Royal Veterinary College (London)

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I was in their 2nd round of interviews and was accepted. I decided not to go there for a few reasons. The main reasons were financial and my husband needing to pick up his law career and just leave (that would be incredibly stupid) but mainly I really did not like their curriculum. I'm older and didn't want to be surrounded by 200 18 and 19 year old kids (no offense :rolleyes:), I didn't want to add an additional year (especially at OOS prices) and it just wasn't for me.

The interview was interesting...very socratic. They'd ask me a question then lead me to an answer, then lead to another, etc. Very different. Also, one of my interviewers answered and responded to not one, not two, but THREE text messages DURING my interview. Very rude to us but it's their culture.

They asked some specific questions and I just kept saying "I don't know." Better than trying to b.s. the people who know the answers!

I had a 3.35 GPA overall and science and last 45. Nothing great.

Overall it was an interesting experience and if I was younger and not married (and without 3 cats and a dog) I would definitely have considered it! Had I NOT gotten in to two schools in the States I would have definitely considered it. Good luck!

Why would vet school students start out at 18/19? And what is the curriculum like? Just wondering because I was thinking about RVC too.

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They can go into vet school right after high school there, more or less. I think the curriculum includes a lot of science courses that most of us take during our undergrad time as pre-reqs. So, the programs are often 5 years instead of 4. I'm sure someone else will elaborate more on this for you...
 
Yes, UK "high school" can graduate a student at either 16 or 18 depending on their leaving exams. They can then enter a college or university to do a degree program (3 years for a BA or BSc) or some type of technical, more vocationally based certificate. Of course, if you are going straight into vet school you need to have your A levels (kinda like our AP's) and then you go into a 5 year program. So anyway, that's why there are a lot of younger students. I went to an ag school in the midlands for a year after finishing my degree in California and it was the same thing: the college I went to had a bunch of vocational programs so there were actually SIXTEEN year olds living on campus with me.... yikes, it was definitely a little weird.

I inquired with RCVS about their "accelerated" program which is 4 years, and their reply was that they offer a place in an accelerated program to various students based on their impressions: you cannot apply directly into the accelerated program. I do know of several US students that were offered accelerated positions.

Also, my friend at Glasgow, was semi-recruited last year by RCVS on the basis of her GRE alone: out of the blue she (supposedly, although, i trust her!) got a letter from them with an offer of admission, and she had not actually applied there. The letter mentioned her rather impressive GRE score. Has anyone else heard of this happening, or had it happen to them??
 
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Wow. Thats...just wow. Sixteen? I couldn't imagine graduating last year... I didn't even my license. haha. That's crazy. Good for them... but crazy.

If they have 3 years of pre-vet and 5 years of vet?.. don't they finish in about the same time as US schools then? or is it 1 year pre and 5 years vet? Confused..
 
If they have 3 years of pre-vet and 5 years of vet?.. don't they finish in about the same time as US schools then? or is it 1 year pre and 5 years vet? Confused..

A vet degree there is a BVSc (Bachelor of Veterinary Science). It's 5 years after "high school" if they've taken their A levels.
 
Hey guys... I'm at RVC now, and I thought I'd clear up some confusion.

The UK is nothing like North America when it comes to their education system. If you look at it like equivalents to us, you'll just be confused. Basically, they do highschool until they're 16 and go on to do their A levels or B levels, depending on what they want to pursue. The first year they take 3 subjects, the second year they concentrate on 2. These 2 years are what they call College. Universities then use their A or B level grades for acceptances.

I can tell you now that you will find that some of the Brits don't want it as much as you do, or have worked as hard for it, but you're coming into their country and culture and it's just something you have to accept. Ideally you're returning home for the most part, right? All the international students are older, and vets aren't doctors in England. That does not mean, however that you cannot be Dr. Whoever when you go back to your city of origin. RVC is AVMA accredited, so you can write your licensing at home the same way a local grad would.

The degree is in fact Bachelor of Veterinary Medicine, BVetMed. You will never be a "DVM" by degree, however it is the exact same thing. There have been some issues with funding from US or Canada because of the program being a "bachelor" program, but it's an easy fix -- you can have the RVC write a letter saying it's the equivalent to post-grad back home.

I was shocked at how different England actually was from Canada when I got here, but you settle in and just appreciate the differences. You can choose to mix in with, or separate from your 18 year old colleagues, but they are smart kids. It's just different, and going out of country, you have to be able to accept different.

I hope I've cleared some stuff up... feel free to contact me if you have any questions. There aren't many RVC students on this forum.

Cheers, guys.

PS - About the 4 year program -- there are currently no International students in the 4 year BVetMed program as they just started opening it up for us this year. I can get you in touch with someone currently in it if you want to ask some questions. Basically, you do years 1 and 2 all in one year. It's intense, jam packed with material and with less lectures than the 5 year program. I'm not trying to say it's a bad thing by any means -- but I know that I would've liked to be able to apply, however once I've seen what their year was like, I personally am glad that I'm in the 5 year. You get more free time and to be honest, you wouldn't want to spend 4 years in England without the time to travel.. It's just something to think about. Not getting the 4 year is definitely not a bad thing!
 
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I can tell you now that you will find that some of the Brits don't want it as much as you do, or have worked as hard for it, but you're coming into their country and culture and it's just something you have to accept.

Would you say, then, that they're at all appreciative/considerate of your personal drive to practice vet med in the application process??? Since I'll have to justify my GPA I was hoping to work that angle somehow with my experiences...

