Organ Donation

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futuresurgeon00

futuresurgeon00

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So today in biology class we were talking about becoming organ donors. What are your thoughts on it? The pros, the cons....I've always been interested in this, so I'm just curious as to what all of you feel on the topic.
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futuresurgeon00 said:
So today in biology class we were talking about becoming organ donors. What are your thoughts on it? The pros, the cons....I've always been interested in this, so I'm just curious as to what all of you feel on the topic.
Click to expand...

Pros: Give someone a second chance at life.
Cons: I don't know.
 
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Pros: Someone might live.. if everything goes well. You also sort of live on in another person.

Cons: Your family will probably be extremely upset at the thought of you being opened and your organs harvested. More delay to the funeral/getting closure.

I signed up to become an organ donor two months ago. Unfortunately, my family, along with many others, still believe in the myth that ER doctors will "let you die" if you're an organ donor.

I think we should have an opt out system instead of an opt in system. There would be a lot more donors and no one would really be forced into doing it since you'd still be notified before it took place provided you have family to notify.
 
Mintcake said:
Pros: Someone might live.. if everything goes well. You also sort of live on in another person.

Cons: Your family will probably be extremely upset at the thought of you being opened and your organs harvested. More delay to the funeral/getting closure.

I signed up to become an organ donor two months ago. Unfortunately, my family, along with many others, still believe in the myth that ER doctors will "let you die" if you're an organ donor.

I think we should have an opt out system instead of an opt in system. There would be a lot more donors and no one would really be forced into doing it since you'd still be notified before it took place provided you have family to notify.
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I totally agree. I think you are right, and there would be so many more donors in the world.

For me, my mom has always said she wants to donate her body for research and to help in science and medicine, so she would be fine with me donating as well (I think, I haven't really talked about it to my family)...
 
I think it's an okay practice (If that's what it is referred to)

I, personally, would be to scared to do it, but it's a great thing. And I'd love to receive an organ if i were in need of one. :naughty:
 
I don't appreciate the thought of parts of my body being disseminated after I die. My narcissistic tendencies rule me on this one.
 
I find organ donation one of the most generous gifts someone can give; either as a living or cadaveric donor.

Then again, I have no moral, religious or ethical dilemmas with it.

I've been an organ donor ever since I got my first driver's license long ago. College may have done my liver in, but the rest of the organs are in pretty good shape.:p
 
Winged Scapula said:
I find organ donation one of the most generous gifts someone can give; either as a living or cadaveric donor.

Then again, I have no moral, religious or ethical dilemmas with it.

I've been an organ donor ever since I got my first driver's license long ago. College may have done my liver in, but the rest of the organs are in pretty good shape.:p
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I actually just went up to my parents and asked them whether they were organ donors. My mom and my grandmother are, and I asked them if I could be one when I got my full license. My mom agreed. Never thought it would be that easy.

I'm glad I am going to do something to help someone. That would be nice.
 
I actually have been since I got my license, but just because I want to help someone if I can.

But, now that they said the ER as hard if something happened may not try I am having 2nd thoughts :scared:
 
Tolbert said:
I actually have been since I got my license, but just because I want to help someone if I can.

But, now that they said the ER as hard if something happened may not try I am having 2nd thoughts :scared:
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Complete and utter nonsense.

I have been involved in many trauma resuscitations and never once did I see a victim's wallet/organ donor card etc and call the code early.

As a matter of fact, if I even knew you were an organ donor, I would work harder resuscitating you, to keep those organs perfused and available, should you not survive to need them.
 
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I think organ donation is such a generous gift, you're giving someone the gift of life even if you don't know it. It's just the cycle of life.
 
Mintcake said:
Cons: Your family will probably be extremely upset at the thought of you being opened and your organs harvested. More delay to the funeral/getting closure.
.
Click to expand...

