Rescission of Offer

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Tired Pigeon said:
If you are type 1, also note that should you get drunk & obnoxious with your classmates at any time during your med school career, it will likely be memorialized forever in pictures/stories/video on the internet. Then some gunner in your class will 'helpfully' forward it to the PD's at the competitive residencies you're trying for. :mad: There are some people in my class, and in the class ahead of me, who are VERY sorry they didn't realize this earlier.
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This is why I refuse to have more than 2 drinks around anyone I work with or anyone I go to school with.
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Mayday said:
This is why I refuse to have more than 2 drinks around anyone I work with or anyone I go to school with.
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Gosh, then who are you drinking buddies?
 
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Mayday said:
Some of us have social lives outside of school :p
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Sorry, I'm in Ann Arbor; I couldn't find a person my age who wasn't a student if I wanted to...
 
HumbleMD said:
booh. Albion doesn't have a football team.
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19962748_tp.jpg
 
haha, don't worry about it... I'm pretty sure I didn't even go to a game this year. I've watched more school tennis matches than football games.
 
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so..we don't know the details of what happened w/that kid?
 
lina123321 said:
so..we don't know the details of what happened w/that kid?
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No, we don't, which is utterly amazing considering the power of the premed rumor mill that is SDN. There has to be current students or admitted students who were there that also post on here. And according to my law "knowledge" from watching Law & Order, getting trashed and spewing insults in public means there was no expectation of privacy.... :laugh:


BTW, :biglove: 1000th Post! I'm an official SDN uber-dork! :biglove:
 
Is MSTPdad still out there? How are things working out?
 
HumbleMD said:
booh. Albion doesn't have a football team. And the only worse performance than UMich in a bowl game was OSU.
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Yeah...UMich got creamed by my boys this year in the Rose Bowl!!!!

Quite comical seeing as how they have gotten waxed by the Trojans the last four of five they've played in the Rose Bowl

I pity all Wolverine fans!!!
 
Probably decided to stop posting on sdn since ppl figured out who it was very quickly... gotta save face
 
riceman04 said:
Yeah...UMich got creamed by my boys this year in the Rose Bowl!!!!

Quite comical seeing as how they have gotten waxed by the Trojans the last four of five they've played in the Rose Bowl

I pity all Wolverine fans!!!
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I have to agree. Rice will kick Michigan's butt 9 times out of 10 in football. Go Rice (Krispies!)!
 
searun said:
I have to agree. Rice will kick Michigan's butt 9 times out of 10 in football. Go Rice (Krispies!)!
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Wait this is a joke right? Since when? I bet you that even the team that my cousins and I put together will probably beat Rice at football.
 
OK, so I thought I'd let MSTPdad have the first word before clarifying things, but he's obviously checked out anyway.

I talked to someone who talked to someone- isn't hearsay great.

Apparently this DB did his best Don Imus impersonation, except that Duke's second look was before all that.

Anyway, it basically goes like this:
1) He was drunk… really drunk … a lot. Apparently, he was even drunk at a formal dinner with faculty and invited speakers.
2) He was overtly sexist around students.
3) And finally, he dropped n–bombs around black students!

If this is all true, I hope Duke did share this information with the other schools. Overtly racist and sexist people should not be doctors.
 
Hednej said:
Wait this is a joke right? Since when? I bet you that even the team that my cousins and I put together will probably beat Rice at football.
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Please, I will not allow the great state of Texas and the pride of Texas, the Rice Football Team, to be disparaged by mere midwesterners, or even worse, wolverine lovers.
 
searun said:
Please, I will not allow the great state of Texas and the pride of Texas, the Rice Football Team, to be disparaged by mere midwesterners, or even worse, wolverine lovers.
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Haha, funniest thing I heard all day. I thought the pride of Texas was the Texas (aka University of Texas) football team. God help us all if Rice's football team became Texas' pride.

PS: finally, we got some sort of closure.
 
thiopental said:
If this is all true, I hope Duke did share this information with the other schools. Overtly racist and sexist people should not be doctors.
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How about people who spread unsubstantiated rumors? Should they be doctors too?

I can see it now: "Dr. Thiopental: Plaintiff's Expert Witness for sale".

:barf:
 
bump.

Don't do this.
 
Kthanksbye said:
bump.

Don't do this.
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Yeah, I heard about a guy from MIT (last year?) that went out drinking with some of the first years after his interview and made some horribly offensive comments while drunk. He was all set to get accepted with a full ride, when some students heard about the decision and told members of the admissions committee what had happened. The guy ended up with a flat out rejection.
 
