Salaries that can be earned in Private Practice Anesthesia

[Sergio99]

Sergio, fwiw I've never thought anything odd about using "greetings" to close a response. it functions, like you said, the same as "regards" or "cheers". Both of those usages have similar Old World phrases like, "mit freundlichen grussen" (which basically means, "with friendly greetings" in German) or "salut"..

Thank you for your understanding and your encouragement, Coldweatherblue. Nolagas is right about my ESL. My daughters tease me often about my English renderings of Spanish expressions.

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[maceo]

I do not take part in many discussions in this forum, but do follow many of then closely.
In my experience, based on my own practice and those of my colleagues at various practices with whom I went through residency with and still keep in touch; the best jobs are not advertised. As has been mentioned above, there's no need to advertise them. Often, the groups making higher than average incomes will seek YOU out as was my case. But you do have to let them know of your availability. I first contacted the group I'm with during the first half of my CA 2 year and maintained contact with them via a phone call every couple of months (sometimes they'd call me, or if it had been awhile, I'd call them to update them). Kept it professional at first, but naturally as they got to know me the conversations became more casual. A year later they offered me a job, just before Christmas of my chief year and gave me a sign on bonus (a GREAT Christmas that year! paid off credit card and then bought presents for everyone with cash).
Now; academics vs private P... the name of the game is proportionality meets liberty. Face it, any where you go there will be politics. However, I feel a physician has greater influence in the game in private practice than in academics. When a hospital controls your salary, they have the upper hand in the game. When you collect your own billing and perform anesthetic services based on contract with the hospital, and work your arse off in an effort to earn the hospital (and yourself) more income, YOU have the upper hand (the OR is usually the highest revenue generation point in the hospital, USUALLY). And therein lies the element of proportionality. I feel I work much more than my colleagues who remained in the academic setting. But I also earn more than twice as much.
In my group (8 anesthesiologists covering 3 hospitals, 1 labor/delivery center and 3 surgery centers, no pain management aside from blocks and epidurals for post op pain) only two partners can be off at a time for vacation (aside from holidays when only the call person is on), and call averages out to roughly Q 4 nights, above this you get bonus pay for call. We collect our own billing in addition to managing and billing for a group of CRNAs we hire. A typical day starts at 0700 (sometimes 0600) and finishes up at 1800-1900. In our group, yearly income varies between 750k-850k plus bonuses. It's a good living, but I'll be the first to admit it's not for everyone. I personally love getting up in the morning and heading into work. Love the job, the atmosphere, and the colleagues I work with. Usually take 8-10 weeks vacation a year. By comparison, before leaving residency I was offered a position starting off at 250K, with 9 weeks vacation a year. Call was 2-3 per month and often attendings were heading home at around 3pm-4pm if not on call.

totally not the norm. hey maybe I am wrong and there are many practices out there making that much. More power to you. Seriously. I am happy that somone is making that much money. At least its not the management companies. I am not making even half of that and ive been working for 8 years and you are making it with 10 weeks off.

 

[karizma098]

totally not the norm. hey maybe I am wrong and there are many practices out there making that much. More power to you. Seriously. I am happy that somone is making that much money. At least its not the management companies. I am not making even half of that and ive been working for 8 years and you are making it with 10 weeks off.

I agree it's not the norm for most people, for those kind of hours, in a location that isn't super super desirable, and with that call schedule and set up.

It's totally doable if you're willing to work..

Partner's in my old man's practice pull in that much and i'm talking relative to the Chicago market, They do work like mad men though..and they don't take 10 weeks off for sure.

 

[maceo]

I agree it's not the norm for most people, for those kind of hours, in a location that isn't super super desirable, and with that call schedule and set up.

It's totally doable if you're willing to work..

Partner's in my old man's practice pull in that much and i'm talking relative to the Chicago market, They do work like mad men though..and they don't take 10 weeks off for sure.

IF there are practices making that much.. there is no way they are letting you in on that.. you will be an employee forever

 

[karizma098]

IF there are practices making that much.. there is no way they are letting you in on that.. you will be an employee forever

kind of a gloomy approach, isn't it?

this isn't true. at my dad's practice the hospital subsidizes each anesthesiologist 350-450k to cover 1 hospital. This is given to each anesthesiologist, partner or not. When they interview new people they always ask if they want partnership - at which point the pay for the first 2 years is lower ( kind of a buy in i guess? ) but they are equal partner after that.

Aside from this, the group covers 2-3 other hospitals that don't get as much traffic. the anesthesiologists in the group that work more and cover these hospitals as well make an additional 50-150 depending on how much extra time they put in, it's almost like moonlighting.

Aside from that, the pain certified docs in the group run the pain clinic. this generates an extra 100-150 or so per doc, netting the hardest workers in the neighborhood of 800k, and the lower paid workers in the 400k neighborhood...One of the partners works full time at the main hospital, covers shifts at the satellite hospitals, and works 12 hours per week on Friday at the pain clinic..he made 800+ last year with bonus. it's a given that those making twice as much are pretty much working twice as hard.

Not everyone can work that hard and not everyone wants to. There are emergency med docs making 200 and emergency med docs making 600 - it's all relative to how hard you want to work.

 

[maceo]

kind of a gloomy approach, isn't it?

this isn't true. at my dad's practice the hospital subsidizes each anesthesiologist 350-450k to cover 1 hospital. This is given to each anesthesiologist, partner or not. When they interview new people they always ask if they want partnership - at which point the pay for the first 2 years is lower ( kind of a buy in i guess? ) but they are equal partner after that.

Aside from this, the group covers 2-3 other hospitals that don't get as much traffic. the anesthesiologists in the group that work more and cover these hospitals as well make an additional 50-150 depending on how much extra time they put in, it's almost like moonlighting.

Aside from that, the pain certified docs in the group run the pain clinic. this generates an extra 100-150 or so per doc, netting the hardest workers in the neighborhood of 800k, and the lower paid workers in the 400k neighborhood...One of the partners works full time at the main hospital, covers shifts at the satellite hospitals, and works 12 hours per week on Friday at the pain clinic..he made 800+ last year with bonus. it's a given that those making twice as much are pretty much working twice as hard.

Not everyone can work that hard and not everyone wants to. There are emergency med docs making 200 and emergency med docs making 600 - it's all relative to how hard you want to work.

usually the hardest working people in the group are the ones making the least

 

[sevoflurane]

Lot's of different ways to get paid. A couple of points:

1) If you work in BFE like I do, you get paid more.

2) In a fair group, you work hard you'll see the fruits of your labor every two weeks.

From August to August of last year I brought in $650K + 10 wks. of vacation. You could take as much as 14 weeks if you wanted to but in my group, if you don't work, then you are not generating income. Some of the older guys love this angle and make much less.

2/3 of our group is home by 3:00 p.m. Generally only the call team is on after 3:00 p.m. 1st call is home btw/ 4:00 and 8:00 p.m., some days longer, but that is very rare. 2nd call goes home btw/ 2:30pm and 5:30 p.m. depending on the day. Cardiac guy that is on for the day is almost always done by 12:00 p.m.

