Planning a transfer

[GoSpursGo]

It's not because I'm just willy nilly transferring. I have lots of reasons I don't like my current place. It's far away from my home, my SO is far away etc. All of those apply to me.

So how many programs will those issues not apply to? And did you apply to them during ERAS?

If so, why are you going to be successful when you weren't during ERAS? If you didn't, then why should they believe that all of a sudden this is a big deal to you?

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[Dr.LeoSpaceman]

Like I said, I'd probably just drop the application if I had the feeling that they'd would call early. Just not respond.

How do you plan to "get the feeling"? You can't ask. If someone asked me "when are you going to contact references", I would immediately contact their references.

And as I and others have said: The contact will happen well before the offer in essentially 100% of cases. If you don't want it to happen, then you should drop the idea of trying to transfer.

 

[Esmolol]

Like I said, I'd probably just drop the application if I had the feeling that they'd would call early. Just not respond.

This! Proof. Troll. There is no way in the world someone got through med school, step 1, step 2, and reasons like that.

 

[Qpworueury]

This! Proof. Troll. There is no way in the world someone got through med school, step 1, step 2, and reasons like that.

How do you plan to "get the feeling"? You can't ask. If someone asked me "when are you going to contact references", I would immediately contact their references.

And as I and others have said: The contact will happen well before the offer in essentially 100% of cases. If you don't want it to happen, then you should drop the idea of trying to transfer.

For all the open spots I've looked at this past year, all it says is send your CV, step scores and cover letter. Nothing about references in the first step. The idea would to submit those materials, and if they ask for the references early, just don't respond back and they'll just move on to the next person.

Yes, I did apply to some programs that may have an open spot that initially didn't interview me. I feel like it would be different because 1) less applicants and they know you would be serious if you apply 2) I've continually improved my application 3) I have a whole year of residency work experience that proves my capabilities.

Plus, I could make many other places work. Not every place fit the bill, but I could make case for many

I sware everyone just expects me to do nothing.

 

[guytakingboards]

Just a heads up on how that PD to PD conversation will go, whenever it happens.

"hello [OP's current PD], someone from your program named Qpworueury has applied to an open position in my program. He says he needs to move here because [long distance spouse, dying relative, etc]. What can you tell me about that?"

[Your current PD]: "Qpworueury has never expressed a need to transfer based on that to us before. But there an episode a few years ago where they sent us a post-match communication saying they didn't think highly of us and then lied about it [segues into your story]."

That's pretty much gonna happen in some form or another.

 

[Dr.LeoSpaceman]

For all the open spots I've looked at this past year, all it says is send your CV, step scores and cover letter. Nothing about references in the first step. The idea would to submit those materials, and if they ask for the references early, just don't respond back and they'll just move on to the next person.

Yes, I did apply to some programs that may have an open spot that initially didn't interview me. I feel like it would be different because 1) less applicants and they know you would be serious if you apply 2) I've continually improved my application 3) I have a whole year of residency work experience that proves my capabilities.

They don't necessarily need to "ask" for references. You're going to tell them where you were/are a resident. Who the PDs are, and how to contact them, isn't a secret. While there will be formal references as part of some hospital hiring process, "backdoor" references in medicine are pretty much the norm. I'm not aware of states that outlaw the practice...but there could be, I suppose.

Different story of you're talking about medical school, which requires your explicit permission due to FERPA.

 

[GoSpursGo]

For all the open spots I've looked at this past year, all it says is send your CV, step scores and cover letter. Nothing about references in the first step. The idea would to submit those materials, and if they ask for the references early, just don't respond back and they'll just move on to the next person.

I am not sure how to be more clear. Even if it is not a first step, talking to your PD will not be a formality and they will take that call very seriously.

Yes, I did apply to some programs that may have an open spot that initially didn't interview me. I feel like it would be different because 1) less applicants and they know you would be serious if you apply 2) I've continually improved my application 3) I have a whole year of residency work experience that proves my capabilities.

For 2-3, how on earth do you figure? You wildly offended your current program. That carries far more weight than some random case report you published in your intern year, or anything else.

Plus, I could make many other places work. Not every place fit the bill, but I could make case for many

I sware everyone just expects me to do nothing.

If you apply to places that are not close to your family or SO, they will not consider you seriously.

And yes, you should do nothing. This is where you matched. It was the best you could do. There are no do overs on the match.

