*~*~*~* Official Letters of Recommendation Questions Thread 2019-2020 *~*~*~*

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Hello.

If I am applying for MD only, is it meaningless/not much weight in having the LORs from my PIs who will have things to say only about my research experience? Will adcoms think, "this letter does not serve much purpose for MD since it talks only about research"?
If my research had lots of clinical implications and translational aspects, will it be fine?

Thank you for your help!

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Hello

I took most of my pre-req science classes in a state college (chem, physics..) due to economic/financial reasons. Do ad committee frown upon if my letter writer for the science letter is a state college professor? I have a very good relationship with him and he can definitely assess my academic and personal strengths. He is now the Dean of the state college. It might be helpful. Please advice. Thank you very much for your help

A letter from this professor is fine

Hello -

Does a Professor of Medicine or a Professor of Surgery count as a science faculty when he/she wrote my letter of recommendation? I did not take classes with them. I worked with them through research and in other professional & academic capacities. Thank you!
It may not be acceptable at a large fraction of schools as science letter
 
Hello.

If I am applying for MD only, is it meaningless/not much weight in having the LORs from my PIs who will have things to say only about my research experience? Will adcoms think, "this letter does not serve much purpose for MD since it talks only about research"?
If my research had lots of clinical implications and translational aspects, will it be fine?

Thank you for your help!
Letter from research PI is acceptable and encourage. Medical do not expects letters to assess your abilities to be a doctor but as a student.
 
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I have been looking into the medical schools admission requirements and timelines, as well as googling, but can't seem to find the answer! Is there a deadline that you have to have LORs in by? I just want to tell the people who are writing my letters a date to have it submitted by. I know you can submit the AMCAS without letters and they can upload it later, but I'm sure there's consequences. For example, I saw some schools won't review your application until they receive all your LORs. That could affect the timing of me receiving secondary applications. My guess is mid-June?
 
I have been looking into the medical schools admission requirements and timelines, as well as googling, but can't seem to find the answer! Is there a deadline that you have to have LORs in by? I just want to tell the people who are writing my letters a date to have it submitted by. I know you can submit the AMCAS without letters and they can upload it later, but I'm sure there's consequences. For example, I saw some schools won't review your application until they receive all your LORs. That could affect the timing of me receiving secondary applications. My guess is mid-June?

1) most schools first screen/initially evaluate your primary to send out secondaries. At many schools they send secondaries without screening primary at all. LOR are NOT required for this
2) most schools will not fully evaluate your application until all parts (primary, secondary, MCAT LOR) are in. This is what is meant by an application is complete
3) most schools do not review applicants by the actual adcom for interview invites until after their application is fully evaluated.
4) at many UGs, committee letters and even individual LORs are not written and sent until AFTER the summer when campus is back in swing in the fall.

So, you LORs are needed at the same time that your secondary has been completed and returned to school

********AMCAS 2020 Timeline Summary (post count #007)************
-AMCAS May 1, 2019, Primary application opens up. Can send formal requests for transcripts from your schools and letter requests to your letter writers.
-AMCAS May 30, 2019, Completed primary applications with all ECs, PS, and course information can be submitted.
-You enter the verification queue (“time to verify”) only when both completed primary application and all transcripts have been received.
-AMCAS does not, repeat, does not verify LOR or MCAT score. Your primary application will be verified regardless of LOR or MCAT score status
-AMCAS June 28, 2019, begins transmission verified applications (though some schools have secondaries sent to contact info upon submission to AMCAS)
-Verification peak is about August 1st and takes 20 days
-Most Primary Apps are transmitted early July thru early September
-Secondaries timelines can vary widely as to when to they are sent out from almost immediately upon submissions to 3 months, though most are in the range 1-3 weeks after transmission.
-Letters via AMCAS are processed/transmitted separately from primary
-Letters can be added after primary has been submitted and transmitted and are mostly not needed until secondary reviews at the earliest.
-While applications are transmitted at end of June, most schools do not start any processing until at least mid-July at the earliest; even then, most dont get up to full speed until mid-August.
-There are usually 3 main phases in processing application
----1) Initial Screening/Evaluation: A hybrid of automatic GPA/MCAT screen plus human for "quick review" of application. Used to for general priority and, in some cases, which team/subcommittee gets application. At some schools, preset criteria or informal policy can lead to II at this stage.
----2) Full Evaluation: This is where evaluator/reader/team/subcommittee will fully evaluate all sections of primary, secondary, and LOR and generally summarize in broad categories or point system. This essentially becomes your priority for adcom review and II. This function may be split up among several evaluators and may go to a team or subcommittee for II decision. Application are not typically evaluated until complete with Primary, Secondary, MCAT, and LOR
----3) Full adcom: this is where your fully evaluated application is reviewed and voted on by adcom for II on later on for acceptance/WL/rejection
-Application and candidate evaluations timeline varies widely by school may not done in a linear, chronological order. EDP, High achievers, URM, family of alumni, feeder schools, associated UG programs, linked postbaccs, and other factor may push an app forward in the process.
-Most adcoms dont start meeting for review of evaluated applicants until at least mid-August, more likely September, though some reviews may be done earlier for groups mentioned above. Evaluation may start almost immediately at some schools.
-Schools receive 5,000-10,000 application but can only evaluate several hundred applications a week. Therefore, it can take anywhere from 4-16 weeks (1-4 months) or more to be evaluated, reviewed and invited for interview after your application is complete.
-Schools must reduce several thousand applications to several hundred interviews. Therefore at least 80% of applicants at any individual school must be rejected pre-interview.
-Applicants should check each applicant portal daily until application is marked complete, under review, or similar. After that, you should check applicant portal 2 to 3 times as week as schools may invite you for interview solely by portal; some schools do not send email for interview invite.
-Submitting Primary Application June is Early, July Medium, August Late
-Having Primary verified and transmitted to school by middle of August is normal speed
-Having Secondary and all LORs complete to school by Labor Day is early/ontime. By late or end of September is about middle/normal speed, by end of October is about late.
--After that point you will generally start getting impacted by the number of applications submitted, the finite number of interview slots, and seats given by rolling admissions. These aren’t absolute dates nor is it a fixed timeline. It should be used as a guideline

