ThoracicGuy

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-Electives during your medical school.
-Sub-Internships/Externships after graduation (limited positions in the country, mainly in Washington DC). There was a program named Providence hospital in DC which closed it's residency program last year. Not sure if its still functional. Another psychiatry program in DC is known to offer externships in Psychiatry and hire the externs as residents.

-Non-ACGME accredited clinical fellowships (look for Geriatric medicine fellowships, sub-specialties in Neurology (Epilepsy/Neurophysiology/Neuroimmunology/Autonomic disorders/Headache).
-Courses and workshops will be good add

-Research fellowships and making 1-2 publication per year at the field of your interest will be influential towards the residency program of your choice.

Other things like assistant, medical billing or type the medical notes really not that helpful. Infact, some clinics would take advantage of the applicant's situation to have them work as cheap labor.
Those can all be nice, but they aren't really the clinical experience that residency programs would look for. Certainly something is better than nothing, though.
 
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-Electives during your medical school.
-Sub-Internships/Externships after graduation (limited positions in the country, mainly in Washington DC). There was a program named Providence hospital in DC which closed it's residency program last year. Not sure if its still functional. Another psychiatry program in DC is known to offer externships in Psychiatry and hire the externs as residents.

-Non-ACGME accredited clinical fellowships (look for Geriatric medicine fellowships, sub-specialties in Neurology (Epilepsy/Neurophysiology/Neuroimmunology/Autonomic disorders/Headache).
-Courses and workshops will be good add

-Research fellowships and making 1-2 publication per year at the field of your interest will be influential towards the residency program of your choice.

Other things like assistant, medical billing or type the medical notes really not that helpful. Infact, some clinics would take advantage of the applicant's situation to have them work as cheap labor.
Thanks for this. I finished all my M4 requirements so don't think I have the option to extend graduation, maybe if I do an online MHA/MPH. The issue is that my Step attempts are what prevented my match so I feel that graduating and taking Step 3 and passing would be the most beneficial. Theoretically, I'm thinking of graduating in May, taking Step 3, and doing an online Masters in Health Care Administration through my school while volunteering/working at a local clinic to keep up my clinical experience. I looked at externships but most seem geared towards US-IMGs and require 5-6 months commitment. I feel like if I do no clinic then programs would question that,
 
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Highway2med

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Did any of the UN MATCHED had Referees call for them supporting their application? Please reply with yes or no. If unmatched had no referees called for them than we can rule in that it is one of the factors! Thanks!
 
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I had no one to call for me, my dean's office was busy preparing Match Day for those who matched. I don't know how much calls helped though since most calls I made went to VM and I think the programs just chose based on scores/connections.
 
Mar 27, 2019
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Did any of the UN MATCHED had Referees call for them supporting their application? Please reply with yes or no. If unmatched had no referees called for them than we can rule in that it is one of the factors! Thanks!
This isn't the 90s anymore. You can't have people call on your behalf till after the last soap round finishes, or they call you for an interview. Programs can technically get in big trouble for that.
 

ThoracicGuy

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Thanks for this. I finished all my M4 requirements so don't think I have the option to extend graduation, maybe if I do an online MHA/MPH. The issue is that my Step attempts are what prevented my match so I feel that graduating and taking Step 3 and passing would be the most beneficial. Theoretically, I'm thinking of graduating in May, taking Step 3, and doing an online Masters in Health Care Administration through my school while volunteering/working at a local clinic to keep up my clinical experience. I looked at externships but most seem geared towards US-IMGs and require 5-6 months commitment. I feel like if I do no clinic then programs would question that,
You should talk with your school dean about extending graduation. That allows you to still get clinical experience/more letters. A MHA/MPH won't add too much for you. Step 3 may help marginally, but applying as a senior student will probably help more.
 
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You should talk with your school dean about extending graduation. That allows you to still get clinical experience/more letters. A MHA/MPH won't add too much for you. Step 3 may help marginally, but applying as a senior student will probably help more.
Thanks for your advice. I finished all of my M4 requirements but was thinking of doing my school's MHA as an excuse to extend graduation if I can since I would be doing dual MD/MHA. The reason I was thinking about Step 3 is because the main reason I didn't match is that programs wouldn't look at my application because of my Step failures so I was thinking taking Step 3 and passing would help with that. But doing that means I'd have to graduate and apply as a US Grad which I heard leads to programs filtering you out even further and there's a risk of failing Step 3 too.
 
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Hello guys, I am currently researching programs with spots in IM. Would like to know: are the chances for fellowship the same for those doing the primary care track as those doing the categorical track?

Thank you for your response.
 

Highway2med

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Dude, after the interview, they can. I don’t think you have credentials to be so sure.

This isn't the 90s anymore. You can't have people call on your behalf till after the last soap round finishes, or they call you for an interview. Programs can technically get in big trouble for that.
 

aProgDirector

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Hello guys, I am currently researching programs with spots in IM. Would like to know: are the chances for fellowship the same for those doing the primary care track as those doing the categorical track?