On 1st call, 50% of the time I don't get called back and 50% of the time you come in and do a quick case or two. Brutal nights are rare. I've had 1 serious GSW, 2 ruptured AAA's and a couple of bring back hearts that have kept me up for a while... but that is over a one year period. The beautiful thing about a 1099/eat what you kill is that if you are there all night long, you don't mind it too much cuz you are generating income above and beyond a typical day.

If you do hearts in our group, that means an extra 50k/year.

We don't get post-call days off. We work... and generate income while maximizing vacation time. Generally, you get the earliest room or you are at home with your beeper on (50% of post call days). It's not bad. In fact, I prefer this set up as my bottom line is increased tremendously by working that post-call day. It's not for everyone.

We don't supervise nurses and most partners bring in about 500K + 12 wks vaca. I took more call than anyone in my group last year. I'm on 6/7 days this week (2nd call/cardiac). No big deal. I've yet to come in since Wednesday at 430pm, unlikely to be called in through Monday and all my partners (except primary... which is my wife) are enjoying a good thanksgiving week with their families. Usually call is Q5-6 with 1 weekend a month for all my other partners. For me, between 1st, 2nd and cardiac, I'm prolly more like Q3-4 with one weekend a month- this is by choice.

When I joined our group, we did not have a buy in. You had voting rights after one year. Partnership now will cost 50k over one year. So 450k + 12 weeks vaca unless you want to work more. No perks with the job. Get paid as a 1099 and everything comes out of your bottom line.

I'm not sure if this is on par with most non-gaswork groups, but of the 5 goups I interviewed with 3 were 500k and 2 were 450K (benefits included) + 8-12 weeks vaca. This was over 2 yrs ago and I know things in the job market have changed.

The one thing I can say is that IF you choose to work in BFE, make sure you have plenty of vacation time to get out or at least have some decent cities w/in 45 minutes.

 

[Sergio99]

These exorbitant figures everybody is talking about are just unbelievable. Don't get me wrong, I am not implying anyone is lying, but I can tell these jobs you are talking about are not in Los Angeles. In over 25 years (I have been working in Los Angeles since 1982), I have never met or even heard of anyone making that much.

Yes, my billing agent told me many times that his Midwest clients made more than double what we made here, but I have never actually seen any of those people in the flesh.

...apparently my billing agent was talking about you.

 

[doctor712]

My good friend in the southeast, not as far south as Florida but not as far west as the mississippi, makes 650k with 17, yes 17 weeks vacation per year. One of four partners in a small group doing hearts all day. Visited him last year, and it is pretty much BFE but I could imagine worse. His surgeons did 2-3 vessel CABGs and MVRs in less than half the time I saw when at a big name hospital down here. Not sure if that contributes to the bottom line... I imagine so.

More proof that you don't see these jobs advertised on gasworks...

D712

 

[doctor712]

Lot’s of different ways to get paid. A couple of points:

1) If you work in BFE like I do, you get paid more.

2) In a fair group, you work hard you’ll see the fruits of your labor every two weeks.

From August to August of last year I brought in $650K + 10 wks. of vacation. You could take as much as 14 weeks if you wanted to but in my group, if you don’t work, then you are not generating income. Some of the older guys love this angle and make much less.

2/3 of our group is home by 3:00 p.m. Generally only the call team is on after 3:00 p.m. 1st call is home btw/ 4:00 and 8:00 p.m., some days longer, but that is very rare. 2nd call goes home btw/ 2:30pm and 5:30 p.m. depending on the day. Cardiac guy that is on for the day is almost always done by 12:00 p.m.

On 1st call, 50% of the time I don’t get called back and 50% of the time you come in and do a quick case or two. Brutal nights are rare. I’ve had 1 serious GSW, 2 ruptured AAA’s and a couple of bring back hearts that have kept me up for a while... but that is over a one year period. The beautiful thing about a 1099/eat what you kill is that if you are there all night long, you don't mind it too much cuz you are generating income above and beyond a typical day.

If you do hearts in our group, that means an extra 50k/year.

We don’t get post-call days off. We work... and generate income while maximizing vacation time. Generally, you get the earliest room or you are at home with your beeper on (50% of post call days). It’s not bad. In fact, I prefer this set up as my bottom line is increased tremendously by working that post-call day. It’s not for everyone.

We don’t supervise nurses and most partners bring in about 500K + 12 wks vaca. I took more call than anyone in my group last year. I’m on 6/7 days this week (2nd call/cardiac). No big deal. I’ve yet to come in since Wednesday at 430pm, unlikely to be called in through Monday and all my partners (except primary... which is my wife) are enjoying a good thanksgiving week with their families. Usually call is Q5-6 with 1 weekend a month for all my other partners. For me, between 1st, 2nd and cardiac, I’m prolly more like Q3-4 with one weekend a month- this is by choice.

When I joined our group, we did not have a buy in. You had voting rights after one year. Partnership now will cost 50k over one year. So 450k + 12 weeks vaca unless you want to work more. No perks with the job. Get paid as a 1099 and everything comes out of your bottom line.

I’m not sure if this is on par with most non-gaswork groups, but of the 5 goups I interviewed with 3 were 500k and 2 were 450K (benefits included) + 8-12 weeks vaca. This was over 2 yrs ago and I know things in the job market have changed.

The one thing I can say is that IF you choose to work in BFE, make sure you have plenty of vacation time to get out or at least have some decent cities w/in 45 minutes.

Sevo,
Do you do hearts? And if so did you do a fellowship? Do those in your group that do hearts all have fellowships? Curious if same applies to any peds you might be doing?
Also, 1099 no perks, ie health insurance and all else out of pocket? Educational trips (near slopes) like CME as well?
D712
D712

 

[Jay K]

Good god sevo and shadowfax... I'm astounded and definitely envious. Kudos. When I was job searching, I applied to jobs off Gaswork as well as cold-calling all the groups I could locate in my "area" of choice. Never found anything even close to THAT awesome. I think the best part of your jobs is that you're not supervising 4 or more rooms of CRNA's to make that income. Nice.

 

[drccw]

Physician only practice, Mid Atlantic area.
- 2 years to partner.
- First year 270K, Second year 280K
Benefits include: Health, Life, disability, malpractice. Retirement contribution of 13% after first year. 6 weeks vacation. Typically 50-55 hours a week. 1:15 in house call, 1:15 call from home

As a partner: 370K per year, plus bonus. Bonus ranges from 80K-90K depending on the year. Vacation increased to 8 weeks. The package for a partner is worth about 525K I figure.

The group does recieve a subsidy from the hospital to provide certain services: 2 rooms to a couple docs, coverage for 24 hour OB call (2000 deliveries/year)

drccw

 

[periopdoc]

Sevo are you one of my partners

Work more make more. Post-call days off are great (for residents). Right now I want more call and less time off. Thankfully, the older guys feel the opposite so we do a fair amount of trading. The official schedule has a fair distribution of work and call. If you have more it is because you asked for it. I like it that way.

D712 I am the only "heart trained" guy in my group and a little less than half our guys do hearts. We don't have any peds trained guys yet, but we all do peds. Youngest that I have done so far is a 4-month-old.