Phoenix. said:
Yeah, I heard about a guy from MIT (last year?) that went out drinking with some of the first years after his interview and made some horribly offensive comments while drunk. He was all set to get accepted with a full ride, when some students heard about the decision and told members of the admissions committee what had happened. The guy ended up with a flat out rejection.
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I don't know what he said, but what's a few horribly offensive comments among friends? There probably isn't a person alive for whom, if all of their comments were a matter of public record, the morality police couldn't find an incriminating line or two to take out of context and use against him. Granted if it's an established pattern of thinking for the person, it's another story. For instance, when I first heard about Watson's comments, the first thing I thought was, "leave the poor guy alone. He's old and possible losing the ability to discern when he's among friends and when he needs to watch his step." But my genetics teacher, who knew the guy personally, says that Watson always said stuff like that, so maybe he deserves what he's getting. But really, if people can never loosen up and tell a few off color jokes, then we are living in a very uptight world indeed. Clearly a good skill to acquire is the ability to discern when you are among friends and when you are surrounded by ACLU types who are trying to crucify you. The med school second look would fall under the category of a place to keep all off color comments locked up. Best behavior only, and drink moderately, even if you can hold your liqueur.
 
Kthanksbye said:
I don't know what he said, but what's a few horribly offensive comments among friends? There probably isn't a person alive for whom, if all of their comments were a matter of public record, the morality police couldn't find an incriminating line or two to take out of context and use against him. Granted if it's an established pattern of thinking for the person, it's another story. For instance, when I first heard about Watson's comments, the first thing I thought was, "leave the poor guy alone. He's old and possible losing the ability to discern when he's among friends and when he needs to watch his step." But my genetics teacher, who knew the guy personally, says that Watson always said stuff like that, so maybe he deserves what he's getting. But really, if people can never loosen up and tell a few off color jokes, then we are living in a very uptight world indeed. Clearly a good skill to acquire is the ability to discern when you are among friends and when you are surrounded by ACLU types who are trying to crucify you. The med school second look would fall under the category of a place to keep all off color comments locked up. Best behavior only, and drink moderately, even if you can hold your liqueur.
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I don't feel comfortable repeating the comments, but it wasn't just one off-color comment. I believe he said someone on the admissions staff must be a _______ (insert incredibly derogatory term for someone who's homosexual), and made some other verbally hostile and threatening comments that really disturbed everyone who heard him. How this guy managed such a perfect interview is scary, but I'm actually glad the admissions committee decided to shelve the offer and give him a rejection instead. I certainly don't want anyone like that in my med school class. Do you? And trust me, I can let loose with the best of them, but I would never in a million years say anything like that no matter how much I had to drink. Those types of comments are indicative of a much deeper problem. At least, that's my opinion.
 
Phoenix. said:
I don't feel comfortable repeating the comments, but it wasn't just one off-color comment. I believe he said someone on the admissions staff must be a _______ (insert incredibly derogatory term for someone who's homosexual), and made some other verbally hostile and threatening comments that really disturbed everyone who heard him. How this guy managed such a perfect interview is scary, but I'm actually glad the admissions committee decided to shelve the offer and give him a rejection instead. I certainly don't want anyone like that in my med school class. Do you? And trust me, I can let loose with the best of them, but I would never in a million years say anything like that no matter how much I had to drink. Those types of comments are indicative of a much deeper problem. At least, that's my opinion.
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Yea, no one could say those things without actually meaning them.

Something a little off-color might have been unintentional or a joke, but repeated verbal abuse is completely unforgivable.

I've never "accidentally" dropped n-bombs or derogatory comments about homosexuals no matter how much I've consumed.
 
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Jolie South said:
Yea, no one could say those things without actually meaning them.

Something a little off-color might have been unintentional or a joke, but repeated verbal abuse is completely unforgivable.

I've never "accidentally" dropped n-bombs or derogatory comments about homosexuals no matter how much I've consumed.
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Well, I'm not going to second guess the school. They probably thought about all these things. They're not stupid, after all. But sometimes the level to which political correctness has permeated our culture is just plain scary. And that's pretty much all I can say about it, without having been there myself.
 