Getting primary in on time does matter because of all the other items that follow it. But applicants often see the beginning and not understanding how it flows from there. Additionally, how each school then opens a file, reviews them on GPA, MCAT, and other factors, and what order they wind up in a queue has less to do with when the primary arrives then when the secondary is completed and received. Since the majority of schools, I dare say, send out pre-transmission, unscreened, or minimal cut off screened secondaries, this is probably a larger factor in where you wind up in the queue for 1) reading an application and 2) decision on interview invite. As I have said previously, and will undoubtedly say dozens of time during this 2020 application cycle (see count above) review of apps is not simply done in a linear chronological order. High achievers, URM, family of alumni, feeder schools, associated UG programs, linked postbaccs, and other factor may push an app forward in the process.
 
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Hello,

I am getting a letter from a surgeon who I conducted research with and I later took a graded course in clinical epidemiology/research (project course) with them. Would this count as a science letter (given that I took a graded course with them)?

Thank you!
 
Hello,

I am getting a letter from a surgeon who I conducted research with and I later took a graded course in clinical epidemiology/research (project course) with them. Would this count as a science letter (given that I took a graded course with them)?

Thank you!

at some schools it may not: it is from surgeon over clinical course and research.
 
Hello -

1. Will it be okay if a letter title is not filled in? I know where every letter will go to which medical school so I don't need this as a guide. However, since this is visible to medical school, does it have any bearing?

2. I have two letter writers (professors) who are associated with a school but he is not writing the LOR from an academic standpoint. I worked with this professor from a research standpoint, and the other, from a professional capacity. Should I still indicate that they are associated with a school?

3. One of my letter writer is a Professor of Surgery, and also a Chief Medical Officer. What do I put for the title? Surgeon? Professor of Surgery? Chief Medical Officer? Or Professor of Surgery and Chief Medical Officer?

4. For my research PI, she is also a Professor of Surgery. Should I indicate her Title as Professor of Surgery, or Principal Investigator?

Thank you
 
Hi,

I am new to SDN. I needed some help deciding whether to request a recommendation letter from a doctor I have shadowed during an internship I did last summer. I shadowed the doctor for about 3 months in surgeries and built a close relationship with him. I also shadowed him in the office like once. However, I am concerned that since it has been a year that the recommendation letter might not be as strong. I have already requested a committee letter from school. So, I am not sure how great his letter will be. Any thoughts or advice?
 
1. Will it be okay if a letter title is not filled in? I know where every letter will go to which medical school so I don't need this as a guide. However, since this is visible to medical school, does it have any bearing?
I would indicate title/position of writer as some schools will use this to quickly classify letters and/or letter requirement fulfillment

2. I have two letter writers (professors) who are associated with a school but he is not writing the LOR from an academic standpoint. I worked with this professor from a research standpoint, and the other, from a professional capacity. Should I still indicate that they are associated with a school?
If you were working in research or in professional capacity under this person who in turn was doing so as part of there association with the school then yes. If you were doing so privately, I would still do so as you need to fulfill specific requirements and are already making a stretch at some schools

3. One of my letter writer is a Professor of Surgery, and also a Chief Medical Officer. What do I put for the title? Surgeon? Professor of Surgery? Chief Medical Officer? Or Professor of Surgery and Chief Medical Officer?
If you can fit both fine, though professor is more important title

4. For my research PI, she is also a Professor of Surgery. Should I indicate her Title as Professor of Surgery, or Principal Investigator?
both

Now that you have these great letters, do you have at least some academic letters as that is what most schools want?
 