 

[Dr.LeoSpaceman]

sware everyone just expects me to do nothing.

No one expects anything. But they are suggesting that you either 1) Approach the process with honesty and integrity or 2) Suck it up and finish out where you matched. Neither of those is "doing nothing".

The fact that no one is validating the feasibility of your preferred option 3-- "Scheme your way into another program"--should tell you something.

 

[LucidSplash]

Like I said, I'd probably just drop the application if I had the feeling that they'd would call early. Just not respond.

EVERYONE will call early. Full stop. This is the way it works. EVERYWHERE.

 

[ThoracicGuy]

Question is how rigorously will they verify your reason of transfer? My hope is the process goes like this


Application submitted -> interview -> PD approval

I need to give myself time to come up with a crafted story and I DO NOT plan on telling my home program that I'm transferring untill I've signed out or very close to signing. If they asked for that info in step 2, I probably just not respond further. People have before there has to be a way to do it

Most programs will not even consider you unless they have a letter from your current PD and most will want to speak with them over the phone. Your plan is unlikely to be successful. You have been told this many times, but either you are too hardheaded to understand or foolish enough to think that it wouldn't apply to you. Honestly, you may just be trolling for the lulz with the way that you are posting. In summary, I'll leave you with this:

 

[NotAProgDirector]

I could write the same advice you've already been given. That you're really misunderstanding the situation. That a transfer between programs is very complicated. That moving programs most often happens at each PGY transition, and that makes things even more complicated and difficult. That most likely any new program PD is going to want to talk to your current PD to find out one thing -- are you a "problem child", because no program wants to inherit someone else's problem. That just leaving your program isn't "no big deal to fill" -- it's a huge problem that leaves your program in the lurch. I could tell you all of that -- but it's all been mentioned above.

So I'll give you this piece of advice instead: Go to your current PD, and run this idea by them. You seem to really respect their opinion. Ask them if this is a good idea. I expect they will repeat much of what you've heard here, but perhaps it will be more impactful for you.

I realize you're very unhappy with your match. You fell far down your list, which is always a disappointment. I can't be certain why this happened, but I do worry it's related to the poor communication issues you're having on this thread. Similar issues may have come up in your interviews, or rotations, and you may be completely unaware of it. Regardless, although I know it's not the advice you want to hear, your best option is to go to your new program, make the best of it, and be the best resident they have ever had. Many threads here on SDN bemoan a low match, and then the poster comes back 6 months later deliriously happy and states they would have ranked the program much higher had they known what they know now. Maybe that will be you. But your chances of success are poor if you go into this with a negative attitude and your primary plan being to transfer somewhere else.

 

[LucidSplash]

Most programs will not even consider you unless they have a letter from your current PD and most will want to speak with them over the phone. Your plan is unlikely to be successful. You have been told this many times, but either you are too hardheaded to understand or foolish enough to think that it wouldn't apply to you. Honestly, you may just be trolling for the lulz with the way that you are posting. In summary, I'll leave you with this:

The Bruh has been invoked. In the traditions of the ancestors, /thread.

 

[Qpworueury]

I could write the same advice you've already been given. That you're really misunderstanding the situation. That a transfer between programs is very complicated. That moving programs most often happens at each PGY transition, and that makes things even more complicated and difficult. That most likely any new program PD is going to want to talk to your current PD to find out one thing -- are you a "problem child", because no program wants to inherit someone else's problem. That just leaving your program isn't "no big deal to fill" -- it's a huge problem that leaves your program in the lurch. I could tell you all of that -- but it's all been mentioned above.

So I'll give you this piece of advice instead: Go to your current PD, and run this idea by them. You seem to really respect their opinion. Ask them if this is a good idea. I expect they will repeat much of what you've heard here, but perhaps it will be more impactful for you.

I realize you're very unhappy with your match. You fell far down your list, which is always a disappointment. I can't be certain why this happened, but I do worry it's related to the poor communication issues you're having on this thread. Similar issues may have come up in your interviews, or rotations, and you may be completely unaware of it. Regardless, although I know it's not the advice you want to hear, your best option is to go to your new program, make the best of it, and be the best resident they have ever had. Many threads here on SDN bemoan a low match, and then the poster comes back 6 months later deliriously happy and states they would have ranked the program much higher had they known what they know now. Maybe that will be you. But your chances of success are poor if you go into this with a negative attitude and your primary plan being to transfer somewhere else.

