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*Official Columbia School of Dental Medicine c/o 2013 Acceptance Thread*
- Thread starter klutzy1987
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yea i dunno. lol so i'm going to add on another question to your question!
do they have block scheduling for exams or just consistently having exams on a week to week basis?
Planning on going?
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Im not sure yet. Its between Columbia and UCSF. I loved the Columbia vibe though... the students seemed happy
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I interviewed in September and haven't heard anything yet! I'm totally freaking out....Has everyone who interviewed already received a notice, whether it be accepted/rejected/waitlisted? Do you guys think I should call them? Or would it make me seem too eager?
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"you will hear soon" well before Christmas.
However, based on the last cycle's predent.com,
it's negative!
So, we should find out if we can anticipate any results(Accepted, waitlisted, rejected) at this time.
Hope there are still three sorts! Probably, those who applied last cycle already know the answer.
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i've heard from current students that they have block scheduling for exams during the first year, but the second year is more hectic with exams on a week to week basis. but, they're changing the curriculum for our incoming class, so it may be different next year..
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I've also heard from current students that the administration actually cares about when your exams are. So for example, when I interviewed, the D1s had two exams in one week, so all of their classes were cancelled that week so they had additional time to study.
Another bonus: H/P/F grading!
Another bonus: H/P/F grading!
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Congrats!!
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A p/f system is great, bnut Columbia defeats the purpose with their H/P/F system. This doesnt eliminate competition and allows for class ranking. Their system is pretty stupid.
I got the letter on 12/5. But I already knew I am not going to Columbia.
The reasons are similar to klutzy1987: The area is basically the Harem slum not to mention all the smog in the air. I was out in street for only 2 hrs or so during that entire day, and by the time I returned to the airport my shirt was stained black with sooth around my sleeves and neck. Unbelievable. I have never seen this kind of dirty air. Los Angeles air would be pure compared to this. I read about this dirty air effect in New York somewhere here in SDN, but I thought he was exagerating. But now I know it's true.
And yet I have to pay so much for a tiny apt for 4 years.
Also, as mentioned, their clinical training and the lab facilities are simply poor in comparison to many other schools. And they told us on the interview day, as you all remember, that they don't expect us to have enough skills to practice by the time we finish 4 years. They don't even allow us to practice after 4 years. This means they not only don't have good clinical training, but won't be improving since they are thinking we should all have 1 extra year before getting licensed.
Competition? Chatted with a 4year that day, and his honest input was that it gets very very competitive for that Honor grade. He also said Columbia has to send out 4 acceptances for every seat, because that many people turn down the offer every year. There are reasons for this as stated above.
Don't get me wrong. It's a good school. It would have a greater chance in attracting students if it were located in a better area with better facilities.
I was very disappointed after series of disappointments by the last part of the tour which was the student lounge. It was dirty, tiny with old furniture. How many chairs did you guys count in the lab for 3rd and 4th years? I thought that clinic was too small and narrow with not enough chairs.
And the classes taken with the med students? A lot of that time spent on memorizing obscure medical details can be spent on learning more about dental care and skills. Such unnecessary curriculum simply adds more stress.
Now, all these will be bearable if they give out sizable scholarships as other private schools do. They don't. That's the first thing they flat out told us. They don't have enough money.
For all these reasons, it's pretty clear to me, that Columbia is definitely not for me. I would like to try to maximize my enjoyment of 4 years of training somewhere healthier in terms of environment and curriculum.
I write all these hoping that it may be helpful for those of you who are deciding between other schools and Columbia.
PM me if you want to discuss anything.
Good luck with you all. And congrats in getting accepted to Columbia. But I'm sure most of you have other options as well.
Choose wisely. It's 4 long years of your life.
The reasons are similar to klutzy1987: The area is basically the Harem slum not to mention all the smog in the air. I was out in street for only 2 hrs or so during that entire day, and by the time I returned to the airport my shirt was stained black with sooth around my sleeves and neck. Unbelievable. I have never seen this kind of dirty air. Los Angeles air would be pure compared to this. I read about this dirty air effect in New York somewhere here in SDN, but I thought he was exagerating. But now I know it's true.
And yet I have to pay so much for a tiny apt for 4 years.