This would be false. While there is a growing resurgence of interest in donation after cardiac death (DCD) - and UNOS now requires all hospitals that wish to perform organ transplants to have written policies on it, even if the policy is that the hospital does not perform DCD - the "standard" practice in this country is relegated to donors who are brain dead. In other words, your heart is still beating (which is why being an organ donor would have zero impact on the resuscitation efforts in the ER, OR or ICU).

As for the "delay", it's a matter of hours. As an Pediatric Critical Care fellow, I think the longest I've seen a patient be "maintained" is 12-15 hours, but usually it is quicker than that...and having been on the other side, sitting with patients waiting for new organs, I promise you that every minute seems like an hour once they've gotten word there is an organ coming for them.

At least from my standpoint as a pediatrician, since it is the parents who are usually making the decision (and a lot of times are the ones who actually bring the topic up first), closure usually comes with making the decision. It can be a very powerful component of helping the family start their grieving process when they decide to proceed with donation, often because it's one of the few positives that is easily seen in an otherwise tragic situation.

I think it is incredibly hypocritical and selfish to say that you'd take an organ if you'd needed it, but refuse to donate if something catastrophic happened to you and you were healthy enough that your organs were viable for donation.
 
@BigRedBeta

Oh yeah, I was only talking in terms of brain death. I figured they didn't usually do transplants after the heart has stopped. Thank you for your explanation!

BigRedBeta said:
I think it is incredibly hypocritical and selfish to say that you'd take an organ if you'd needed it, but refuse to donate if something catastrophic happened to you and you were healthy enough that your organs were viable for donation.
Click to expand...

I agree. I didn't want to be the one to say it.
 
After a certain age, are you not eligible to be a donor anymore?
 
CameronMed said:
It makes sense but currently im not an organ donor because i never thought about it seriously and it was a very quick question when i got my driver's license. Maybe i will change it in the future.
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The way they mutilate your body is horrendous.
 
Arijos0222 said:
The way they mutilate your body is horrendous.
Click to expand...
Technically, you're dead...so it's not like you can actually feel what's being done to you. In bio today, they showed us a video about organ donation, and how there are two steps, one to sign up and the other, to talk to our family about it, because they are able to say no. How does that work? If you are over the age of sixteen, does your entire family have the right over the choice (your immediate family) or is it your emergency contact? How does that work in terms of legal rights?
 
As a future physician..I'm very torn regarding this subject.
Before I got my driver's license, I thought long and hard about it...the pros and the cons. When it came down to it, I decided not to become an organ donor. Due to different illnesses and stomach issues that I have, I felt horrible that there was a possibility that someone could potentially receive my crappy organs..so I said no. Now that I've been thinking about it more, I'm not sure if I'll change my mind next time around or not.
I would say if you're comfortable with it and can essentially sign your organs and/or skin away without regrets, then go for it. You could save someones life.
 
I see little is any cons to organ donations.
Similar to giving blood it is screened for potential health problems that would make the organ unsuitable for donation, so there is less risk in regards to the patient.
As a person who has had to use blood donations and am forever grateful to whomever has taken time out of their day to help save someone's life, I think organ donations are just as amazing.

I'd rather postpone a funeral by a few days while they harvest some usable organs to save someone else's life.
 
Winged Scapula said:
Complete and utter nonsense.

I have been involved in many trauma resuscitations and never once did I see a victim's wallet/organ donor card etc and call the code early.

As a matter of fact, if I even knew you were an organ donor, I would work harder resuscitating you, to keep those organs perfused and available, should you not survive to need them.
Click to expand...

that actually made me feel so much better :thumbup:
 
eitak said:
As a future physician..I'm very torn regarding this subject.
Before I got my driver's license, I thought long and hard about it...the pros and the cons. When it came down to it, I decided not to become an organ donor. Due to different illnesses and stomach issues that I have, I felt horrible that there was a possibility that someone could potentially receive my crappy organs..so I said no. Now that I've been thinking about it more, I'm not sure if I'll change my mind next time around or not.
I would say if you're comfortable with it and can essentially sign your organs and/or skin away without regrets, then go for it. You could save someones life.
Click to expand...

