Programs requiring Step 2 CS for ranking

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LadyJubilee8_18

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One of my very top choices for medicine residency is UCSF, however they require Step 2 CS scores before ranking the applicants. I attend a school where step 1 is taken in the fall of 3rd year, so I had not yet scheduled this exam. I planned to schedule it for December or January so that the score report would be back by February 15th. This morning I looked at the available dates, and the test is booked at all centers until February 5th! I won't be able to get my score back in time for the match. Is there any way around this? Do programs ever make accommodations for this sort of thing? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

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I don't know of a way around it, but you might want to continuously recheck the website for available dates. People drop out all the time. Good luck.
 
Wait. Are you a 3rd year or 4th year? If you're a 3rd year, just scroll down and look at the dates for 2010-2011. Good luck.
 
Wait. Are you a 3rd year or 4th year? If you're a 3rd year, just scroll down and look at the dates for 2010-2011. Good luck.

No I'm a 4th year. I wanted to do psych until July. At my home institution, step 1 is taken spring of 3rd year, and step 2 is usually taken February or March of 4th year. I didn't bank on scheduling being such a nightmare, or programs requiring step 2 for ranking. :(
 
No I'm a 4th year. I wanted to do psych until July. At my home institution, step 1 is taken spring of 3rd year, and step 2 is usually taken February or March of 4th year. I didn't bank on scheduling being such a nightmare, or programs requiring step 2 for ranking. :(

Plenty of psych programs require step 2 cs for ranking as well (my home program being one of them). You're really supposed to schedule cs as early as possible regardless of your specialty choice. But, since berating you doesn't really change the situation now, my best advice is to do what I did: stalk the rescheduling website several times a day to look for an open spot. I had the emails sent to my phone about open spots, but even so I never managed to snag it before someone else. What worked for me was just happening to check it right after someone dropped out before the email alert even went out... I jumped on it and got a September date (yesterday, in fact). GL!
 
I am in the same boat - it is VERY frustrating. If you sign up for the alert service you might have SOME luck...
 
Plenty of psych programs require step 2 cs for ranking as well (my home program being one of them). You're really supposed to schedule cs as early as possible regardless of your specialty choice. But, since berating you doesn't really change the situation now, my best advice is to do what I did: stalk the rescheduling website several times a day to look for an open spot. I had the emails sent to my phone about open spots, but even so I never managed to snag it before someone else. What worked for me was just happening to check it right after someone dropped out before the email alert even went out... I jumped on it and got a September date (yesterday, in fact). GL!

Yeah, but I would have done psych at my home institution which doesn't require Step 2 before ranking. No matter, I'm going to have to check the web page like a fiend. I checked it this morning at 4am (I had heartburn, couldn't sleep) and there were two spots in January available. By 7:00am when I sent my application, the spots were gone. Hopefully things start opening up. How long did you check the site before you found something?
 
Yeah, but I would have done psych at my home institution which doesn't require Step 2 before ranking. No matter, I'm going to have to check the web page like a fiend. I checked it this morning at 4am (I had heartburn, couldn't sleep) and there were two spots in January available. By 7:00am when I sent my application, the spots were gone. Hopefully things start opening up. How long did you check the site before you found something?

Just a week or two, it didn't take long. Don't know how much of that was luck, but it worked out great for me-- I got exactly the month I wanted, and my result will be back in plenty of time for ranking.

ETA: Also, it helps if you can be incredibly flexible regarding travel. I know when I was looking it was really easy to find a date for the next day or two, because people would postpone at the last minute and it was hard to make travel arrangements with only 24-48 hours notice. If you can afford to book next-day airfare or live near enough to a test center to drive, that should really help your ability to get a sooner test date.
 
Yeah, but I would have done psych at my home institution which doesn't require Step 2 before ranking. No matter, I'm going to have to check the web page like a fiend. I checked it this morning at 4am (I had heartburn, couldn't sleep) and there were two spots in January available. By 7:00am when I sent my application, the spots were gone. Hopefully things start opening up. How long did you check the site before you found something?

I know someone who was just able to move into a spot in December, so keep on checking. I think it's one of those things where you have to be logged at the right time and lucky.
 
