Should I still take USMLE?

[JimBone905]

8 weeks before exam: AMBOSS SA: 215
6 weeks before exam: UWSA1: 225
5 weeks before exam: COMSAE: 520
4-5 weeks before exam: NBME 25: 205 (yikes...)

~1000 questions into uworld and i plan on finishing it before my exam (~4 weeks away) along with at least 2 more NBME and UWSA2.

Should I still take USMLE considering my performance on the NBME? I heard the NBMEs are tough, but I was shook once i got my score back

Edit:
225 UWSA2
Acrual: 227

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[calivianya]

If you have four weeks left, it’s still too early to make that decision.

Take UWSA2 a few days before your test date. If you don’t like where your score is on that, don’t take it. My UWSA 2 only overpredicted my score by 2 points, so it was incredibly close for me.

 

[JimBone905]

If you have four weeks left, it’s still too early to make that decision.

Take UWSA2 a few days before your test date. If you don’t like where your score is on that, don’t take it. My UWSA 2 only overpredicted my score by 2 points, so it was incredibly close for me.

Do you think the NBME 25 score is a little low? I'm not sure how to interpret it because it's rather new...

 

[calivianya]

Do you think the NBME 25 score is a little low? I'm not sure how to interpret it because it's rather new...

All of those NBMEs underpredict pretty ferociously, often by 20-ish points. The last one I took before my test (one of the 20 somethings) underpredicted me by 11. A couple I took were 30+ points below where I scored. I don’t remember which is which at this point.

 

[Goro]

8 weeks before exam: AMBOSS SA: 215
6 weeks before exam: UWSA1: 225
5 weeks before exam: COMSAE: 520
4-5 weeks before exam: NBME 25: 205 (yikes...)

~1000 questions into uworld and i plan on finishing it before my exam (~4 weeks away) along with at least 2 more NBME and UWSA2.

Should I still take USMLE considering my performance on the NBME? I heard the NBMEs are tough, but I was shook once i got my score back

What is your pre-clinical GPA?

 

[Ho0v-man]

My highest nbme under predicted me by over 20 points. Uwsa2 is where it’s at. Keep grinding!

 

[JimBone905]

What is your pre-clinical GPA?

84. Lowest grade is a 79

 

[Goro]

84. Lowest grade is a 79

Go for it. You're in a good spot.

 

[JimBone905]

Go for it. You're in a good spot.

Would it be a good idea to extend my dedicated by 2 weeks to try and get a 2nd pass through uworld? would be taking it june 1st instead of may 22nd. I dont think I can finish uworld otherwise

 

[Ho0v-man]

Would it be a good idea to extend my dedicated by 2 weeks to try and get a 2nd pass through uworld? would be taking it june 1st instead of may 22nd. I dont think I can finish uworld otherwise

If you can finish uworld before the exam then don’t push out your date. You’ll burn out. I’m not sure how an extra two weeks goes from not finishing to finishing twice.

 

[JimBone905]

If you can finish uworld before the exam then don’t push out your date. You’ll burn out. I’m not sure how an extra two weeks goes from not finishing to finishing twice.

Sorry, 2nd pass is too optimistic I guess. I would probably be able to take an extra NBME and do a lot of the questions I got wrong on uworld again. Maybe I'm just getting cold feet

 

[Ho0v-man]

Sorry, 2nd pass is too optimistic I guess. I would probably be able to take an extra NBME and do a lot of the questions I got wrong on uworld again. Maybe I'm just getting cold feet

That’s normal. Keep grinding. I tried to just redo my incorrects and just dipped in productivity. Ended up just doing anki and free120. Highly recommend free120 over any nbme.

 

[Goro]

Would it be a good idea to extend my dedicated by 2 weeks to try and get a 2nd pass through uworld? would be taking it june 1st instead of may 22nd. I dont think I can finish uworld otherwise

Yes

 

[Billroth_III]

That’s normal. Keep grinding. I tried to just redo my incorrects and just dipped in productivity. Ended up just doing anki and free120. Highly recommend free120 over any nbme.

I played around with a block of free120, how similar is it to the real deal?

I'm on my 2nd go through of UWorld and test is 1.5 months out.

Shooting for a 235+

 

[Osteosaur]

I found NBME 18 and UWSA2 to predict within 2 points of my score. I believe these have been very predictive for others, too.