I would indicate title/position of writer as some schools will use this to quickly classify letters and/or letter requirement fulfillment


If you were working in research or in professional capacity under this person who in turn was doing so as part of there association with the school then yes. If you were doing so privately, I would still do so as you need to fulfill specific requirements and are already making a stretch at some schools

If you can fit both fine, though professor is more important title

both

Now that you have these great letters, do you have at least some academic letters as that is what most schools want?
I am a non-traditional student who has been out of school for over four years now. Most of my letter will come from people who I worked in professional capacity and physicians who i shadowed. I have a letter from my PI and one science professor from a state college. Will this be a challenge if the admissions committee take into consideration that I am a non-tradition student who have been out of college for more than four years?
 
I am a part of the Big Brothers Big Sisters of America program. I am in constant contact with the mother of the child (updating her, talking about plans with him, etc.). I feel it would be beneficial to get a letter of recommendation from her; however, I'm not sure if that's professional enough? I could get one from the social worker, but I barely speak to him. She would be able to talk most about me.

Do you think it would be okay to get that letter from the mother?
 
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I am a part of the Big Brothers Big Sisters of America program. I am in constant contact with the mother of the child (updating her, talking about plans with him, etc.). I feel it would be beneficial to get a letter of recommendation from her; however, I'm not sure if that's professional enough? I could get one from the social worker, but I barely speak to him. She would be able to talk most about me.

Do you think it would be okay to get that letter from the mother?
No, it is not worth getting it
 
1) I took 2 classes with a professor called Physiology of Aging and Neurobiology of Aging - they're classified by GERO for their course numbers since they're in a gerontology school - would the professor who's writing my rec count as non-science or science bc it was a science heavy class?
2) I also have a professor who i took a 2 unit medical ethics class (titled contemporary issues in health care) that can only be taken credit/no credit - he's been my mentor throughout college and is also a faculty advisor for a club I'm president of - would he count as non-science or other?
3) my other 3 recs are from a professor i had physiology and anatomy with; my biochem professor and my PI - would this work for enough recommendation letters in the right categories? (enough science, non-science other? or should i ask a gero professor i took a social aspects of death class with)
 
1) I took 2 classes with a professor called Physiology of Aging and Neurobiology of Aging - they're classified by GERO for their course numbers since they're in a gerontology school - would the professor who's writing my rec count as non-science or science bc it was a science heavy class?
2) I also have a professor who i took a 2 unit medical ethics class (titled contemporary issues in health care) that can only be taken credit/no credit - he's been my mentor throughout college and is also a faculty advisor for a club I'm president of - would he count as non-science or other?
3) my other 3 recs are from a professor i had physiology and anatomy with; my biochem professor and my PI - would this work for enough recommendation letters in the right categories? (enough science, non-science other? or should i ask a gero professor i took a social aspects of death class with)

1) every medical school has specific requirements for letters, both in who they are from and in the numbers of letter needed, included maximum.
2) each school, perhaps each evaluator, may have their own formal or informal acceptability of what is science and non-science
3) the rule of thumb of 2 science and one non-science is just that, a rule of thumb. you need to check each school's specific requirements
4) I advise students to have 2 clearly science letters and 1 clearly non-science, non-medical, non-health related letter from a general education requirement such as english, humanities, or social science
5) as for your specific questions
-- the Physiology of Aging and Neurobiology of Aging would be considered science by most
-- the medical ethics would be considered non science by most
-- the A&P and Biochem would be science
-- PI, while science faculty, may not be counted as science if you did not take a class with them
-- social aspects of death would be non science

What are you getting a degree in?
 
Hi! I just called interfolio to make sure all my ducks were in a row wrt letterhead/signatures, and they kindly informed me that one of my writers misspelled my first name all through the letter (think Sara vs. Sarah). They recommended I reach out and ask him to update. I’ve sent him an email but he’s honestly not the promptest responder. Is this a big deal? My gut says no but I guess misspelling my name doesn’t instill confidence that he knows me well and can speak to my character.
 
Hi! I just called interfolio to make sure all my ducks were in a row wrt letterhead/signatures, and they kindly informed me that one of my writers misspelled my first name all through the letter (think Sara vs. Sarah). They recommended I reach out and ask him to update. I’ve sent him an email but he’s honestly not the promptest responder. Is this a big deal? My gut says no but I guess misspelling my name doesn’t instill confidence that he knows me well and can speak to my character.