Also, as mentioned, their clinical training and the lab facilities are simply poor in comparison to many other schools. And they told us on the interview day, as you all remember, that they don't expect us to have enough skills to practice by the time we finish 4 years. They don't even allow us to practice after 4 years. This means they not only don't have good clinical training, but won't be improving since they are thinking we should all have 1 extra year before getting licensed.
Competition? Chatted with a 4year that day, and his honest input was that it gets very very competitive for that Honor grade. He also said Columbia has to send out 4 acceptances for every seat, because that many people turn down the offer every year. There are reasons for this as stated above.
Don't get me wrong. It's a good school. It would have a greater chance in attracting students if it were located in a better area with better facilities.
I was very disappointed after series of disappointments by the last part of the tour which was the student lounge. It was dirty, tiny with old furniture. How many chairs did you guys count in the lab for 3rd and 4th years? I thought that clinic was too small and narrow with not enough chairs.
And the classes taken with the med students? A lot of that time spent on memorizing obscure medical details can be spent on learning more about dental care and skills. Such unnecessary curriculum simply adds more stress.
Now, all these will be bearable if they give out sizable scholarships as other private schools do. They don't. That's the first thing they flat out told us. They don't have enough money.
For all these reasons, it's pretty clear to me, that Columbia is definitely not for me. I would like to try to maximize my enjoyment of 4 years of training somewhere healthier in terms of environment and curriculum.
I write all these hoping that it may be helpful for those of you who are deciding between other schools and Columbia.
PM me if you want to discuss anything.
Good luck with you all. And congrats in getting accepted to Columbia. But I'm sure most of you have other options as well.
Choose wisely. It's 4 long years of your life.
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Wow i hope you are joking... I live 20 blocks away and I agree its not a great neighborhood but its not like you have to be worried when you walk around like in newark or by temple. Also what were you doing rolling in the streets or something:? i mean come on dude your shirt wont get dirty by just standing around.... Sorry to break it to you but LAs smog is much worse, hands down.
I forgot one more thing. When the two first years were having lunch with us, we asked one guy how it is to study with the med students and how they get along. Here is what he said. I'm quoting from my memory. "It's interesting knowledge definitely but it's tough. You have to come here knowing it's going to be tough. Med students just have classes. We have the same classes + practicals afterward. This is why dental students average lower than med students. But med students must be smarter, you know. As to relating, there are some med students who are friendly and nice. But we get treated as second class. They think they are superior and don't mingle with us. But I get along with few nice med students."
I said the exact same thing when I read that post by someone else in the past. I could not believe it either until I saw it with my own eyes. Try it. Just walk around or even just stand still waiting for bus for 2 hrs, and come home and check. I was wearing a new shirt and I took a good hot shower that morning. I know, it is unbelievable. After seeing that, I was afraid to blow my nose because I didn't want to know what's collected there.
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Thanks for the input. I know NYC isn't right for a lot of people but I wanted to add my two cents.
I think the knocks on Columbia get exaggerated a bit. Every student I've talked to there loves the school and feels very taken care of. In fact on my interview day I talked to a first year from Cali who had been having trouble adjusting. He said he walked into a professors office and they talked for almost 2 hours, with not a single word about dentistry.
The area is near Harlem, but Harlem isnt that bad anymore. Todays Harlem isn't great, but its not the Harlem of yesteryear and you are like a 10 minute cab ride from central park. Bill Clinton has his offices are in Harlem and you know he could afford to have them in Soho if he desired. Honestly, the area isnt even close to the ghettos that Temple and UDM are parked in. And about that small apartment, you aren't paying so much for the space, you are paying so much because you are living in the cultural and economic capital of the country. Besides, student housing is just $700-800.
All this being said, it is bothersome that they tell you this isnt the place to go if you want to do general dentistry. So much can change in 4 years and it would suck to be forced to do a GPR bc the school wan't able to teach you enough clinically.
Ahh tough decisions. Is anyone here set on going to Columbia?
I think the knocks on Columbia get exaggerated a bit. Every student I've talked to there loves the school and feels very taken care of. In fact on my interview day I talked to a first year from Cali who had been having trouble adjusting. He said he walked into a professors office and they talked for almost 2 hours, with not a single word about dentistry.