Thank you for your response.
It will depend on the program. In general, yes. But some Primary care residencies have much less time on critical care or inpatient services. And often the leadership of the program will want you to go into PC, so if you arrive and in your first 2 months say "So I want to be a cardiologist..." you may not get great support.

It also depends on the field. If you want one of the "outpatient" fellowships - Endo, Rheum, etc -- some PC tracts will be perfectly fine with that.
 
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Mar 27, 2019
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Dude, after the interview, they can. I don’t think you have credentials to be so sure.
Yes, AFTER you get an interview, you can contact them and ask others to contact them on your behalf. If you look at the quote you made of what I said, I explicitally said: "after the last soap round finishes, or they call you for an interview"

You made it sound like the free for all it used to be years ago where you had every attending you knew calling up open programs they knew someone at.

The rules are all written down and repeatedly emailed to everyone involved, dozens of times, PDs and applicants alike, with very threatening language telling you what constitutes a match violation. And every EULA you have to accept at every step of the process spells this out as well.

I'm pretty sure anyone who has the "credentials" of being able to read an EULA and understand what it says is qualified to remark on this. However, most people don't read EULAs.
 
Mar 26, 2020
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Hello

I am a 2020 graduate from Saskatchewan medical school in Canada. So, I am a Canadian graduate.

I did not match in CaRMS 2020 in Vascular surgery. I am really interested in Vasc Surg. Before immigration to Canada in 2012, I did undergrad medicine before in EGYPT and graduated in 2002 and trained as a vascular surgeon in a 3 years residency training program in Egypt.

the reason I did undergrad medicine again in Canada is to make myself a Canadian medical Graduate.

do I have a chance to match in Vasc surg residency program in the states???

Thanks
 
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It will depend on the program. In general, yes. But some Primary care residencies have much less time on critical care or inpatient services. And often the leadership of the program will want you to go into PC, so if you arrive and in your first 2 months say "So I want to be a cardiologist..." you may not get great support.

It also depends on the field. If you want one of the "outpatient" fellowships - Endo, Rheum, etc -- some PC tracts will be perfectly fine with that.
Thank you very much
 

aProgDirector

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Hello

I am a 2020 graduate from Saskatchewan medical school in Canada. So, I am a Canadian graduate.

I did not match in CaRMS 2020 in Vascular surgery. I am really interested in Vasc Surg. Before immigration to Canada in 2012, I did undergrad medicine before in EGYPT and graduated in 2002 and trained as a vascular surgeon in a 3 years residency training program in Egypt.

the reason I did undergrad medicine again in Canada is to make myself a Canadian medical Graduate.

do I have a chance to match in Vasc surg residency program in the states???

Thanks
Honestly, probably not. You would need the USMLE exams, which you might not have taken. You'd need significant research. And you probably need a visa. And you're coming from what I'm sure is a good medical school, but not one that many in the states have ever heard of. And if you were not competitive enough to get a spot in Canada, you may not be competitive in the US.

You would have great difficulty just taking the USMLE exams in time for next year's application cycle, given that they are all shut down now and when they reopen will likely prioritize US grads.

If you had lots of research, then maybe.

If you spend 2 years trying and don't get a spot, then you may find it hard to get ANY spot.

You can try again next year in Canada again, but you should also apply to another field and ensure you get a spot.
 

Braveheart1985

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Hello

I am a 2020 graduate from Saskatchewan medical school in Canada. So, I am a Canadian graduate.

I did not match in CaRMS 2020 in Vascular surgery. I am really interested in Vasc Surg. Before immigration to Canada in 2012, I did undergrad medicine before in EGYPT and graduated in 2002 and trained as a vascular surgeon in a 3 years residency training program in Egypt.

the reason I did undergrad medicine again in Canada is to make myself a Canadian medical Graduate.

do I have a chance to match in Vasc surg residency program in the states???

Thanks
I agree with the previous comment about the research and USMLEs.
If you didn't finish USMLEs, then this is the first thing to do.
If you have it handy, then find the vascular program of your interest and ask them for research position. This way they will get to know you better.
Residency is competitive in USA. Many factors being considered here including scores, experience , year of graduation and age. I have heard it from some attendings involve in the selection process, they said they don't like to get older applicants because they would feel harsh in bossing them around (especially if the attending is younger than the applicant). It is not impossible, though, since I have seen residents in late 30s and early 40s before.
 
Mar 26, 2020
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I agree with the previous comment about the research and USMLEs.
If you didn't finish USMLEs, then this is the first thing to do.
If you have it handy, then find the vascular program of your interest and ask them for research position. This way they will get to know you better.
Residency is competitive in USA. Many factors being considered here including scores, experience , year of graduation and age. I have heard it from some attendings involve in the selection process, they said they don't like to get older applicants because they would feel harsh in bossing them around (especially if the attending is younger than the applicant). It is not impossible, though, since I have seen residents in late 30s and early 40s before.

thanks a lot for the advice

I will graduate in 2020. If I did not match this year, I will take year 5 in med school here in Canada and will postpone my graduation to 2021. I did USMLE step 1 and 2CK but with average scores. I will do the CS part in Nov 2020.