- pod

 

[sevoflurane]

Sevo are you one of my partners

Work more make more. Post-call days off are great (for residents). Right now I want more call and less time off. Thankfully, the older guys feel the opposite so we do a fair amount of trading. The official schedule has a fair distribution of work and call. If you have more it is because you asked for it. I like it that way.

D712 I am the only "heart trained" guy in my group and a little less than half our guys do hearts. We don't have any peds trained guys yet, but we all do peds. Youngest that I have done so far is a 4-month-old.


- pod

Maybe one day when I'm ready to move to the mountains...
Your BFE is better than my BFE...

D712. Like pod, we only have one CT trained guy. There are 3 of us that are not CT trained. No pedi trained docs over here either. All of us feel very comfortable with our pedi population. Mainly a very busy ENT service + hernia, pyloric stenosis and occasional I&D of abscess. Honestly, I wish we did more . I'll do a handfull of < 6mo. over a six month period, but generally they are >1 yr. old. You are very busy in our ENT room: 15-20 T&A's/BMT's a day.

 

[fabfive5]

Maybe one day when I'm ready to move to the mountains...
Your BFE is better than my BFE...

D712. Like pod, we only have one CT trained guy. There are 3 of us that are not CT trained. No pedi trained docs over here either. All of us feel very comfortable with our pedi population. Mainly a very busy ENT service + hernia, pyloric stenosis and occasional I&D of abscess. Honestly, I wish we did more . I'll do a handfull of < 6mo. over a six month period, but generally they are >1 yr. old. You are very busy in our ENT room: 15-20 T&A's/BMT's a day.

is where it's at!

 

[Mman]

If you want big $$$, find a private job supervising anesthetists in a mid to small sized town with a group that has a monopoly on services in the area.

It also helps to find a group where every partner is equal and not some pyramid scheme with different levels of partner.


Do that and you probably make something slightly under a million a year (including benefits).


edit: as to the post mentioning pay in Los Angeles. Of course you won't get paid anything to work in LA. The job is too easy to fill because everybody would like living there. To make lots of money, you need to work somewhere that not everyone wants to live. Supply and demand.

 

[Jay K]

To make lots of money, you need to work somewhere that not everyone wants to live. Supply and demand.

That's my philosophy as well, but now I'm thinking, how does one FIND these jobs if word-of-mouth is the only option since they're not going to be posted on Gaswork for the most part. The group's prob small, so word-of-mouth is not gonna be widespread. Cold-calling BFE is not practical, cause most of us don't know all the small little BFE's in this nation.

So, is it really only word-of-mouth that these lucrative, ideal BFE jobs are passed around?

I'm assuming they don't use recruiters either.

Just wondering how the majority of BFE-er's found their jobs: word-of-mouth?

Also, just to give a little perspective, what population-size is a BFE? <50K Or rather is it just remoteness from any major airport/city?
(I suppose Periopdoc's BFE if it's Kalispel, MT is 14K in population... is that "about right?")

 

[doctor712]

That's my philosophy as well, but now I'm thinking, how does one FIND these jobs if word-of-mouth is the only option since they're not going to be posted on Gaswork for the most part. The group's prob small, so word-of-mouth is not gonna be widespread. Cold-calling BFE is not practical, cause most of us don't know all the small little BFE's in this nation.

Dr. JK,

As for cold-calling, maybe I can give my .02 cents. When I was writing for television shows, and I thank my lucky stars that part of my life is slowly fading away, I was a cold calling monster. And it paid off (in a notably obnoxious egocentric business like showbiz). I wonder, how different could cold calling be in other careers, like medicine...?

Case in point, when I was out of work, I literally called 100 shows, to introduce myself, give em the shpiel in 30 seconds flat, maybe shoot an email, and call everyone in the business that I knew to get a lead. All from Long Island, FARRRRR away from the nepotistic center of showbiz, LA. I was certain I was the only employed comedy TV writer on all of LI at some points. I had complied (nerdy, yeah I know, but it's key not to call the same person twice) an Excel spreadsheet of places/shows I called, emailed, sent scripts to, heard back from, whether they seemed interested or not, were generally D*#$CKS, were currently hiring, etc etc. If you put the time in, I could easily find 10 hospitals within 100 miles of Denver and reach out to all of them within one business day. You just have to want to...

So, with medicine, and I am 37, so I'm not afraid to make a phone call, if it were today, and I had to rely on calling or asking only the people I know personally (and not the people I'll meet over the next 4 years in med school, or during anesthesia residency), I don't think I'd have a really hard time connecting a few dots, and asking around. I'd start with my own (future) PD, who I have co-authored papers with, or talk to the Chair, who knows me well, or talk to any of the people I've written papers with and for (about 20 docs) whether they were in Anesthesia or just personal and close friends in Cards or Derm for example. YOU NEVER know who has heard of something. Just putting the word out there that, "I'm looking" is sometimes worth its weight in gold.

Furthermore, I live in SOFLA, but if I wanted to work in BFE Colorado or Utah or Montana (and frankly, seeing Periop and Sevos photos that is probably a REAL option for me), I'd have no problem getting on email or phone and reaching out in a genuine way. It goes far when people can see you love something. And I think people allow you to make a few mistakes when you're still green and looking for that first job...

I've emailed a stranger at Wash U Anesthesia to do an oversees volunteer stint, and got a great reply. I spoke at length with a PD in NY about his department (wanted to observe at one point), and it turns out he knows the current PD who I work with daily. I imagine academic anesthesia is a small community, and they surely have inroads to PP.

Lastly, when I was at Columbia, I had only observed in an ER in LA and wanted to see some new specialities. So, I wrote a SHORT and SWEET email (THATS SO KEY) individually addressed to 10 Chairs at P&S Med school. Asking to observe. The only reply: Margaret Dean, the Chair of Anesthesia. I had never seen an anesthesia machine until a week after that reply. I ended up with a GREAT PEDS guy at P&S for 6 mos. And that's what made me want to get involved with anesthesia and set my sights as a career. Cold calling has a low result, but you have to try. Being able to write might simply come in handy here, and I can really see how some people just aren't able to accomplish something so simply, docs included, so ask your buddy to read an email before you send it if you think short and sweet isn't your forte.

Point is, reach out, it's important to keep things SHORT (unlike this post) and to the point. Don't come off like a tool, be cogent, show interest, compliment, phrase it as if you're asking for advice (people love showing off their smarts) and see what happens. Cold calling BFE can be very smart. So can asking friends, docs in the family, or just asking for a meeting during a ski trip to BFE, or to the beach in BFE south. WHY NOT???

Frankly, if/when I get through the big process, I'd have no problem PMing people on this board and asking for some help. Isn't that part of why this exists? Rejection stings, but you get nothing without asking. Set your ego aside and pick up the phone. That's 1/2 the game. We've all been there...

D712

 

[Coastie]

Excellent post. Worth its weight in gold.

Dr. JK,

As for cold-calling, maybe I can give my .02 cents. When I was writing for television shows, and I thank my lucky stars that part of my life is slowly fading away, I was a cold calling monster. And it paid off (in a notably obnoxious egocentric business like showbiz). I wonder, how different could cold calling be in other careers, like medicine...?