If it helps, even if someone designates themselves as an organ donor, their organs are not automatically accepted. Multidisciplinary teams trained in the evaluation of potential donors are called in. If the family decides to donate, then the process includes a consideration of past medical history. So specially-trained teams of professionals will decide if your [likely not as crappy as you think] organs are suitable for donation.

And to echo what WS posted, I can't remember a time when I've actually seen someone's wallet/card/license during a resus; it gets scooped up by the registration people/security while the resus is ongoing. Regardless if you don't make it out of the ED/trauma bay then you can't donate. Finally, it's considered quite a faux pas for a medical professional caring for a patient to even mention donation/Donor Services before a patient is declared brain dead. At my institution (and I warrant and most if not all others as well) the people who handle that are an entirely separate team; they get notified that there is a potential donor candidate once the medical diagnosis of brain death is made and then they take it from there. When making your decision about being a donor, please be assured it is a complete urban legend that any healthcare professional would let someone expire prematurely to allocate their organs elsewhere.
 
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And this thread is officially dead....-__- RIP thread :'( You will be missed. :'(....
 
BigRedBeta said:
This would be false. While there is a growing resurgence of interest in donation after cardiac death (DCD) - and UNOS now requires all hospitals that wish to perform organ transplants to have written policies on it, even if the policy is that the hospital does not perform DCD - the "standard" practice in this country is relegated to donors who are brain dead. In other words, your heart is still beating (which is why being an organ donor would have zero impact on the resuscitation efforts in the ER, OR or ICU).

As for the "delay", it's a matter of hours. As an Pediatric Critical Care fellow, I think the longest I've seen a patient be "maintained" is 12-15 hours, but usually it is quicker than that...and having been on the other side, sitting with patients waiting for new organs, I promise you that every minute seems like an hour once they've gotten word there is an organ coming for them.

At least from my standpoint as a pediatrician, since it is the parents who are usually making the decision (and a lot of times are the ones who actually bring the topic up first), closure usually comes with making the decision. It can be a very powerful component of helping the family start their grieving process when they decide to proceed with donation, often because it's one of the few positives that is easily seen in an otherwise tragic situation.

I think it is incredibly hypocritical and selfish to say that you'd take an organ if you'd needed it, but refuse to donate if something catastrophic happened to you and you were healthy enough that your organs were viable for donation.
Click to expand...


There is definitely a lot of misinformation in this thread, and a fellow in Transplant Research and an aspiring Transplant Surgeon, I figure I need to correct some things... I'm gonna link some references that may not be acceptable to all. If anyone had interest in reading the article linked and can't find it, PM me...

Myth 1 seen: It's against Christianity

http://journals.lww.com/co-transpla...ng_donor_families__culture,_religion__.3.aspx

Most religious leaders are actually very pro-donation. The most orthodox of christians do consider the body and soul as one, they do not accept the diagnosis of brain death and object to organ donation. However, the principle of altruism, or 'love for other people' is interpreted differently in different groups, and so Roman Catholics are positive about organ donation, orthodox Protestant groups one can donate organs based on voluntary love for other people. Generally the individual believer makes her or his own choice

Myth 2: The way they mutilate your body is horrendous

This requires no link, no source. Having been a part of a dozen procurements myself, and present at least a dozen more, this is the furthest from the truth. I guess it does depend on your definition of mutilate as well. While it is an extensive surgery, the end result is that there can still be an open casket funeral, so that should tell you all you need to know about mutilation. The procedure is significantly less "mutilating" than an autopsy, and significantly less "mutilating" than what you will do as a medical student to anatomy lab cadavers.

