Practically failing!

[ddstothecor]

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O.K. Everyone!!

Here's your chance to expound upon my self-doubt. Most everyone here is naturally gifted, so I don't know why I'm posting this. It isn't for pity. I just want to know how many you (if you're willing to talk about it) have experienced a failing effort at one task or another in school. I'm sure some people have at one time or another.

Now, I have to suffer through the anxiety of wondering if I'm going to survive another lab practical exam. They're the worst kind of living nightmare that I've ever experienced.

 

[UBTom]

Don't worry. Once you are in 3rd year you will look back and laugh! 😀

What are you having difficulty with specifically? Maybe there's something in my bag of preclinical lab tricks that might help.

 

[DrRob]

First year I failed at least one practical in every lab course. My first lab operative practical I got a 67, by the last practical I got an 86. It just takes practice and confidence. By second year I think I only failed one practical all year but consistently scored 80's in any practical.

 

[aphistis]

I actually experienced this just a few days ago.

Our preliminary instruction on waxing technique was *extremely* rudimentary, and I didn't immediately catch on. It ended up haunting me all throughout the tooth morph module, until yesterday I finally sat down with the course director for an hour and he actually *showed* me how it's done. Intellectually, I've got the TM stuff down cold; it was just the manual techniques that were killing me.

Fortunately, I'm fine now; and even better, today were our slide and station exams! No more tooth morph for us; now, it's on to the untamed frontiers of gnathology 😀

 

[DrJeff]

I pulled the big fail on biochemistry, which was the first final of my first year😱 , and once I managed to scrape by my second course (Law and ethics), I got my feet back under me and survived and ended up thriving in the remainder of my four year(although a hiccup or two did occur during the first two year (I also managed to fail cariology(the first dental final we had - sense a trend here about first tests and me😡 ). Just remember, to get into dental school you've got some serious brain power, just relax, and take a deep breath and go with the flow.

I can tell you, that after being out in private practice for many years now, that you won't have "your A game" every single day with every single patient. You do though learn to roll with the punches and make it through each day. After all, things could be alot worse, you could be a proctologist!😀

 

[ddstothecor]

Originally posted by UBTom
Don't worry. Once you are in 3rd year you will look back and laugh! 😀

What are you having difficulty with specifically? Maybe there's something in my bag of preclinical lab tricks that might help.

Really, I think it's a matter of speed. I went to one of the faculty who gave me some wicked advice on how to visualize the tooth, and that helped. Also, though, I don't work very efficiently.

I'm going to get tutoring, and try to get in at least two practice runs before the next one, but we also have to carve a tooth out of a block, and all that measuring and Boley Guage work is quite the nuisance. I try to just eyeball it - that's easiest for chopping it down, but once I've get to that point - oh boy!!! It's probably a matter of practice (and confidence), but it takes me 8 hours to do what the other students can accomplish in 2 and 1/2 or 3 hours.

 

[tinker bell]

You will get better over time. Just remember to pay absolute attention at observing the tooth first before you even start. Have the image of that tooth in your head, then start working.
Good luck

 

[DrRob]

I thought marquette was the only school that did the tooth carving from a wax block - but now they go rid of it.

 

[Temple 2006]

We had to carve #8 and #3 out of a wax block last year at Temple....biggest waste of time in my mind

 

[ItsGavinC]

I think most schools are dropping carving.

In regards to the OP, don't worry, most everybody here is really smart, yet I think we've ALL had our tough exams.

I've come within 2 points of failing!

It doesn't mean you won't be an awesome dentist, that's for sure.

 

[xc1999]

ddstothecor,

I think going to the instructor directly and just asking for help helps a lot. Especially if he/she is willing to sit with you and SHOW you how to do the whole thing. My prelab instructor at Temple is holding help sessions this year for anyone having trouble with waxing. It really did help to not only see what techinque he was using but also what tools he was using to wax the tooth. I know your school may not have these help sessions, but I'm sure the instructor would (or at least should be!) willing to sit with you and show you how to wax a tooth. At any rate, I feel your pain! Good luck! 🙂

 

[MsPurtell]

I'm a second year at UConn and I stink at operative dentistry......of all things!!! I can do everything else (BMS, PBL, other dental classes), but I screw up the operative quizzes (56 on the first one this year..........everyone else passed) and it always takes me longer to complete my lab assignments and get them signed off. I feel like everyone knows something.........or maybe a lot of things.......that I just don't know. Any advice?