Case in point, when I was out of work, I literally called 100 shows, to introduce myself, give em the shpiel in 30 seconds flat, maybe shoot an email, and call everyone in the business that I knew to get a lead. All from Long Island, FARRRRR away from the nepotistic center of showbiz, LA. I was certain I was the only employed comedy TV writer on all of LI at some points. I had complied (nerdy, yeah I know, but it's key not to call the same person twice) an Excel spreadsheet of places/shows I called, emailed, sent scripts to, heard back from, whether they seemed interested or not, were generally D*#$CKS, were currently hiring, etc etc. If you put the time in, I could easily find 10 hospitals within 100 miles of Denver and reach out to all of them within one business day. You just have to want to...

So, with medicine, and I am 37, so I'm not afraid to make a phone call, if it were today, and I had to rely on calling or asking only the people I know personally (and not the people I'll meet over the next 4 years in med school, or during anesthesia residency), I don't think I'd have a really hard time connecting a few dots, and asking around. I'd start with my own (future) PD, who I have co-authored papers with, or talk to the Chair, who knows me well, or talk to any of the people I've written papers with and for (about 20 docs) whether they were in Anesthesia or just personal and close friends in Cards or Derm for example. YOU NEVER know who has heard of something. Just putting the word out there that, "I'm looking" is sometimes worth its weight in gold.

Furthermore, I live in SOFLA, but if I wanted to work in BFE Colorado or Utah or Montana (and frankly, seeing Periop and Sevos photos that is probably a REAL option for me), I'd have no problem getting on email or phone and reaching out in a genuine way. It goes far when people can see you love something. And I think people allow you to make a few mistakes when you're still green and looking for that first job...

I've emailed a stranger at Wash U Anesthesia to do an oversees volunteer stint, and got a great reply. I spoke at length with a PD in NY about his department (wanted to observe at one point), and it turns out he knows the current PD who I work with daily. I imagine academic anesthesia is a small community, and they surely have inroads to PP.

Lastly, when I was at Columbia, I had only observed in an ER in LA and wanted to see some new specialities. So, I wrote a SHORT and SWEET email (THATS SO KEY) individually addressed to 10 Chairs at P&S Med school. Asking to observe. The only reply: Margaret Dean, the Chair of Anesthesia. I had never seen an anesthesia machine until a week after that reply. I ended up with a GREAT PEDS guy at P&S for 6 mos. And that's what made me want to get involved with anesthesia and set my sights as a career. Cold calling has a low result, but you have to try. Being able to write might simply come in handy here, and I can really see how some people just aren't able to accomplish something so simply, docs included, so ask your buddy to read an email before you send it if you think short and sweet isn't your forte.

Point is, reach out, it's important to keep things SHORT (unlike this post) and to the point. Don't come off like a tool, be cogent, show interest, compliment, phrase it as if you're asking for advice (people love showing off their smarts) and see what happens. Cold calling BFE can be very smart. So can asking friends, docs in the family, or just asking for a meeting during a ski trip to BFE, or to the beach in BFE south. WHY NOT???

Frankly, if/when I get through the big process, I'd have no problem PMing people on this board and asking for some help. Isn't that part of why this exists? Rejection stings, but you get nothing without asking. Set your ego aside and pick up the phone. That's 1/2 the game. We've all been there...

D712

 

[ANCAdoc]

I've got physician compensation by specialty from the Medical Group Management Association. 2009 report = 2008 data.

Anesthesiology data (3,814 providers from 197 practices):

Mean: $410,311 +/- $161,580 (st. dev)

25th%: $321,980
Median: $410,658
75th%: 486,000
90th%: $593,020

I also have similar data for Pain Management and Pediatric Anesthesiology. Interestingly, the mean salaries are higher for those two fields than general anesthesia.

Sure beats the renal salary I hope to make soon!

 

[maceo]

most people are making 250-350. the outliers are making more.

 

[deleted126335]

Also note, that is only salary data. Not hours worked. The highest income jobs will also tend to be the highest hours worked (lower lifestyle, granted there are exceptions )

 

[IlDestriero]

Subtract about $100k and you've got academics.

I've got physician compensation by specialty from the Medical Group Management Association. 2009 report = 2008 data.

Anesthesiology data (3,814 providers from 197 practices):

Mean: $410,311 +/- $161,580 (st. dev)

25th%: $321,980
Median: $410,658
75th%: 486,000
90th%: $593,020

I also have similar data for Pain Management and Pediatric Anesthesiology. Interestingly, the mean salaries are higher for those two fields than general anesthesia.

Sure beats the renal salary I hope to make soon!

 

[Jay K]

Set your ego aside and pick up the phone. That's 1/2 the game. We've all been there...D712

In your zeal to give me $.02, you've completely misunderstood my comment, even though you quoted it in your own reply.

I was saying cold-calling BFE is impractical, when you don't know what constitutes BFE.

I think I'm living in BFE right now, having moved from major metropolitan cities, however it might not be BFE enough. What exactly are the parameters for a BFE location that yields jobs such as sevo and periopdoc have? THAT is the question.

 

[maceo]

its not so much bfe as it that nobody wants to go there..

 

[doctor712]

Dr. JayK,

Just trying to help. I took a part of your post and went with it.

Who knows what defines 500K$ BFE anesthesia-land, others will speak to that. I was simply replying to the "cold calling BFE is impractical" comment and that, with a little work, cold calling may help. Sure, you have to find and define BFE first, but once that's accomplished, I think people in general simply need to go in gung ho, and make it calculated. I think there might be two problems: finding the right BFE, and knowing how to approach it when you find it. I was addressing the latter. With zeal apparently.

For the record, setting one's ego aside, the small part of my post you quoted, was general advice, and not addressed or meant to you directly AT ALL. Spoken in the royal, "We should all set our egos aside..." And I mean that. I simply think that people looking for jobs, myself included, hate to make "that phone call". But it's a necessary evil. And after 8 years + of training, I'm sure the phone call is even more annoying. Oh wait, I'm missing the point again. JUST KIDDING. I can see how you took that out of context, but it wasn't meant that way.

D712

 

[IlDestriero]

In your zeal to give me $.02, you've completely misunderstood my comment, even though you quoted it in your own reply.

I was saying cold-calling BFE is impractical, when you don't know what constitutes BFE.

I think I'm living in BFE right now, having moved from major metropolitan cities, however it might not be BFE enough. What exactly are the parameters for a BFE location that yields jobs such as sevo and periopdoc have? THAT is the question.

Pick a state, preferably in the south or midwest. Locate all desirable areas. Block out anything within about an hour of there. Look around that parimeter. Than find small cities a couple hours from anything nice, or a major city or airport. That's the gold. Really. The jobs are not hard to find, but it is very hard to live there. I spent 3 years in a place where I gladly drove an hour to a regional airport to fly to a major airport, drove 20 miles to the only Starbucks. I left town literally EVERY weekend I was not on call. That's fine when you're single or have no kids and a willing spouse, never again.
It's not just living there, but living in the intellectual wasteland around you. Even at the hospital. Some of the surgeons out there in BFE can also be somewhat suspect at best. Don't expect harvard and Stanford fellowship grads. That's a factor, a BIG factor. I had a couple arguments with surgeons about some patients that were too sick for what we offered, complex post op management, etc. More than once I was looking into the abyss wondering what I was going to do as the surgeon attempted to exsanguinate the patient, mentally depleting our limited blood supply, etc. Once I offered to help with a delivery when the OB froze up and couldn't get the kid out. Seriously. Thinking "WTF Biatch, get your f'ing act together, am I really going to let the kid going to die in MY OR?" "WTF am I doing here?" All the while telling mom and dad "everything was fine". "just another minute". They're not all bad, of course, but it can be a real pain in the balls. Never again.
Be careful what you wish for.