No one will care... leave it alone and move on
 
1) every medical school has specific requirements for letters, both in who they are from and in the numbers of letter needed, included maximum.
2) each school, perhaps each evaluator, may have their own formal or informal acceptability of what is science and non-science
3) the rule of thumb of 2 science and one non-science is just that, a rule of thumb. you need to check each school's specific requirements
4) I advise students to have 2 clearly science letters and 1 clearly non-science, non-medical, non-health related letter from a general education requirement such as english, humanities, or social science
5) as for your specific questions
-- the Physiology of Aging and Neurobiology of Aging would be considered science by most
-- the medical ethics would be considered non science by most
-- the A&P and Biochem would be science
-- PI, while science faculty, may not be counted as science if you did not take a class with them
-- social aspects of death would be non science

What are you getting a degree in?
Thank you I'm majoring in human biology and minoring in dance (the dance teacher who was writing my non-science rec has a medical issue and cant anymore) and gerontology. I never asked the social aspects of death professor for a rec and I'm afraid its too late to ask her now (though we were very close and i think her letter would be great) but I'm hoping the medical ethics class (called contemp issues of health care) will count as non-science even if its 2 units and a credit/no credit class?
 
Thank you I'm majoring in human biology and minoring in dance (the dance teacher who was writing my non-science rec has a medical issue and cant anymore) and gerontology. I never asked the social aspects of death professor for a rec and I'm afraid its too late to ask her now (though we were very close and i think her letter would be great) but I'm hoping the medical ethics class (called contemp issues of health care) will count as non-science even if its 2 units and a credit/no credit class?
Its a course you got credit for that is all you need
 
Hello! My first post here, so please go easy on me. I will be submitting my application to MD/PhD programs on May 30th and want to clarify a few things before I click "submit."

1. Is it true that I can change LOR assignments to schools however I wish AFTER submitting my primary application? Those LORs should all be submitted to AMCAS by mid-June though to ensure that my application will be received as verified and complete by June 28 (the first day that completed applications are sent to schools), right? This means that I should have LOR assignments fully ironed out by mid-June?

2. I have only had one significant (2.5 years long) research experience, but some MD/PhD programs want two research letters. Since I was in only one lab, would it be acceptable to notify them of this and substitute one of the research letters with another science professor, perhaps?

3. I have just begun a new research experience for four months over the summer. I would like to request a LOR from my mentor in this new research experience when it is over, in August, but I hope that by then my application would have been complete and transmitted to med schools for review already (June 28th). Could I add a letter in August and have my mentor upload it right away? Would my application be temporarily considered incomplete during the window between when I add her as a LOR and when she actually uploads the letter? Would this prevent my application from being reviewed? Is there another way to handle this so that my application's completeness isn't affected for review but I'm still able to add this letter of recommendation in August? Note that this would ameliorate my question (2) above.

Thank you!
 
Hello! My first post here, so please go easy on me. I will be submitting my application to MD/PhD programs on May 30th and want to clarify a few things before I click "submit."
like that is gonna happen,, especially since all your questions can be answered by a careful reading of the AMCAS Applicant Guide 2020.

1. Is it true that I can change LOR assignments to schools however I wish AFTER submitting my primary application? Those LORs should all be submitted to AMCAS by mid-June though to ensure that my application will be received as verified and complete by June 28 (the first day that completed applications are sent to schools), right? This means that I should have LOR assignments fully ironed out by mid-June?
**NO! You can add new letters after submission but
(page 46) "You may not make any changes to letter information after you have submitted your application"
(page 50)• You may continue to add/assign letters after the initial submission of your application, but you may
not edit or delete existing information after your initial submission.
• Once AMCAS receives a letter, no party may delete or edit a letter. Any letters that follow an original
letter with the same AMCAS Letter ID will be appended to the original letter and sent to all medical
schools to which the letter is designated.


**NO! The AMCAS primary application is wholly separate from the AMCAS letter service. You do not, repeat, do not need LORs to submit, verify or transmit AMCAS. (page 2) You may submit your application before your letters of evaluation arrive at AMCAS. Letters are not
required for AMCAS to verify your application.
You made add letters at any time via AMCAS and they will be transmitted in a single day (page 2)
Letters of evaluation that AMCAS receives on your behalf will be distributed to your designated medical schools as they are received.
The term "complete" is used in medical schools admissions to have you primary, secondary, MCAT and letters on file at a specific school. Letters are required by school specific dates and are needed with secondary.


2. I have only had one significant (2.5 years long) research experience, but some MD/PhD programs want two research letters. Since I was in only one lab, would it be acceptable to notify them of this and substitute one of the research letters with another science professor, perhaps?
-A school saying it wants two research letter strongly implies it wants two research experiences. I would read their letter specifics very carefully and see if that is the case. I would not call to ask and substitute but simple get the PI and one other researcher in the lab who you worked closely with and supervised you to write it

3. I have just begun a new research experience for four months over the summer. I would like to request a LOR from my mentor in this new research experience when it is over, in August, but I hope that by then my application would have been complete and transmitted to med schools for review already (June 28th). Could I add a letter in August and have my mentor upload it right away? Would my application be temporarily considered incomplete during the window between when I add her as a LOR and when she actually uploads the letter? Would this prevent my application from being reviewed? Is there another way to handle this so that my application's completeness isn't affected for review but I'm still able to add this letter of recommendation in August? Note that this would ameliorate my question (2) above.

