My first real anti-DO run in

[DD214_DOC]

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Just an interesting tidbit of info for those considering DO schools. Two of my fiancee's nursing-student friends got into a discussion about DOs, and claimed they, "would have a problem calling me 'doctor' because I was a DO".

Although it really didn't bother me, it does make the decision of going to a DO school more "real" when you run into these sorts of problems. I'm sure they will change their minds once they're working in a hospital, although that may not happen since they have failed more than one of their nursing courses. 😱

 

[Chronotropic]

From what I've experienced some nursing students will go to great lengths to put down any premed (MD or DO).

 

[PublicEnemy]

hmm, sounds like the tables turn pretty quickly though, don't they? i feel like more nurses complain about not getting adequate respect than any doctors DO or MD. not every nursing student out there is a gaylord fokker. if you're a DO, all your patients will call you doctor and you'll get a doctors $, it just might be, in fact, you'll actually be a doctor, and in the end, thats what really matters, or so i've heard.

 

[bobo]

Just an interesting tidbit of info for those considering DO schools. Two of my fiancee's nursing-student friends got into a discussion about DOs, and claimed they, "would have a problem calling me 'doctor' because I was a DO".

Although it really didn't bother me, it does make the decision of going to a DO school more "real" when you run into these sorts of problems. I'm sure they will change their minds once they're working in a hospital, although that may not happen since they have failed more than one of their nursing courses. 😱

Dude who really gives a crap what some stupid nursing students think? I work with 90%+ MD's. Nobody really gives a crap here. We are all doctors. My coat says Dr. bobo and that's what they call me, period. Take your stupid comments elsewhere.

bobo, do

pgy-1

 

[DrMom]

funny, my only anti-DO encounter was with a nurse who said she'd never even worked with one 🙄

 

[Caverject]

Most Americans have no idea what a DO is! They will call whomever a Doctor at a doctor's office without hesitation. I don't think that is an insult either, just a testament that you guys are as good as MD's

 

[OnMyWayThere]

Both DO's that I worked with in the ER had just Dr. xxxxx and no initials after their names unlike ALL the MDs that had M.D. after their name.

That is really the only thing that bothers me because I couldn't give a s(*y about what ignorant people say about DOs. Unfortunately though, I think I'd leave the D.O. off too because I would hate for patients to question my work, or ask for a MD. That's really the only thing that bothers me about this D.O. situation.

I really wish the AOA would charge $100 from each matriculant, that's something in the vicinity of $100x 3000 matriculants (this is an estimate of 150 students x 20 schools) and spend that $300,000 on educating the public on Osteopathic Medicine!! Although that $300k isn't much, it's SOMETHING.

 

[bobo]

My coat says Dr. bobo. That's just the way my hospital is. When I move on, my coat will say, bobo, DO.

 

[(nicedream)]

My coat says Dr. bobo too. Come to think of it - why am I wearing a coat that says Dr. bobo....where am I?....

 

[ASDIC]

all nurses seem to hate doctors because they want authority in patient intervention. sometimes such hostility can be seen when a nurse argues with a doctor or just avoid working with doctors.

doctors seem to dictate what nurses shud and shudnt do...that pisses the nurses off

 

[exmike]

My coat says Dr. bobo and that's what they call me, period.

hehe, somehow i find that very funny.

 

[lowbudget]

Why not just Jun Fan / Jeet Kune Do / Wing Chun / Kali / Submission Grapple them into calling you "doctor"?

 

[DD214_DOC]

I think the point of my post is being missed. It didn't bother me what they said, but it puts into perspective the seriousness of deciding to pursue a career in osteopathic medicine.

 

[flighterdoc]

Just an interesting tidbit of info for those considering DO schools. Two of my fiancee's nursing-student friends got into a discussion about DOs, and claimed they, "would have a problem calling me 'doctor' because I was a DO".

Although it really didn't bother me, it does make the decision of going to a DO school more "real" when you run into these sorts of problems. I'm sure they will change their minds once they're working in a hospital, although that may not happen since they have failed more than one of their nursing courses. 😱

Thats why they're students - because they're uneducated. And, it sounds like they'll wind up ignorant, too.

 

[(nicedream)]

Thats why they're students - because they're uneducated. And, it sounds like they'll wind up ignorant, too.