Also about the acceptance based on GRE, their site says that they don't even require them. So would they still be looking at the scores? Can they DO that? In other words, I guess, if I'm applying but decide to not send them my scores, can they look them up somehow anyway? Just curious.

:D

Thanks all. :)
 
Why would vet school students start out at 18/19? And what is the curriculum like? Just wondering because I was thinking about RVC too.

They don't require "undergrad" in the UK-- this is their form of "undergrad". That's why it's called the BVetMed. Most of their home students are 18/19 years old.

Like I said before, FOR ME this was not the right place. Had I not gotten in to my IS school (or anywhere in the States) I most likely would have gone- and would have enjoyed it and learned a lot.

Sorry this is so long but I couldn't upload it and don't have the time to separate it. Their website didn't have any information about curriculum that I could find.

BVETMED CURRICULUM

.What is so special about the BVetMed curriculum at the RVC?.

.In 2007 the RVC launched a radical new curriculum for the professional degree programme, the Bachelor of Veterinary Medicine (BVetMed). The College has always prided itself on providing a course that offers a wide range of stimulating teaching and learning methods designed to equip you for a fulfilling career in veterinary medicine. Now, with the added strength of the only Centre for Excellence in Teaching and Learning in a British veterinary school, we have taken a fresh look at how we can bring together the best elements of technological change, clinical and scientific progress, and best practice in teaching methods. The result is a degree programme that will equip you for a variety of careers in the veterinary professions over the course of your lifetime..

.We have made a number of changes starting this year. One of the most important is that we have reduced the amount of detail that students are expected to cover. Scientific and veterinary knowledge has exploded in the last few years, and you can't hope to learn more than a fraction of what might come in useful one day. What you can do, though, is to achieve a thorough understanding of the key concepts and essential facts that form the basis of veterinary science and medicine, ..and develop vital problem-solving, clinical reasoning and communication skills. .

.Programme content.
.As the only veterinary school in England accredited by both the US and European authorities, we provide a curriculum that meets all the requirements laid down by the American Veterinary Medical Association and the Veterinary Directives of the European Union. The programme is designed to help you acquire:.

  • .an understanding of the basic biological principles of normal body function and disease.
  • .the ability to distinguish the pathological from the normal.
  • .the ability to prevent disease and safely manage the processes of animal production.
  • .the expertise to diagnose and treat disease and alleviate suffering.
  • .the professional skills you need to work and communicate effectively with your colleagues and the public.

.We teach the curriculum from a comparative perspective. We use only one or two species - primarily the dog - to teach many aspects of the basic and clinical sciences, but we teach so that you will learn principles that can be applied to other common species. In the more clinical teaching later in the course much of the teaching will focus on common cases that you would encounter in veterinary practice, and on cases that will help you to understand the most important clinical principles. Teaching of Special Species (exotics, wildlife, birds, fish etc) is integrated into the mainstream teaching of body systems. .

.Veterinary medicine is first and foremost a scientific discipline, and you will not get very far as a veterinarian without a sound grasp of the scientific theory underpinning veterinary practice. But wherever possible the science will be presented in the context of its clinical relevance, so you have a clear understanding of where it all leads. .

.The classroom-based teaching during the first three and a half years is organised into ten "Strands". Seven of these focus on major body systems, which will normally be encountered three times, so that your knowledge of the system steadily increases and consolidates. The seven systems are:.
·.Locomotor.
·.Skin.
·.Cardiovascular and Respiratory.
·.Neurology and Special Senses.
·.Endocrine.
·.Alimentary.
·.Urogenital .

.The other Strands, which occur throughout the course, are:.
·.Principles of Veterinary Science.
·.Professional Studies.
·.Public Health and Population Medicine.

.Your first two years will be spent mainly at our London Campus, with visits to Hertfordshire for lectures and practicals in animal health and handling. You will study the healthy animal in its normal environment and acquire basic skills in handling and examining horses, farm animals and companion animals. The basic veterinary sciences are taught in an integrated manner on a body systems basis, with the clinical relevance of the sciences highlighted at every stage. But we also showcase some of the stimulating stories that have inspired scientists at the RVC and elsewhere in their quest to push back the frontiers of knowledge..

.You will undertake a minimum of twelve weeks Animal Husbandry ExtraMural Studies (AHEMS) during your first two years, giving you an opportunity to tackle real-life problems in a variety of settings such as dairy and sheep farms, stables, kennels and catteries. The first year's work includes three weeks' lambing during your Easter vacation. At some stage during Years One and Two, you must spend two weeks at a dairy cattle farm, two weeks at a pig farm and two weeks working with horses. Four weeks may be spent working with an animal of your choice. You may spend up to six weeks on overseas AHEMS, an opportunity that is particularly valuable if you are planning on going into Farm Animal practice in the USA after you graduate. .

.The third year and the first half of the fourth year are spent at the Hertfordshire Campus. This phase provides the framework of knowledge and basic practical skills relating to the pathology of disease, diagnosis, prognosis, and medical and surgical therapy necessary for you to participate fully in clinical practice at the RVC and in private veterinary practice. Detailed consideration of specific diseases is based on integrated teaching of individual body systems, building on the material learnt during the first two years. During the Third and Fourth Years, you will spend increasing amounts of time in the College's state-of-the-art Clinical Skills Centre, the first of its kind in the UK, practising a wide range of clinical skills under expert guidance. The Clinical Skills Centre has been inaugurated so that you can learn essential skills in a "safe" setting where no animal can be harmed, meaning that you will already have started to develop many of the skills essential for practice when you start your clinical placements..