*NO! you can either have your application complete and reviewed early by not having the new research letter on the list or you can add the new letter and your application will sit waiting for it. My advice is to add and assign this letter to keep your application from being reviewed as MD/PhD wants to see the research. And being complete in August is fine
 
Hope this ain't a dumb question

I already have a great letter from my position coach who knows me very well, but I have the possibility to get another one from my head coach too ( who does not know me so well). My head coach is pretty well known in cfb, but more than likely it would be his secretary actually writing it and she knows me somewhat as well. Would it still be beneficial to get the extra letter in this case or would it have minimal impact (or possibly hurt me assuming it would be pretty average)?

Edit: most of it would probably be drafted by his secretary, then he'd edit, personalize, and sign it.
 
Last edited:
Hope this ain't a dumb question

I already have a great letter from my position coach who knows me very well, but I have the possibility to get another one from my head coach too ( who does not know me so well). My head coach is pretty well known in cfb, but more than likely it would be his secretary actually writing it and she knows me somewhat as well. Would it still be beneficial to get the extra letter in this case or would it have minimal impact (or possibly hurt me assuming it would be pretty average)?

Edit: most of it would probably be drafted by his secretary, then he'd edit, personalize, and sign it.
Having someone other than faculty, PI, or employment supervisor is already, with few exceptions, is already a second tier letter. While they may be considered faculty, Having a head coach over coach is trivial, even from NCAA Division I school
 
Hello

I took most of my pre-req science classes in a state college (chem, physics..) due to economic/financial reasons. Do ad committee frown upon if my letter writer for the science letter is a state college professor? I have a very good relationship with him and he can definitely assess my academic and personal strengths. He is now the Dean of the state college. It might be helpful. Please advice. Thank you very much for your help
Its perfectly fine
 
Hello -

Does a Professor of Medicine or a Professor of Surgery count as a science faculty when he/she wrote my letter of recommendation? I did not take classes with them. I worked with them through research and in other professional & academic capacities. Thank you!
1) a large fraction of schools will require/expect traditional course science letter
2) a large fraction of schools will require/expect a letter from course instructor
3) while a PI letter from medical school prof may be good, it may not fulfill requirements
4) you need to carefully examine each school’s website for specific letter requirements
 
I have questions about filling out "Primary Contact/Author" form:

1) If one of my writers is, let's say, both a professor of surgery and a vice president of my university, which would be better to put in "Title"?
2) Should I add what kind of degree my writer has in the "Title"? For example, Associate Professor, MD–PhD
3) Is it okay to abbreviate some words if I run out of space? For example, Molecular and Integrative Biology --> Mole & Integ Biology

Thank you for your help!
 
I have questions about filling out "Primary Contact/Author" form:

1) If one of my writers is, let's say, both a professor of surgery and a vice president of my university, which would be better to put in "Title"?
2) Should I add what kind of degree my writer has in the "Title"? For example, Associate Professor, MD–PhD
3) Is it okay to abbreviate some words if I run out of space? For example, Molecular and Integrative Biology --> Mole & Integ Biology

Thank you for your help!
1. Put professor. Vice president can imply administrator only
2. Put professor. MD-PhD is an academic degree not a title
3. No, shorten title or other as that abbreviation is meaningless
 
1. Put professor. Vice president can imply administrator only
2. Put professor. MD-PhD is an academic degree not a title
3. No, shorten title or other as that abbreviation is meaningless

1) If I have space, is it okay to put both as long as I put professor as first?

Thank you!!!
 
1) If I have space, is it okay to put both as long as I put professor as first?

Thank you!!!
You can but you think that “vice president” is an impressive title where if I see that, I would immediately wonder how much some administrator would know about a student.
 
Hi,

I am new to SDN. I needed some help deciding whether to request a recommendation letter from a doctor I have shadowed during an internship I did last summer. I shadowed the doctor for about 3 months in surgeries and built a close relationship with him. I also shadowed him in the office like once. However, I am concerned that since it has been a year that the recommendation letter might not be as strong. I have already requested a committee letter from school. So, I am not sure how great his letter will be. Any thoughts or advice?


Make an appointment and talk to him in person. When you ask for a letter, I think (with all of my bias) that you should do it in person so you can see someone’s reaction. Give them a little direction. You can straight up say “Would you feel comfortable writing a letter of recommendation for me that touches on X,YZ qualities?” If they hesitate, give any reason why they think it isn’t a good idea, abort. If they seem like they expected the question and would be able to write something substantive about you, then you can go forward. Going forward means being prepared to provide them with your CV and maybe even your personal statement so they can echo themes/strengths that you are trying to bring out in your application. It also means that sometimes people will tell you to write the letter yourself and they will sign it.
 