NBME 21, 19, and 16 underpredicted by like 15 points.

You're going to be studying this material for COMLEX anyway, right? Keep at it, take 18 and UWSA closer to your date. You had one bad exam. Your others are still scores that would be an asset to your applications.

 

[JimBone905]

I found NBME 18 and UWSA2 to predict within 2 points of my score. I believe these have been very predictive for others, too.

NBME 21, 19, and 16 underpredicted by like 15 points.

You're going to be studying this material for COMLEX anyway, right? Keep at it, take 18 and UWSA closer to your date. You had one bad exam. Your others are still scores that would be an asset to your applications.

unfortunately those NBME are not available anymore and I am stuck with NBME 25-30 (finished 25). Ill definitely save UWSA2 for close to the end! I have heard that the NBME tend to underpredict, but I've also heard that UWSA tend to overpredict.

 

[Ho0v-man]

I played around with a block of free120, how similar is it to the real deal?

I'm on my 2nd go through of UWorld and test is 1.5 months out.

Shooting for a 235+

Felt very similar to the free 120. And Ben whites explanations were great

 

[JimBone905]

Just to update:

NBME 26: 207 - 2 weeks ago
NBME 29: 217 - 1 week ago
UWSA 2: 225! (same score as uwsa1 wtf) - Yesterday
61% done with UW with a 61% correct average (lol)

... am i still in a good place to get a 220+? exam in FIVE DAYS (FREAKING THE FK OUT)

 

[Ho0v-man]

Yes. Do free 120 in like 2-3 days and review it the next day with the Ben white explanations.

 

[Surgeon D.O.]

I did not realize how real the pre-STEP freakout was but I am right there too man. Hang in there

 

[JimBone905]

What I find strange is that the %correct average on uwsa2 is like 67%and my % correct was also 67... yet my percentile was 10 points off from the average score people get on it? How can there be such a crazy large gap between scores but still get the same % correct?

 

[Captain_Falcon]

What I find strange is that the %correct average on uwsa2 is like 67%and my % correct was also 67... yet my percentile was 10 points off from the average score people get on it? How can there be such a crazy large gap between scores but still get the same % correct?

If you miss easier questions the curve is harsher. It is much better to answer all easy to medium difficulty questions correct and have most of your wrong answers be on hard ones (i.e. ones that most people will miss) versus getting all hard questions right but missing easy ones

 

[Surgeon D.O.]

If you miss easier questions the curve is harsher. It is much better to answer all easy to medium difficulty questions correct and have most of your wrong answers be on hard ones (i.e. ones that most people will miss) versus getting all hard questions right but missing easy ones

I have noticed this recently as well.

If I miss a couple that has >75% answered correctly, even if I grab a few that only 40% get right, I am below average.

 

[Captain_Falcon]

I have noticed this recently as well.

If I miss a couple that has >75% answered correctly, even if I grab a few that only 40% get right, I am below average.

The key is to be the right kind of dumb

 

[JimBone905]

last update:
took free 120 and got 78%
(my dumb ass was doing it 1 block at a time instead of all at once, but i didnt take any breaks between blocks, just added up the scores).

Is it just me or did it seem a little easier than Uworld?

Step 1 in 3 days!

 

[Captain_Falcon]

last update:
took free 120 and got 78%
(my dumb ass was doing it 1 block at a time instead of all at once, but i didnt take any breaks between blocks, just added up the scores).

Is it just me or did it seem a little easier than Uworld?

Step 1 in 3 days!

Yeah I also thought it was definitely easier than UW. My % correct was 6-8 higher than my typical UW block

 

[JimBone905]

Yeah I also thought it was definitely easier than UW. My % correct was 6-8 higher than my typical UW block

so with a UWSA2 of 225 and a free 120 of 78%, am i likely to still get around those scores on the real deal?

 

[Ho0v-man]

last update:
took free 120 and got 78%
(my dumb ass was doing it 1 block at a time instead of all at once, but i didnt take any breaks between blocks, just added up the scores).

Is it just me or did it seem a little easier than Uworld?

Step 1 in 3 days!

The real thing felt mostly like the free 120 with some random sprinkling of uworld difficulty. I remember that my first few questions were the hardest ones I had the whole day which was not encouraging to say the least.