I'll ask this week.

 

[LunaOri]

You aren’t listening. You say you don’t think it matters, but there’s all these seasoned people trying to tell you that 1) you need the good graces of every place you train at (not just where you graduate from) literally for the rest of your professional career because every time you apply for a new job/get new credentials all your training programs will need to send verification and 2) small fields especially most people know each other, especially the kind of people that are on the academic tracks who may be PDs or APDs now but end up as chairs who hire people. Even if you don’t want to stay academic, smaller fields everyone STILL knows everyone and they call around to people they know to hear their thoughts. Professional reputation is a BFD in these smaller fields and you are apparently wholly discounting the importance to your future career.

There are definitely a couple people I’ve come across in my training and career that if someone called and said “hey you know this person from X or Y place, what are your thoughts” who I would honestly have to say “I wouldn’t want to work with that person.” You don’t want to be that person.

🤷🏼‍♀️

He already is that person.

 

[cj_cregg]

So you want to apply to a program that had spots that went unfilled, and is willing to accept a problem resident without the blessing of their current PD. Do you really think that type of program will be better (in terms of clinical opportunities, program culture, etc.) than your current program?

 

[Qpworueury]

So you want to apply to a program that had spots that went unfilled, and is willing to accept a problem resident without the blessing of their current PD. Do you really think that type of program will be better (in terms of clinical opportunities, program culture, etc.) than your current program?

No incorrect. I'm hoping for an open spot between PGY-2 and PGY-3. People do leave programs for various reasons (specality changes etc.)

 

[cj_cregg]

No incorrect. I'm hoping for an open spot between PGY-2 and PGY-3. People do leave programs for various reasons (specality changes etc.)

The good programs that people left for specialty changes, etc. will not have to or be willing to take a resident who has proven themselves to have significant professionalism issues, or take ANY resident without the explicit blessing and involvement of the PD early on in the process.

 

[Qpworueury]

The good programs that people left for specialty changes, etc. will not have to or be willing to take a resident who has proven themselves to have significant professionalism issues, or take ANY resident without the explicit blessing and involvement of the PD early on in the process.

That's why I plan to work hard for a year then hope a spot re-opens up

 

[guytakingboards]

That's why I plan to work hard for a year then hope a spot re-opens up

In case this hasn't been spelled out yet: the number one thing you can do for your future in medicine at this point is to go to your advanced program, be a rockstar/model resident, prove your terrible/horrible/no good/very bad first impression wrong, finish residency there and move on.

Anything short of that, like trying to lie your way into transferring out, is gonna have that professionalism red flag lingering in the air. At that point, who knows when it'll prevent you from getting a job/license/ whatever in the future.

Transferring to a better program will not erase your prior professionalism red flag. Read that last sentence again. You transferring will not magically erase your prior professionalism problem. And working hard for one year is super unlikely to mends all fences.

(This is besides the point that many of us have made that transferring out will actually make your professionalism red flag even worse, cuz you'd be abandoning that program on top of everything else).

 

[cj_cregg]

That's why I plan to work hard for a year then hope a spot re-opens up

Working hard for a year does not change the fact that you are a resident who has proven themselves to have significant professionalism issues, and just a few posts up you were talking about intentionally avoiding involving your PD in the process until you were basically at the point of no return....

 

[DO2015CA]

Working hard for a year does not change the fact that you are a resident who has proven themselves to have significant professionalism issues, and just a few posts up you were talking about intentionally avoiding involving your PD in the process until you were basically at the point of no return....

exactly the last part. I don’t understand how they don’t see the continued lack of professionalism further validating the original concerns

 

[Qpworueury]

exactly the last part. I don’t understand how they don’t see the continued lack of professionalism further validating the original concerns

In fairness, is there any other job where you would tell your current employer you're quitting before you secured another offer? Attendings - do you tell your employer that you're looking to switch jobs before you even started to look for one

 

[cj_cregg]

In fairness, is there any other job where you would tell your current employer you're quitting before you secured another offer? Attendings - do you tell your employer that you're looking to switch jobs before you even started to look for one

No, but this is not any other job. This is a job where the next employer will EXPECT you to have your current employer's blessing. This is residency. This is a buyer's market where even crappy programs will have their pick of applicants who, unlike you, have not been demonstrated to have serious professionalism issues. Any reasonable PD who gives half a crap about the quality of care and the culture of the program will want to make sure (by checking with the prior PD) that the applicant is worth their time before making any kind of serious commitment. Literally everyone in this thread, including multiple attendings involved in resident education, has told you that this is standard and expected in the residency world - do you think we're lying?