.In your third year you will begin Clinical Extra Mural Studies (EMS). To progress to Year Four, you will need to have spent eleven weeks at a variety of veterinary practices. In total, you must complete 26 weeks of Clinical EMS within this final three-year timeframe, via a balanced programme of placements at general veterinary practices, specialist veterinary centres, the State Veterinary Service, research institutes and, as importantly, at the Veterinary Laboratories Agency (VLA). One week must be spent studying meat hygiene in an abattoir. Up to nine of your 26 weeks of Clinical EMS may be spent overseas, which provides another good opportunity to prepare for practice back in the USA..

.From the mid-point of the Fourth Year onwards, most of your remaining time will be spent gaining hands-on experience in RVC clinics (IntraMural Rotations: IMR). IMR covers the following areas:.

  • .Small animal medicine, surgery and emergency critical care. This is based in the Queen Mother Hospital for Animals (the QMH - Europe's largest small animal hospital), the Beaumont Animals' Hospital (BAH) and other major hospitals in the London area. Apart from the emergency service, the heavy caseload at the QMH comprises secondary and tertiary referral cases, whilst the BAH is a first opinion clinic and it is here that you will gain extensive experience of spaying and neutering..
  • .Equine medicine and surgery, based in the Sefton Equine Hospital and our equine practice. The Equine Hospital specialises in referral work (both medicine and surgery) whilst the equine practice provides a first opinion service..
  • .Farm animal medicine and surgery, reproduction and herd health investigation undertaken on our farm, in our farm animal practice and at specialist practices in other parts of the UK under the guidance of RVC staff.
  • .Pathology, including training in our diagnostic laboratories and veterinary surveillance centre.

.During this year, you will also spend eight weeks devising and executing a research project on an aspect of veterinary science that interests you. Self-motivation is key here, but a supervisor will be assigned to provide support and advice..

.Specialisation.
.All UK veterinary graduates are required to have acquired basic competence in all the species (companion animals, food animals, equines) most commonly encountered in veterinary practice. However, we recognise that most students have a particular preference, so in the new curriculum we have created more opportunities for students to gain further knowledge and experience with their preferred species, both through additional time in more advanced classes, and through supplementary clinical rotations. You may also have the opportunity for more advanced study of other topics that particularly interest you, such as work with exotic species, anaesthesia, reproduction, or veterinary entrepreneurship, in the Final Year. We are also working on the possibility of introducing choice into the work that you do in the last few weeks of the Second Year..

.Teaching and Learning in the BVetMed .
.We have always provided a course that offers a wide range of stimulating teaching and learning methods. Now, with the support of our Centre for Excellence in Teaching and Learning, we are introducing a number of techniques that are new to the RVC. .

.Most lectures have been timetabled early in the week, with usually no more that two lectures per day. In the new curriculum you will spend less time in the classroom, giving you more time to really master the material you need to learn. Lectures will be followed by timetabled Private Study Sessions, usually eight hours per week. The remainder of the week will comprise a mixture of practicals, dissections, academic tutorials, Integrated Structure and Function (ISF) tutorials using live animals, and Directed Learning (DL), which aim to help you consolidate and apply your knowledge. .

.We will help you to monitor how well you are learning the material by using the handheld voting systems that we have introduced in the lecture theatres on both campuses this year. .

.On many Fridays you will be offered the opportunity for self-evaluation of your knowledgeusing computer-based MCQs, which will offer immediate feedback on why your chosen answer may be wrong, offer a further hint to the correct answer for a repeat attempt at the question, and quote a reference so that you can extend your knowledge through further study. This feedback is designed to help you assess how you are coping with the demands of the course, and meeting our expectations. Should you encounter problems with learning, support is available through our Learning Support Officers as well as the tutorial system..

.The tutorial system has been completely revamped this year. You will meet monthly in groups of six for an hour with an academic tutor, and besides reflecting on your learning in broad terms, you may be asked to discuss your understanding of one of the topics from the previous month's classes; discuss a hot scientific topic that you have been asked to research and think about in advance; or there may be an occasional journal club. These groups will also be a route for learning through sharing of experiences, successes or problems. .

.There are three terms a year in the early years of the course, and they normally last for between 8 and 11 weeks, including examination periods. The Spring Term is usually the shortest, to allow adequate time for practical experience on sheep farms during the lambing season. Placements generally take place during vacation periods, except in the Final Year when each student has an individualised and continuous programme of internal and external clinical rotations, interspersed with research blocks and vacations..

.Although the class size is between 220 and 240 students, you will only be together in formal lectures. In all other teaching formats - tutorials, dissections, clinical rotations, groupwork - you will be divided into much smaller groups, often only four to six students..

.Examinations.
.The BVetMed is very demanding and there are rigorous examinations throughout the five-year programme. Like the other veterinary programmes in the UK, there is an opportunity to retake each examination. However, a student who fails an examination twice is usually required to withdraw from the College, unless an appeal panels accepts that there are convincing mitigating circumstances. .