I asked the teacher about getting a tutor, but I haven't heard back yet.

TIA, Margaret

 

[ItsGavinC]

Just thought I'd let you all know that I passed our exam today by .08%!!

That's right! One more question wrong and I would have failed.

So, that's how it goes sometimes I've found. I didn't study much this past week, but I wouldn't trade that family time or relaxing time for anything.

Bottom line: don't worry, everybody will have tough weeks. Most importantly: don't compare yourself against your classmates! We all have vastly different situations.

 

[UBTom]

to Margaret:

Hmm... What kind of questions are in those quizzes there at UConn? At my school those Operative quizzes were pretty straightforward, with questions like why one needs a bevel margin for resins or where to put retention features and such.

As far as the projects go, I tend to do the following: Cut one prep on the benchtop so 1) I get a good idea of how the final product is supposed to look like 2) and find out which parts are the most difficult to cut. Then I cut the prep in the mounted typodont for real. Usually works pretty good for me. Some guys are born with a highspeed in their hands, can cut it one shot and have it come out like a prep cut by G.V. Black himself, but not me.. 😀

I assume you also knew all the other tricks such as using an end-cutting bur like a #1 round bur to start proximal boxes (blunt-ended side-cutting burs like the 169 or 56 absolutely SUCK for doing that, despite what all the instructors tell us), and using diamonds whenever you can since those cut ivorine much better than carbides, and whenever you have to use a carbide use a new, sharp one.

I must have spent more than $100 on additional ivorine teeth during my freshman year..

Don't get discouraged though if you find it difficult to cut preps on ivorine. When you start working on real patients you will see that cutting preps on real teeth is MUCH easier-- The high-speed won't have a tendency to "run away" when cutting enamel and you need far less finger pressure.

HTH!

 

[DrRob]

I used to cut the manikin teeth with a 330 bur to depth (which is 1.8 mm) I can't remember the exact measurement but our preps had to be 2 mm in depth. I used to drop the box with a 245 and gently drop the box while following the curvature of the tooth - so that the axial wall will follow the contour of the tooth.

I think it really just takes practice and developping your own technique - I went from a 67 on my first practical freshman year to a 93 my first practical sophmore year - so you can do it with practice!! I too must have spent hundreds of dollars on plastic teeth!

Know I cut with a 556 for everything!!

 

[juan7677]

Originally posted by DrRob
I thought marquette was the only school that did the tooth carving from a wax block - but now they go rid of it.

I wish that UOP got rid of carving. We have to do 6 of them.

 

[hopefully]

I'm taking dentures right now and it's making my life miserable. They never give us enough class time to work on it, so there's a ton of time spent in lab. Plus we have fixed and operative. I think I'm taking 10 courses, but it's hard to keep track. Basically, I'm falling behind in my didactic courses because of my preclinical lab classes. I wish I was good at this. It's hard not to compare yourself to your classmates, when they're a lot faster or have better hand skills. As much as I think dentistry is interesting, I often wonder if this is the right field for me after starting dental school because I'm terrible at this. I'm getting tired and it's only my 2nd year in dental school! For instance, after nearly 5 hours working on my dentures, the glass slab broke that I'm using as my occlusal plane. So much for nothing. I know I should have a positive attitude about school, but it's hard to keep the morale up. Now back to studying for my 2 quizzes...

 

[aphistis]

My position mirrors yours almost exactly...I'm doing fine in didactic, but I'm so crummy working with my hands compared to the rest of my class that when I think about suffering through two more years of this, it's all I can do to not simply give up.

Anybody else experiencing this now, or gone through it before?

 

[ItsGavinC]

Bill, our lab work is nonexistant at this point (we're finishing up ALL of our medical didactic work first), but keep your head up.

You'll make a superb dentist.

 

[ddstothecor]

All I can say is that I hope this trend doesn't continue for any of us. I really believe that many attempts will get us through, but in the meantime, my life is hell. I dread practical exams, and I seem to do everything at a snail's pace compared to everybody else. Even with a tutor - which helped immensely - I'm praying to pass dental anatomy.