Help!
I already have the required 3 LORs. But at the last minute, I found out that one of my science LOR is not on a letterhead. I contacted my professor, and she is willing to re-write the LOR on letterhead. Problem is that she won't be able to finish it until August/September since she's traveling for research over the summer.
I REALLY want my application to be reviewed as soon as possible this cycle.
Would it be advisable to go ahead and send the LORs including the one without the letterhead so that schools will look at my application and THEN I can send the updated LOR in August/September? Or should I just wait until I have the updated LOR to send to AMCAS?
 
Help!
I already have the required 3 LORs. But at the last minute, I found out that one of my science LOR is not on a letterhead. I contacted my professor, and she is willing to re-write the LOR on letterhead. Problem is that she won't be able to finish it until August/September since she's traveling for research over the summer.
I REALLY want my application to be reviewed as soon as possible this cycle.
Would it be advisable to go ahead and send the LORs including the one without the letterhead so that schools will look at my application and THEN I can send the updated LOR in August/September? Or should I just wait until I have the updated LOR to send to AMCAS?
Some schools wont look at the application without proper letterhead. But I would submit the LORs as is. Some schools may require more than 3 letters. Check each school's website for specs
 
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It is possible to assign or remove letter from a school after verification?
 
I just received an email from my pre-health office saying that we should wait to submit our secondaries until the committee letter has been submitted. With the amount of premeds at my school, this probably means that the letter will be submitted in August or September. For the schools that send out secondaries in July, I would be late. Should I listen to my pre-health office or just plan to submit secondaries in a week once I receive it?
 
I just received an email from my pre-health office saying that we should wait to submit our secondaries until the committee letter has been submitted. With the amount of premeds at my school, this probably means that the letter will be submitted in August or September. For the schools that send out secondaries in July, I would be late. Should I listen to my pre-health office or just plan to submit secondaries in a week once I receive it?

1) schools send out secondaries as they get/initially screen primary, whenever that may be.
2) most schools do not mark applications complete into evaluation until primary, secondary, MCAT, LOR
3) However, when it comes to committee letters, historically most were not written and sent out until after the Fall semester when the UG was back in sessions. Medical schools know this
4) Applicants seem to not appreciate the how the sheer number of applications (5000+), the admission process workflow limits (maybe 500 a week), an the fact that most medical schools are slower in the summer with adcom not coming up to full speed starting in August.
5) applicants also woefully underestimate the amount of time it takes to complete secondaries. Even if you get them in July, after July 4th, you still may not have it turned around until August
6) with my point #4 it still can take weeks after you submit, and the letters arrive in midSept to get evaluated and reviewed.
7) Chiil

********AMCAS 2020 Timeline Summary (post count #016)************
-AMCAS May 1, 2019, Primary application opens up. Can send formal requests for transcripts from your schools and letter requests to your letter writers.
-AMCAS May 30, 2019, Completed primary applications with all ECs, PS, and course information can be submitted.

-You enter the verification queue (“time to verify”) only when both completed primary application and all transcripts have been received.
-AMCAS does not, repeat, does not verify LOR or MCAT score. Your primary application will be verified regardless of LOR or MCAT score status
-AMCAS June 28, 2019, begins transmission verified applications (though some schools have secondaries sent to contact info upon submission to AMCAS)
-Verification peak is about August 1st and takes 20 days
-Most Primary Apps are transmitted early July thru early September
-Secondaries timelines can vary widely as to when to they are sent out from almost immediately upon submissions to 3 months, though most are in the range 1-3 weeks after transmission.
-Letters via AMCAS are processed/transmitted separately from primary
-Letters can be added after primary has been submitted and transmitted and are mostly not needed until secondary reviews at the earliest.
-While applications are transmitted at end of June, most schools do not start any processing until at least mid-July at the earliest; even then, most dont get up to full speed until mid-August.
-There are usually 3 main phases in processing application
----1) Initial Screening/Evaluation: A hybrid of automatic GPA/MCAT screen plus human for "quick review" of application. Used to for general priority and, in some cases, which team/subcommittee gets application. At some schools, preset criteria or informal policy can lead to II at this stage.
----2) Full Evaluation: This is where evaluator/reader/team/subcommittee will fully evaluate all sections of primary, secondary, and LOR and generally summarize in broad categories or point system. This essentially becomes your priority for adcom review and II. This function may be split up among several evaluators and may go to a team or subcommittee for II decision. Application are not typically evaluated until complete with Primary, Secondary, MCAT, and LOR
----3) Full adcom: this is where your fully evaluated application is reviewed and voted on by adcom for II on later on for acceptance/WL/rejection
-Application and candidate evaluations timeline varies widely by school may not done in a linear, chronological order. EDP, High achievers, URM, family of alumni, feeder schools, associated UG programs, linked postbaccs, and other factor may push an app forward in the process.
-Most adcoms dont start meeting for review of evaluated applicants until at least mid-August, more likely September, though some reviews may be done earlier for groups mentioned above. Evaluation may start almost immediately at some schools.
-Schools receive 5,000-10,000 application but can only evaluate several hundred applications a week. Therefore, it can take anywhere from 4-16 weeks (1-4 months) or more to be evaluated, reviewed and invited for interview after your application is complete.
-Schools must reduce several thousand applications to several hundred interviews. Therefore at least 80% of applicants at any individual school must be rejected pre-interview.
-Applicants should check each applicant portal daily until application is marked complete, under review, or similar. After that, you should check applicant portal 2 to 3 times as week as schools may invite you for interview solely by portal; some schools do not send email for interview invite.
-Submitting Primary Application June is Early, July Medium, August Late
-Having Primary verified and transmitted to school by middle of August is normal speed
-Having Secondary and all LORs complete to school by Labor Day is early/ontime. By late or end of September is about middle/normal speed, by end of October is about late.
--After that point you will generally start getting impacted by the number of applications submitted, the finite number of interview slots, and seats given by rolling admissions. These aren’t absolute dates nor is it a fixed timeline. It should be used as a guideline
 
