clean record and is a current med school student (MS2) at a prestigious university here in Canada! They learned from their mistake and attributed it to 'stress' and 'immaturity' at the time!

Sometimes one makes a mistake... but before calling someone 'stupid' and berating them we should look into the circumstances surrounding the event. However, stealing $20 worth of jewlery does NOT sound worth it! still though....

Yeah, immature before the 'individual' applied, not DURING the freaking application process. Bottom line, your cousin has issues that she needs to see someone about. Hopefully they don't drop the charges and she does it again. Where's the rehabilitation in that? They should teach people lessons from the first time!

 

[ad_sharp]

If I recall correctly, both of my acceptance packages had a form that asked for disclosure of any convictions. Just because she didn't have it when she did the secondaries doesn't mean that she's out of the woods. You need to let the med schools know. It would be better than messing things up when its too late.

 

[DrBodacious]

Originally posted by ad_sharp
If I recall correctly, both of my acceptance packages had a form that asked for disclosure of any convictions. Just because she didn't have it when she did the secondaries doesn't mean that she's out of the woods. You need to let the med schools know. It would be better than messing things up when its too late.

Aha, I was unaware of this detail, not haveing any acceptances yet myself. Still I think it would be better to wait until you are accepted to disclose any information because then they can see your good points without being influenced by your screw up.

 

[JohnHolmes]

Originally posted by green plastic
my cousin just got a misdemeanor in the middle of the application cycle and she is freaking out. Her misdeanor is for petti-theft cuz she was caught stealing like $20 worth of some jewelry. I told her it probably won't be a problem unless some med schools screen right before matriculation. She doesn't have an acceptance yet, but probably will get one soon. Is this misdemeanor gonna be big problem regarding matriculation to med school?

Because it is a state matter, if she is applying to out of state medical school, it is DOUBTFUL that they will do a criminal check through the state she has been arrested in. Additionally, before anything shows up, it has to work its way through the judicial system. If a trial date is set for march or more, then it will be an non-issue. Either way, for first time offenders, more than likely she will be reprimanded verbally pretty severly by the judge and her parents, hopefully ... and friends, colleagues etc. She will probably receive community service, a $1-2k fine and 6 months probation. At the end of this time, if all is done and good, more than likely the case will be dismissed, depending on state laws. I am not a lawyer, and this is not legal advice and not intended for you to follow or quote me on, just an appraisal of what might or could happen. It could be worse, it could be better, my appraisal could be way off, I don't know.

She should not worry too much, but the fact that she is committing larceny at 21-22 is not a good sign. Hopefully this will send a wake up call. I think the board also needs to admit people need 2nd chances, sometimes third ones. I am sure she is generally an honest person, and was having a lapse in normally sound judgment. Best of luck to her and her future medical career, but let this be an educational experience and a warning!

Coops

 

[JohnHolmes]

Originally posted by ad_sharp
If I recall correctly, both of my acceptance packages had a form that asked for disclosure of any convictions. Just because she didn't have it when she did the secondaries doesn't mean that she's out of the woods. You need to let the med schools know. It would be better than messing things up when its too late.

None of mine have. I am sure it varies by school.

 

[JohnHolmes]

Originally posted by DrBodacious
ACK!

Why on earth would you tell the schools? She claimed on her secondaries and AMCAS that she had not gotten in trouble AT THAT TIME. Only by lying when answering that question could she get kicked out of Medical School, right? TO my knowledge, there was no fine print saying that you are required to report any future run in with the law in order to stay legit.

This thread started out reaking of dishonesty. However, from a legal stand point it is sound. Even if such a disclosure policy was part of the AMCAS agreement between applicant and school, she should not report at this time. IT is detrimental to her defense and unless she already has been through the judicial system, it is a violation of the 5th amendment's protection against self-incrimination. Unless the agreement says have you been "charged" and makes it clear it carries no indication of guilt. Doing so, or admitting to this through AMCAS unless that is abundantly clear in legalese, would greatly hinder her case, if she decides to plead not guilty. This could be taken as an admission of guilt. Also, it seems ethical that if she pleads not guilty and by trial she is found to be not guilty, reporting this could be detrimental to her legal career. It seems ethical to me that people have a right to privacy regarding criminal legal actions taken against them, of which they have been found not guilty. Being forced to reveal this would undoubtedly prejudice future employers, even if the outcome was stated and understood to have freed the individual. To do otherwise, to me, would seem to be a miscarriage of justice and never let people recover from being charged with a crime, even though they may have been found not guilty. What is the point of having a system of justice if you are not only unassumed to be innocent, but the mere act of being targeted assured your "guilt" in the eyes of the public indefinitely.