 

[Fin-Nor]

I think the point of my post is being missed. It didn't bother me what they said, but it puts into perspective the seriousness of deciding to pursue a career in osteopathic medicine.

y would this be a serious concern of yours? they are students... they prolly havent had enough real world contact/experience to even make such a broad statement. they prolly dont even know what the basis of osteopathy are.

btw, team gracies always seem to smother team japan with their bjj

 

[ZOT! ZOT!]

Please go get those girls, show them this thread, and let them read this post from a future MD:

You guys are stupid, ignorant, and judgmental. People like you give nursing a bad name! There are 7% of nursing slots left unfilled every year. If keeping people like you out of nursing school causes this shortage, I say bring it on! Healthcare is a team effort and each member is equally important. Can a DO save a life just like a MD? YES! So, what's the problem here? 👎

 

[Jojo tuna]

well said, Zot ZOT

good etho, good logos, good pathos

no flaw in his message

~jojotuna

 

[Fin-Nor]

my eyes... lol

 

[Robz]

Just an interesting tidbit of info for those considering DO schools. Two of my fiancee's nursing-student friends got into a discussion about DOs, and claimed they, "would have a problem calling me 'doctor' because I was a DO".

Thats ok.....here is a list of 5 orders that have to be done tonight and since they all deal with values you can't skimp out on them and said you have done them when you haven't. Thanks! 🙂

 

[DocWagner]

Don't let a couple of little girls influence your career goals.

PS My coat says Dr. Wagner because I don't want patients to know my first name (don't need an ER patient calling my house.)

 

[medic170]

Thats ok.....here is a list of 5 orders that have to be done tonight and since they all deal with values you can't skimp out on them and said you have done them when you haven't. Thanks! 🙂

Exactly, you may not be able to force those nurses to call you Dr., but they sure as hell have to complete your charted orders!

 

[DD214_DOC]

I don't expect nurses to call me doctor anyways -- Josh is fine with me. However, I imagine patients wouldn't like that, so I guess in front of patients it would be a professional necessity.

I'm not concerned with the title or the degree, it's the job that I want.

 

[Eyecon82]

I don't expect nurses to call me doctor anyways -- Josh is fine with me. However, I imagine patients wouldn't like that, so I guess in front of patients it would be a professional necessity.

I'm not concerned with the title or the degree, it's the job that I want.

I completely agree

 

[jhug]

she claimed they, "would have a problem calling me 'doctor' because I was a DO".

i promise, at 2am she'll have no problems calling you up, apologizing, kissing your DO-derri?re and asking for permission to give a patient a tylenol 🙂

 

[freesolo]

enough nurse bashing =p. Most of them have never been dinguses to me as a premed 😀 maybe that will change.

 

[premeddo]

Most Americans have no idea what a DO is! They will call whomever a Doctor at a doctor's office without hesitation. I don't think that is an insult either, just a testament that you guys are as good as MD's

True! During the time I was shadowing my friend at a hospital, his patients the nurses everyone would call me doctor! and Im not even in med school! I personally don't care what other people think about DO's though. I like their philosophy and so is why I want to go into a DO program.

 

[Pitt Panther]

Just an interesting tidbit of info for those considering DO schools. Two of my fiancee's nursing-student friends got into a discussion about DOs, and claimed they, "would have a problem calling me 'doctor' because I was a DO".

Although it really didn't bother me, it does make the decision of going to a DO school more "real" when you run into these sorts of problems. I'm sure they will change their minds once they're working in a hospital, although that may not happen since they have failed more than one of their nursing courses. 😱

Here's your response...

MD, DO, whatever. Your all going to be calling me an "A-hole" momentarily since all of the patients on my service are in need of a bracing enema tonight. Make sure to leave breath mints under each of their pillows too.

 

[PublicEnemy]

Here's your response...

MD, DO, whatever. Your all going to be calling me an "A-hole" momentarily since all of the patients on my service are in need of a bracing enema tonight. Make sure to leave breath mints under each of their pillows too.

now thats what you call motivation. hell hath no fury like bowels scorned.

 

[Amy B]

My coat says Dr. bobo too. Come to think of it - why am I wearing a coat that says Dr. bobo....where am I?....

HAHAHA

 

[MoosePilot]

Here's your response...