 

[DO2015CA]

In fairness, is there any other job where you would tell your current employer you're quitting before you secured another offer? Attendings - do you tell your employer that you're looking to switch jobs before you even started to look for one

Depends on the field. Don’t burn bridges is a saying for a reason. Small fields make your reputation even more important.

 

[LucidSplash]

In fairness, is there any other job where you would tell your current employer you're quitting before you secured another offer? Attendings - do you tell your employer that you're looking to switch jobs before you even started to look for one

No one is arguing that residency isn’t different than most other jobs. We are telling you what IS, not having a lengthy discussion on grand solutions for how to improve the many inequities in medical training. We are trying to tell you how to be successful in the situation you are in, and you seem hell bent on pretending like you know better than everyone here.

I took a spot outside the match for my fellowship while I was still in residency. When I was applying to open spots, I sent in my CV and inservice scores and whatever else. Several times, before I heard back from a program, the first thing they did was call some fellow attending they knew at my residency program and ask that person what they thought of me. The same thing happened when I was applying for attending jobs. You seem to think that you will have a chance to withdraw if they want to call someone at your program early and we are trying to tell you that is fantasyland.

Done trying to help you because either you really are too obtuse and beyond help at this point, or this is a troll. Hopefully your prelim/transitional year PD can talk some sense into you to try to salvage your career, but I doubt it.

 

[RangerBob]

Everyone here has given great advice.
Please listen to them.

I will go further and add this. As someone who sits on the Medical Executive Committee at our hospital, which approves any physician credentialing for our hospital, we would have grave concerns regarding your experiences with your advanced program. If you then took it a step further and transferred out of their program, our concerns would only deepen.

Frankly, if our credentialing committee heard about your prior escapade likely the only reason they would advance you to us for a vote is so the department that gave you an offer could save face a bit and formally say things were taken to the highest level at Med Exec and your application for credentials could not be advanced and thus your contract is null and void.

Hospitals talk with all your program directors (especially advanced programs). Dishonest physicians not only put patients at risk, but they put the hospital’s financials at risk as well.

Your absolute best bet is to go to your advanced program, show them how smart AND professional your are, complete the program as their #1 star resident (be first to show up, last to leave, become their chief resident) so that when we call your program director, they will say “we started off a bit bumpy but Dr Qpworueury has been hands down our best and most professional resident physician ever and I would let them take care of my own mother/child.”

Please don’t dig an even deeper hole for yourself. Do the right thing. If you really do have a valid reason for transferring then do it the right way and talk with your PD first, get their blessing.

Edit: I was tired from hiking when I wrote this. And irritated if this isn’t a troll thread, as OP should know better by now. I should clarify Med Exec wouldn’t be making the phone calls to your prior PDs—that’s up to the medical staff office/credentialing committee, who would be the ones to forward your application for privileges to Med Exec. Likely they’d do so “with reservations” or “do not recommend,” if they had access to all the info from this and the prior post and there were no subsequent (and significant) redeeming factors.

 

[mvenus929]

I was going to wax poetic for a second, but I'll keep it short.

The field of medicine is much smaller than you think it is. Burning bridges by leaving your residency program after you've already made it clear that you didn't want to be there in the first place will 100% hurt you--maybe you'll be able to snag a position as a PGY-2 somewhere, but when you go looking for jobs in the field, you better believe word of your professionalism snafu will get out and you're going to have a hard time finding a job.

 

[Qpworueury]

Okay from the summary of this thread, everyone thinks it's detrimental to transfer in my position.

Serious question, why even offer transfer spots then? If it was so detrimental for everyone to move why encourage people to apply? Or it okay for someone without my record to apply?

 

[cj_cregg]

Okay from the summary of this thread, everyone thinks it's detrimental to transfer in my position.

Serious question, why even offer transfer spots then? If it was so detrimental for everyone to move why encourage people to apply? Or it okay for someone without my record to apply?

It's not inherently detrimental for you to transfer or to want to transfer. It is the way you want to do it that is the issue - by hiding it from your PD, by hiding your professionalism issues from the programs you apply to, and by "crafting a story" about the reasons for your desire to transfer. Would it be wiser for you to try to excel at your current program? Probably. But nobody here has unequivocally said "don't transfer," they have said "if you want to transfer, you need to do it this way."