I'm in this exact situation. Between interviews and rotations, I really have zero free time to take Step 2 CS before the end of the year, unless maybe a Saturday spot opens up. My interview trail also right now doesn't take me to any of the exam sites (maybe Atlanta or Philadelphia later). I'm just going to explain this to the program directors and try not to worry about it. Such a colossal waste of time, money, energy, and anxiety for a worthless exam.
 
I'm in this exact situation. Between interviews and rotations, I really have zero free time to take Step 2 CS before the end of the year, unless maybe a Saturday spot opens up. My interview trail also right now doesn't take me to any of the exam sites (maybe Atlanta or Philadelphia later). I'm just going to explain this to the program directors and try not to worry about it. Such a colossal waste of time, money, energy, and anxiety for a worthless exam.

Your rotations will give you the time off to go take the test, they have to. Don't expect to "just explain" it away to PDs, if they require you to have the CS by rank time and you don't, they won't rank you.
 
Your rotations will give you the time off to go take the test, they have to. Don't expect to "just explain" it away to PDs, if they require you to have the CS by rank time and you don't, they won't rank you.

From what I've heard, this is actually kind of variable. I think it's possible that if a program really likes you, they'll overlook it because they know that it is mostly a formality for US grads. All the programs at my school require CS passing before ranking, but I know someone who hit a snag with this like the others users here and asked the PD of one of the programs about it. The PD told him not to worry about it and that the program would still be interested in him. Of course, you might have more sway on stuff like this with your home program in a less competitive specialty. UCSF might be a harder sell for anybody since I'm sure they're overwhelmed with great applicants for every specialty.

Also, adding that rotations do not have to give you time off to take this test. You can usually work around it in some way, but I'm sure your school could just say that the test is offered every day, so hey, why not schedule it some other time?
 
Also, adding that rotations do not have to give you time off to take this test. You can usually work around it in some way, but I'm sure your school could just say that the test is offered every day, so hey, why not schedule it some other time?

You're a 4th year. Unless it's your Sub-I, tell your rotations to suck it and go take the test whenever you can.
 
My school does offer administrative excuses for the Steps. I'm sure it could be arranged, but I worry more about the possibility of my attendings griping because I'm missing more time during an AI, despite the official school policy. It also doesn't look great if you're doing an away sub-I, as I'm planning in November. I'll still keep my eyes peeled for whatever opens up in the next three months.
 
You're a 4th year. Unless it's your Sub-I, tell your rotations to suck it and go take the test whenever you can.

Doesn't always matter.

Some of my classmates last year took off during a 4th year, non-sub-I rotation to go to interviews or to CS. They were told to come in on weekends and make up their missed days "or else." (And obviously, no, they weren't going into that specialty.)
 
My school does offer administrative excuses for the Steps. I'm sure it could be arranged, but I worry more about the possibility of my attendings griping because I'm missing more time during an AI, despite the official school policy. It also doesn't look great if you're doing an away sub-I, as I'm planning in November. I'll still keep my eyes peeled for whatever opens up in the next three months.

Yeah, doing it during an away is probably a bad idea. What are you worried about the attendings griping for though? It's not like they're going to dock your grade because you missed a day to take a required test.

Doesn't always matter.

Some of my classmates last year took off during a 4th year, non-sub-I rotation to go to interviews or to CS. They were told to come in on weekends and make up their missed days "or else." (And obviously, no, they weren't going into that specialty.)

Or else what? They might not write you a rec letter that you shouldn't need at this point? They might not give you an Honors that probably doesn't matter at this point?
I'd probably say go in on the weekend just to keep the peace, but this isn't something a quick phone call to your dean couldn't fix in about 2 minutes.
 
Or else what? They might not write you a rec letter that you shouldn't need at this point?

Or else they'd be required to repeat the rotation, to avoid getting a failing grade.

And what do you think the dean would do about it? It's THEIR rotation, and it's their perogative to make the rules.

The rationale for CS will always be that it's offered on weekends, why not take it then?

Whatever, it's all a moot point now for all of them. I'm just saying, don't assume that because you're a 4th year that a) people will understand or care that interviews and CS take priority and b) your dean will be able to somehow magically "fix" the situation.
 