The area is near Harlem, but Harlem isnt that bad anymore. Todays Harlem isn't great, but its not the Harlem of yesteryear and you are like a 10 minute cab ride from central park. Bill Clinton has his offices are in Harlem and you know he could afford to have them in Soho if he desired. Honestly, the area isnt even close to the ghettos that Temple and UDM are parked in. And about that small apartment, you aren't paying so much for the space, you are paying so much because you are living in the cultural and economic capital of the country. Besides, student housing is just $700-800.
All this being said, it is bothersome that they tell you this isnt the place to go if you want to do general dentistry. So much can change in 4 years and it would suck to be forced to do a GPR bc the school wan't able to teach you enough clinically.
Ahh tough decisions. Is anyone here set on going to Columbia?
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Dude, Columbia's neighborhood is not great but is not terrible. Its not in Harlem, its in Washington Heights. I am a big Columbia Hater, but Im honest. I live in NY and my shirts arent dirty with soot unless its during the summer and Im sweating or im playing ball in a dress shirt??
Think about it, dude. What do I get by making up a story about the shirt getting dirty around the neck and sleeves after a short stay out in the street? That's what happened that day.
I don't hate Columbia. No need to. I just shared what I know and what I think with you guys to be any help in your decision making. That's all. I have no need to exaggerate or make up anything.
As to it not being exactly in Harlem. I had to take buses and subway to get to and from the school that day and the previous evening. It did not feel safe. That's all. It's subjective. But it's from someone who is not from NY.
$700-800 for a shared crammed apt with I don't know how many people is considered very high for me. I could get a whole apt to myself in a nice neighborhood with that price.
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$700-800 per person for a 2 bedroom apt with a full kitchen and full bathroom, for me, I think is fine. Who wants to spend a lot of time in your apartment anyways when you could be enjoying NYC! or pulling teeth!
....
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You need to get a grip my man...
Firstly, to call Washington Heights the "Harem" slum, as others have noted, please get your geography straight. It is Washington Heights, which might very well be a neighborhood more diverse in both heritage and socioeconomic status than wherever you hail from, but that inherently does not make it a slum. Living here for over a year and a half, taking the bus ::gasp:: or train :gasp:: or walking ::gasp:: to class every day and I have yet to been mugged, beaten up by a roving 'Harem' gang, or succumbed to the inferior air quality and passed out on the sidewalk. I am actually wearing a clean white shirt right now actually and it doesn't seem to have any soot on it... Go figure... Seriously, you must have been like rolling around in the back seat of a cab or something.
And as for not being 'allowed' to practice after 4 years, I think your best bet would be to take that up with the state of New York bud. The mandatory PG training is required to practice in New York City. Some (very few) graduates have sought to practice after their 4 years of training, and were thereafter dissuaded. So whether you go to a school like Columbia, or a dental mill elsewhere, if you'd like to practice in our fair city you'd have to suck it up and take the PGY.
As far as competition, if you don't like competition, don't compete! You can lead a rather stress-free existence here, pass every class, even focus more of your time on the dental aspects of things 1st and 2nd years if you so desire, and end up a very capable dentist. If you want to specialize and want to go for all H's, then you might have to deal with some competition. Would you not think that to achieve high grades in any other school you would not need to compete? If you want to be one of the 20-someodd 4th years applying to OS this year, then yes, you have to take your work seriously, though oftentimes not as seriously as you might be inclined to believe. If you'd like to go elsewhere and want to specialize and want to have to end up in the top 5% of a 250 person class, good luck not having any stress than either. They're not going to hand you an H just for showing up and the school aims for driven students that aren't going to slack and not 'compete'. The 'competition' that exists is that we all push each other to do better, not that we drive each other down for our own personal gains. There's a reason why we kick the boards' ass every year as a whole, as opposed to across the board mediocrity with some outliers. And if you don't like memorizing minute details, have fun taking those boards. Columbia Dental was founded 90 years ago on the premise of creating a well-rounded "Doctor of the Mouth" and the taking of classes with the med school was in the original charter. Obviously, said charter has worked better than those of sayyyyyy Georgetown, Fairleigh Dickinson, or Northwestern etc. etc. , so I for one hope that Columbia keep doin what they doin.
The lab you speak speak of with chairs that you lost count of is for 1st and 2nd years, and never once sitting in it have I felt as if there was a lack of space. In fact compared to the other schools I interviewed at I am quite certain that these were some of the spacier preclinical confines. Also remember that when you visited there were also another 25 bodies milling about in there that normally aren't.