 

[Captain_Falcon]

so with a UWSA2 of 225 and a free 120 of 78%, am i likely to still get around those scores on the real deal?

Supposedly UW2 is the "best" predictor. But you can find an online predictor that has you input all of your practice scores for the given forms plus your UW% correct and it will give you a predicted score with a 95% confidence interval range so check that out (predict my step score)

The real thing felt mostly like the free 120 with some random sprinkling of uworld difficulty. I remember that my first few questions were the hardest ones I had the whole day which was not encouraging to say the least.

My first 2 blocks were easily the hardest, so i had a similar experience lol

 

[Surgeon D.O.]

Are you guys saying that STEP feels / is easier than UWorld?

 

[Ho0v-man]

Are you guys saying that STEP feels / is easier than UWorld?

It did to me. I kept waiting for that extra gotcha and it didn’t really happen. There really are questions that are just something something India ink—> what’s the microorganism or treatment?

The hardest part is keeping going after 5-6 hours. The mental fatigue and stress of it all starts making it harder than uworld. But content wise I think it’s on par or a little easier than uworld. However, since everyone uses uworld, this isn’t really a distinct advantage.

 

[Ho0v-man]

One thing I’ll throw out that made step 1 harder than uworld in a way was that after a while of doing uworld you start to answer questions by thinking “what’s this question trying to teach me?”. That doesn’t happen on the real deal. It just sees if you know it or don’t. It’s not a big deal. But I consciously remember having to adjust to that in my first block on test day.

 

[JimBone905]

Any tips on filtering out experimental questions?

 

[JimBone905]

UPDATE:

got a 538 on my comlex, still waiting on USMLE july 7th.
Is this a good score?
What are some realistic programs that i can match into with this score? can i land an academic internal medicine residency?

 

[Ho0v-man]

UPDATE:

got a 538 on my comlex, still waiting on USMLE july 7th.
Is this a good score?
What are some realistic programs that i can match into with this score? can i land an academic internal medicine residency?

Since you took step, it’ll all come down to step. Your comlex won’t matter at all unless you don’t report step.

 

[JimBone905]

Since you took step, it’ll all come down to step. Your comlex won’t matter at all unless you don’t report step.

I hope I do well on step but if I just report COMLEX, would this be good enough? Outcomes last year show 59/76 matched with scored 501-550

 

[Ho0v-man]

I hope I do well on step but if I just report COMLEX, would this be good enough? Outcomes last year show 59/76 matched with scored 501-550

Yeah but that’s borderline useless in the field with most residency positions. They could have all matched community programs, all matched academic, or mixed.

It also ignores the data point that includes how many of them are comlex-only applicants. Half of those applicants may have taken step and had that score ignored, for example.

The only thing you’ll know right now is anecdotes from people who matched academic IM with only comlex. And when you get those anecdotes from SDN, they’ll be even more worthless. This is because in my experience everyone at a communiversity program is super quick to describe their program as “mid-tier”.

I know this isn’t what you want to hear. But we won’t know anything until step comes back. Sorry.

 

[JimBone905]

Yeah but that’s borderline useless in the field with most residency positions. They could have all matched community programs, all matched academic, or mixed.

It also ignores the data point that includes how many of them are comlex-only applicants. Half of those applicants may have taken step and had that score ignored, for example.

The only thing you’ll know right now is anecdotes from people who matched academic IM with only comlex. And when you get those anecdotes from SDN, they’ll be even more worthless. This is because in my experience everyone at a communiversity program is super quick to describe their program as “mid-tier”.

I know this isn’t what you want to hear. But we won’t know anything until step comes back. Sorry.

227 step 1. Good for IM and anesth? Charts show im about the same still

 

[Ho0v-man]

227 step 1. Good for IM and anesth? Charts show im about the same still

IM yeah. Low tier community and large community places with fellowships are likely still on the table. It depends on your give on location.

After this last years anesthesia ridiculousness, I’m not confident at all about stratifying candidates for the field.

edit: meant low tier university and large community.

 

[JimBone905]

IM yeah. Low tier community and large community places with fellowships are likely still on the table. It depends on your give on location.

After this last years anesthesia ridiculousness, I’m not confident at all about stratifying candidates for the field.