.Graduation and Licensure.
.You will be entitled to practice as a veterinarian in the UK as soon as you have earned your BVetMed degree and registered as a Member of the Royal College of Veterinary Surgeons. The American Veterinary Medical Association (AVMA) will recognise your degree as equivalent to those awarded by veterinary colleges in the United States. The RVC is the only English veterinary school accredited by the AVMA, and this gives you a real advantage. Some of the USA's major veterinary employers recruit actively among our Final Year students. The College runs a revision class for students who are preparing for their NAVLE, drawing on the expertise of the many Board Certified clinical faculty with experience in North America. .
 
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Starlene, "RCVS" is not equivalent to "RVC". RCVS is the Royal College of Veterinary Surgeons. This is the governing body of veterinary medicine in the UK: similar to AVMA in the US, but possibly with a bit more authority - you must be "MRCVS" (member of RCVS) to practice in the UK, but you don't have to be a member of the AVMA to practice in the USA. "RVC" is the Royal Veterinary College (London), one of the several UK veterinary schools. I assume you meant RVC in the following paragraphs?

I'm an American alumna of Uni. of Glasgow and was just confused by your message.

Yes, UK "high school" can graduate a student at either 16 or 18 depending on their leaving exams. They can then enter a college or university to do a degree program (3 years for a BA or BSc) or some type of technical, more vocationally based certificate. Of course, if you are going straight into vet school you need to have your A levels (kinda like our AP's) and then you go into a 5 year program. So anyway, that's why there are a lot of younger students. I went to an ag school in the midlands for a year after finishing my degree in California and it was the same thing: the college I went to had a bunch of vocational programs so there were actually SIXTEEN year olds living on campus with me.... yikes, it was definitely a little weird.

I inquired with RCVS about their "accelerated" program which is 4 years, and their reply was that they offer a place in an accelerated program to various students based on their impressions: you cannot apply directly into the accelerated program. I do know of several US students that were offered accelerated positions.

Also, my friend at Glasgow, was semi-recruited last year by RCVS on the basis of her GRE alone: out of the blue she (supposedly, although, i trust her!) got a letter from them with an offer of admission, and she had not actually applied there. The letter mentioned her rather impressive GRE score. Has anyone else heard of this happening, or had it happen to them??
 
Would you say, then, that they're at all appreciative/considerate of your personal drive to practice vet med in the application process??? Since I'll have to justify my GPA I was hoping to work that angle somehow with my experiences...

Also about the acceptance based on GRE, their site says that they don't even require them. So would they still be looking at the scores? Can they DO that? In other words, I guess, if I'm applying but decide to not send them my scores, can they look them up somehow anyway? Just curious.


They won't even look at your GRE scores... I wrote my MCAT and they didn't require the scores and therefore didn't look at them. Um.. About the appreciative part... I guess it depends on who you're talking to. They don't understand our education system any more than we understand theirs, and therefore they're just plain shocked that we're so "old", entering and then graduating from RVC. It's just different, that's all.

Just make sure you have an amazing personal statement.. forget about your GRE and chalk it up to a good life experience. Sucks that you wrote it and they don't require it, but such is life.

Hope this helps?


And Cindy, thanks for that message about the person talking about RCVS, I was slightly confused as well.

Cheers!
 
::Bump::

Maybe this'll bring out some more RVC students/grads... I've just been accepted and am trying to make a decision between RVC and Glasgow, which'll be dependent on a couple of things-

1. I got the definite feeling in my interview that my interviewers were, um,... LESS than impressed, shall we say, with Americans in general. Is this the general consensus over there? I mean I know we're nobody's favorite, but... I just don't want to live somewhere for 5 years where i'll feel uncomfortable/looked down on/possibly prejudiced against, even... (Just some stuff I've heard)

2. They made it seem like it was virtually impossible to find housing that would allow you to have dogs. Is this really the case? My fiance will be coming with me and, honestly, I don't think we will end up going if we can't eventually find a place to live that will accept dogs.

3. How did you secure your funding before applying for your Visa??? I'm a little confused as to how this process works, and I haven't gotten any information in the mail yet...

If anyone knows anything about these, it'd be a reeeally big help to me!
Thanx! :D
 
I got the "less than impressed" impression from them too. I think you will experience some level of anti-americanism anywhere you go outside the US, Glasgow included. My interviewer mentioned that "the American students are highly variable, some very bright and others less competent" and he said there's a high degree of variability among the British student as well. I don't think the professors or people in general will be prejudiced against you. If they were, they wouldn't be accepting you into their program. Sometimes Brits come off as dry and stern, because some just are that way, but I would not base your perception of London or England as a whole off of the two interviewers you had. I really wouldn't worry about this issue. In my experience, the UK has a far less degree of anti-american sentiment than the rest of Europe (eh-hem..France...;)

I think it may be difficult to find a place in Zone 1 (central London) that allows pets. However, if you opt to stay in Zone 2, you will have cheaper rent and should be able to find some places that allow pets. Plenty of people living in London have pets, otherwise RVC wouldn't have much of a caseload. So yeah, it is possible. Zone 2 could still put you pretty close to school. I would suggest Kentish Town or somewhere near Chalk Farm. That's where some of the RVC housing is anyway. They are nice, safe areas.

(btw, the way you worded #2 really made it sound like your fiance is a dog!! LOL)

I don't really know what you mean by #3. So that's about all I can offer on these issues. I'm sure there's some RVC students who know more...
 
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a HA ha HA ha...I didn't even realize I had worded it that way!!!
Sorry, he's not a dog at all- what I meant to say was that he's so in love with our dog, I don't think i'll be able to convince him to move unless or dog can come with.