Kthanksbye said:
I don't know what he said, but what's a few horribly offensive comments among friends? There probably isn't a person alive for whom, if all of their comments were a matter of public record, the morality police couldn't find an incriminating line or two to take out of context and use against him. Granted if it's an established pattern of thinking for the person, it's another story. For instance, when I first heard about Watson's comments, the first thing I thought was, "leave the poor guy alone. He's old and possible losing the ability to discern when he's among friends and when he needs to watch his step." But my genetics teacher, who knew the guy personally, says that Watson always said stuff like that, so maybe he deserves what he's getting. But really, if people can never loosen up and tell a few off color jokes, then we are living in a very uptight world indeed. Clearly a good skill to acquire is the ability to discern when you are among friends and when you are surrounded by ACLU types who are trying to crucify you. The med school second look would fall under the category of a place to keep all off color comments locked up. Best behavior only, and drink moderately, even if you can hold your liqueur.
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Apples and oranges. In neither instance (the OP and the MIT incidents) was the person "among friends". They were in situations with people they barely knew and where they were making first impressions. If you want your first impression to be that you are an intolerant buffoon and/or terrible drunk, then by all means go around drinking more than you can handle, making off-color jokes, and using slurs - but don't be upset when you are treated as such.

I go to a school where we have students who think it's okay to use racial slurs around those who they think are "cool" and don't see anything wrong with it. Rest assured, the word gets around - you don't have to be of a certain color/sexual persuasion/gender to be offended. You'd be surprised at who has the ear of the administration, admission committee, and program directors.
 
Jolie South said:
Yea, no one could say those things without actually meaning them.

Something a little off-color might have been unintentional or a joke, but repeated verbal abuse is completely unforgivable.

I've never "accidentally" dropped n-bombs or derogatory comments about homosexuals no matter how much I've consumed.
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:thumbup: Alcohol may not be "truth serum", but somehow the vast majority of people can drink to excess without "accidentally" using slurs.
 
chaser08 said:
:thumbup: Alcohol may not be "truth serum", but somehow the vast majority of people can drink to excess without "accidentally" using slurs.
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I think some people have a very strong idea of how the world should be and they may or may not have a clear idea of what is socially acceptable. For someone who has strong opinions that are perhaps bigoted by everyone else's standards, it may be an effort for them to hide those opinions all the time, if they are even aware of the fact that most everyone else does not share their views. Since they firmly believe that they are right, they believe it is how the world should be anyway. So, when they let their guard down a little, they may start verbalizing those opinions and actually expect that most people will agree with them.
 
Kthanksbye said:
I think some people have a very strong idea of how the world should be and they may or may not have a clear idea of what is socially acceptable. For someone who has strong opinions that are perhaps bigoted by everyone else's standards, it may be an effort for them to hide those opinions all the time, if they are even aware of the fact that most everyone else does not share their views. Since they firmly believe that they are right, they believe it is how the world should be anyway. So, when they let their guard down a little, they may start verbalizing those opinions and actually expect that most people will agree with them.
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you're allowed to have views, but I feel like most people that respectfully disagree with certain lifestyles/issues aren't going to berate the people that practice them at a social function after drinking a few drinks.

this sounds like someone that is unbending and intolerant. if you can't respect someone else's views, then how are you going to deal with patients from different cultural backgrounds?
 
Jolie South said:
you're allowed to have views, but I feel like most people that respectfully disagree with certain lifestyles/issues aren't going to berate the people that practice them at a social function after drinking a few drinks.

this sounds like someone that is unbending and intolerant. if you can't respect someone else's views, then how are you going to deal with patients from different cultural backgrounds?
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Exactly. I'm just saying that some people may think that their opinions are so right that they can't understand why other people don't share them. These people will likely put their foot in their mouth when they go out in public. Imus could be an example, or Watson, or, here are a few that haven't been mentioned yet in this thread:

Geraldine Ferraro, who said publicly that if all blue states were to secede, all the talent in the country would go with them.

John Kerry, who implied that the soldiers in Iraq were there because they didn't stick to getting a good education.

For elitist types such as these, they may be so used to talking to people who agree with them, that they forget themselves in a broader audience and betray their own bigotry, which may be exactly what happened to this student.
 
Kthanksbye said:
Well, I'm not going to second guess the school. They probably thought about all these things. They're not stupid, after all. But sometimes the level to which political correctness has permeated our culture is just plain scary. And that's pretty much all I can say about it, without having been there myself.
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I generally agree with you, but feel that there's a time, place, and audience for expressing yourself and a second look weekend isn't the place to express those type of thoughts. People have their own private beliefs about things, and I would be lying if I said I didn't have my own set of prejudices and stereotypes as well. That's just the way the world works, and if people say they have no stereotypes of anything, they're not telling the truth as it's simply the way human beings think. That said, there's a difference between having thoughts and verbalizing them to people you don't even know that could use that information against you.
 