MD, DO, whatever. Your all going to be calling me an "A-hole" momentarily since all of the patients on my service are in need of a bracing enema tonight. Make sure to leave breath mints under each of their pillows too.

You might read the nurse vs. doc discussions that went on about a month back. Nurses are apparently not absolutely required to carry out a doctor's orders. If they disagree with the order they can not do it and the doc has to carry out his own orders.

 

[ad_sharp]

I guess I'll share my first real experience with prejudice against DOs. There is a large healthcare system of several hospitals and clinics near where I lived. They employ some 300 or so doctors in just about every field of medicine out there. My friend, Wordup, and I thought that this would be a great place to shadow in the ER. When we signed up at volunteer services, the woman running the program found out that we were applying to OSUCOM. She warned us about talking about DOs and the trouble that it might get us into with some of the docs in the hospital. I was somewhat shocked at her encouragement for us to be hush-hush about the whole thing (like we were cooking meth in our basement and didn't want the cops to find out).

Anyhoo, I picked up the physicians directory.....not a single DO in the whole system. I asked one of the PAs and he said that "it was not hospital policy to hire DOs." They had grads from Mexico, all of the Carribeans schools, and many foriegn schools in addition to many US allopathic schools. No docs were from TCOM or OSUCOM (both of which are nearby and offer the DO degree). This was my first run in with REAL prejudice. These folks won't even consider you for a job-a little worse than ignorant nursing students who have no say in your future. Although this is not as common as it once was, it is still a reality.

 

[OSUdoc08]

What hospital was that?

Interestingly enough, half of the residents in the hospitals in or around the OU medical center are DO's, including 100% of all emergency medicine residents.

DO's are very common in Oklahoma, so that would be a very unusual case.

In fact, I've never seen a hospital discriminate in such a way, especially since the AMA made it illegal to do so.

 

[jhug]

at our meeting in June the AMA-MSS passed legislation (and it passed the HOD) stating that anytime the AMA states "physician" it is automatically means MD/DO, any time one or the other is inadvertently left out the other is put in with it (unless specifically speaking of one profession). The new AMA president was inaugurated with DO representation on the stage with him! Any hospital practicing such things should be reported and it should be fixed...not only is it very illegal, they are missing out on a lot of very qualified physicians.

 

[sophiejane]

JKD--

You say that all you want is the job and you don't care about the title, yet you think what a couple of nursing students say points out the "seriousness" of choosing to become a DO. Your statements seem contradictory. Nothing a nursing student or pre-med says has a whole lot of relevance about the reality of the field of medicine. It's like a high school student talking about how life is after college. Just wink, smile, and ignore them. If the job is what you want, you first have to let go of being an MD (unless you choose that). Then, you need to be proud of being a DO. Believe me, when you really see DOs in action and when you get going in school, being proud of the future letters behind your name won't be a problem...

 

[ad_sharp]

The main hospital campus is located in Denison, TX (just an hour north of Dallas on highway 69/75). It is called Texoma Medical Center (TMC). I'm sure that the hospital does not have an "'official policy" stating that DOs cannot be hired-it's just kinda unofficial.

👎

 

[DD214_DOC]

You say that all you want is the job and you don't care about the title, yet you think what a couple of nursing students say points out the "seriousness" of choosing to become a DO. Your statements seem contradictory. Nothing a nursing student or pre-med says has a whole lot of relevance about the reality of the field of medicine. It's like a high school student talking about how life is after college. Just wink, smile, and ignore them. If the job is what you want, you first have to let go of being an MD (unless you choose that). Then, you need to be proud of being a DO. Believe me, when you really see DOs in action and when you get going in school, being proud of the future letters behind your name won't be a problem...

As I said, it was more of a post for others who simply pass off the DO stigma as nonsense to rationalize their decision to attend because it was their only acceptance. However, this doesn't really affect me. Hence, it would seem contradictory. The biases/stigma/whatever DOES exist and isn't something to not be considered.

Please stop attributing my post to my own personal feelings.
👎

 

[drusso]

The main hospital campus is located in Denison, TX (just an hour north of Dallas on highway 69/75). It is called Texoma Medical Center (TMC). I'm sure that the hospital does not have an "'official policy" stating that DOs cannot be hired-it's just kinda unofficial.

👎

I noticed that there is one DO recent graduate in family medicine there

Jim Tarpley, DO

Maybe you want to contact him and see what his experiences are.