Or else they'd be required to repeat the rotation, to avoid getting a failing grade.

And what do you think the dean would do about it? It's THEIR rotation, and it's their perogative to make the rules.

The rationale for CS will always be that it's offered on weekends, why not take it then?

Whatever, it's all a moot point now for all of them. I'm just saying, don't assume that because you're a 4th year that a) people will understand or care that interviews and CS take priority and b) your dean will be able to somehow magically "fix" the situation.

Noone would fail a rotation because they took a day to take the CS. Hell, people here take days off just to meet with their pathway advisor. This is 4th year, we aren't talking about the 3rd year medicine clerkship or something. And even if they did, like I said, the dean would step in. Rotation directors are given a lot of leeway on how they run their ship, but if they do something so completely and blatantly absurd as that, the school is going to step in and tell them to shove it. The school is still ultimately in charge.

It's not a moot point for them, these guys need to be able to check the website constantly and as soon as they see a date open be able to schedule it without worrying if it will affect their grade. It shouldn't, and unless your attending is out of their mind it won't, and even if they are out of their mind that is something a dean should be able to take care of.
 
Noone would fail a rotation because they took a day to take the CS.

Well, yeah, it's unlikely, but I think saying "no one" is a bit strong. I'm also puzzled as to why a lawyer who's married to a medical student knows so much about how every medical school works. Schools don't have universal policies about this stuff.
 
Well, yeah, it's unlikely, but I think saying "no one" is a bit strong. I'm also puzzled as to why a lawyer who's married to a medical student knows so much about how every medical school works. Schools don't have universal policies about this stuff.

Clearly they aren't universal, but what is universal is that med schools are in the business of getting their students matched. Absurd policies that prevent that isn't something they're going to be okay with.

I spend a lot of time on here mostly to research stuff for my wife, but also because I'm bored. I don't know how every med school works, but I do know how her's works and numerous friends of ours spread in different med schools around the country. When I do give advice on here, it's mostly from a point of common sense informed by what I happen to know about the topic.
 
Clearly they aren't universal, but what is universal is that med schools are in the business of getting their students matched. Absurd policies that prevent that isn't something they're going to be okay with.

<sigh>

Something that you have to understand is (and this is something you probably wouldn't understand unless you were a med student yourself) is that your SCHOOL's best interests do not always match with your ROTATION's best interests.

Your school's best interests are to get you to graduate and into a residency without too many problems.

Your rotation's best interests are to get you to be there as much as possible, and not blow them off.

In many cases, your rotation takes precedent over your school. Your student dean isn't going to step in and piss off a rotation director, a rotation coordinator, an attending, and a resident, unless it's something MAJOR. Step 2 CS, as weird as this will sound to you, is not considered that major. Your dean will likely tell you that you should've scheduled it for a weekend.

I don't know how every med school works, but I do know how her's works and numerous friends of ours spread in different med schools around the country. When I do give advice on here, it's mostly from a point of common sense informed by what I happen to know about the topic.

Well, the truth of the matter is:

a) You don't ACTUALLY know how hers works. She hasn't gone all the way through it yet.

b) You don't actually know how hers works because you aren't there all the time.

I mean, you can make the argument that I do know how *mine* worked, seeing as I graduated from it, and I've had numerous friends at different med schools around the country as well.

And I appreciate that your advice is influenced by a "point of common sense." However, since when has medical school/residency EVER been influenced by common sense? It would be "common sense" for interns to get paid for orientation....which we don't. It would be "common sense" for Step 2 CS to be offered in more than 5 locations in the country....which it isn't. Etc.

And God help your wife if both of you think that attendings and senior residents are influenced by common sense....because trust me, a lot of times they aren't. :laugh:
 
There's a spot open in Houston for this Saturday if any of you guys want it.

:thumbup: thanks, hopefully someone can take advantage of that. Maybe if people drop the exam, or see an open spot they can post in this thread so that SDNers who need it can have the heads up.
 
I'm home studying for Step 2 CK, so I'm just checking it every time I need a break (i.e. every 5 minutes). I'll keep posting if I see something in the next couple of days.
 