 

[Sergio99]

...It's not just living there, but living in the intellectual wasteland around you. Even at the hospital.

...Don't expect harvard and Stanford fellowship grads. That's a factor, a BIG factor. I had a couple arguments with surgeons about some patients that were too sick for what we offered, complex post op management, etc.

...Be careful what you wish for.

That is exactly why I am where I am, making less money, but in a relatively decent professional environment, and near friends, family, and community. That has a price, too, which, in my case, I think has been worth paying.

 

[karizma098]

That is exactly why I am where I am, making less money, but in a relatively decent professional environment, and near friends, family, and community. That has a price, too, which, in my case, I think has been worth paying.

Very well said...

Money can only buy so much. I will never take a job in BFE, even if i get paid a million dollars a year. We only have one life, and I'd like to spend it living somewhere i love. I'll willingly make half as much, ( and heck, in california's case, pay twice as much for living expenses. )

 

[GasEmDee]

Pick a state, preferably in the south or midwest. Locate all desirable areas. Block out anything within about an hour of there. Look around that parimeter. Than find small cities a couple hours from anything nice, or a major city or airport. That's the gold. Really. The jobs are not hard to find, but it is very hard to live there. I spent 3 years in a place where I gladly drove an hour to a regional airport to fly to a major airport, drove 20 miles to the only Starbucks. I left town literally EVERY weekend I was not on call. That's fine when you're single or have no kids and a willing spouse, never again.
It's not just living there, but living in the intellectual wasteland around you. Even at the hospital. Some of the surgeons out there in BFE can also be somewhat suspect at best. Don't expect harvard and Stanford fellowship grads. That's a factor, a BIG factor. I had a couple arguments with surgeons about some patients that were too sick for what we offered, complex post op management, etc. More than once I was looking into the abyss wondering what I was going to do as the surgeon attempted to exsanguinate the patient, mentally depleting our limited blood supply, etc. Once I offered to help with a delivery when the OB froze up and couldn't get the kid out. Seriously. Thinking "WTF Biatch, get your f'ing act together, am I really going to let the kid going to die in MY OR?" "WTF am I doing here?" All the while telling mom and dad "everything was fine". "just another minute". They're not all bad, of course, but it can be a real pain in the balls. Never again.
Be careful what you wish for.

I have often wondered about this. You can see questionable practices even at small, community hospitals in a metropolitan setting. It has to be a lot worse in BFE.

 

[periopdoc]

I have often wondered about this. You can see questionable practices even at small, community hospitals in a metropolitan setting. It has to be a lot worse in BFE.

Personally, I think the worst tend to be those small community hospitals in the metropolitan settings. I would much rather have surgery at the hospital I work in than in the big city "community hospital" I did locums at.

Keep in mind that not all BFE locations are undesirable. They just are smaller out of the way places. That is very appealing to some folks.

You can live in LA where the celebs live/work. I will live where they vacation.

- pod

 

[Jay K]

It's not just living there, but living in the intellectual wasteland around you. Even at the hospital. Some of the surgeons out there in BFE can also be somewhat suspect at best....They're not all bad, of course, but it can be a real pain in the balls. Never again.
Be careful what you wish for.

That is exactly why I am where I am, making less money, but in a relatively decent professional environment, and near friends, family, and community. That has a price, too, which, in my case, I think has been worth paying.

Good points.

Personally, I think the worst tend to be those small community hospitals in the metropolitan settings. I would much rather have surgery at the hospital I work in than in the big city "community hospital" I did locums at.

Keep in mind that not all BFE locations are undesirable. They just are smaller out of the way places. That is very appealing to some folks.

You can live in LA where the celebs live/work. I will live where they vacation.

- pod

Also good points.

If only it were easier to move around and try things out in different locales. Can't know till you tried I suppose.

Dr. JayK,

Just trying to help. I took a part of your post and went with it.

I can see how you took that out of context, but it wasn't meant that way.

That's cool, man. And it's just Jay.

 

[pgg]

Some of the surgeons out there in BFE can also be somewhat suspect at best. Don't expect harvard and Stanford fellowship grads. That's a factor, a BIG factor.

I've caught a glimpse of this truth over the last year when I moonlight.

One of the general surgeons was just forcibly retired. The guy's old for a general surgeon working the hours he did, looks like he's approaching 70, and his hands would cramp up during long surgeries. Operate for 5 minutes. Rest for 3 minutes. Operate for 5 ... rest for 3. He was doing ~q3 call + clinic postcall days right up until the end.

An orthopod was just pushed out ... something like 19 or 20 malpractice cases filed against him in this state, with another dozen still pending from another. Rumor has it he's somehow latched on to another surgical group a few towns up the road.

Another general surgeon, foreign trained. I don't know how many routine lap choles I've done with him only to see the screen flash bright red and hear a stream of native-language curses start filling the room. He asks the scrub tech things like 'you think this hepatic artery?' followed by 'maybe I clip it and we see if it bleed or no' ... I used to think he was just joking with those comments.

Another general surgeon has been learning how to do one-port lap choles for at least the 18 months I've been working there. 3-4 hours per case. Plus, he's a dick.

Once I offered to help with a delivery when the OB froze up and couldn't get the kid out. Seriously. Thinking "WTF Biatch, get your f'ing act together, am I really going to let the kid going to die in MY OR?" "WTF am I doing here?" All the while telling mom and dad "everything was fine". "just another minute".

That is scary.

 

[Mman]

Not all locations where you can make money are in the middle of nowhere or horrible places to live.

Instead of living ON the beach, live 30-60 minutes inland. You still go to the beach on the weekend. Heck, you can still own a beach house.

Instead of living IN Atlanta or Charleston or Charlotte or whatever bigger city you want to live in, live an hour's drive away so you can still get to the city to do stuff, but earn an extra $200K-400K per year.

And not all jobs outside of a big city are filled with poorly trained colleagues. My partners trained at the cream of the crop big name residencies/fellowships on the east coast. And that's how they recruit, via word of mouth contacts with friends at their old programs.

 

[fabfive5]

Not all locations where you can make money are in the middle of nowhere or horrible places to live.

Instead of living ON the beach, live 30-60 minutes inland. You still go to the beach on the weekend. Heck, you can still own a beach house.

Instead of living IN Atlanta or Charleston or Charlotte or whatever bigger city you want to live in, live an hour's drive away so you can still get to the city to do stuff, but earn an extra $200K-400K per year.

And not all jobs outside of a big city are filled with poorly trained colleagues. My partners trained at the cream of the crop big name residencies/fellowships on the east coast. And that's how they recruit, via word of mouth contacts with friends at their old programs.

