Needing input

[alphaeve]

So here's the story:
I graduated from undergrad a few years ago from a top liberal arts college. I majored in psych with a focus on neuroscience, and graduated with a low GPA (3.0, though my major GPA was a 3.5). My science courses were just the core requirements, so I have almost no science credit. Basically, I had some skewed priorities, and I spent most of college being social rather than being studious.

Since graduating, I've worked for about a year as a direct care counselor for emotionally and behaviorally disturbed youth, and after that, worked with the same company as an in-home family counselor for the same types of kids.
I'm headed back to school starting this summer to take science courses and bring up my GPA, albeit at a less rigorous school, in order to start on the path to med school. I've taken one full-length practice MCAT, and I got a 28 on it (9 BS, 7 PS, 11 VR), which I think is good news given I've never taken a gen chemistry, organic, physics, or upper level bio course.
What are my odds? I feel like I can do this, but I'm basically quitting a job that could be a career, planning on taking out more loans when I'm not exactly living the good life now, and embarking on another decade of school. I'm actually really excited about the idea of all of it, but a realistic assessment from others would be helpful at this point!
Thanks!

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[spicedmanna]

So here's the story:
I graduated from undergrad a few years ago from a top liberal arts college. I majored in psych with a focus on neuroscience, and graduated with a low GPA (3.0, though my major GPA was a 3.5). My science courses were just the core requirements, so I have almost no science credit. Basically, I had some skewed priorities, and I spent most of college being social rather than being studious.

Since graduating, I've worked for about a year as a direct care counselor for emotionally and behaviorally disturbed youth, and after that, worked with the same company as an in-home family counselor for the same types of kids.
I'm headed back to school starting this summer to take science courses and bring up my GPA, albeit at a less rigorous school, in order to start on the path to med school. I've taken one full-length practice MCAT, and I got a 28 on it (9 BS, 7 PS, 11 VR), which I think is good news given I've never taken a gen chemistry, organic, physics, or upper level bio course.
What are my odds? I feel like I can do this, but I'm basically quitting a job that could be a career, planning on taking out more loans when I'm not exactly living the good life now, and embarking on another decade of school. I'm actually really excited about the idea of all of it, but a realistic assessment from others would be helpful at this point!
Thanks!

Most of all of us here have taken significant risk and given up plenty to get to where we are now; so, welcome to the group! Take a moment to do a search and read some of the wonderful success stories of the non-trads on this board; it may astonish you. Rest assured, you are not alone.

It sounds like you are on the right track, if there ever was one. What I mean is, you are doing post-baccalaureate work, taking science classes, and have a good start with the MCAT. Keep up the good work.

The good news is that since you don't have much history with science classes (BCPM --> Biology, Chemistry, Physics, and Math), it will be pretty easy to raise your BCPM GPA, provided, of course, you do well in all of your classes. Your overall undergraduate GPA might be a little bit harder to raise.

Demonstrate to the admissions committees that you have changed academically by trending A's from now on. Your past does follow you to some extent, but admissions committees pay close attention to trends and your recent performance, so make all that work in your favor. Make your studies your one of your highest priorities. Outside of your academic studies, you will probably want to shadow some doctors and do some volunteer work (medical schools particularly like clinical volunteer work that involves the medically-underserved, but any volunteer work should suffice). You may want to supplement with some additional clinical experience in a hospital, or the like, if you have the extra time, since it sounds like you have already worked with patients in a therapeutic capacity. You just want to further demonstrate your new commitment to medicine, otherwise your school work should definitely be your focus.

When it comes time for you to study for the MCAT, take as many practice tests as possible under realistic conditions. I cannot emphasize enough how important that is. Most people start seriously studying about 3-4 months, or so, before their test date. Buy all of the AAMC practice tests. If you decide to enroll in Kaplan, do all of the AAMC and QBank problems. In the meanwhile, do lots of critical reading where you time yourself and try to get the gist of each paragraph with scientific and literary journals; this will help your VR out a lot. Yeah, PS was my worst section as well. In retrospect, I think I just needed to do a lot more practice problems. Make sure there are no holes in your knowledge, because you never know exactly what you are going to get come test time. Understand the basics very well and take the time to diagnose and resolve your issues in each section. You should strive to do as well on the MCAT as possible; try to score above 30 consistantly on your practice tests. Obviously, the higher your average score, the better.

Keep us posted on your progress.

Good luck!

