National Guard instead of HPSP?

[notdeadyet]

I JUST GOT PAID!!!!!! I really want to use some emoticons, but I'll refrain.
Bend it -

Congrats, amindwalker. It's all real now...

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[TheGoose]

I have decided not to pursue anesthesia. I am now in an accelerated program called the Primary Care Scholars Pathway. There are 5 of us and we are cramming all 4 years of med school into 3 years. I plan to go into internal medicine.

cool beans.

 

[iatrosB]

I JUST GOT PAID!!!!!! I really want to use some emoticons, but I'll refrain.
Bend it -

NICE!

 

[Buhr77]

In simple terms, what are the differences between NG and HPSP with regard to commitment and salary/stipends?

just FYI - North Dakota resident, entering my senior year of undergrad, applying to medical schools for admission fall 2009

 

[notdeadyet]

In simple terms, what are the differences between NG and HPSP with regard to commitment and salary/stipends?

Read the thread. One of the guys did just that: a detailed comparison of the two programs side by side.

 

[Buhr77]

I did... any specifics on ND?

Also what do the commitment ratios mean?

 

[notdeadyet]

I did... any specifics on ND?

That'll be a longshot. If you looked over the comparison, you'll see the bulk of the differences between the programs.

The only big difference with the states is going to be tuition scholarships made available to National Guard members. (Illinois = free; California = none). Do a google search on North Dakota National Guard benefits/scholarship/tuition and you should find if your state offers anything special for tuition while you're in school.

Best of luck....

EDIT: Just did a quick hunt and it looks like North Dakota might be free tuition for NGers as well. Here's the link I used (which shows tuition breaks for all states). Confirming this with your AMEDD recruiter would be wise.

 

[Buhr77]

Thank you!

 

[amindwalker]

That chart on notdeadyet's link is accurate as far as I can tell. However, it is not for grad schools or for officers. Pennsylvania Guard will send an enlistee to college and pay for the whole thing (as indicated on the chart), but they will only pay 10K/year for med school. It is possible that your state will give you the same deal (found on the chart) for med school, so I recommend contacting your state ANG AMEDD officer recruiter.

 

[EMH]

Also what do the commitment ratios mean?

If you take the STRAP (the $1900/mo stipend) then for every year you receive the $ you owe 2 years commitment.

The STRAP used to be the best deal the Guard had. The ASR program is a different program and can't be used at the same time you are taking the STRAP. For details on the ASR program see the first page of this thread.

 

[slycaper]

That chart on notdeadyet's link is accurate as far as I can tell. However, it is not for grad schools or for officers. Pennsylvania Guard will send an enlistee to college and pay for the whole thing (as indicated on the chart), but they will only pay 10K/year for med school. It is possible that your state will give you the same deal (found on the chart) for med school, so I recommend contacting your state ANG AMEDD officer recruiter.

So California will not offer any Tuition Assistance while I go to medical school? Can any califonians attest to this?

 

[EMH]

So California will not offer any Tuition Assistance while I go to medical school? Can any califonians attest to this?

I thought those California Med schools were free/cheap tuition anyways.

 

[notdeadyet]

So California will not offer any Tuition Assistance while I go to medical school? Can any califonians attest to this?

I'm a Californian in the application process for ASR. I verified with my recruiter: there is not established tuition scholarship for being in the NG here.

I thought those California Med schools were free/cheap tuition anyways.

Our state has it in our constitution that public education will always be "tuition free".

So medical school in California is tuition-free. But you know the "other fees" you see listed for schools, that usually runs about a grand for gym membership and parking? Ours is $25K/year.

Cheap compared to some states, expensive compared to most.

 

[slycaper]

I'm a Californian in the application process for ASR. I verified with my recruiter: there is not established tuition scholarship for being in the NG here.

Our state has it in our constitution that public education will always be "tuition free".

So medical school in California is tuition-free. But you know the "other fees" you see listed for schools, that usually runs about a grand for gym membership and parking? Ours is $25K/year.