For the previous 20+ posts....thanks. I'm currently looking for a job in Adult/Peds and am going through all the quandries we are discussing. It seems (very obviously that..) money is only money and cannot buy some of the intangibles we so respect....i.e. happiness. I've interviewed from BFE <--> Academia and man is there a difference. You all are helping me make up my mind.

Also, having worked with CRNAs as an attending during my fellowship...they all aren't that bad. There ARE some (though small) who work well with docs.

Question: What do you think the best CRNA : Doc ratio is? Please don't say 0:1 I know some think that....sometimes including me.

 

[sevoflurane]

Here is my perspective on BFE. This may be particularly important to those looking for a job now.

While on the interview trail I interviewed in Dallas, San Antonio, Houston, Spokane Washington, Colorado and my current city in BFE.

PROS:

Income:
My wife and I jumped right into full financial partnership = 1.3 mil our first year out vs. 2-3 year partnership at 250k/yr/ea. I’m scared of Obama and I’m getting a piece of the pie while there is still a pie to be had.

Quality of life:
Excellent. We do work post call, but my day to day grind is so much better than what I’m used to. No supervision. I have plenty of time to do all the things I like to do. At least 2 X a week I’m home at or before 3:00pm.
Plenty of vacation 10-14wks.: I’ll be in Jackson hole in less than 2 weeks. I leave my house at 5:30am, get to my international airport at 6:15am (45 min. drive), arrive in the mountains at 10:30a.m. and on the slopes THE SAME DAY at 11:30am. I’ve gone down to see Noy in Durango, and the flight (weather permitting) gets me on the slopes 1 hr. earlier.
I paid 260k for a 4000sq ft. new construction (2 yr. old) home with all the bells and whistles. My partners have 100+ acre ranch compounds and love to get their hands dirty. One of our spine surgeons gets up at 4:30 am. to feed his cattle before he comes in to work. He loves it and he is a great surgeon.

Medical Malpractice:
Tort Reform state/malpractice 5k first year, 6.5k second. Overhead very small.

Respect:
Plenty of it. Enough said.

Surgeons:
Not all surgeons in BFE suck at what they do. We just had our 3 yr. CT outcome review and let me tell you, our morbidity/mortality is 50% lower than national standards. Our orthopedic surgeons rock. We have a joint center where we give some of them 3 rooms to bounce in between. One guy does 5 knees by 12:00 consistently. Regional is fun and we do lots of it. Our general surgeons are team players. We don’t get called in the middle of the night because there is an “emergent” appy that “needs” to go to the OR. We’ll just schedule it 1 hr. before our regular start of the day. This keeps us in bed for most of the nights. OB... well same thing. Going from academics to PP was a BIG eye opener for me. Instead of a 2 hours c/s, we are always in pacu before the 1 hr. mark. We only do 600 deliveries a year... and even if we do get called in to place an epidural I’m back in bed within 1 hr. and that will boost my day by $500. Our vascular surgeons are top notch. We do VATS, deep hyperthermic arrest, kids, major vascular, etc... My practice is not boring in any way. Professionally I’m very fulfilled.

My little city:
In our “city” of 50k, we have a Super Walmart and about 4 other grocery stores, Best Buy, Chili’s, Bob Evans, Apple bees, O’charlies, Olive Garden, and prolly 8 more mainstream restaurants + a couple really nice home grown restaurants + 2 Starbucks. We have a Lowe’s, Home depot and a mall with all the regular stores. Plenty of pubs to go out to if that is what you are into.

BIG PRO: My commute to work is exactly 8 minutes. What’s it like in L.A./ D.C./San Antonio/Houston or any other major city? Less time driving means more time to work out, play my guitar, hit some tennis balls, take my dog to the dog park or the 40 acre park/trail that is down the street from where I live.

Hospital:
Our hospital is brand spanking new and is gorgeous... Our OR’s are not the 70-80’s OR’s I’ve seen on the interview trail. We have plasma screens, apollo machines, all the anesthesia equipment you could ever ask for. Our hospital comes complete with Starbucks a nice cafeteria with gourmet chefs and a real nice doctors lounge that stocks food and good coffee around the clock. Our hospital is a 300 bed hospital that is positive 350 million and that reserve is just getting bigger.

CONS:
Well, my wife does get sick of our little town of 50k. So we ask for the keys of any one of our partners condo’s in Chicago, get in our car and by 6:00pm on a Friday we are sipping a glass of nice wine overlooking downtown Chicago on the 41st floor. We have other major metropolitan cities within 1 hour, but we prefer Chicago.


Mental Stimulus:
IlDestriero mentioned “intellectual wasteland” and well... regarding our patient population... he’s 75% right. The people I work with however, are all very well educated people. This includes every surgeon, pa, scrub tech, etc I work with. Outside of the hospital, you will find a lot of people/farmers/blue collar workers that don’t have a college degree. So what? They walk a different path than I do and they posses skills I don’t.

My wife and I are both on call today. Nothing going on in the OR. One of our “local” friends was butchering a pig today. Took us 10 minutes to get out to his property. I’ve never seen a pig being butchered before. I learned that the psoas muscle is one of the best parts of the pig. Yeah.. I know... it’s not for everybody, but I sure found it entertaining.

After the butchering was all done, we stepped outside and I was able to see my gas-passing wife blow up a pigs foot with a .44 caliber Magnum. Neither of us had ever handled a .44 caliber before and it sure was fun.... and loud.... and had a nice kick to it.

Doesn't she look like a pro? She nailed that little piggy foot...

Life out here has a good pace to it. I can tell you this: By the time I’m ready to leave here and move to the AZ, CO, NM, or some other place that has mountains around the corner I will:

1) Be a better anesthesiologist with a good amount of SOLO experience.

2) Be financially able to accept a job that will pay me 350K a year.

To graduating residents:

I do not regret coming here and am 100% sure I made the right decision. It is not permanent, and it’s not for everybody, but for me.... this “journey” as someone else mentioned, has been 10x more than I ever thought possible.

You just have to find what it is that you want out of your first job. I hope this helps.



My 2 cents.

 

[fabfive5]

Here is my perspective on BFE. This may be particularly important to those looking for a job now.

While on the interview trail I interviewed in Dallas, San Antonio, Houston, Spokane Washington, Colorado and my current city in BFE.

PROS:

Income:
My wife and I jumped right into full financial partnership = 1.3 mil our first year out vs. 2-3 year partnership at 250k/yr/ea. I’m scared of Obama and I’m getting a piece of the pie while there is still a pie to be had.

Quality of life:
Excellent. We do work post call, but my day to day grind is so much better than what I’m used to. No supervision. I have plenty of time to do all the things I like to do. At least 2 X a week I’m home at or before 3:00pm.
Plenty of vacation 10-14wks.: I’ll be in Jackson hole in less than 2 weeks. I leave my house at 5:30am, get to my international airport at 6:15am (45 min. drive), arrive in the mountains at 10:30a.m. and on the slopes THE SAME DAY at 11:30am. I’ve gone down to see Noy in Durango, and the flight (weather permitting) gets me on the slopes 1 hr. earlier.
I paid 260k for a 4000sq ft. new construction (2 yr. old) home with all the bells and whistles. My partners have 100+ acre ranch compounds and love to get their hands dirty. One of our spine surgeons gets up at 4:30 am. to feed his cattle before he comes in to work. He loves it and he is a great surgeon.