That's pretty funny, though... :D

And thank you for all your responses- I had just heard some scary stories of how people felt they were treated abroad. But you're right- i'm sure it's the exception, rather than the rule.

Thanks! :love:
 
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Any thoughts from current RVC students on College Grove housing? It seems to be a viable option for the 1st year, while looking for something more permanent for years 2-5.

pyxystyx, we seem to be in precisely the same boat - Glasgow vs. RVC. May I ask what you're factoring into your decision? I'm thinking that the curriculum at RVC may be a little closer to the PBL structure at Western, Cornell, or the bit they have at Tufts. Glasgow maybe a little more didactic?

i'm sort of leaning towards RVC right now, but i keep vacillating (or oscillating?). I know London well, Glasgow less so - but at this point, is it about a new experience, or a place to settle in quickly so that one can focus on studies?

feel free to PM if you'd rather not discuss on forum. :)
 
I'm beginning to think there are no current RVC students active on this forum....think we're on our own.

But when I visited, I saw the college grove housing inside and out. It was pretty nice. You get your own room and bathroom and share a kitchen with a few others. Everything looked clean and modern. It is a decent price too. I think if I go though I want to do private accomodation because I may want to get away from school. The College grove halls are right next door. There are other houses that are about a 20 min walk from the college in Kentish Town also.

I would suggest having a look at gumtree.com. There are tons of flats for rent all over london listed on the website.
 
Glasgow vs RVC? hey! thats me too!
 
Mistofelles, jellytea- I guess we're all in the same boat!
I have to admit, I am/was leaning more towards RVC.

Some of my considerations:
RVC was my #1 from the start- but then after my interviews, I felt more comfortable with the people from Glasgow.
I have one friend at Glasgow right now, and another person from my school who'll be going next year. I don't know anyone in London.
My SO was waaay more comfortable with his job prospects in London as opposed to Scotland, but now he's just told me he might not make it with me for the first year, even if it's in London. He's really pushing me to wait another year and re-apply to UC Davis (my IS). We're getting married this summer, and I can't imagine starting off our marriage continents apart for who-knows-how-long. :( BUT,... I applied to these schools for a reason, because I've always wanted to take the adventure studying abroad.

Honestly,... I'm completely torn! Got zero sleep last night...
what are you guys thinking?

Hopefulvet, I would be doing off-campus private housing as well. I'm really nervous about it. Are you looking mostly in the Kentish Town/Camden area? How early are you really going to start looking?
 
Pyxystx,
It may be a bit early to be looking right now, but have a browse through gumtree.com just to see what's out there. You may have a little trouble finding a place that allows pets, but you will not have trouble finding affordable off-campus housing. There's constantly turnover all over the place, and there are tons of new posts on that website every day. I actually did start looking and have almost solidified a SWEET off campus housing flat. I almost want to just pick RVC because this flat is such an amazing deal. I'd also suggest posting an ad offering you and your SO as potential flatmates on gumtree. I did that and got lots of responses within a few days.

I am just getting so worried about vet school in general. I am so stressed out about making the right decision. My heart says to go to RVC, but I think my mind says no...If my decision was between glasgow and RVC, I think I would choose RVC personally. If you're in this for the "abroad" experience, I think London has better access to all over Europe because it has more airports and trains, etc. Coming from someone who studied abroad in London, it's something you do not want to miss out on!
 
I'd like to get my official acceptance pack from RVC, and then I'll be much more comfortable making a decision. I'm a little old to live with roommates, so it's either a single in College Grove, or my SO moves with me (which she can't do 1st year) - unless I get really lucky with housing somewhere.

I'm not so concerned with getting away from school - I'm very used to endless hours at the library. :)
 
i'm still waiting on davis, but am torn about glasgow vs rvc. Before I got my acceptance to RVC, I was more set on going to Glasgow jsut because I have a friend in vet school there and have met 2 doctors who went there as well. I havnt met any in the rvc curriculum or who has graduated from there so don't know very much about the school. I'm a little concerned with rvc's new curriculum that seems similar to that of westerns (problem based learning). I don't know about learning all that material on my own, without formal lectures and someone to give you and teach you the information you need. I feel that the staff and students at glasgow are more welcoming as well. Has anyone seen both facilities? Are they comparable? Good sized, comfortable classrooms?
 
where did you read/hear of this new curriculum? I haven't heard anything about a new curriculum...
 
well i asked about the curriculum when i was at my interview and that's what I was told. THey recently made a change in their teaching style. My interviewer said that they are straying away from classroom/lecture time and having more group/pbl sessions.

Edit: I was reading the post carrbear posted earlier and it explains more about the curriculum. At first I thought these group sessions were students learning on their own but it looks like they are directed by a professor.

Teaching and Learning in the BVetMed
.We have always provided a course that offers a wide range of stimulating teaching and learning methods. Now, with the support of our Centre for Excellence in Teaching and Learning, we are introducing a number of techniques that are new to the RVC. .

.Most lectures have been timetabled early in the week, with usually no more that two lectures per day. In the new curriculum you will spend less time in the classroom, giving you more time to really master the material you need to learn. Lectures will be followed by timetabled Private Study Sessions, usually eight hours per week. The remainder of the week will comprise a mixture of practicals, dissections, academic tutorials, Integrated Structure and Function (ISF) tutorials using live animals, and Directed Learning (DL), which aim to help you consolidate and apply your knowledge. .

.We will help you to monitor how well you are learning the material by using the handheld voting systems that we have introduced in the lecture theatres on both campuses this year. .

