Rad Onc Twitter

  • Thread starter Thread starter deleted1002574
  • Start date Start date
This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.
elementaryschooleconomics said:
These are the details I know as well. The people I heard this from in real life are people who are generally oblivious to national RadOnc gossip/issues and I was shocked to hear it from them, that's how over-the-line Wallner's response was.

At some point in this process the one and only KO stepped in to defend said young attending. I'm not entirely clear on the chain of events for how KO became involved, the "street words" I was told was that Wallner CC'ed a bunch of people on his email which is how this circulated?
Click to expand...
Classic "Reply All" mix up.
 
Mandelin Rain said:
Classic "Reply All" mix up.
Click to expand...

I desperately want this to be true - Wallner sends what sounds like the most heinous/inappropriate email to send in this situation, BCC'ing some of his buddies, one of them accidentally hits "Reply All" --> every RadOnc in America has recoiled in revulsion?
 
elementaryschooleconomics said:
Also, if anyone gets their hands on Wallner's letter/email/whatever I vote we make that it's own thread for maximum visibility (outside of this 43 page Twitter thread, haha).
Click to expand...

Now that I figured out what’s going on I third this. THE Paul Wallner outed himself as the a-hole that he is? Who would have thought that could ever happen. Let’s get our hands on that thing boys and girls
 
Mandelin Rain said:
Whatever you guys do, please leave the young, discriminated against attending above or somehow outside the fray.

She didn't ask for this nonsense.
Click to expand...

The fray? Sticking up for herself and for other women, both now and in the future, by fighting injust policies and an injust organization, headed by one who can best be described as the Platonic Ideal of precisely the kind of entrenched male Boomer whose death grip on power society desperately needs to loosen? She’s a goddamn hero. She’s miles above the fray.
 
OTN said:
The fray? Sticking up for herself and for other women, both now and in the future, by fighting injust policies and an injust organization, headed by one who can best be described as the Platonic Ideal of precisely the kind of entrenched male Boomer whose death grip on power society desperately needs to loosen? She’s a goddamn hero. She’s miles above the fray.
Click to expand...

PREACH
 
medgator said:
Looking forward to Wallner getting exposed for the out-of-touch 21C boomer that he is.
Click to expand...

Unless it’s really really something unlikely anything will happen to him except some eye brow furrowing from the likes of Harari and kachnic. Hopefully it’s really really bad though and we can get it trending on twitter. Truthfully the medical system is sick, it’s easy to see if you go to Astro and these sick old men are spending extra time talking to the young good looking resident about her or his poster prez. Not sure why General pop don’t scrutinize it more. Like police, physicians/nurses are also in positions of unmitigated power and often use that in exploitative ways
 
73B696AC-C4BD-4ECD-AFB6-C23B85BE186A.jpeg

To lighten the mood, I would like to share a very artistic summary of our field. Sit in the museum chair and stare at it, as you sip on your americano. Our best years are yet to come. Or are they??
 
Last edited:
elementaryschooleconomics said:
I desperately want this to be true - Wallner sends what sounds like the most heinous/inappropriate email to send in this situation, BCC'ing some of his buddies, one of them accidentally hits "Reply All" --> every RadOnc in America has recoiled in revulsion?
Click to expand...

My understanding is that this was definitely not a "reply all" whoopsie. The purpose of the email was to threaten and intimidate a young woman to keep silent about these problems and big names were copied as way to intensify this intimidation.

Imagine if nobody showed up for orals next year. They'd be done. In the past, nobody has been willing to stick their necks out to stand up against bullies in the field such as the ABR and abusive chairs and PDs because it wasn't worth sacrificing one's career as you can't practice unless you play by their rules. But there's power in numbers. Just need an organizer and something to get behind. A sexist threatening email trying to intimidate a young pregnant woman's freedom to speak up in a public forum would do it. Especially when it is coming from a objectively awful old man who is nearly universally despised in the field with a reputation of abusing power and being generally cruel.