Cheap compared to some states, expensive compared to most.

What do you mean "tuition free"? I'm a California resident(and National Guard member in CA) but am attending med school in Nevada? How would that play out?

 

[notdeadyet]

What do you mean "tuition free"? I'm a California resident(and National Guard member in CA) but am attending med school in Nevada?

All california schools are "tuition-free" by state charter. UC, CSU, etc. are all "tuition-free". They get around it by charging high "fees". So they end up being just as expensive. It has no bearing here.

How would that play out?

You'd have to ask the Guard. My understanding is that you get the tuition break in the state you're in the Guard in. If you're in the CalNG, it means nothing, because they offer no tuition assistance and you're not studying in-state anyway. If you're in Nevada, check to see if they offer tuition assistance. If they do, you might consider switching to the Nevada guard, especially if you'll be there for four years.

Are you in a medical company or something that protects you from deployment while in med school? If so, I'd tread very carefully before changing anything.

 

[iatrosB]

Keep in mind guys, that everyone can get $4500 per year for tuition assistance because that is federal...any on top of that can come from the state.

 

[notdeadyet]

Keep in mind guys, that everyone can get $4500 per year for tuition assistance because that is federal...any on top of that can come from the state.

Thanks for the tip, iatrosB. I wasn't aware of this.

EDIT: Here's a link to the program. It's a $4,500/year grant. ADSW (like ASR) is eligible. The only obligation mentioned is "Officers must serve 4 years after course completion."

I'd make sure to see it in writing that that four years starts when you finish medical school and not when you finish residency and start unrestricted drilling. If the clock started right after medical school, the $4,500 would essentially bump up your active drilling service obligation by one year, if you took ASR for three years and did a three year residency. Someone correct me if my math seems off.

I'd also want verification that this four year payback can be paid concurrently with your obligations from ASR. Some of the other Guard financial programs (STRAP comes to mind) are paid in addition to any other obligations.

For applicable educational programs, the language reads "Credentials at the associate, bachelor, or master degree level and a vocational/technical certification and licensing." Medical school is technically a doctoral-level program. It's odd they didn't include doctoral.

It's also limited to "first come, first serve", so I'm curious how quickly it runs out, especially in populous states like California, New York, etc.

Has anyone actually received payment for this for medical school yet?

 

[EMH]

New thread:

I'm not trying to kill this thread, I've really enjoyed the help you guys have provided while I'm going through this process. I thought making a thread about the ASR program that was organized with all the important info in a single thread and also add a FAQ after that. If you'd like to contribute to it check it out here.

I'll put any changes in an edit of the post and since I know the same questions will be asked over and over I'll make an FAQ in the next few days. Maybe we can get it stickied when it's cleaned up.

 

[CTARNG HMS]

I'm currently on the ASR program. It's incredible. Drill is extremely flexible. It simply comes down to how much your commander is going to ask of you. No one upsets my class schedule however and I simply have made myself available to talk about the program in the city where I go to med school. The flex training schedule is real and truly does come down to a day every three months. Like I said, incredible. Contact Joe Guerriero at jmgue-at-beld.net.

 

[notdeadyet]

Like I said, incredible. Contact Joe Guerriero at [B]jmgue-at-beld.net[/B].

Might want to change his email address to something like the above. Otherwise spiders will scrape his address and he'll be getting a nice fat influx of spam.

By the way, I've been working with LTC Gurriero on my package and he's been fantastic. Top notch guy.

 

[CTARNG HMS]

Might want to change his email address to something like the above. Otherwise spiders will scrape his address and he'll be getting a nice fat influx of spam.

By the way, I've been working with LTC Gurriero on my package and he's been fantastic. Top notch guy.

Thanks for the advice. LTC G. is most honest and on the ball military recruiter i've worked.