.On many Fridays you will be offered the opportunity for self-evaluation of your knowledgeusing computer-based MCQs, which will offer immediate feedback on why your chosen answer may be wrong, offer a further hint to the correct answer for a repeat attempt at the question, and quote a reference so that you can extend your knowledge through further study. This feedback is designed to help you assess how you are coping with the demands of the course, and meeting our expectations. Should you encounter problems with learning, support is available through our Learning Support Officers as well as the tutorial system..

.The tutorial system has been completely revamped this year. You will meet monthly in groups of six for an hour with an academic tutor, and besides reflecting on your learning in broad terms, you may be asked to discuss your understanding of one of the topics from the previous month's classes; discuss a hot scientific topic that you have been asked to research and think about in advance; or there may be an occasional journal club. These groups will also be a route for learning through sharing of experiences, successes or problems. .

.There are three terms a year in the early years of the course, and they normally last for between 8 and 11 weeks, including examination periods. The Spring Term is usually the shortest, to allow adequate time for practical experience on sheep farms during the lambing season. Placements generally take place during vacation periods, except in the Final Year when each student has an individualised and continuous programme of internal and external clinical rotations, interspersed with research blocks and vacations..

.Although the class size is between 220 and 240 students, you will only be together in formal lectures. In all other teaching formats - tutorials, dissections, clinical rotations, groupwork - you will be divided into much smaller groups, often only four to six students..
 
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good info, thanks!

what's your impression of it? Do you think it's good/bad/both?
 
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i have a question about the finances about studying in the UK. London's tuition is $37,430/year but the tuition in pounds is 19,320. With the exchange rate right now at about 1.4 or 1.5 it comes out to be around $29,000 whick is almost $10,000 more. For glasgow, the tuition for US students is just 18,750 pounds which with the exchange rate is only about $28,125. Am i missing something? Does the exchange rate fluctuate a lot? Is it really going to about about $10,000 cheaper to go to scotland?
 
heya,

i'm trying to decide between RVC and Edinburgh (while also waiting to hear back from Davis.)

Can I ask, why did you all choose to apply to Glascow over Edinburgh?
 
London's tuition is $37,430/year but the tuition in pounds is 19,320. With the exchange rate right now at about 1.4 or 1.5 it comes out to be around $29,000 whick is almost $10,000 more.

I was wondering why it's so much more myself. I figured, probably easier to get their funds from our US loans if it's just done in dollars, but... maybe they grossly over-estimate just to cover themselves, in case of a huge swing in the currency exchange? Or maybe just another way to get $$, i dunno...

WildVet, I applied to Glasgow because i have a friend there, and because I'd heard it was less "touristey" than the capital city. Just me personally. :D
 
I asked about this in an email to the college a few months ago. The fee quoted for international students on the RVC website does not apply to US students. They put the fee at a fixed US dollar amount to help US students plan finances and loans for their education. The exchange rate for the pound: dollar right now is the lowest its ever been. Usually it is about $2=1 pound. So although Glasgow is cheaper right now, in a year or two, the exchange rate could easily change. When I was in London last semester, the exchange rate started at about 1.95 and went down to 1.46 over the course of 2 months. Of course this was largely due to the economic crash, but the exchange rate can change a lot in a short amount of time. So I actually think RVC is making it better for US students by charging a tuition rate that is comparable to most OOS tuition costs. If you're planning finances, I definitely would not count on the current exchange rate to stick around for very long.
 
I was talking to a British friend I have and he thinks I shouldn't go to London for school. He said in his opinion, the quality of the education in the US would be better. Granted, he really doesn't know anything about vet med or comparisons between schools, but he just said that's his opinion. I am totally confused by this, especially because he is British himself :confused: If that is really the case, which from everything I've heard and read it is not, then I don't think I could really justify going there...

For those of you accepted to a US school as well, would you choose staying here over the RVC, strictly based on academic quality?
 
I was talking to a British friend I have and he thinks I shouldn't go to London for school. He said in his opinion, the quality of the education in the US would be better. Granted, he really doesn't know anything about vet med or comparisons between schools, but he just said that's his opinion. I am totally confused by this, especially because he is British himself :confused: If that is really the case, which from everything I've heard and read it is not, then I don't think I could really justify going there...

For those of you accepted to a US school as well, would you choose staying here over the RVC, strictly based on academic quality?

Based on what I've read, and discussions I've had with folks who have studied education for a living, the model that RVC uses fits very well with what we know about how we (as a collective species, not speaking to individuals) learn. The idea of an integrative systems based approach, learning things multiple times, and adding layers of detail each time you pass through, is very enticing.

In terms of quality of education . . . there's so much cross-continental exchange in academia (i.e., there are US academics in Europe and vice-versa, much of the biochemical research is Japanese and Chinese, South America is a major center of anesthesia research) that I think you'll find high quality professors no matter where you go.

In the end, I think it boils down to the environment you'll feel most comfortable in. For myself, a curriculum that integrates large lecture but spends a lot of time in small group/self study sounds very similar to my post-bacc pre-vet program, which I thrived in. My only US option is Tufts (alternate), which is a very clear didactic learning (with some small group PBL and small section labs) setup, which I would probably be fine with, but not be quite as happy. And I would probably not at all enjoy the approach at Western, which eschews almost all traditional learning structure (from what I've heard).