How problematic is obtaining a science LOR from a professor who taught a month-long summer course? Is specifying the duration of a relationship standard procedure, either in individual letters, committee letters, or on the AMCAS application? Thank you.
 
How problematic is obtaining a science LOR from a professor who taught a month-long summer course? Is specifying the duration of a relationship standard procedure, either in individual letters, committee letters, or on the AMCAS application? Thank you.
Yes duration is typically mentioned
 
1) schools send out secondaries as they get/initially screen primary, whenever that may be.
2) most schools do not mark applications complete into evaluation until primary, secondary, MCAT, LOR
3) However, when it comes to committee letters, historically most were not written and sent out until after the Fall semester when the UG was back in sessions. Medical schools know this
4) Applicants seem to not appreciate the how the sheer number of applications (5000+), the admission process workflow limits (maybe 500 a week), an the fact that most medical schools are slower in the summer with adcom not coming up to full speed starting in August.
5) applicants also woefully underestimate the amount of time it takes to complete secondaries. Even if you get them in July, after July 4th, you still may not have it turned around until August
6) with my point #4 it still can take weeks after you submit, and the letters arrive in midSept to get evaluated and reviewed.
7) Chiil

********AMCAS 2020 Timeline Summary (post count #016)************
-AMCAS May 1, 2019, Primary application opens up. Can send formal requests for transcripts from your schools and letter requests to your letter writers.
-AMCAS May 30, 2019, Completed primary applications with all ECs, PS, and course information can be submitted.

-You enter the verification queue (“time to verify”) only when both completed primary application and all transcripts have been received.
-AMCAS does not, repeat, does not verify LOR or MCAT score. Your primary application will be verified regardless of LOR or MCAT score status
-AMCAS June 28, 2019, begins transmission verified applications (though some schools have secondaries sent to contact info upon submission to AMCAS)
-Verification peak is about August 1st and takes 20 days
-Most Primary Apps are transmitted early July thru early September
-Secondaries timelines can vary widely as to when to they are sent out from almost immediately upon submissions to 3 months, though most are in the range 1-3 weeks after transmission.
-Letters via AMCAS are processed/transmitted separately from primary
-Letters can be added after primary has been submitted and transmitted and are mostly not needed until secondary reviews at the earliest.
-While applications are transmitted at end of June, most schools do not start any processing until at least mid-July at the earliest; even then, most dont get up to full speed until mid-August.
-There are usually 3 main phases in processing application
----1) Initial Screening/Evaluation: A hybrid of automatic GPA/MCAT screen plus human for "quick review" of application. Used to for general priority and, in some cases, which team/subcommittee gets application. At some schools, preset criteria or informal policy can lead to II at this stage.
----2) Full Evaluation: This is where evaluator/reader/team/subcommittee will fully evaluate all sections of primary, secondary, and LOR and generally summarize in broad categories or point system. This essentially becomes your priority for adcom review and II. This function may be split up among several evaluators and may go to a team or subcommittee for II decision. Application are not typically evaluated until complete with Primary, Secondary, MCAT, and LOR
----3) Full adcom: this is where your fully evaluated application is reviewed and voted on by adcom for II on later on for acceptance/WL/rejection
-Application and candidate evaluations timeline varies widely by school may not done in a linear, chronological order. EDP, High achievers, URM, family of alumni, feeder schools, associated UG programs, linked postbaccs, and other factor may push an app forward in the process.
-Most adcoms dont start meeting for review of evaluated applicants until at least mid-August, more likely September, though some reviews may be done earlier for groups mentioned above. Evaluation may start almost immediately at some schools.
-Schools receive 5,000-10,000 application but can only evaluate several hundred applications a week. Therefore, it can take anywhere from 4-16 weeks (1-4 months) or more to be evaluated, reviewed and invited for interview after your application is complete.
-Schools must reduce several thousand applications to several hundred interviews. Therefore at least 80% of applicants at any individual school must be rejected pre-interview.
-Applicants should check each applicant portal daily until application is marked complete, under review, or similar. After that, you should check applicant portal 2 to 3 times as week as schools may invite you for interview solely by portal; some schools do not send email for interview invite.
-Submitting Primary Application June is Early, July Medium, August Late
-Having Primary verified and transmitted to school by middle of August is normal speed
-Having Secondary and all LORs complete to school by Labor Day is early/ontime. By late or end of September is about middle/normal speed, by end of October is about late.
--After that point you will generally start getting impacted by the number of applications submitted, the finite number of interview slots, and seats given by rolling admissions. These aren’t absolute dates nor is it a fixed timeline. It should be used as a guideline