 

[EMH]

My packet is going to be complete and submitted today or tomorrow (just in time for a deadline of course). When I asked my recruiter if there's anything else I can do she said pray. She then said she was serious, depending on the mood of the officer who has to board me I may or may not get picked up. I always assumed they'd take anyone without any major problems and I am shocked by this statement. Can anyone comment on this?

(I'm a good candidate on paper so I don't know what could get me rejected. No serious medical history, top 1/3 of my class, great MCAT, almost all 7's on the letters of rec. Seriously, how could they not take me?)

 

[amindwalker]

You will not have a problem. The doc at meps told me that there was a physician with one eye who got in, he had to get a waiver, but he got in. Of course he's a doc not a med student. I'm 39 and I needed 3 waivers; lasek, mildly elevated LDLs, and weight (I'm muscular, not fat, but it still triggered a waiver). My MCAT was not great. EMH, you will get in.

 

[notdeadyet]

I'm 39 and I needed 3 waivers; lasek, mildly elevated LDLs, and weight (I'm muscular, not fat, but it still triggered a waiver).

Good lord, you need a waiver for mildly elevated LDLs? Do you need one if you have good LDLs but take statins to do so?

I'm 36, have a history of getting banged up, and have MEPS a week from today. If they're saying mild hyperlipidemia needs a waiver, I'm visualizing enough waivers with which to play a decent game of cards.

My MCAT was not great. EMH, you will get in.

Does the MCAT come in to play? My recruiter never asked for mine. Until he does, I'm thinking along the lines of Don't Ask, Don't Tell.

 

[notdeadyet]

dupe

 

[EMH]

Does the MCAT come in to play? My recruiter never asked for mine. Until he does, I'm thinking along the lines of Don't Ask, Don't Tell.

I'm an M2 and she said she had to include it. She called AAMC to get the score directly. I'm surprised they would release it to her actually.

 

[iatrosB]

I'm an M2 and she said she had to include it. She called AAMC to get the score directly. I'm surprised they would release it to her actually.

Dude, you'll get it...welcome to the family.

 

[amindwalker]

Statins will prolly trigger a waiver. As I understand it, any deviation from perfect health will require a waiver, but you will get the waiver because you are not trying to become a pilot or a SEAL, but a physician. Nobody asked me for my MCAT.

Enjoy meps notdeadyet !!!!

They give you a breathalizer test first thing in the morning. If you register at all, your meps experience ends there. I learned that morning that 6-7 beers does in fact get completely metabolized in about 6 hours. Either that or their breathalizer was broken .

 

[notdeadyet]

Statins will prolly trigger a waiver. As I understand it, any deviation from perfect health will require a waiver, but you will get the waiver because you are not trying to become a pilot or a SEAL, but a physician.

Amen. It'd be rich irony to be rejected from becoming a National Guard physician solely because you're proactive enough about your health to get your lipids tested.

Enjoy meps notdeadyet !!!!

Thanks. Fingers crossed.

 

[iatrosB]

I just got drill pay for attending a medical student national conference (something I was going to do anyway)...gotta love that!

 

[amindwalker]

These ARNG threads have recently been read by the AMEDD recruitment and Retention Command at National Guard Bureau in Washington, DC.

I have been instructed to post the following corrections;

1. HPLRP (loan repayment) and the special pay cannot be taken together

2. Starting your second year of residency, if enrolled in STRAP you can
receive HPLRP and the stipend concurrently.

3. 90 day BOG (boots on the ground) (AKA deployment) can be as frequent as 18 month apart following residency completion.

4. We are accepting 200 new ASR's annually not just 200 total...

5. Also and one of the most important. Doc's need to drill monthly not 1
drill every 3 months. There is a flex training policy, but it is primarily
for med students and residents and the State Surgeon sets the policy for
their state...

6. Service obligation: All officers incur an 8 yr MSO, 6 of which must be
spent in drilling status. 2 can be in the IRR
-no additional commitment for the ASR program
-MDSSP and Strap are both a 2 for 1 repayment following program
completion.