Am I not good for academic IM? And I looked up some places for anesthesia and they have averages at 225-230 so shouldn't i be ok for those? 2020 charting shows like an 80% chance to match too

 

[drducky.]

Am I not good for academic IM? And I looked up some places for anesthesia and they have averages at 225-230 so shouldn't i be ok for those? 2020 charting shows like an 80% chance to match too

I’ve been following this too and it seems like last year DOs got screwed really hard in semi-competitive specialties like gas. Depending on which programs you looked up, that 225-230 average might be distributed like 220 avg for MD and 240 avg for DO or something.

 

[JimBone905]

I’ve been following this too and it seems like last year DOs got screwed really hard in semi-competitive specialties like gas. Depending on which programs you looked up, that 225-230 average might be distributed like 220 avg for MD and 240 avg for DO or something.

Mean for DO IS 233

 

[Ho0v-man]

Am I not good for academic IM? And I looked up some places for anesthesia and they have averages at 225-230 so shouldn't i be ok for those? 2020 charting shows like an 80% chance to match too

IM: It’s not necessarily a reach…but not a lock either. It’s going to be location-dependent. You’re marginally below the 50th percentile. Like if you’re in the Midwest you’re probably good. If you’re going for Cali, probably not. It’s also going to depend on the rest of your app (step 2, aways, letters, +/- research). You’re not in a position to coast into university programs like your colleagues who scored 30 points higher than you. But you’re certainly not out of the running either.

Gas: another poster above said it well. This past match was a blood bath and A LOT of people who’d been planning of anesthesia since day one got blindsided. Last year I would have agreed with you.

 

[JimBone905]

IM: It’s not necessarily a reach…but not a lock either. It’s going to be location-dependent. You’re marginally below the 50th percentile. Like if you’re in the Midwest you’re probably good. If you’re going for Cali, probably not. It’s also going to depend on the rest of your app (step 2, aways, letters, +/- research). You’re not in a position to coast into university programs like your colleagues who scored 30 points higher than you. But you’re certainly not out of the running either.

Gas: another poster above said it well. This past match was a blood bath and A LOT of people who’d been planning of anesthesia since day one got blindsided. Last year I would have agreed with you.

What was the avg IM and anesth match for DO? data showed 227 and 233 for im and anesth in 2020 which sound reasonable. So would applying Anesth with IM as backup be reasonable?

 

[Ho0v-man]

What was the avg IM and anesth match for DO? data showed 227 and 233 for im and anesth in 2020 which sound reasonable. So would applying Anesth with IM as backup be reasonable?

Yeah. Just gotta get letters/subis for both. A jump on step 2 will help. Seems like IM likes step 2 more.

 

[drducky.]

Mean for DO IS 233

Crazy the mean was only 227 in 2018

 

[JimBone905]

Yeah. Just gotta get letters/subis for both. A jump on step 2 will help. Seems like IM likes step 2 more.

If I want to match into a decent community IM with in-house fellows, can i match in the northeast? trying to use residency explorer but every cutoff is at 210 or 220, not sure where to get accurate information about the programs. I'll try to get a 230+ on step 2 and do sub-i's at programs where I want to go to. I was told by an IM resident from my school that matched in the program that I want to match into (his scores are slightly higher) that I don't need a sub-i for IM (he said he didn't do one there), how true is this?

 

[Ho0v-man]

If I want to match into a decent community IM with in-house fellows, can i match in the northeast? trying to use residency explorer but every cutoff is at 210 or 220, not sure where to get accurate information about the programs. I'll try to get a 230+ on step 2 and do sub-i's at programs where I want to go to. I was told by an IM resident from my school that matched in the program that I want to match into (his scores are slightly higher) that I don't need a sub-i for IM (he said he didn't do one there), how true is this?

I’ll just pm you

 

[FutureDoctor5000]

IM yeah. Low tier community and large community places with fellowships are likely still on the table. It depends on your give on location.

After this last years anesthesia ridiculousness, I’m not confident at all about stratifying candidates for the field.

Low tier community or low tier university? I didn’t even know there were tiers among community IM programs really haha

 

[Ho0v-man]

Low tier community or low tier university? I didn’t even know there were tiers among community IM programs really haha

Whoa, good pickup. I meant low tier university and large community. My bad. Will edit.