<sigh>

Something that you have to understand is (and this is something you probably wouldn't understand unless you were a med student yourself) is that your SCHOOL's best interests do not always match with your ROTATION's best interests.

Your school's best interests are to get you to graduate and into a residency without too many problems.

Your rotation's best interests are to get you to be there as much as possible, and not blow them off.

In many cases, your rotation takes precedent over your school. Your student dean isn't going to step in and piss off a rotation director, a rotation coordinator, an attending, and a resident, unless it's something MAJOR. Step 2 CS, as weird as this will sound to you, is not considered that major. Your dean will likely tell you that you should've scheduled it for a weekend.



Well, the truth of the matter is:

a) You don't ACTUALLY know how hers works. She hasn't gone all the way through it yet.

b) You don't actually know how hers works because you aren't there all the time.

I mean, you can make the argument that I do know how *mine* worked, seeing as I graduated from it, and I've had numerous friends at different med schools around the country as well.

And I appreciate that your advice is influenced by a "point of common sense." However, since when has medical school/residency EVER been influenced by common sense? It would be "common sense" for interns to get paid for orientation....which we don't. It would be "common sense" for Step 2 CS to be offered in more than 5 locations in the country....which it isn't. Etc.

And God help your wife if both of you think that attendings and senior residents are influenced by common sense....because trust me, a lot of times they aren't. :laugh:

Clearly, my wife and you have had very different experiences with their school's administration. I can guarantee you that her school WOULD step in in that situation, because I've seen them step in for much less. If anything, it's been my experience that her school babies them a little too much, making sure they can get whole days off for things like meeting with an advisor. Plenty of people take several days off their rotations to interview as well, do you think they're going to be failed for that as well? Of course not.

The dean probably would ask why you didn't schedule it for a weekend first. That's when you say that you planned to, but didn't realize that some programs required it before rank lists went in, so now you need to know that you can take whatever spot you can find available regardless of when it is. The situation is what makes this a big deal, not the CS itself.

Maybe you're right, maybe some schools would just let the rotation fail someone for taking the CS, but that seems absurd. Also, quit building straw man arguments about how I'm not a student so I can't possibly know what I'm talking about. If you want to say I'm wrong because what I've said was not your experience, then that's fine. I will amend my stance to be that her school would step in, and that I can't imagine how any school wouldn't, but apparently some schools just don't care about their students. Shame.
 
The thing about medical schools is that they do want you to succeed, but they're also a big bureaucratic structure with lots of little fiefdoms. Consequently, they don't always operate as rationally or as much in the best interest of students as they school. At my school, taking time off for anything is generally up to the attendings/clerkship coordinators. While most are reasonable, some really resent students missing days even for important stuff. On one of the required rotations this year, we're not allowed to miss days at all except for emergency situations. Unreasonable for a fourth year, yeah, but it's not changing.
 
Maybe you're right, maybe some schools would just let the rotation fail someone for taking the CS, but that seems absurd. Also, quit building straw man arguments about how I'm not a student so I can't possibly know what I'm talking about. If you want to say I'm wrong because what I've said was not your experience, then that's fine. I will amend my stance to be that her school would step in, and that I can't imagine how any school wouldn't, but apparently some schools just don't care about their students. Shame.

I just find it odd that you're talking about common sense....and yet arguing about your OBSERVATIONS of someone else's med school experience to someone who's already gone through it. ;)

And I wouldn't say that your wife's SCHOOL babies the students too much - it was that particular attending/resident that she interacted with. I've had residents who were like, "Hey, you want the day off before the interview to prepare and travel?" And I've had other residents who were like, "If you're not back here RIGHT AFTER YOUR INTERVIEW, we'll make you come in on a weekend." It varies.

I wouldn't say that my school didn't care about students, it's just not the way that certain attendings work. Your med school administration is generally fairly far removed from the day-to-day workings of a student's daily rotations.

The thing about medical schools is that they do want you to succeed, but they're also a big bureaucratic structure with lots of little fiefdoms. Consequently, they don't always operate as rationally or as much in the best interest of students as they school. At my school, taking time off for anything is generally up to the attendings/clerkship coordinators. While most are reasonable, some really resent students missing days even for important stuff. On one of the required rotations this year, we're not allowed to miss days at all except for emergency situations. Unreasonable for a fourth year, yeah, but it's not changing.