Please disregard any info to the contrary.

 

[RDC12304]

MEPS Thursday....... fingers crossed.

 

[Milamber]

These ARNG threads have recently been read by the AMEDD recruitment and Retention Command at National Guard Bureau in Washington, DC.

I have been instructed to post the following corrections;

1. HPLRP (loan repayment) and the special pay cannot be taken together

2. Starting your second year of residency, if enrolled in STRAP you can
receive HPLRP and the stipend concurrently.

3. 90 day BOG (boots on the ground) (AKA deployment) can be as frequent as 18 month apart following residency completion.

4. We are accepting 200 new ASR's annually not just 200 total...

5. Also and one of the most important. Doc's need to drill monthly not 1
drill every 3 months. There is a flex training policy, but it is primarily
for med students and residents and the State Surgeon sets the policy for
their state...

6. Service obligation: All officers incur an 8 yr MSO, 6 of which must be
spent in drilling status. 2 can be in the IRR
-no additional commitment for the ASR program
-MDSSP and Strap are both a 2 for 1 repayment following program
completion.

Please disregard any info to the contrary.

Wow didn't realize they read this over in DC

 

[EMH]

These ARNG threads have recently been read by the AMEDD recruitment and Retention Command at National Guard Bureau in Washington, DC.

I have been instructed to post the following corrections;

Thanks for that.

 

[iatrosB]

MEPS Thursday....... fingers crossed.

 

[Tiger26]

Wow didn't realize they read this over in DC

It's the government . . .

 

[amindwalker]

I have referred about 50 people since May. They wanted to know what I have been doing, so I sent them the links. Don't worry, it's just the AMEDD R & R Command in DC. They are judging me, not you.

 

[TheGoose]

I have referred about 50 people since May. They wanted to know what I have been doing, so I sent them the links. Don't worry, it's just the AMEDD R & R Command in DC. They are judging me, not you.

and youre probably the poster-child for recruitment....well done!

 

[amindwalker]

More like the red-headed step child. Thanks Goose.

 

[TheGoose]

More like the red-headed step child. Thanks Goose.

what member of AMEDD isnt the red headed step child....

 

[amindwalker]

Goose, I'm really thankful that you have chosen the most beloved character from Top Gun as your avatar/call sign. How's everything?

Notdeadyet, how was meps?

RDC12304, Enjoy tomorrow !

 

[iatrosB]

Goose, I'm really thankful that you have chosen the most beloved character from Top Gun as your avatar/call sign. How's everything?

Notdeadyet, how was meps?

RDC12304, Enjoy tomorrow !

Yeah, good luck man...

And notdeadyet, give us the scoop

 

[notdeadyet]

And notdeadyet, give us the scoop

Thanks, guys. I got bumped, actually. I had the appointment for today, but on reviewing my file a couple of days prior to my appointment, the folks at MEPS told my recruiter that they wanted a letter from the National Guard saying they'd give me a waiver for two health problems prior to my coming in (minor ones, at that: acid reflux that self resolved years ago and high cholesterol that's been controlled with statins).

Ugh. My recruiter's looking into it now. Hopefully it won't delay things too long. But for now I'm on hold while he looks into how to get this done. Hopefully it won't take more than a few weeks, but I haven't heard back yet.

 

[Tiger26]

Thanks, guys. I got bumped, actually. I had the appointment for today, but on reviewing my file a couple of days prior to my appointment, the folks at MEPS told my recruiter that they wanted a letter from the National Guard saying they'd give me a waiver for two health problems prior to my coming in (minor ones, at that: acid reflux that self resolved years ago and high cholesterol that's been controlled with statins).

Ugh. My recruiter's looking into it now. Hopefully it won't delay things too long. But for now I'm on hold while he looks into how to get this done. Hopefully it won't take more than a few weeks, but I haven't heard back yet.