Myth 3: Family upset/delay in funeral/etc

http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/sesc/tas/2012/00000078/00000003/art00036
Arrangements do get delayed slightly. Average donor management time is about 23 +/- 9 hours. But the sharing networks do work closely with families and work closely to satisfy wishes regarding the timing and desire for funeral arrangements. And again, if the case was going to go to the medical examiner (ie, the death was suspicious), the funeral arrangements were going to be delayed anyway.

The sharing networks also have a wide range of councilors and staff that do a great job with families regarding education and support. Most people are very pleased and comforted by their efforts, and it shows with higher rates of donation

Myth 4: After a certain age you can not be a donor anymore
http://journals.lww.com/transplantj...ctogenarian_Livers_Safely_Expands_the.21.aspx

Each organ procurement organization sets their own criteria for whom they will accept to attempt to be a donor, and each transplant center sets their own criteria and weighs each case on its own. That being said, there are typical age cut offs that are organ specific. I really only know the experience of the new jersey sharing network, but anyone over 75 years old is ruled out. Pancreas is ruled out over 45 years old. And when you get above 50-55 or so, rarely will a heart or lungs be accepted. But as my link shows, some 80+ year olds can still donate a liver...

Myth 5: Organ donors won't get as good of care

As Winged Scapula stated, this is patently false. There is not 1 bit of truth to this statement, and if anything the opposite is true because donors whose hearts aren't beating aren't any good to anyone (donation after cardiac death happens only in controlled settings, with withdraw of life support in the operating room. If a patient codes and is not resuscitated, they will not be able to be an organ donor...)
 
thedrjojo said:
There is definitely a lot of misinformation in this thread, and a fellow in Transplant Research and an aspiring Transplant Surgeon, I figure I need to correct some things... I'm gonna link some references that may not be acceptable to all. If anyone had interest in reading the article linked and can't find it, PM me...

Myth 1 seen: It's against Christianity

http://journals.lww.com/co-transpla...ng_donor_families__culture,_religion__.3.aspx

Most religious leaders are actually very pro-donation. The most orthodox of christians do consider the body and soul as one, they do not accept the diagnosis of brain death and object to organ donation. However, the principle of altruism, or 'love for other people' is interpreted differently in different groups, and so Roman Catholics are positive about organ donation, orthodox Protestant groups one can donate organs based on voluntary love for other people. Generally the individual believer makes her or his own choice

Myth 2: The way they mutilate your body is horrendous

This requires no link, no source. Having been a part of a dozen procurements myself, and present at least a dozen more, this is the furthest from the truth. I guess it does depend on your definition of mutilate as well. While it is an extensive surgery, the end result is that there can still be an open casket funeral, so that should tell you all you need to know about mutilation. The procedure is significantly less "mutilating" than an autopsy, and significantly less "mutilating" than what you will do as a medical student to anatomy lab cadavers.

Myth 3: Family upset/delay in funeral/etc

http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/sesc/tas/2012/00000078/00000003/art00036
Arrangements do get delayed slightly. Average donor management time is about 23 +/- 9 hours. But the sharing networks do work closely with families and work closely to satisfy wishes regarding the timing and desire for funeral arrangements. And again, if the case was going to go to the medical examiner (ie, the death was suspicious), the funeral arrangements were going to be delayed anyway.

The sharing networks also have a wide range of councilors and staff that do a great job with families regarding education and support. Most people are very pleased and comforted by their efforts, and it shows with higher rates of donation

Myth 4: After a certain age you can not be a donor anymore
http://journals.lww.com/transplantj...ctogenarian_Livers_Safely_Expands_the.21.aspx

Each organ procurement organization sets their own criteria for whom they will accept to attempt to be a donor, and each transplant center sets their own criteria and weighs each case on its own. That being said, there are typical age cut offs that are organ specific. I really only know the experience of the new jersey sharing network, but anyone over 75 years old is ruled out. Pancreas is ruled out over 45 years old. And when you get above 50-55 or so, rarely will a heart or lungs be accepted. But as my link shows, some 80+ year olds can still donate a liver...