Medical Malpractice:
Tort Reform state/malpractice 5k first year, 6.5k second. Overhead very small.

Respect:
Plenty of it. Enough said.

Surgeons:
Not all surgeons in BFE suck at what they do. We just had our 3 yr. CT outcome review and let me tell you, our morbidity/mortality is 50% lower than national standards. Our orthopedic surgeons rock. We have a joint center where we give some of them 3 rooms to bounce in between. One guy does 5 knees by 12:00 consistently. Regional is fun and we do lots of it. Our general surgeons are team players. We don’t get called in the middle of the night because there is an “emergent” appy that “needs” to go to the OR. We’ll just schedule it 1 hr. before our regular start of the day. This keeps us in bed for most of the nights. OB... well same thing. Going from academics to PP was a BIG eye opener for me. Instead of a 2 hours c/s, we are always in pacu before the 1 hr. mark. We only do 600 deliveries a year... and even if we do get called in to place an epidural I’m back in bed within 1 hr. and that will boost my day by $500. Our vascular surgeons are top notch. We do VATS, deep hyperthermic arrest, kids, major vascular, etc... My practice is not boring in any way. Professionally I’m very fulfilled.

My little city:
In our “city” of 50k, we have a Super Walmart and about 4 other grocery stores, Best Buy, Chili’s, Bob Evans, Apple bees, O’charlies, Olive Garden, and prolly 8 more mainstream restaurants + a couple really nice home grown restaurants + 2 Starbucks. We have a Lowe’s, Home depot and a mall with all the regular stores. Plenty of pubs to go out to if that is what you are into.

BIG PRO: My commute to work is exactly 8 minutes. What’s it like in L.A./ D.C./San Antonio/Houston or any other major city? Less time driving means more time to work out, play my guitar, hit some tennis balls, take my dog to the dog park or the 40 acre park/trail that is down the street from where I live.

Hospital:
Our hospital is brand spanking new and is gorgeous... Our OR’s are not the 70-80’s OR’s I’ve seen on the interview trail. We have plasma screens, apollo machines, all the anesthesia equipment you could ever ask for. Our hospital comes complete with Starbucks a nice cafeteria with gourmet chefs and a real nice doctors lounge that stocks food and good coffee around the clock. Our hospital is a 300 bed hospital that is positive 350 million and that reserve is just getting bigger.

CONS:
Well, my wife does get sick of our little town of 50k. So we ask for the keys of any one of our partners condo’s in Chicago, get in our car and by 6:00pm on a Friday we are sipping a glass of nice wine overlooking downtown Chicago on the 41st floor. We have other major metropolitan cities within 1 hour, but we prefer Chicago.


Mental Stimulus:
IlDestriero mentioned “intellectual wasteland” and well... regarding our patient population... he’s 75% right. The people I work with however, are all very well educated people. This includes every surgeon, pa, scrub tech, etc I work with. Outside of the hospital, you will find a lot of people/farmers/blue collar workers that don’t have a college degree. So what? They walk a different path than I do and they posses skills I don’t.

My wife and I are both on call today. Nothing going on in the OR. One of our “local” friends was butchering a pig today. Took us 10 minutes to get out to his property. I’ve never seen a pig being butchered before. I learned that the psoas muscle is one of the best parts of the pig. Yeah.. I know... it’s not for everybody, but I sure found it entertaining.

Life out here has a good pace to it. I can tell you this: By the time I’m ready to leave here and move to the AZ, CO, NM, or some other place that has mountains around the corner I will:

1) Be a better anesthesiologist with a good amount of SOLO experience.

2) Be financially able to accept a job that will pay me 350K a year.

To graduating residents:

I do not regret coming here and am 100% sure I made the right decision. It is not permanent, and it’s not for everybody, but for me.... this “journey” as someone else mentioned, has been 10x more than I ever thought possible.

You just have to find what it is that you want out of your first job. I hope this helps.



My 2 cents.

WHERE do you work??? Sounds like fun actually.

 

[maceo]

Here is my perspective on BFE. This may be particularly important to those looking for a job now.

While on the interview trail I interviewed in Dallas, San Antonio, Houston, Spokane Washington, Colorado and my current city in BFE.

PROS:

Income:
My wife and I jumped right into full financial partnership = 1.3 mil our first year out vs. 2-3 year partnership at 250k/yr/ea. I'm scared of Obama and I'm getting a piece of the pie while there is still a pie to be had.

Quality of life:
Excellent. We do work post call, but my day to day grind is so much better than what I'm used to. No supervision. I have plenty of time to do all the things I like to do. At least 2 X a week I'm home at or before 3:00pm.
Plenty of vacation 10-14wks.: I'll be in Jackson hole in less than 2 weeks. I leave my house at 5:30am, get to my international airport at 6:15am (45 min. drive), arrive in the mountains at 10:30a.m. and on the slopes THE SAME DAY at 11:30am. I've gone down to see Noy in Durango, and the flight (weather permitting) gets me on the slopes 1 hr. earlier.
I paid 260k for a 4000sq ft. new construction (2 yr. old) home with all the bells and whistles. My partners have 100+ acre ranch compounds and love to get their hands dirty. One of our spine surgeons gets up at 4:30 am. to feed his cattle before he comes in to work. He loves it and he is a great surgeon.

Medical Malpractice:
Tort Reform state/malpractice 5k first year, 6.5k second. Overhead very small.

Respect:
Plenty of it. Enough said.

Surgeons:
Not all surgeons in BFE suck at what they do. We just had our 3 yr. CT outcome review and let me tell you, our morbidity/mortality is 50% lower than national standards. Our orthopedic surgeons rock. We have a joint center where we give some of them 3 rooms to bounce in between. One guy does 5 knees by 12:00 consistently. Regional is fun and we do lots of it. Our general surgeons are team players. We don't get called in the middle of the night because there is an "emergent" appy that "needs" to go to the OR. We'll just schedule it 1 hr. before our regular start of the day. This keeps us in bed for most of the nights. OB... well same thing. Going from academics to PP was a BIG eye opener for me. Instead of a 2 hours c/s, we are always in pacu before the 1 hr. mark. We only do 600 deliveries a year... and even if we do get called in to place an epidural I'm back in bed within 1 hr. and that will boost my day by $500. Our vascular surgeons are top notch. We do VATS, deep hyperthermic arrest, kids, major vascular, etc... My practice is not boring in any way. Professionally I'm very fulfilled.

My little city:
In our "city" of 50k, we have a Super Walmart and about 4 other grocery stores, Best Buy, Chili's, Bob Evans, Apple bees, O'charlies, Olive Garden, and prolly 8 more mainstream restaurants + a couple really nice home grown restaurants + 2 Starbucks. We have a Lowe's, Home depot and a mall with all the regular stores. Plenty of pubs to go out to if that is what you are into.

BIG PRO: My commute to work is exactly 8 minutes. What's it like in L.A./ D.C./San Antonio/Houston or any other major city? Less time driving means more time to work out, play my guitar, hit some tennis balls, take my dog to the dog park or the 40 acre park/trail that is down the street from where I live.