 

[alphaeve]

Thanks for the advice, Spicedmanna! I'm so glad I found this site... I feel like it's going to be really helpful over the next steps in this process. I just had one more quick question.

Outside of your academic studies, you will probably want to shadow some doctors and do some volunteer work (medical schools particularly like clinical volunteer work that involves the medically-underserved, but any volunteer work should suffice). You may want to supplement with some additional clinical experience in a hospital, or the like, if you have the extra time, since it sounds like you have already worked with patients in a therapeutic capacity. You just want to further demonstrate your new commitment to medicine, otherwise your school work should definitely be your focus.

In order to make it through my trip back to undergrad, I will definitely have to get a job. The hospital in my town is good about hiring the college students, and they almost always have 2 positions open on a PRN basis: lab tech and "patient care associate". My initial instinct is that patient care associate would obviously give me more patient contact, but would it look bad if a substantial amount of my clinical experience was paid?

Sorry if this doesn't make too much sense... it's been a long day at work.

 

[southpawcannon]

NEEEEEEDD INPUT!!!!

 

[alphaeve]

Need input indeed!

Hilarious!

 

[spicedmanna]

In order to make it through my trip back to undergrad, I will definitely have to get a job. The hospital in my town is good about hiring the college students, and they almost always have 2 positions open on a PRN basis: lab tech and "patient care associate". My initial instinct is that patient care associate would obviously give me more patient contact, but would it look bad if a substantial amount of my clinical experience was paid?

Sorry if this doesn't make too much sense... it's been a long day at work.

Yeah, if you want patient contact at a hospital, definitely being employed by one would give you much more of that than volunteering. Working as a patient care associate certainly sounds like a good solution. I think medical schools just care that you have cinical experience. I don't think it has to be tied in with volunteer work, per se, although many people do tie it in for convenience.

I would say take the job at the hospital, and then when you manage to squeeze in some spare hours into your already busy day, do some volunteer, or community service, work that you enjoy. It doesn't have to be clinically-related, if you don't want it to be. You have a lot of background in counseling kids, so perhaps you could volunteer some time working with underpriviledged kids, or something like that. Medical schools like to see volunteer work/community service because it allegedly shows that you are service-minded.

 

[southpawcannon]

Thanks for the advice, Spicedmanna! I'm so glad I found this site... I feel like it's going to be really helpful over the next steps in this process. I just had one more quick question.



but would it look bad if a substantial amount of my clinical experience was paid? QUOTE]


Of course not. Don't be ridiculous. If you volunteer over an extended period of time, then that's a plus. If you become employed over a period of time, that will only be a bigger plus because you've been given more responsbility. I've not volunteered yet(though I plan on it soon and a lot) because my clinical work has taken up all my time.

 

[spicedmanna]

NEEEEEEDD INPUT!!!!

"Number five is alive!"

 

[Lebesgue]

So here's the story:
I graduated from undergrad a few years ago from a top liberal arts college. I majored in psych with a focus on neuroscience, and graduated with a low GPA (3.0, though my major GPA was a 3.5). My science courses were just the core requirements, so I have almost no science credit. Basically, I had some skewed priorities, and I spent most of college being social rather than being studious.

Since graduating, I've worked for about a year as a direct care counselor for emotionally and behaviorally disturbed youth, and after that, worked with the same company as an in-home family counselor for the same types of kids.
I'm headed back to school starting this summer to take science courses and bring up my GPA, albeit at a less rigorous school, in order to start on the path to med school. I've taken one full-length practice MCAT, and I got a 28 on it (9 BS, 7 PS, 11 VR), which I think is good news given I've never taken a gen chemistry, organic, physics, or upper level bio course.
What are my odds? I feel like I can do this, but I'm basically quitting a job that could be a career, planning on taking out more loans when I'm not exactly living the good life now, and embarking on another decade of school. I'm actually really excited about the idea of all of it, but a realistic assessment from others would be helpful at this point!
Thanks!

You won't know till you pull the trigger...

I was in a similar situation - pulled the trigger, got into med school and recently secured a very competetive residency.

I actually threw away 2 good jobs to go for it and I have no regrets. Your MCAT is great (especially verbal, most peoples weakness) for not having the background - do about 8-9 practice tests after taking the required courses and you should do well >30.

Make sure it's what you want since you'll be fully committed once you're in. The face of medicine is changing so do some soul searching to find out what it is about being an MD that is important to you - if it's money or status, don't go for it, if its something else you'll never regret it. It's not that much money and it's not that much status. And it is one heck of a lot of work compared to what your friends will be doing...