Myth 5: Organ donors won't get as good of care

As Winged Scapula stated, this is patently false. There is not 1 bit of truth to this statement, and if anything the opposite is true because donors whose hearts aren't beating aren't any good to anyone (donation after cardiac death happens only in controlled settings, with withdraw of life support in the operating room. If a patient codes and is not resuscitated, they will not be able to be an organ donor...)
Click to expand...

amazing post. Thanks for shedding some light :thumbup: so I'm guessing you're for donation ;)
 
Tolbert said:
amazing post. Thanks for shedding some light :thumbup: so I'm guessing you're for donation ;)
Click to expand...

I'm against implied consent funny enough, even though I know it would increase donation rates, it would remove the altruism from the system (although I wouldn't be opposed to compensating the donors/donor families...)

http://jmp.oxfordjournals.org/content/35/2/154.short

What I am for is a re-appraisal of the dead-donor rule (that is, in order to procure organs, the donor must be dead). Why is this the case? Why can someone decide to withdraw care and die, but can not decide to allow to procurement of their organs even if they are "alive". Just give me enough "stuff" (analgesia, anesthetics) so I am comfortable and don't feel/know a thing, and let me pass "knowing" that I was able to give the best gift possible. A major philosophical debate to be had, no doubt, but those are my feelings
 
futuresurgeon00 said:
Technically, you're dead...so it's not like you can actually feel what's being done to you. In bio today, they showed us a video about organ donation, and how there are two steps, one to sign up and the other, to talk to our family about it, because they are able to say no. How does that work? If you are over the age of sixteen, does your entire family have the right over the choice (your immediate family) or is it your emergency contact? How does that work in terms of legal rights?
Click to expand...

Hmm... interesting (and I missed it on my other large post)...

Laws vary state by state. I believe most states currently (it is the case in New Jersey), that for individuals over 18, if you state on your drivers license or otherwise sign an organ donor card, then your family is not allowed to override your wishes. Historically, and I believe it to still be the truth in some states, next-of-kin was allowed to override your stated wishes with regards to organ donation. If you have not designated yourself as a donor, the decision always goes to the next-of-kin, so it wouldn't be your entire family or your emergency contact, but the person legally responsible for your decisions. While you can via a living will or other means state beforehand who you would like to be your surragate decision maker, if you do not, the hierchy goes (in general, I am sure there is some variation)

1) Spouse (depending on states and civil union/marriage laws, this may or may not count a same sex partner :eek:)
2) Adult children
3) Parents
4) Siblings in order of age

after that it definitely gets fuzzy


but the legal standing of the donor designation for minors... that's a new one for me. I'm sure there are definitely laws regarding it, just none that I know the specifics of.
 
thedrjojo said:
Hmm... interesting (and I missed it on my other large post)...

Laws vary state by state. I believe most states currently (it is the case in New Jersey), that for individuals over 18, if you state on your drivers license or otherwise sign an organ donor card, then your family is not allowed to override your wishes. Historically, and I believe it to still be the truth in some states, next-of-kin was allowed to override your stated wishes with regards to organ donation. If you have not designated yourself as a donor, the decision always goes to the next-of-kin, so it wouldn't be your entire family or your emergency contact, but the person legally responsible for your decisions. While you can via a living will or other means state beforehand who you would like to be your surragate decision maker, if you do not, the hierchy goes (in general, I am sure there is some variation)

1) Spouse (depending on states and civil union/marriage laws, this may or may not count a same sex partner :eek:)
2) Adult children
3) Parents
4) Siblings in order of age

after that it definitely gets fuzzy


but the legal standing of the donor designation for minors... that's a new one for me. I'm sure there are definitely laws regarding it, just none that I know the specifics of.
Click to expand...
Yes, I was wondering that because in Canada your family is able to override your wishes (that is why they stress so much on the two steps - making sure your family is aware of your intentions, because without that, they have the right to say no, and you signing up for the process was a waste.)
 
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