In summary . . . I wouldn't worry too much about quality. :)
 
Thanks Mistoffeles. I'm not sure if that's a learning style I could really thrive in. I don't know how I would tell. It sounds like it would work really well...but I guess I can't know until I try. All through undergrad I've usually been in large lectures and done all the learning on my own. I guess it would be good to be in small groups because half the time I just zone out in lectures and it becomes a waste of time. When I get together with friends to study for a test in a small group its usually very helpful, so I think RVC's approach would work well for me. I'm just hesitant because it's not something I'm used to and I'm uncertain about it...
 
if I may ask, where in NY are you from? I'm from Brooklyn, but contrary to the stereotype of over-sized classes, I've been lucky enough to be in "gifted" programs for most of my educational career, where small classes (no more than 25 or so) were the norm.

The only exception, where I had large lectures, was college - at William and Mary, where despite the relatively small student body, most of the classes were large lecture . . . and I didn't do very well at all. However, in my music classes (mostly 20 people or so) and my upper-division sociology classes (7-10 people), I excelled.

As a further point (not to be pushy, just to try and help you ;)), if you remember the first time you tried to learn a foreign language, you (probably) took the approach that RVC does. For example, they teach you how to say hello, goodbye, about the colors, etc. Then you learn about verbs with simple endings. But, that's not the last time you learn about verbs - there are multiple tenses, and each time you pass through the verbs, you get exposed to another layer of their rules. If that worked for you, then I suspect you'd do very well with the RVC model.

This is all said in light of getting my acceptance letter yesterday (finally!!). In particular, the part about "multiple examination methods . . . including essay papers, problem-solving, multiple-choice papers, practicals and orals." For people who have spent an academic career memorizing large numbers of facts, writing an essay in the sciences can be daunting. I remember my microbiology class three semesters ago - the professor gave exams that were almost all essay based, and it took a lot of students 2 exams or so before they were truly comfortable. Or my biochemistry class, where the professor was interested in our ability to comprehend the flow of "information" (be it ATP, billirubin, PEP, etc.) through the system, and what the implications were for the organic whole, and less so with memorizing every single intermediate in a pathway (although he didn't complain if you put that information in your answer).

And, for many US students not in Masters or PhD programs, the oral exam is completely foreign. Unless they've studied an instrument (where a jury is somewhat like an oral/practical exam), done an honors thesis, or taken flight training (where the FAA has an oral component to the licensure exam).

Geez. Rambling on now. I think I might be trying to convince myself that *I'll* do well at RVC. :D
 
Mistoffeles, thanks again. That wasn't a ramble, you made some really good points. You did remind me that here at NYU our language classes are small (about 10 students) and I've gotten straight A's through 4 semesters of Italian. That's the only time I've also done an oral exam, and I did well. Obviously learning a language is different than science, but I do feel a bit better about it. I also have written essay tests in science before. I did it for Immunology, Virology, and Biochemistry. And I did well in all those too. Even if I'm not adjusting well, everyone I've talked to there says the professors are very helpful, especially for international students.

I'm not actually from NY, I'm from north jersey, but I've been living here for a while now in Manhattan. By the way, you went to William and Mary!! That's cool! I applied there and didn't get in, you must be really smart to have been accepted there! Maybe you can just be my private tutor if we go to RVC together!;)
 
And, for many US students not in Masters or PhD programs, the oral exam is completely foreign. Unless they've studied an instrument (where a jury is somewhat like an oral/practical exam), done an honors thesis, or taken flight training (where the FAA has an oral component to the licensure exam).

Or unless you've done some FFA team livestock judging. Each competition usually has an oral "justifications" portion, where you have to justify your placing of each animal.
Not that I did FFA... but wish I did. :)

Mistoffeles, you finally got your letter in the mail?!?! Was it a big packet? Ugh,... i just want as much information as possible!! :p
 
Mistoffeles, you finally got your letter in the mail?!?! Was it a big packet? Ugh,... i just want as much information as possible!! :p

I did, yesterday. It was an A4 size envelope, which came via Royal Mail Airsure, dated 3/13/2009 - so 5 days transit time. It contained the official offer from Margaret Kilyon, a welcome letter from Dr. Nigel Goode, who is the admissions tutor, and a "health questionnaire," which you may use to disclose any disabilities (i.e., need extra time for exams) up front.

The letters discuss the structure of the program in broad detail (first semester is basic histology and anatomy, terms two and three are systems based integration in anatomy, physiology, biochemistry, pharmacology, along with introduction to animal handling). Second year is cardiovascular, respiratory, urinary, reproductive, endocrine, locomotor, plus immunology and introductory pathology. Years 3 and 4 are pathology, medicine, surgery, and clinical theory. Year 5 has no lectures.

It also discussed that North American students sometimes need a semester to get adjusted to the British teaching and examination method, which is why Term 1 is so light.

The timetables, schedules, as well as textbook lists, and housing information, are all forwarded to you once you have accepted the offer, although Margaret is happy to answer questions (within reason, I'm sure).

I'm seriously leaning towards this program. :)
 
So I got a reply back on some of my questions by one of the student contacts at RVC. I can't say it was all what I wanted to hear, but she was very honest and helpful. She said she doesn't like the testing at all and is very frustrated with their grading. She said it is very hard to adjust to it and it is one of the things she really doesn't like about the school. However, she said there is no competition at all, everyone gets along, and there is a great community. She also said that if she got an acceptance here like I did, she probably would have taken it. She said the facilities at RVC are a bit lacking. She also said she is happy with her decision though and that her year is somewhat of a guinea pig and that there are huge improvments already. She thinks by the time I got there it would be much, much better.