EXACTLY. :thumbup: Very well put.
 
I just find it odd that you're talking about common sense....and yet arguing about your OBSERVATIONS of someone else's med school experience to someone who's already gone through it. ;)

And I wouldn't say that your wife's SCHOOL babies the students too much - it was that particular attending/resident that she interacted with. I've had residents who were like, "Hey, you want the day off before the interview to prepare and travel?" And I've had other residents who were like, "If you're not back here RIGHT AFTER YOUR INTERVIEW, we'll make you come in on a weekend." It varies.

I wouldn't say that my school didn't care about students, it's just not the way that certain attendings work. Your med school administration is generally fairly far removed from the day-to-day workings of a student's daily rotations.

At this point you're not even reading what I wrote. Nevermind. We've derailed the thread enough.
 
At this point you're not even reading what I wrote. Nevermind. We've derailed the thread enough.

Just checked and September 30 is open for Houston. I wish I could take it, but I haven't been sent a scheduling permit yet :( hope someone can take advantage of it
 
Somebody took 10/23 in Los Angeles right as I was signing up for it. Ugh....

9/30 in Houston is now gone too.

My plan is to wake up at 5am every day to check. Better odds of getting something that early. Sorry it's gone :( Also, could someone feasibly study for CS in 2-3 days? Anyone know how far from the current date you'd have to schedule it to actually pass.
 
My plan is to wake up at 5am every day to check. Better odds of getting something that early. Sorry it's gone :( Also, could someone feasibly study for CS in 2-3 days? Anyone know how far from the current date you'd have to schedule it to actually pass.

Yes -- it's not a test you have to do much studying for if you're a US student. Study First Aid for a day or two, and you should be fine. You just need to figure out the little nuances of the test, and that's what FA is for.
 
My plan is to wake up at 5am every day to check. Better odds of getting something that early. Sorry it's gone :( Also, could someone feasibly study for CS in 2-3 days? Anyone know how far from the current date you'd have to schedule it to actually pass.
The funny thing is that the date I posted this AM was available for several hours. I think there are just a lot more people checking the schedule after they get off the wards at the end of the day.
 
My plan is to wake up at 5am every day to check. Better odds of getting something that early. Sorry it's gone :( Also, could someone feasibly study for CS in 2-3 days? Anyone know how far from the current date you'd have to schedule it to actually pass.

- All you really need is 2-3 evenings to read FA, and you'll be good to go.

- The NBME has provided a rough guide to let you know when you can expect your score based on the date that you took it.

Good luck getting a test date! :luck::luck::luck:
 
UCSF is requiring applicants to take Step 2 for all specialties this year. My guess is that they got burned last year with residents not being able to start on time.

My school allows us 4 days off per rotation for interviews before we have to start making up time. I would imagine that step 2 would fall under those 4 days that you're allowed off (or at least I hope so since I'm going to be on a rotation during my step 2 date). I'm surprised more schools don't have policies like that. Also, I'm not sure why everyone seems upset that they might be forced to come in on weekends - who cares? It's not like you're going to have to make up the whole rotation, and you'd end up working the number of days that you should be working anyway, not more. Sure, having weekends off is nice, but is it really the end of the world if you have to come in one weekend if it means you can take Step 2 in time to meet a program's requirements (or interview, or whatever)?
 
Lucked into a November spot in Philadelphia after 3 days of obsessive refreshes! The timing and location couldn't be more convenient.

If you guys just keep checking, I bet you'll experience similar good fortune. :xf::luck:
 
Lucked into a November spot in Philadelphia after 3 days of obsessive refreshes! The timing and location couldn't be more convenient.

If you guys just keep checking, I bet you'll experience similar good fortune. :xf::luck:

This is the way to go. For a couple of days in a row, I sat around and watched TV, idly hitting refresh every few minutes, and voila a date popped up.
 
This is the way to go. For a couple of days in a row, I sat around and watched TV, idly hitting refresh every few minutes, and voila a date popped up.

THis will be my job monday-whenever I get a spot. Wish me luck!
 
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