Like I said, I think/hope he finally overplayed his hand. Copying all these bigwigs on it to pack a bigger punch to her increases the chances it will be leaked.
 
KHE88 said:
My understanding is that this was definitely not a "reply all" whoopsie. The purpose of the email was to threaten and intimidate a young woman to keep silent about these problems and big names were copied as way to intensify this intimidation.

Imagine if nobody showed up for orals next year. They'd be done. In the past, nobody has been willing to stick their necks out to stand up against bullies in the field such as the ABR and abusive chairs and PDs because it wasn't worth sacrificing one's career as you can't practice unless you play by their rules. But there's power in numbers. Just need an organizer and something to get behind. A sexist threatening email trying to intimidate a young pregnant woman's freedom to speak up in a public forum would do it. Especially when it is coming from a objectively awful old man who is nearly universally despised in the field with a reputation of abusing power and being generally cruel.

Like I said, I think/hope he finally overplayed his hand. Copying all these bigwigs on it to pack a bigger punch to her increases the chances it will be leaked.
Click to expand...

Well let’s get our hands on that thing then and be sure the press finds out about it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: OTN
medgator said:
Click to expand...


I just saw KO's Tweet with "170". Where did he get that number? I haven't seen it elsewhere. It still seems significantly too high - the only way to justify going above the pre-expansion numbers (say, what we had between 2005-2010) would be if 1) the indications for radiation significantly expand, 2) the number of cancer patients need radiation significantly expand, 3) we universally accept that each Radiation Oncologist will see fewer patients on average and take the revenue hit.

I...don't see any of those 3 happening...but maybe KO has some secret data somewhere? Throw it up as a pre-print at least Ken!
 
elementaryschooleconomics said:
I just saw KO's Tweet with "170". Where did he get that number? I haven't seen it elsewhere. It still seems significantly too high - the only way to justify going above the pre-expansion numbers (say, what we had between 2005-2010) would be if 1) the indications for radiation significantly expand, 2) the number of cancer patients need radiation significantly expand, 3) we universally accept that each Radiation Oncologist will see fewer patients on average and take the revenue hit.

I...don't see any of those 3 happening...but maybe KO has some secret data somewhere? Throw it up as a pre-print at least Ken!
Click to expand...
Nah he's just being KO
 
Neuronix said:
170 is a made up number, but it's a good start. Are we actually contracting though? I have seen nothing that indicates that our specialty will just not SOAP all or the vast majority of unfilled positions.
Click to expand...

I have seen absolutely nothing either.

The only thing I have seen is a concerted effort by my department to boost recruiting techniques in advance of an all-virtual interview season.
 
1. Diversity of the applicants has nothing to do with what we're talking about, and is obviously something everyone would agree with. To suggest that you get either 240+ board scores or diverse applicants, but not both, smacks of racism of low expectations.

2. Convincing under-represented minorities to go into a field with limited job opportunities so you can feel good about being able to put the right emojis in your tweet is morally wrong.

3. 170 is a made-up number, just like "90% of graduates change jobs in the first year" and means nothing.
 
This is why i will never join Twitter..

"...Step1 has nothing to do with being a good oncologist."

Um..nothing? So Mayo will rank a candidate who did not pass Step 1?

Of course standardized tests are not the be all end all and some of the best clinicians I have seen in my 30 years in the business had mediocre scores.
 
medgator said:
Click to expand...


That's funny. When I applied 7 years ago with an average step 1 score in the 220s I only got a handful of interviews and could barely get into this field. One interviewer, I'm not going to say who but lets just say his first name was Drew, literally asked me "did you just not study?"

Ended up going to an underserved area and taking a job nobody else wanted. I wasn't a "diverse" applicant though looking at me (even though I was nothing like any of the other applicants if you bothered to talk to me). Of course, diversity doesn't matter on an individual basis to these people; it just matters in terms of what group identity you can be placed into.

Now step 1 doesn't matter (you know, the test we waste months rote memorizing biochem trivia and other irrelevant minutiae we have all long since forgotten) and dedication to the field and cancer patients is more important. Funny how things change!