Just wanted to point out a few of your myriad misconceptions that you might have come to in what I'm sure was a very very enlightening 5 hour stay with us on interview day.
If anyone wants to know what things are like here, from someone whom has spent more than enough time to soil many many shirts and acquire about a ton of carcinogens in their lungs, feel free to ask.
Didn't mean to flame ya, just defending my school's honor,
aaaaand just be happy you didn't blast my undergrad...
Firstly, to call Washington Heights the "Harem" slum, as others have noted, please get your geography straight. It is Washington Heights, which might very well be a neighborhood more diverse in both heritage and socioeconomic status than wherever you hail from, but that inherently does not make it a slum. Living here for over a year and a half, taking the bus ::gasp:: or train :gasp:: or walking ::gasp:: to class every day and I have yet to been mugged, beaten up by a roving 'Harem' gang, or succumbed to the inferior air quality and passed out on the sidewalk. I am actually wearing a clean white shirt right now actually and it doesn't seem to have any soot on it... Go figure... Seriously, you must have been like rolling around in the back seat of a cab or something.
And as for not being 'allowed' to practice after 4 years, I think your best bet would be to take that up with the state of New York bud. The mandatory PG training is required to practice in New York City. Some (very few) graduates have sought to practice after their 4 years of training, and were thereafter dissuaded. So whether you go to a school like Columbia, or a dental mill elsewhere, if you'd like to practice in our fair city you'd have to suck it up and take the PGY.
As far as competition, if you don't like competition, don't compete! You can lead a rather stress-free existence here, pass every class, even focus more of your time on the dental aspects of things 1st and 2nd years if you so desire, and end up a very capable dentist. If you want to specialize and want to go for all H's, then you might have to deal with some competition. Would you not think that to achieve high grades in any other school you would not need to compete? If you want to be one of the 20-someodd 4th years applying to OS this year, then yes, you have to take your work seriously, though oftentimes not as seriously as you might be inclined to believe. If you'd like to go elsewhere and want to specialize and want to have to end up in the top 5% of a 250 person class, good luck not having any stress than either. They're not going to hand you an H just for showing up and the school aims for driven students that aren't going to slack and not 'compete'. The 'competition' that exists is that we all push each other to do better, not that we drive each other down for our own personal gains. There's a reason why we kick the boards' ass every year as a whole, as opposed to across the board mediocrity with some outliers. And if you don't like memorizing minute details, have fun taking those boards. Columbia Dental was founded 90 years ago on the premise of creating a well-rounded "Doctor of the Mouth" and the taking of classes with the med school was in the original charter. Obviously, said charter has worked better than those of sayyyyyy Georgetown, Fairleigh Dickinson, or Northwestern etc. etc. , so I for one hope that Columbia keep doin what they doin.
The lab you speak speak of with chairs that you lost count of is for 1st and 2nd years, and never once sitting in it have I felt as if there was a lack of space. In fact compared to the other schools I interviewed at I am quite certain that these were some of the spacier preclinical confines. Also remember that when you visited there were also another 25 bodies milling about in there that normally aren't.
Just wanted to point out a few of your myriad misconceptions that you might have come to in what I'm sure was a very very enlightening 5 hour stay with us on interview day.
If anyone wants to know what things are like here, from someone whom has spent more than enough time to soil many many shirts and acquire about a ton of carcinogens in their lungs, feel free to ask.
Didn't mean to flame ya, just defending my school's honor,
aaaaand just be happy you didn't blast my undergrad...
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I agree with you about the air quality and the neighborhood, however I think that the facilities and curriculum is very lacking. For such a famous and "impressive" school you would think that the facilities would be modern and up to date. They are very behind technologically speaking and they seem to b more devoted to book learning and training academics than they are practicing dentists. I dont love classes with medical students and I certainly do not like H/P/F. That defeats the entire purpose of a pass fail system. The reason for a pass fail system is to eliminate competition but inserting that honors undos everything. The school just rubbed me the wrong way.
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Hey Bedentist,Haha, That's right.
Just curious...which D-School have you decided to attend? And are you turning down an offer from Columbia?
Cheers.
Sounds like you are from NY. We can understand your defense for your city and school. No problem.