 

[bella_dottoressa]

yikes, you have more patience than me 🙂 i would have had to refrain from slapping the nursing students 😉 trouble calling you a doctor? good lord.

 

[sia_simba]

Why even bother w/ those nursing students or care what they say ? They are jealous because they can't be doctors themselves or they don't get any special title after they graduate. The only reason why they exist is because they are more affordable than doctors. I am sure if DO salary went down to 60k a year, the hospitals wouldnt even need to hire nurses and just get a whole bunch of DOs.

 

[medic170]

Why even bother w/ those nursing students or care what they say ? They are jealous because they can't be doctors themselves or they don't get any special title after they graduate. The only reason why they exist is because they are more affordable than doctors. I am sure if DO salary went down to 60k a year, the hospitals wouldnt even need to hire nurses and just get a whole bunch of DOs.

Dude, no offense, but this nurse bashing post of yours sounds just as ignorant and unfounded as the ignorant nurses that were D.O. bashing. Nurses are medical professionals that play a separate and important role in medicine, they are not just cheap doctors. Also, they do get the title of RN, BSN, MSN and so on. They are not necessarily "lower" than doctors. You treat them that way when your a resident, and you will regret it, they can make your life hell some residency positions. You are smarter and better than that buddy, I am sure of it. Don't go there, don't be "that guy".

 

[jhug]

You treat them that way when your a resident, and you will regret it, they can make your life hell some residency positions.

too true!!! nurses make great friends and horrible enemies! when you really want to find out what a doc is like-- you ask the nurses he/she works for🙂

 

[DrMom]

Dude, no offense, but this nurse bashing post of yours sounds just as ignorant and unfounded as the ignorant nurses that were D.O. bashing. Nurses are medical professionals that play a separate and important role in medicine, they are not just cheap doctors. Also, they do get the title of RN, BSN, MSN and so on. They are not necessarily "lower" than doctors. You treat them that way when your a resident, and you will regret it, they can make your life hell some residency positions. You are smarter and better than that buddy, I am sure of it. Don't go there, don't be "that guy".

excellent post.

 

[Robz]

First off...cause this post is directly heading toward trashing nurses I am going to ask that people please not turn this thread into a hate match....please....

Why even bother w/ those nursing students or care what they say ?

True...take care of number one...best advice.

They are jealous because they can't be doctors themselves or they don't get any special title after they graduate. The only reason why they exist is because they are more affordable than doctors.

Highly doubtful....they may want more autonomy but I know plenty of nurses that don't want to be physicians. I don't know if you have spent any time in hospitals, nursing homes, assisted livings, health councils, health department clincis or actually see how dynamic a RN degree can be but I can say thats an asinine statment to say they only exist cause they are more affordable than doctors. Read about the profession, its really quite unique and they do work thier asses off and many health agancies could not run without them. Please go shadow some for a bit...they do a lot!

I am sure if DO salary went down to 60k a year, the hospitals wouldnt even need to hire nurses and just get a whole bunch of DOs.

So if an MD or a DO is only earning 60K a year they would just hire physicians to the nessessary education/nursing duties. Ummmmmmm. If it was only 60K a year I doubt you would find many physians that would do it...let alone even enter the field. You go find a doctor that wants to do "all" the duties of a nurse PLUS doing thier dx and treatments on top. Right.

AGain please lets not turn this into a fight and get back to the subject of DO percetions and ignorant ALLIED health. Personally I haven't seen a problem except some people don't know what the a DO is but they sure as hell know things like Emergency Physician, Surgeon, Radiologist, Family Practice, Pedatrics, and Cardiologist. Iniitials are kinda lost once you have a speciality.

 

[sia_simba]

My original post:
"Why even bother w/ those nursing students or care what they say ? They are jealous because they can't be doctors themselves or they don't get any special title after they graduate."

How can you rule out that is not true ? Those two nursing students are probably just jealous and throwing their little fits. That part of the post is specifically referring to those two nursing student and what they might be thinking. I understand they get RN etc. after their name, but so does someone w/ an M.A. They are prob mad because people won't be calling them Nurse this, nurse that, and they would have to call a DO doctor this, doctor that, so its just hard for them to stomach. =)

My original post:
"The only reason why they exist is because they are more affordable than doctors. I am sure if DO salary went down to 60k a year, the hospitals wouldnt even need to hire nurses and just get a whole bunch of DOs."