Cool, I understand what you are saying. I figured that schools would understand if the committee letter came after September. I just wanted to clarify if it had any bearing on when I should submit my secondaries. Since I have prewriten the majority of my essays, I can submit when I receive my secondaries. My school made it seem that submitting secondaries before the letter is a negative.
 
Cool, I understand what you are saying. I figured that schools would understand if the committee letter came after September. I just wanted to clarify if it had any bearing on when I should submit my secondaries. Since I have prewriten the majority of my essays, I can submit when I receive my secondaries. My school made it seem that submitting secondaries before the letter is a negative.
Submit the secondaries as you get them. Some schools may in fact start evaluation without them
 
Hello,

I am posting this question for one of my friends that does not frequent SDN. They were wondering if it would be appropriate to have a patient's family member write them a letter of recommendation. My friend currently works as a CNA and has developed a relationship with the patient and the patient's husband and sees them on a regular basis. The patient's husband is a former dean of the college of science at our undergrad university as well.

My friend asked me if it would be appropriate to have them write a letter, and my response was that I would be worried about patient confidentiality. I also have not heard of anyone doing such a thing as most of the time letters come from some sort of advisor/ mentor. I am curious to know what y'alls thoughts are on this.

Thanks!
 
Hello,

I am posting this question for one of my friends that does not frequent SDN. They were wondering if it would be appropriate to have a patient's family member write them a letter of recommendation. My friend currently works as a CNA and has developed a relationship with the patient and the patient's husband and sees them on a regular basis. The patient's husband is a former dean of the college of science at our undergrad university as well.

My friend asked me if it would be appropriate to have them write a letter, and my response was that I would be worried about patient confidentiality. I also have not heard of anyone doing such a thing as most of the time letters come from some sort of advisor/ mentor. I am curious to know what y'alls thoughts are on this.

Thanks!
No, it is inappropriate. Most medical schools are looking for academic letter
 
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I have some questions regarding a letter I am receiving from a surgeon I shadowed.
  1. Should I say "No" to the question asking whether this author is associate with a school, if I met him outside of school, even though his name comes up in the school website? (still not a professor though. seems to be one of the surgeons who does operations at the university hospital time to time)
  2. What would be his "Title"? Just Doctor?
  3. If this writer is not very communicable via email or phone, and does most of communication through his secretary, is it okay to provide the secretary's email address as his contact when adding his letter in AMCAS?
Thank you for your clarification in advance!
 
I have some questions regarding a letter I am receiving from a surgeon I shadowed.
  1. Should I say "No" to the question asking whether this author is associate with a school, if I met him outside of school, even though his name comes up in the school website? (still not a professor though. seems to be one of the surgeons who does operations at the university hospital time to time)
  2. What would be his "Title"? Just Doctor?
Thank you for your clarification in advance!

1) No, he is not associated
2) You can put doctor
 
Thank you for your reply.
I have another questions I think I added right after you answered my previous 2 questions.
  • If a writer is not very communicable via email or phone, and does most of his communication through his secretary, is it okay to provide the secretary's email address/phone as his contact when adding his letter in AMCAS?
  • When specifying the department of a writer, should I put a bigger umbrella (actual university name), smaller (School of Molecular Biology), or both?
 
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Thank you for your reply.
I have another questions I think I added right after you answered my previous 2 questions.
  • If a writer is not very communicable via email or phone, and does most of his communication through his secretary, is it okay to provide the secretary's email address/phone as his contact when adding his letter in AMCAS?
  • When specifying the department of a writer, should I put a bigger umbrella (actual university name), smaller (School of Molecular Biology), or both?
yes
yes
 
Yes duration is typically mentioned

Hi Gonnif, (not Goro),

Thank you for following up. Are even strong letters from short courses (but with classes M-F) problematic? Thanks again.
 
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I just created an entry for a LOR and already sent the letter request form to the doctor who is writing it. However, I realized that I somehow forgot to enter a title for him. It contains the hospital name, but not the "Professor of X"/"Doctor of X" part. I don't believe this can be edited once the letter entry is created on AMCAS. I'll have a committee letter and this isn't fulfilling any specific academic letter requirements. Do you think this is a mistake that warrants deleting the entry and sending him a new letter request, or will it be okay as is?
 
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