Next time only list major diseases if you've had them. seriously i've done meps 3 times over the course of 7 years in the army

 

[notdeadyet]

Next time only list major diseases if you've had them. seriously i've done meps 3 times over the course of 7 years in the army

Yeah, I've heard that recommendation before as well. I'm just not comfortable giving my word about something that isn't true. I'm especially not crazy about not being honest on what's essentially a contract document with the Army. I'm not going to volunteer information about the cold I had last season if I'm not asked about recent colds, but if the question is pretty black and white, I'm not comfortable lying. If that delays entry, so be it.

Remind me I said all this if I'm still waiitng on getting in in six months and I'm looking at potentially $20K in lost wages.

 

[notdeadyet]

MEPS Thursday....... fingers crossed.

Best of luck, RDC. Hope they treat you right...

 

[iatrosB]

the folks at MEPS told my recruiter that they wanted a letter from the National Guard saying they'd give me a waiver for two health problems prior to my coming in (minor ones, at that: acid reflux that self resolved years ago).

 

[darmalee]

Yeah, I've heard that recommendation before as well. I'm just not comfortable giving my word about something that isn't true. I'm especially not crazy about not being honest on what's essentially a contract document with the Army. I'm not going to volunteer information about the cold I had last season if I'm not asked about recent colds, but if the question is pretty black and white, I'm not comfortable lying. If that delays entry, so be it.

Remind me I said all this if I'm still waiitng on getting in in six months and I'm looking at potentially $20K in lost wages.

I'm not going to necessarily say lie to them...because I get what you're saying about not wanting to sign a contract that says you're being completely honest...but they REALLY don't try too hard to find out if you're lying. We had a kid who was bi-polar schizophrenic who made it all the way through basic training and ait before anything was done about it...and all they did to him was medboard him out, and now he's getting paid for the rest of his life. Another soldier had heart disease...actually had a heart attack in basic training, and they let her finish training and come to my unit because she cried and did the whole "I just want to serve my country" thing. That one made me mad, since she was 100 percent useless to us, spent her entire time at the hospital and going to appointments, and had a profile that wouldnt even let her be at work a full day, after all of her "I just want to be a soldier" nonsense, and my XO and I actually tried to find out how to get her in trouble for false enlistment, and even after she had confessed to another soldier that she knew she had heart trouble and hadn't said anything at meps...no one wanted to do the paperwork and she ended up getting medboarded also...and now my tax dollars are paying her lazy ass to do nothing...DON'T get me wrong, I have no problem with disability for people who get medboarded who have actually done something for their country...but people like that...piss me off...

Wow, I kind of went off on a tangent there, but back to my original point...the Army knows that people are almost never completely honest at MEPS...and maybe in another time when we aren't hurting so badly for people they'll actually do something about it...but unless you have something that will seriously inhibit you from doing your basic military crap...don't stress it too much.

 

[Tiger26]

Yeah, one of my best friends at basic training had 3 knee surgeries before joining that never came up at meps when he went through.

I'm not saying you should lie, just don't voluntarily put every sore throat, sprained ankle, or cough on the self questionnaire.

Heart attack? Yes, reportable

GERD? Unless it's actively burning a hole through your esophagus to the point of hemodynamic instability during your physical, I'd leave that one out.

MEPS, when functioning properly, is supposed to be like an ER (an ideal one at least) in that they're trying to rule out what could potentially kill you, not just make you uncomfortable

 

[chroroform]

Hey what function do you have when you drill while in med school and while in residency? I mean while in med school I might have 0 prior military training and 0 medical training(not even an m.d.), so what would i be doing? Is it possible, if you volunteer, to do some military training? For example to take an infantry course the summer before med school and drill as an infantry officer? Or to go on some "humanitarian" missions during the summers of med school?

Also am i correct to understand that you get the same salary as USUHS students while in school (even higher as you're promoted to O-2 after 2nd year) but instead of a 7yr commitment after residency, you only have a short part-time commitment?
thanks