That is a little too bold of me to say, but what the heck right? opinions are opinions and I'm sure everyone who wants to sound all nice and polite isn't 100% like that all the time, so please excuse me for being rude this 1%. I believe that a DO is competent enough to do what a nurse can do. I've been in an ER as an intern and seriously, I AM LIKE the nurse in there except I was not able to do the invasive stuff because of hospital regulations not because of my skills. I understand that nursing is a totally different department, but honestly though, why is there a nursing department? So hospitals can hire more people to help w/ the unempolyment rate? NO.!! It is because doctors CANT do everything themselves so nurses are there to help out. That is why there are "Nurses aide" because the nurses can't do everything themselves either. I am NOT saying that nurses aren't smart, I'm sure they are. I have met a lot of nurses that are really nice compassionate generous helpful and kind. But I have met nurses that are stuck up hateful not helpful at all and mean. What I am saying is that if a hospital doesn't have to pay a doctor the amount of money they have to and pays them the salary of a nurse, why would they need nurses ? instead of 10 doctors and 20 nurses at the ER, just hire 30 doctors for the same price. More education, probably more educated in field of medicine, and better understanding of situations and such. (these thoughts are hypothetical... not comparing a 10 yr nurse w/ a 1st yr resident, but rather a 1st yr nurse, to a 1st yr doctor)

Referring to the pay of why would a doctor want to work for 60k ? It is hypothetical situation in which the salary of a doctor is only 60k a year and is not being compared to what it is now. So w/ that aspect taken care of, MONEY is not an issue for the hospital and now the questionable thing is SKILL.

So there, I am not nurse bashing or anything, nor am I being a cocky, ignorant, arrogant, DO student. But hey, lets be frank, who doesn't want cheap smart labor? I'm sorry my friends.... but we are TOOOO expensive and not a lot of people can afford us, not the way we wanted but its the way how it was set up for us. So please respond w/ your opinions, I want to hear what other people have to say.

NOTE: I am not nurse bashing but stating my opinion on the relation and existence between nurses and doctors.

 

[Robz]

Dude, no offense, but this nurse bashing post of yours sounds just as ignorant and unfounded as the ignorant nurses that were D.O. bashing. Nurses are medical professionals that play a separate and important role in medicine, they are not just cheap doctors. Also, they do get the title of RN, BSN, MSN and so on. They are not necessarily "lower" than doctors. You treat them that way when your a resident, and you will regret it, they can make your life hell some residency positions. You are smarter and better than that buddy, I am sure of it. Don't go there, don't be "that guy".

Man, shorter than my post and quite possibly better....good post.

 

[DD214_DOC]

Let's avoid degenerating into a flame fest. 👍

 

[daelroy]

JKD

You are contradicting yourself. You said you don't care about others perceptions of you and that you only want to be able to practice medicine. Well, you know that you will have no trouble practicing medicine as a DO. The only issue was the stigma or lack of respect that you are afraid of receiving as a DO. As a case in point, you raised the example of a couple of nursing students who look down upon DO's, and that has caused you to question pursuing osteopathic medicine. Obviously, you do care what others think of you which is why you wrote your post. Don't backtrack because you are getting criticized. Have the fortitude to at least stand by your opinion.

My advice would be to not apply to a DO school. If a couple of nursing students can make that much of an impression upon you then you aren't secure enough with being a DO. It's only going to get worse. Reapply to an M.D. school. Some people are affected by others opinions more than others. You happen to be one of these people. Be honest with yourself and stick to the M.D. You sound like you care too much about how others will perceive you. DO isn't for you.

 

[daelroy]

The main hospital campus is located in Denison, TX (just an hour north of Dallas on highway 69/75). It is called Texoma Medical Center (TMC). I'm sure that the hospital does not have an "'official policy" stating that DOs cannot be hired-it's just kinda unofficial.

👎

Texoma Medical Center in Denison, TX .... ...at first we thought you were talking about a real hospital in a real city. NEXT

 

[DD214_DOC]

JKD

You are contradicting yourself.

You see, this is what irritates me more than anything. How many times have I explained this? I am not contradicting myself. My post was originally to demonstrate to those who may be seeking DO as an alternative to MD to not make light of the decision.

Please get a clue. Thanks.