On the other hand, another RVC student who is a 3rd year got back to me also and had only good things to say about the school. She said she went to a vet student symposium or something over break and was talking to some UPenn students. She said they had hardly any hands-on experience at all, while she had already done spays and neuters and lambing, etc. She went to UPenn for undergrad and said she applied only to RVC because she wanted to study abroad again mainly. She said although there's a lot of work, she feels a lot less stress at RVC and not feeling like you're being competed with constantly has really made things worthwhile.

I guess it completely depends on the person you are if you will like it there, which is making this decision even harder! I guess I'd get mixed opinions from students at any school though. I think I equally weigh being in an education style I can adapt well to and going to a school in a location and community I would love. So I reallyyyy don't know what to do...hopefully my interview at Penn tomorrow will go well and help me decide.:shrug:
 
Did she say specifically why she thinks the facilities are lacking? From what I've heard/seen they seem to be on top of things and have new learning centers, etc. I seriously have no idea what I'm going to do. Does anyone know when we have to notify them if we are attending or not? Has anyone else received a welcome packet because I have not yet. Thanks for all the info!
 
Does anyone know when we have to notify them if we are attending or not? Has anyone else received a welcome packet because I have not yet. Thanks for all the info!

May 1st is the date for them to have your acceptance of the offer and your US$1500 deposit.
 
Thanks! May 1st sounds a lot better than April 15th...I've got some soul searching (and major financial planning) to do until then!
 
Did she say specifically why she thinks the facilities are lacking? From what I've heard/seen they seem to be on top of things and have new learning centers, etc. I seriously have no idea what I'm going to do. Does anyone know when we have to notify them if we are attending or not? Has anyone else received a welcome packet because I have not yet. Thanks for all the info!

She didn't say specifically why. I have only seen the Camden campus, which I thought was really nice. I've toured Edinburgh, Tufts, and Penn now, and I definitely think RVC is up to par if not better than all of those as far as classrooms and laboratories go. Has anyone toured the Queen Mother Hospital? I wish I could have seen it while I was there.

If anyone's curious, I found some rather interesting videos on youtube of RVC. Here's the link:
http://www.youtube.com/user/RoyalVetsLondon?gl=GB&hl=en-GB

If you keep clicking around you can even watch a video of "Mr. RVC" :laugh: strange, but funny.
 
I'm getting so excited about the prospect of going to RVC!!! I'm really leaning towards it.

I desperately need to research info. on loans- even if I get the max. in Federal, it's still not going to cover it. Plus I know there are going to be lots of costs up-front with moving and visas and puppy-transport and such, so I'm a bit nervous about securing funds ASAP.
Anyone know of any reputable private loan companies, preferably that are easy to work with, since it'll be abroad?
 
I am not sure exactly how the RVC grading system works. I know somewhat what there testing and exam style is like. I am just concerned because I doubt they do "class rank" which is partially a good thing, but may be a bad thing when applying to internships. I read a research article that surveyed employers selecting veterinary interns and it said that class rank was the most important factor. I think LORs and GPA were next. How can an RVC grad be a competitive applicant for those spots if they don't have a class rank at all? This is discomforting to me because I am pretty sure I would want to do an internship...and later maybe a residency :(
 
Mine's still on the way over here from my permanent address...wildzoovet, are you being sarcastic? are they completely useless?
 
This is totally off topic but I just wanted to say, for those of you going to RVC that I am jealous (I love England!) and that if you get the chance while you are over there, you should look up/ do research with etc, Prof. Josh Slater.

I worked with him when he was at the University of Cambridge Veterinary School and he is Just. So. Awesome. He really made my fellowship over there fantastic. He mostly works with horses. But anyways, just keep an eye out for him, I would go there just to have him as a prof if i could!
 
cool GellaBella, I looked him up on the RVC website...pretty impressive!
Will you be joining the RVC in the future? Did you apply this year?

I think I am definitely going to RVC. What an adventure it will be!

BTW, the student who referred to the facilities as "a bit lacking" was only talking about the Camden campus. Maybe she wasn't used to having all her classes in one building, but I think that is how most vet schools are. The Camden facilities are great, everything looked brand new there. I actually think that the anatomy labs, library, and lecture halls were much nicer than Penn's. And the Queen Mother Hospital at Hawkshead just finished an 8 million pound extension, and they have a hydrotherapy pool!
 
Mine's still on the way over here from my permanent address...wildzoovet, are you being sarcastic? are they completely useless?

Oh no, I wasn't being sarcastic at all. I was just wondering where they were. Your's went to your permanent address? Interesting...I wonder if mine is going to end up at my parents house as well...
 
yeah, my dad got it in the mail and is mailing it to me at school. He also noticed they STILL did not include the zip code, even after I emailed them about it. :rolleyes:
 
They were having zip code issues a lot this year. I know my +4, so I include it whenever I write my zip code. But . . . they read it without the dash, and so registered my zip code as a 9-digit number. the post office didn't like that.
 
Had my interview yesterday and just learned that I got in! I'm going to RVC, so excited!
 
I keep getting closer and closer to a decision . . . I just need that little extra nudge.

Although everyone keeps telling me that I should wait until I hear about the Tufts alternate list before making anything final.

This is almost as bad as waiting for interviews or waiting for letters post-interview.

actually, no it's not. :D
 
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