Best Wishes

 

[RPCVGuy]

As a fourth-year medical student who was in a similar position to yours when I was applying to medical school (unsuccessfully x 2 prior to a successful 3rd), the advice I wish someone had given to me is: if you are serious about medicine, half-time your job, take out the loans, enroll in a post-bac program at a reputable university and work your ass off.

I tried to go the middle route of taking classes here and there when I could and took an MCAT prep course (and did very well), but in the end what schools wanted to see was A's in my basic Chem, Bio, and Physics classes from a major univ. This was despite almost of decade of working in social work-type fields where I had more contact with 'patients' than most students in their third year of medical school. At the end of the day, schools were still hung up on numbers/grades that were the result of mistakes I made at age 18 .

I ended up 'wasting' a lot of money trying to go a different route and although I dont regret the time I spent working, it would have been much more straight-forward had I gone back to a post-bac program and fixed the things that needed to be fixed.

I happen to interview applicants for my school and LOVE to encounter students with life experience. But it takes leaping through a few GPA/MCAT hoops to get to the interview where you can impress someone like me and I can then advocate for you to the admin committee. It makes my job a lot easier when there are no doubts about your academic ability and I can tell everyone how much better of a classmate/physician you will be b/c of your unique experiences than someone who just graduated last June.

 

[alphaeve]

As a fourth-year medical student who was in a similar position to yours when I was applying to medical school (unsuccessfully x 2 prior to a successful 3rd), the advice I wish someone had given to me is: if you are serious about medicine, half-time your job, take out the loans, enroll in a post-bac program at a reputable university and work your ass off.

Thanks for the advice! I do plan on quitting my current full time job to go back and trying to get a PRN type of job at the hospital in order to have SOME income. I've already figured on taking out loans over the next two years to pay for this all... which sucks, but I know I'll likely have to do.

My question is how important is the reputation of the school I take the pre-reqs from? This school is much cheaper for me (due to being a state school) than others might be, and cost of living here is ridiculously low. This school sends several students each year to the state med schools, but it's not necessarily known outside of the state, unless you want to go into engineering. Is this going to seriously hurt me in applying outside of the state schools?

 

[RPCVGuy]

Hard to know w/o knowing the specific school to which you are referring.

I would say that any 'state' school is a pretty good bet and any school with a post-bac program is even better. post-bac programs offer the advantage of (generally) having some staff that can give you feedback re: what classes to take, programs to apply to, MCAT help, etc. Some schools have specific 're-applicant' post-bac programs that are tailored specifically to those who have tried and failed to gain acceptance to medical school.

On a an up-beat note, getting good science grades at a school known for engineering is not a negative! Also, schools will have some respect for you working while going to school and it will looks that much better when you get good grades while working on the side. Having done so myself throughout college and later while applying to medical school, I am always more impressed with applicants who have managed to repair past wrongs while working at the same time than those who had nothing more to do than take classes (not hard to get good grades if school is all you have to do).

I think you have a compelling story to tell admin committees about your experiences post-college. Give yourself the opportunity to do that face-to-face and I dont think you will have a problem.

Just as an aside, one thing that made a huge difference to me mentally when I returned to take classes was that I swore if a professor was going to give me a B, he/she would know my name and face - so I went to every single office hours and had a list of questions to ask (even if it was something stupid like, 'tell me why you became interested in your field'). I could probably walk up to one of them today and they would recognize me - I put in that much time (sat in row #1, raised my hand in class, etc). Dont be afraid to go whole hog where your future is concerned

 

[spicedmanna]

Just as an aside, one thing that made a huge difference to me mentally when I returned to take classes was that I swore if a professor was going to give me a B, he/she would know my name and face - so I went to every single office hours and had a list of questions to ask (even if it was something stupid like, 'tell me why you became interested in your field'). I could probably walk up to one of them today and they would recognize me - I put in that much time (sat in row #1, raised my hand in class, etc). Dont be afraid to go whole hog where your future is concerned

Right on. I had a similar approach and would recommend the same.

 

[alphaeve]

Thanks everyone! I've decided that I'm going to go ahead and start with the post-bac work this summer rather than waiting for fall. That way, there will be 3 semesters worth of work to bring my GPA up/ demonstrate my newfound dedication to scholastic endeavors before I submit my AMCAS. You guys are all really helpful, and I appreciate that you took the time to help!