Hospital:
Our hospital is brand spanking new and is gorgeous... Our OR's are not the 70-80's OR's I've seen on the interview trail. We have plasma screens, apollo machines, all the anesthesia equipment you could ever ask for. Our hospital comes complete with Starbucks a nice cafeteria with gourmet chefs and a real nice doctors lounge that stocks food and good coffee around the clock. Our hospital is a 300 bed hospital that is positive 350 million and that reserve is just getting bigger.

CONS:
Well, my wife does get sick of our little town of 50k. So we ask for the keys of any one of our partners condo's in Chicago, get in our car and by 6:00pm on a Friday we are sipping a glass of nice wine overlooking downtown Chicago on the 41st floor. We have other major metropolitan cities within 1 hour, but we prefer Chicago.


Mental Stimulus:
IlDestriero mentioned "intellectual wasteland" and well... regarding our patient population... he's 75% right. The people I work with however, are all very well educated people. This includes every surgeon, pa, scrub tech, etc I work with. Outside of the hospital, you will find a lot of people/farmers/blue collar workers that don't have a college degree. So what? They walk a different path than I do and they posses skills I don't.

My wife and I are both on call today. Nothing going on in the OR. One of our "local" friends was butchering a pig today. Took us 10 minutes to get out to his property. I've never seen a pig being butchered before. I learned that the psoas muscle is one of the best parts of the pig. Yeah.. I know... it's not for everybody, but I sure found it entertaining.

After the butchering was all done, we stepped outside and I was able to see my gas-passing wife blow up a pigs foot with a .44 caliber Magnum. Neither of us had ever handled a .44 caliber before and it sure was fun.... and loud.... and had a nice kick to it.

Doesn't she look like a pro? She nailed that little piggy foot...

Life out here has a good pace to it. I can tell you this: By the time I'm ready to leave here and move to the AZ, CO, NM, or some other place that has mountains around the corner I will:

1) Be a better anesthesiologist with a good amount of SOLO experience.

2) Be financially able to accept a job that will pay me 350K a year.

To graduating residents:

I do not regret coming here and am 100% sure I made the right decision. It is not permanent, and it's not for everybody, but for me.... this "journey" as someone else mentioned, has been 10x more than I ever thought possible.

You just have to find what it is that you want out of your first job. I hope this helps.



My 2 cents.

why cant i send you a pm..

listen thats combined income 1.3. not each..

right?

not bad.

like i said those jobs are not available to everyone.

you have to be a good old boy to get those jobs for the most part.

most of the jobs available like i said are 250-350 type of jobs where you are working your dick off.

 

[Sergio99]

I learned that the psoas muscle is one of the best parts of the pig. Yeah.. I know... it’s not for everybody, but I sure found it entertaining.

Yes, the psoas muscle is called "tenderloin" or "filet mignon" in butcher shops and restaurants.

Doesn't she look like a pro?

You are lucky. My wife has been asking me to take her to a shooting range for years now, and we never got around to it. I don't even know where they are and never have shot anything myself, other than needles in the operating room. Enjoy it!

 

[pgg]

After the butchering was all done, we stepped outside and I was able to see my gas-passing wife blow up a pigs foot with a .44 caliber Magnum. Neither of us had ever handled a .44 caliber before and it sure was fun.... and loud.... and had a nice kick to it.

Nice shot!

I shot a friend's 44 mag compact revolver a few days ago. Ow, ow, ow. Five shots of that thing and my hand hurt.

 

[sevoflurane]

why cant i send you a pm..

No se?


listen thats combined income 1.3. not each..

right? Yep.

 

[sevoflurane]

Yes, the psoas muscle is called "tenderloin" or "filet mignon" in butcher shops and restaurants.


You are lucky. My wife has been asking me to take her to a shooting range for years now, and we never got around to it. I don't even know where they are and never have shot anything myself, other than needles in the operating room. Enjoy it!

Ahh... "tendorloin and filet"... thank you for closing the loop.

I don't see why you can't go out and shoot with your wife. I'm just now getting into guns and I think that anyone can go to a shooting range, get some instruction and have a fun afternoon... old western style.

 

[sevoflurane]

Nice shot!

I shot a friend's 44 mag compact revolver a few days ago. Ow, ow, ow. Five shots of that thing and my hand hurt.

Honestly... once I took a couple of cracks at it I was a little worried about my wife shooting. You remember that youtube video that Blade posted a while back... you know, the one where the female shooter got hit square in the face from the recoil...

It's funny on you tube, but I don't think she woulda liked it.

I was proud of her. She literally blew that piggy's foot to smithereens.

 

[sevoflurane]

I think this is it....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5OYc4393JVE

 

[countingdays]

why cant i send you a pm..

listen thats combined income 1.3. not each..

right?

not bad.

like i said those jobs are not available to everyone.

you have to be a good old boy to get those jobs for the most part.

most of the jobs available like i said are 250-350 type of jobs where you are working your dick off.

Exactly. This board gives a false impression of what kind of jobs are competitively available. Must be nice to be in the good ole boy network. Not advertising jobs is bs. I understand that a personal recommendation from someone you know is the best way to judge an applicant, some people who suck ass have great resumes, but that's little comfort to those of us without useful connections.

 

[sevoflurane]

Exactly. This board gives a false impression of what kind of jobs are competitively available. Must be nice to be in the good ole boy network. Not advertising jobs is bs. I understand that a personal recommendation from someone you know is the best way to judge an applicant, some people who suck ass have great resumes, but that's little comfort to those of us without useful connections.

I met the chief of our department at the ASA. No connections... just hit it off. I was lined up with GHA in Houston... by cold turkey calling. But yes... I'm sure it's nice to be in that network.

 

[sevoflurane]

Try these guys: http://www.gaswork.com/post/118958

A little bit of a dumpy hospital, but good guys and good case variety.

400K+ and 10weeks vaca Q6 call. Dr. Yarber, Dr. Joy and the rest of their group are solid dudes. No buy in. Immediate partnership and alpine living.

Regional, Cardiac, Peds all represented. NO CRNA's. They just took over another ASC.

Spokane is my type of town. Not far from Coeurdalene Idaho and close to Schwitzer Mountain.

 

[CristaGalli]

Very well said...

Money can only buy so much. I will never take a job in BFE, even if i get paid a million dollars a year. We only have one life, and I'd like to spend it living somewhere i love. I'll willingly make half as much, ( and heck, in california's case, pay twice as much for living expenses. )

C'mon man, we all know you're going to be the future managing partner of your father's practice, so this job search discussion does not apply to you. Haha just kidding. As a current intern, I really appreciate your perspective (both as a med student and the son of a private practice anesthesiologist) on discussions in this forum, keep 'em coming....

 

[karizma098]

C'mon man, we all know you're going to be the future managing partner of your father's practice, so this job search discussion does not apply to you. Haha just kidding. As a current intern, I really appreciate your perspective (both as a med student and the son of a private practice anesthesiologist) on discussions in this forum, keep 'em coming....

haha, thanks.

yeah that would rock, but i've got to match anesthesia first. =)

 

[Jay K]

I was able to see my gas-passing wife blow up a pigs foot with a .44 caliber Magnum.

Good god, you really ARE living the dream... I couldn't get any greener with envy.