Regarding the mandatory PG training, guess who pushed for it. Ask Dr. McManus. He told us Columbia and few other schools are strongly pushing other schools and states to pass this rule as well. But other schools are being smart in not allowing such BS come any near their states.
If Columbia is not capable or confident to train their students to be able to at least start working as an associate in 4 years, it should either revamp its curriculum and put more money and effort into its sorry clinical training or admit its defect and allow individual students to decide for himself whether to spend extra 1 year or not. Instead it's trying to make all the other fine schools to conform to its incompetency by pushing for this ridiculous rule.
Dental schools have for long long been 4 years in training without problems. Why is it all of a sudden a problem? In fact, UoP train their fine clinicians in only 3 year!
Of course I am turning down Columbia as other 3 out of 4 people who got the acceptance letters.
We take Boards 1 in the summer after second year. The exam schedule varies and will probably change for your class due to the new curriculum. Currently, first year exams are in blocks and second year we fairly consistently have exams every week or so.
I don't know all the details of the new curriculum, but the general approach is to condense the current first year into the first semester (with, of course, other tweaks so they don't kill you with the workload! haha!) If I had to guess (and this is ONLY a guess), you'll start out with exams in blocks and starting second semester, slowly transition to exams coming more frequently. If this is a major concern, though, your best bet would be to contact Drs McManus or Davis. I think you'll find, though, that it doesn't really matter as much as everyone thinks it does.
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hey guys i just made a facebook group: http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=39960957010
let me know if the link doesn't work! i'm looking forward to seeing everyone in august!
let me know if the link doesn't work! i'm looking forward to seeing everyone in august!
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i was just wondering if this was actually true? i was looking at the adea book on columbia and it stated that 47 ny state residents were accepted, and 125 non-ny state residents were accepted in the 2008 cycle. that would be 172 students who are accepted for a class size of 75...that's definitely more than 1/4 people committing to columbia once they are accepted..if anything, it's more like 1/2 of the people committing after acceptance..
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that 1 out of 4 thing sounds like BS. Im not calling anyone a liar but that's gotta be a miscommunication. I bet its 1 in 4 people interviewed end up going to the school. 300 interviews for 75 spots seems about right.
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You don't need to defend Columbia. Columbia is considered an excellent school and has an outstanding reputation to the people who actually matter (random internet predents are not included). What I find very interesting is all the Columbia bashing. If I visited a school and didn't like it I would simply not attend. What I wouldn't do is bash the school that I have no plans to attend. People say Columbia is expensive and then go to NYU. People complain of taking classes with the med students and go to Stony Brook. People complain of city life and go to Temple. What is the real basis of the Columbia bashing? Jealousy and hatred have an interesting relationship.
Also if you look at the people bashing Columbia you will see that it is the same small group of people over and over again. Guys, get a life. Columbia grads have had an excellent track record and success in dentistry. I doubt that will change because of a few disgruntled predents. It is unfortunate that some people take the opinions on SDN way too seriously. Hopefully they will think independently about making any choice, especially about their future career.
I simply quoted what we were told by a 4th year dropping in for something while 4 of us sitting at the waiting area. He was in scrub and started asking us if we had interviewed elsewhere and if we want to specialize. This is what he told us: "If you can get into Harvard, go there. If not, this would be the next best for specializing. At harvard they only send 40 or so acceptances. Here [Columbia] they have to send 4 acceptances for each seat because many end up going elsewhere...."
That's what he said and that's what I quoted. It's obvious that if you really want to specialize, Columbia is not bad to go through all that extra work taking hardcore medical courses. But if you know you are not spending extra years to accrue more expensive loans to learn some skills that general dentists can do anyway and won't send their patients to you, then Columbia is not for you. McManus told us "If you want to practice after 4 years, don't come here."
How am I lying? How am I bashing by telling the truth? Again, I repeat. The only reason I wrote what I heard from the Dean and 4th year student of Columbia is because some people here with multiple acceptances said they are trying decide where to go. I offered some facts to help their decisions. That's all.
I do agree that Columbia is good for specializing. But it's just harder to compete there because a lot more people want to specialize there. Again, the words from that 4th year, "It gets very competitive for that honor grade. If you want to do Perio. No need to sweat. But if you want ortho or OMS, you really have to work hard."
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