I really feel your pain hopefully, but you've made it this far. I'm starting to see the trend, though. Bust ba!!$ all day in lab, and hope to get enough didactic work in between. I know that it just keeps piling on until the end of the term.

Try to keep the end in your sight (But it never ends, and for me, it's just beginning). Good luck to all, and remember this boat we're floating on can make it to the shore with enough luck and a good, strong current in a fortuitous direction.

 

[UBTom]

Originally posted by aphistis
Anybody else experiencing this now, or gone through it before?

Fret not, Bill. Lots of guys were in the exact same boat as you. Several of my instructors confess that they thought seriously about quitting during second year. So did I. The amount of work one has to do bordered on insane and I almost couldn't keep my head above the water.

If you can survive the first two years, you should be good for the duration!

 

[UBTom]

Originally posted by hopefully
I'm taking dentures right now and it's making my life miserable. They never give us enough class time to work on it, so there's a ton of time spent in lab. Plus we have fixed and operative. I think I'm taking 10 courses, but it's hard to keep track. Basically, I'm falling behind in my didactic courses because of my preclinical lab classes. I wish I was good at this. It's hard not to compare yourself to your classmates, when they're a lot faster or have better hand skills. As much as I think dentistry is interesting, I often wonder if this is the right field for me after starting dental school because I'm terrible at this. I'm getting tired and it's only my 2nd year in dental school! For instance, after nearly 5 hours working on my dentures, the glass slab broke that I'm using as my occlusal plane. So much for nothing. I know I should have a positive attitude about school, but it's hard to keep the morale up. Now back to studying for my 2 quizzes...

Yep... Preclinical removable is a trip. 😛 I can sympathize because it was also one of those lab courses in which I worked like a dog and still couldn't get high marks.

BTW, you are using glass for your occlusal plane? How do you build in the curve of Spee if you use a slab of flat glass?

 

[aphistis]

Originally posted by UBTom
If you can survive the first two years, you should be good for the duration!

If. 😛

 

[critterbug]

We got faith in ya.

 

[hopefully]

BTW, you are using glass for your occlusal plane? How do you build in the curve of Spee if you use a slab of flat glass? [/B][/QUOTE]

UBTom,

As we go from anterior to posterior, we have dimensions to follow. For instance for the 1st premolar both buccal and lingual cusps touch the occlusal plane, for the 2nd premolar, the buccal cusp is 0.5mm above the plane, but the lingual cusp touches the plane. For the 1st molar, the mesial buccal cusp is 1 mm above the plane, the distal buccal cusp is 1.5 mm above, the mesial lingual cusp touches the plane and the distal lingual cusp is 0.5mm above the plane. Also the molars are tilted mesially. Hopefully, this is supposed to give you the curve of spee. How did you do it?

 

[UBTom]

Hi there Hopefully,

Hmm... From your mention of using the glass to set the buccal flare, it sounds to me like you are setting the maxillary posteriors first then the mandibular posteriors?

Here's my preferred method:

I prefer setting the mandibular posteriors first, since mandibulars don't have that buccal flare (each pair of cusp tips are at the same height), so it is easier to establish the curve of Spee with the mandibulars.

After all the mandibular posteriors are set (with the generated curve of Spee starting with the mesial tilt of the mandibular 1st molars), then I set the maxillary posteriors.

I find that easier because the maxillary lingual cusps are supposed to interdigitate into the fossae and marginal ridges of the mandibular posteriors-- Having the mandibulars set first means you get to use it as a guide for setting the maxillaries with the curve of Spee and archform already established. Much easier to set the maxillaries against indentations they are supposed to fit into than against a piece of flat, featureless glass! 😀

After I "tack-weld" the maxillaries into their interdigitated positions using melted hard baseplate wax applied with a #7 wax spatula, then I can start adjusting them to the proper buccal tilts while keeping their lingual cusps interdigitated in the right place.

So basically, my order for setting teeth for a complete CU/CL denture case would be to set 1) the max anteriors 2) man anteriors 3) man posteriors and lastly 4) max posteriors.

So far I've done two cases of complete dentures using Dentsply Bioform semianatomic acrylic teeth and my patients are pleased with their functionality.