All the stupid commentary is just low-level thinking and a miserable fail at pigeon-holing applicants.
 
OTN said:
1. Diversity of the applicants has nothing to do with what we're talking about, and is obviously something everyone would agree with. To suggest that you get either 240+ board scores or diverse applicants, but not both, smacks of racism of low expectations.

2. Convincing under-represented minorities to go into a field with limited job opportunities so you can feel good about being able to put the right emojis in your tweet is morally wrong.

3. 170 is a made-up number, just like "90% of graduates change jobs in the first year" and means nothing.
Click to expand...

Just because one can find the black and brown emojis does not make one woke. Too many fake arse woke virtue signallers out there these days. Lip service is cheap. It is not even enough to claim you’re pro URM but what are you really doing to help these groups? Is it really ethical to pull wool over URM eye and trick them into a field with declining pay, declining job opportunities and flexibility? Not very woke, did not think so. This is an ethical issue.

absolutely bigotry of low expectations. If you want more URM dont imply you can let more in now that standards are lower. Maybe tell them the truth and let them decide. I suspect many will not be cool with ending up in rural place where there is nobody like them.
 
KHE88 said:
That's funny. When I applied 7 years ago with an average step 1 score in the 220s I only got a handful of interviews and could barely get into this field. One interviewer, I'm not going to say who but lets just say his first name was Drew, literally asked me "did you just not study?"

Ended up going to an underserved area and taking a job nobody else wanted. I wasn't a "diverse" applicant though looking at me (even though I was nothing like any of the other applicants if you bothered to talk to me). Of course, diversity doesn't matter on an individual basis to these people; it just matters in terms of what group identity you can be placed into.

Now step 1 doesn't matter (you know, the test we waste months rote memorizing biochem trivia and other irrelevant minutiae we have all long since forgotten) and dedication to the field and cancer patients is more important. Funny how things change!

All the stupid commentary is just low-level thinking and a miserable fail at pigeon-holing applicants.
Click to expand...

its funny even a few yrs ago a “240+” was not any guarantee.Wisdom was apply to all places and rank all and just feel lucky you matched
 
KHE88 said:
That's funny. When I applied 7 years ago with an average step 1 score in the 220s I only got a handful of interviews and could barely get into this field. One interviewer, I'm not going to say who but lets just say his first name was Drew, literally asked me "did you just not study?"

Ended up going to an underserved area and taking a job nobody else wanted. I wasn't a "diverse" applicant though looking at me (even though I was nothing like any of the other applicants if you bothered to talk to me). Of course, diversity doesn't matter on an individual basis to these people; it just matters in terms of what group identity you can be placed into.

Now step 1 doesn't matter (you know, the test we waste months rote memorizing biochem trivia and other irrelevant minutiae we have all long since forgotten) and dedication to the field and cancer patients is more important. Funny how things change!

All the stupid commentary is just low-level thinking and a miserable fail at pigeon-holing applicants.
Click to expand...

I can 100% picture Drew spewing this crap.
 
frijoles said:
Heard rumors that Harvard and MDACC are axing a few spots. Anyone know if this is true?
Click to expand...
Supposedly 7 hires for mdacc had their July contracts deferred/delayed to start, supposed to hear an update regarding that in the fall afaik. So essentially they are being strung along until they can find a job before then
 
When it was fashionable to deny problems, he denied them. When it was fashionable to bash SDN, he bashed. When it was fashionable to talk about job market concerns, he talked about them. When it became fashionable to publicly promote diversity, he posted emojis.

There is a trend here. If you're wondering which way the wind is blowing today, you know who to ask.
 
Mandelin Rain said:
When it was fashionable to deny problems, he denied them. When it was fashionable to bash SDN, he bashed. When it was fashionable to talk about job market concerns, he talked about them. When it became fashionable to publicly promote diversity, he posted emojis.

There is a trend here. If you're wondering which way the wind is blowing today, you know who to ask.
Click to expand...