 

[Dr.LeoSpaceman]

Okay from the summary of this thread, everyone thinks it's detrimental to transfer in my position.

Serious question, why even offer transfer spots then? If it was so detrimental for everyone to move why encourage people to apply? Or it okay for someone without my record to apply?

I can't believe I'm coming back in.

Transferring programs is not inherently problematic. On the other hand, transferring programs in the manner which you are suggesting, and with the history you have, is problematic.

As with essentially any other situation on life, the devil is in the details.

 

[guytakingboards]

Okay from the summary of this thread, everyone thinks it's detrimental to transfer in my position.

Serious question, why even offer transfer spots then? If it was so detrimental for everyone to move why encourage people to apply? Or it okay for someone without my record to apply?

You've been told ad nauseum in this thread what types of transfers more commonly occur. You have also made it clear you do not fit into those categories.

If you want specific examples: my best friend from growing up had his fiance transfer into his program from 4 states away. They got to spend their last three years of residency living together instead of seeing each other every other month and are now married with children. A person transferred into my residency program to be with his wife, who was also a resident in my program. A single person in my program transferred out to a more prestigious program somewhat under the guise of dating someone in that area. They didn't end up together but i know my entire 2nd year schedule got wrecked having to cover that person's absence.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

In fairness, is there any other job where you would tell your current employer you're quitting before you secured another offer? Attendings - do you tell your employer that you're looking to switch jobs before you even started to look for one

Actually, yes. I just did this recently. Ultimately decided to stay where I was.

 

[rokshana]

I've been on good terms with my current program. Although not perfect, I think they would have no issue writing a positive recommendation or putting in a good word if I came up with a good story. The program I'm going into, not so much but I've successfully onboarded. I'm planning on trying to justify the transfer on having a family member or my SO in that area wherever it ended up being. I've also built up my research profile during that time

I've heard programs with open spots are very desperate to fill and they might be flexible on the process in wanting to hear from PDs. I'm hoping I can just send them my CV and a solid reason for moving and that would be enough . If I can figure out what documents I need to have ready when that spot opens, I can be the first to apply. Odds I'll be competing with internal candidates and hence have to be ready

You are either very dense or very naive to think that medicine is not a small world.

 

[rokshana]

I'm not lying here. Its more so not sharing information until I'm ready

Sin of omission is still lying.

 

[rokshana]

Question is how rigorously will they verify your reason of transfer? My hope is the process goes like this


Application submitted -> interview -> PD approval

I need to give myself time to come up with a crafted story and I DO NOT plan on telling my home program that I'm transferring untill I've signed out or very close to signing. If they asked for that info in step 2, I probably just not respond further. People have before there has to be a way to do it

Not ever going to happen.
You may want to consider looking for an alter move career than medicine.

 

[Qpworueury]

A single person in my program transferred out to a more prestigious program somewhat under the guise of dating someone in that area. They didn't end up together but i know my entire 2nd year schedule got wrecked having to cover that person's absence.

Makes sense you'd be against transfers

 

[guytakingboards]

Makes sense you'd be against transfers

It's like you don't even acknowledge information that doesn't fit your world view. I clearly provided examples where transfers were justified.

I mentioned the latter example to provide real world context to what everyone has said about there being a negative impact to the program if someone transfers out. Yes, I experienced the other side of it. It was not pleasant. Having short resident coverage has a way of permeating the program. Remaining residents are overworked, attendings get upset cuz they have less people to do the clinical/educational/research work, etc. Even the chair became aware of the problems/disgruntlement that could be traced back to being short a resident. If it were the case we were short because someone went to go live with their spouse or near their dying relative, i think we all would have sucked it up a bit more.

So yes, your callous disregard for your advanced program and the spot you'd potentially be putting them in does bother me. But I think everyone else here can implicitly understand the impact of being short staffed without it being explained.

 

[cj_cregg]

Makes sense you'd be against transfers

And your PD will feel the same way.

 

[LunaOri]

Okay from the summary of this thread, everyone thinks it's detrimental to transfer in my position.

Serious question, why even offer transfer spots then? If it was so detrimental for everyone to move why encourage people to apply? Or it okay for someone without my record to apply?