Kthanksbye said:
Exactly. I'm just saying that some people may think that their opinions are so right that they can't understand why other people don't share them. These people will likely put their foot in their mouth when they go out in public. Imus could be an example, or Watson, or, here are a few that haven't been mentioned yet in this thread:

Geraldine Ferraro, who said publicly that if all blue states were to secede, all the talent in the country would go with them.

John Kerry, who implied that the soldiers in Iraq were there because they didn't stick to getting a good education.

For elitist types such as these, they may be so used to talking to people who agree with them, that they forget themselves in a broader audience and betray their own bigotry, which may be exactly what happened to this student.
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I understand what you are saying, but the examples you sited were all said by sober people and so it can be construed that they believed what they were saying was acceptable. However, the OP's son knew that what he did was wrong/unacceptable. How do I know?

1. He immediately attempted to make an apology - before the offer was rescinded or any other indication of how the school felt was made known - and is still trying to do damage control. You would not do this if you somehow thought what you did was acceptable. For public figures as those you have mentioned, they may at times have to bow to political/social pressure and apologize for something they didn't think was wrong. But if a private citizen genuinely thought that what he did was acceptable, one would think that he would stick to his guns or not even understood what the big deal was.

2. He presumably did not use any of these slurs while sober, and therefore knew what was acceptable conversation. This wasn't a matter of innocently sticking his foot in his mouth. His inhibitions were down and he said what he really thought.

The fact of the matter is that this guy has poor judgment all around. Why would you insult a member of the admissions committee? Getting drunk at more than one event before you even start school? Using slurs in the midst of said group? None of this makes any sense. Slurs aside, this kid has a lot of growing up to do and no medical school has time to deal with that.
 
chaser08 said:
I understand what you are saying, but the examples you sited were all said by sober people and so it can be construed that they believed what they were saying was acceptable. However, the OP's son knew that what he did was wrong/unacceptable. How do I know?

1. He immediately attempted to make an apology - before the offer was rescinded or any other indication of how the school felt was made known - and is still trying to do damage control. You would not do this if you somehow thought what you did was acceptable. For public figures as those you have mentioned, they may at times have to bow to political/social pressure and apologize for something they didn't think was wrong. But if a private citizen genuinely thought that what he did was acceptable, one would think that he would stick to his guns or not even understood what the big deal was.

2. He presumably did not use any of these slurs while sober, and therefore knew what was acceptable conversation. This wasn't a matter of innocently sticking his foot in his mouth. His inhibitions were down and he said what he really thought.

The fact of the matter is that this guy has poor judgment all around. Why would you insult a member of the admissions committee? Getting drunk at more than one event before you even start school? Using slurs in the midst of said group? None of this makes any sense. Slurs aside, this kid has a lot of growing up to do and no medical school has time to deal with that.
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I agree with that. It's a hard way to learn his lesson, though.
 
Kthanksbye said:
Exactly. I'm just saying that some people may think that their opinions are so right that they can't understand why other people don't share them. These people will likely put their foot in their mouth when they go out in public. Imus could be an example, or Watson, or, here are a few that haven't been mentioned yet in this thread:

Geraldine Ferraro, who said publicly that if all blue states were to secede, all the talent in the country would go with them.

John Kerry, who implied that the soldiers in Iraq were there because they didn't stick to getting a good education.

For elitist types such as these, they may be so used to talking to people who agree with them, that they forget themselves in a broader audience and betray their own bigotry, which may be exactly what happened to this student.
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I don't know about talent, but most of the economy would go with them.
 
Drogba said:
I don't know about talent, but most of the economy would go with them.
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That just shows you don't know what drives the nations economy. Try to substantiate your comment. I dare you! Her comment was about as bigoted and unfounded as anything Watson said, it's just that no one will challenge her in a New York coffee shop. But then she aired it on national television, and it (rightly) pissed people off.
 
Kthanksbye said:
That just shows you don't know what drives the nations economy. Try to substantiate your comment. I dare you! Her comment was about as bigoted and unfounded as anything Watson said, it's just that no one will challenge her in a New York coffee shop. But then she aired it on national television, and it (rightly) pissed people off.
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I'm glad I already substantiated it privately before posting my initial comment, anticipating your doubt with extreme precision! There is an 800 million dollar difference in GDP between red and blue states including a 6k/capita difference. Obviously, the economy would be hard pressed to really function if any states seceded. However, the blue states are a bigger part of the US economy than the red ones even though they are less in number and population. BOOYA!
 
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