Read the clause in the AMCAS agreement, make sure it is clear, more than likely this whole thing needs to play out legally before action can be taken by either party.

Coops

 

[UCLA2000]

Many if not all medical schools do a prematriculation background check. Although it's not a felony and won't prevent her from obtaining a medical license, it may be cause of rejection from the medical school.

A recent history of petty theft shows that the person is not trustworthy, and raises several serious concerns including the person's ability to manage/dispense drugs (amongst other things).

 

[JohnHolmes]

Originally posted by UCLA2000

A recent history of petty theft shows that the person is not trustworthy, and raises several serious concerns including the person's ability to manage/dispense drugs (amongst other things).

Fortunately for her, she is applying to medical school, not pharmacy school, brother.

 

[green plastic]

Well she says she is gonna go speak to the general manager of the store sometime in the next couple days and explain that it was just a sudden impulse/lapse of judgement and request if they can withdraw her case from the court. Is this even possible for them to do? She says she's gonna tell them about her record of service and academics and how that truly doesn't reflect her character (she has no past legal record)....this girl even has newspaper articles that were published about her service to underserved communities. She's also gonna offer to pay for any damages they may have incurred as a result of her actions.

 

[JohnHolmes]

Originally posted by green plastic
Well she says she is gonna go speak to the general manager of the store sometime in the next couple days and explain that it was just a sudden impulse/lapse of judgement and request if they can withdraw her case from the court. Is this even possible for them to do? She says she's gonna tell them about her record of service and academics and how that truly doesn't reflect her character (she has no past legal record)....this girl even has newspaper articles that were published about her service to underserved communities. She's also gonna offer to pay for any damages they may have incurred as a result of her actions.

Once charges have been filed, they have been filed. Its really out of their hands. Its up to the ADA, honestly. If they contact him and ask to have them dropped, he may listen, he may not. Best of luck!

Coops

 

[DrBodacious]

Originally posted by green plastic
Well she says she is gonna go speak to the general manager of the store sometime in the next couple days and explain that it was just a sudden impulse/lapse of judgement and request if they can withdraw her case from the court. Is this even possible for them to do? She says she's gonna tell them about her record of service and academics and how that truly doesn't reflect her character (she has no past legal record)....this girl even has newspaper articles that were published about her service to underserved communities. She's also gonna offer to pay for any damages they may have incurred as a result of her actions.

For god's sake, tell her to get a lawyer. She is MUCH more likely to get the charges dropped if she gets a lawyer to represent her. Lawyers know the personalities of the judges and DAs in your area and will be able to work accordingly with them. They will also be able to tell her what her chances are of getting the charges dropped, keeping the offense off of her record via community service, etc. Find a reputable lawyer who has many years of experience working in your area!!

I doubt a store manager will have any sympathy with her as they probably have a policy to prosecute all shoplifters. Plus, as someone else mentioned, if they have filed charges they may not be able to "un-file" them.

I'd like to reply to someone saying my previous advice sounded dishonest. I don't think it is dishonest in the slightest so allow me to explain. (We are not talking "WWJD" here with getting into medical school.) Lets say you have a really awsome job (fun + $$$,$$$). Would you tell your boss if you got into trouble with the law? I know many of you would never break the law, but lets say, hypothetically, that your parents are murdered, your sig other dumps you, and you fail a chemistry test. It doesn't really matter what happens, but for some reason you go out to a bar to drown your sorrows and drive home trashed because you are not acting like yourself. (I think most of us would agree that there is no ethically sound excuse for driving home trashed) You get pulled over and get a DUI.

Now, lets say your boss is a bit of a hardass and probably wont sympathize with your sorrows. He has tons of responsability to get **** done at the company, and manages a couple hundred extremely talented employees. Many other people in the job market would kill for your job. The bottom line is that you are not sure whether he will or will not sympathize with you. The thing to do that is in your best interests is not to openly reveal your DUI using all your problems as an excuse, but to just get over you sorrows, pay your debt to society through the courts, and get on with your life while trying to keep your job. In the long run, who would not feel more satisfied to be able to accomplish thier dreams, rather than choosing to be overly open with your boss and getting fired because there are thousands of other people who didn't screw up, or didn't tell the boss that they screwed up, available to replace you in a competive job position.

Jesus wouldn't have been a doctor. He was a carpenter.

 

[lattimer13]

Originally posted by green plastic
my cousin just got a misdemeanor in the middle of the application cycle and she is freaking out. Her misdeanor is for petti-theft cuz she was caught stealing like $20 worth of some jewelry.

what a *******!!!

 

[green plastic]

would it be possible to get something like this expunged off of one's record? how long does the process usually take?