We offer transfer spots because we have an opening—someone has left and we need to fill the spot. We don’t plan to have an open spot.

 

[mistafab]

This is the gold standard kind of trolling. Just believable enough for everyone to pile in. An artistic mix of hubris, poor grammar, and original content.

Bravo.

 

[xffan624]

This is the gold standard kind of trolling. Just believable enough for everyone to pile in. An artistic mix of hubris, poor grammar, and original content.

Bravo.

I still think the original thread is the best. The sequel is decent, but lacks the contemporaneousness and urgency of the original.

 

[HemeOncHopeful19]

I still think the original thread is the best. The sequel is decent, but lacks the contemporaneousness and urgency of the original.

Agreed

 

[GoSpursGo]

Okay from the summary of this thread, everyone thinks it's detrimental to transfer in my position.

Serious question, why even offer transfer spots then? If it was so detrimental for everyone to move why encourage people to apply? Or it okay for someone without my record to apply?

It would be OK for someone without your record to apply.

 

[Qpworueury]

And your PD will feel the same way.

I understand that residency is different, but I don't have any allegiance to these people. I don't them anything outside the job requirements. I don't have to like them. And there nothing to like about them. I hate the place with a passion. Some people take this so personally, a random person online doesn't like their program and it's labeled as a calloused disregard

 

[DO2015CA]

I understand that residency is different, but I don't have any allegiance to these people. I don't them anything outside the job requirements. I don't have to like them. And there nothing to like about them. I hate the place with a passion. Some people take this so personally, a random person online doesn't like their program and it's labeled as a calloused disregard

Lol the problem is you haven’t even worked with them how can you say you don’t like them and there is nothing to like about them?

 

[Qpworueury]

Lol the problem is you haven’t even worked with them how can you say you don’t like them and there is nothing to like about them?

I've heard many negative things about the program name, location, reputation etc.

 

[guytakingboards]

I understand that residency is different, but I don't have any allegiance to these people. I don't them anything outside the job requirements. I don't have to like them. And there nothing to like about them. I hate the place with a passion. Some people take this so personally, a random person online doesn't like their program and it's labeled as a calloused disregard

I've heard many negative things about the program name, location, reputation etc.

Just pointing out here that you matching with this program was not random chance. You applied to this program, interviewed there, and ranked them.

You say you hate this program. Why? Even through your own account of the prior incident, the program never did anything wrong to you. They’ve been measured and open minded through out.

And once again, to flip things so you can better understand your situation: you say you don’t owe them anything. And that is somewhat correct if you ignore the whole binding contract part. Though if taken with the same attitude, the program doesn’t owe you anything…. and that includes a career in medicine. They can choose to callously end your career in medicine quite frankly much easier than you can do anything to them. If they fire you at day 46, there’s a good chance you never complete residency anywhere.

 

[LucidSplash]

Yeah, **** that place for ranking you over others and giving you a job when the places you wanted didn’t want you more than other candidates! Serves them right! Who cares about binding contracts! 🙄 It’s so hard to figure out why you dropped farther down on your rank list than you expected. Perplexing even! This place will probably breathe a sigh of relief after your nonsense. A toxic resident, after all, is NOT better than having no resident.

Dude if you want to try to transfer then try to transfer, that is not the issue. In this thread you’ve changed from “I want to transfer as soon as my 45 days are up” to “I’m going to work hard for a year and then transfer, why is everyone so worked up.”

I don’t know about anyone else but I’ve moved on to schadenfreude. OP please keep us posted when this blows up in your face.

 

[Qpworueury]

Just pointing out here that you matching with this program was not random chance. You applied to this program, interviewed there, and ranked them.

You say you hate this program. Why? Even through your own account of the prior incident, the program never did anything wrong to you. They’ve been measured and open minded through out.

I think the reputation from what I heard is poor, in terms of teaching and research opportunities. A lot of people don't like the location either. I don't know a single person that had this place in their top 5. It's a backup for most people. No one is excited to go there. I haven't even heard from any of the residents there yet. By this time last year everyone was chatting at my current program

 

[rokshana]

I think the reputation from what I heard is poor, in terms of teaching and research opportunities. A lot of people don't like the location either. I don't know a single person that had this place in their top 5. It's a backup for most people. No one is excited to go there. I haven't even heard from any of the residents there yet. By this time last year everyone was chatting at my current program

Yet they ranked you to match… what does that say about the quality of you?