I swear my eyes rolled to the back of my head when I saw the emojis.
 
radoncdoc16 said:
Can you share where?

Despicable, but predictable unfortunately
Click to expand...
Would guess Penn State and NYMC


The new Department of Radiation Oncology is developing a residency program, as well as training programs in medical physics, which will increase the number of health professionals to care for our own patients while addressing the shortage of these kind of experts across the nation.
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
medgator said:
Would guess Penn State and NYMC
Click to expand...

I think it may not be NYMC at least acutely

In job description for chair, they said long term ambition is for residency program

Still annoying though considering the already oversupply of Rad Onc in the NYC area
 
radoncdoc16 said:
I think it may not be NYMC at least acutely

In job description for chair, they said long term ambition is for residency program

Still annoying though considering the already oversupply of Rad Onc in the NYC area
Click to expand...

You can take "in the NYC area" out there and still be accurate.

Simul on Twitter is suggesting maybe Louisiana. No matter where it is, it still doesn't have a right to exist.
 
I have heard that there may be a program in Louisiana trying to open as well.

many will try. Many will fail.
 
OTN said:
You can take "in the NYC area" out there and still be accurate.

Simul on Twitter is suggesting maybe Louisiana. No matter where it is, it still doesn't have a right to exist.
Click to expand...

oh must be some truth to rumor then because I heard same thing independent of Simul

must be LSU or Tulane or maybe a PP cancer center like Willis Knighton?
 
radoncgrad2019 said:
oh must be some truth to rumor then because I heard same thing independent of Simul

must be LSU or Tulane or maybe a PP cancer center like Willis Knighton?
Click to expand...

Wouldn't surprise me if Willis Knighton. They were hiring for a non partnership track position recently because "partnership doesn't exist in major metros". Since when is Shreveport a major metro? Def looking for cheap labor.
 
radoncgrad2019 said:
how can a PP get approved though? aren't there requirements like rad bio faculty, etc?
Click to expand...

. How many actual rad biologists are out there these days. Not some person who just reads from the book but someone who is engaged in rad bio research. Oh that’s right, precious few.

There are so many workarounds. Just dredge one up from the academic center hell even ones that have retired. You throw them a bone and they read from that god awful Hall book for 1-2 hours a week. Problem solved

Physics? Who cares. Pay your physics Dept or better yet physics resident slaves to breeze through a cool 50-100 slides or so every few weeks and call it a day.

Faculty’s lectures? LOL. All they need to do is shove together an incoherent bunch of clinical info onto a slide and email to the residents

And as far as the ACGME is concerned, you’re an upstanding program with nothing but pure intentions.
 
If you can pay a semi retired PhD 10k to teach a class an hour a week to have a perpetual supply of cheap labor, you do it
 
Haybrant said:
Haha who in their right mind that is competitive would go into rad onc. That’s just dumb.

Can we not detract too much from the task at hand though, finding that PW letter
Click to expand...
Yup i agree. Someone reading this has the letter. If you want anonymously send to me and i will post. Im working on trying to get letter myself but closest i have is description of what was said but not the evidence. This has to come out for the good of our field
 
thecarbonionangle said:
recent update: many people are saying, ABR emergency meeting tonight with board of trustees, stay tuned folks!

time is up on you Paul. Release the letter!!!!
Click to expand...

I have also been working on getting this letter - nothing so far.

Do the right thing, vote Wallner out!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

uchihastan
Rad Onc vs. Heme/Onc
Replies
18
Views
2K
medgator
M
B
Rad Onc Procedures and RVUs
Replies
35
Views
5K
CurbYourExpectations
CurbYourExpectations
D
Saving Rad Onc
2
Replies
60
Views
7K
RickyScott
R
TheWallnerus
Rad Onc is in a dark place
Replies
13
Views
3K
RickyScott
R
M
Rad Onc Oral Boards: To quote or not quote studies?
Replies
4
Views
539
alwaysbeIMRTing
A
Top