I know that I am weak on the research part because I did only a summer dean research project with a vascular surg staff here in SK, Canada.
 

shelf exam 1959

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@ aprogdirector.
step 1 -213, step 2 -229, CS - Pass and step 3 222, ( all in the first attempt ) Canadian, any advice on how to prepare me for the next match. thanks,I did not match this year. Caribbean medical school, 2 years of rotations in the US, Any advice will be appreciated.
 
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With average scores, minimal research, and needing a visa your chances of getting a vasc surgery spot in the US is zero.

Thank you so much for the advice

Does it make any difference if I am Canadian graduating from a Canadian medical school with a clinical vascular surgery experience in Canada?
 

aProgDirector

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@ aprogdirector.
step 1 -213, step 2 -229, CS - Pass and step 3 222, ( all in the first attempt ) Canadian, any advice on how to prepare me for the next match. thanks,I did not match this year. Caribbean medical school, 2 years of rotations in the US, Any advice will be appreciated.
If you've already taken and passed S3, it means you've already graduated, perhaps quite awhile ago. How many times have you tried to match? What field(s)? How many applications did you send out, and get?
 

shelf exam 1959

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If you've already taken and passed S3, it means you've already graduated, perhaps quite awhile ago. How many times have you tried to match? What field(s)? How many applications did you send out, and get?
2019 graduate, just this match, passed step 3 I took recently got the results only last week.
 
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aProgDirector

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You've got weak-ish USMLE scores, and need a visa, so that's going to limit your options. But if you apply to reasonable programs, you should usually get more interviews than that.

Why did you grad in 2019 and not apply for the 2019 match? I feel like there's still part of the story you're not including.
 

shelf exam 1959

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You've got weak-ish USMLE scores, and need a visa, so that's going to limit your options. But if you apply to reasonable programs, you should usually get more interviews than that.

Why did you grad in 2019 and not apply for the 2019 match? I feel like there's still part of the story you're not including.
I graduated only Sep in 2019. This is first match after my grad. there nothing to hide let me know

When you say Reasonable program can you plez explain a little bit more so that I can follow that
 
Mar 19, 2020
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Anyone who went through this in the past have any success finding a position post Match? What did you do and when do positions open up? I haven't had any luck so far.
 

aProgDirector

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I graduated only Sep in 2019. This is first match after my grad. there nothing to hide let me know

When you say Reasonable program can you plez explain a little bit more so that I can follow that
Why did you graduate in Sept? Most people would graduate in May.

Reasonable programs = programs that are in non-competitive areas of the country where students from your school have placed before.
 

shelf exam 1959

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okay thanks for the explanation, will do in the next match. I graduated on Sep 6th, 2019 that is when my school graduation date after finishing all the required steps.
 

aProgDirector

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Not trying to torture you, but something sounds wrong. You should have taken your steps in a timeline that allowed you to graduate on cycle. If you required extra time for the step exams, if you didn't schedule your exams in a timely fashion, or if you failed some and had to retake -- all of those could be problems.
 

GoSpursGo

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okay thanks for the explanation, will do in the next match. I graduated on Sep 6th, 2019 that is when my school graduation date after finishing all the required steps.
To echo @aProgDirector , it seems like either your school failed to impress upon you the importance of taking the USMLEs in an appropriate timeline, or you decided to take extra time to study which resulted in you graduating off-cycle.

In any event, that can't be changed now, but what you have been doing since graduation is hugely important. If you've been doing some sort of medically-related work in Canada or near your med school, then you potentially could just cast an even wider net next year and hope that step 3 helps. If you've been sitting at home hoping that this year's match would work out... then you're a re-applicant with a time gap in your CV, and that would be a problem. Given the current state of affairs in the world, I'm not even sure how you would go about trying to find a meaningful job between now and the next match cycle.
 

ThoracicGuy

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okay thanks for the explanation, will do in the next match. I graduated on Sep 6th, 2019 that is when my school graduation date after finishing all the required steps.
Also of importance is probably the school you are from as well. Places like St. George and Ross will place people better than some of the other schools in the Caribbean. Finding places were your school's grads have matched is probably the best thing to search for to help guide your chances, second being places that take caribbean grads in general.
 

washboardEarth

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i just want to say to those who didn't match/soap this year that my heart really goes out for you. the SOAP thread here and on reddit were really helpful. i feel guilty in a way because . this process is messed up, not you. it is ridiculous that we have 2000+ U.S. citizens going unmatched and 4000+ FMGs entering . no hate to FMGs, i am a US citizen today because my parent was one. but to cast out the US citizens who have mortgage-level of debt is more signs that this is a failure of a country. just like veterans living homeless on the street. i am so sorry. it could have been you in the SOAP spot and me posting about post-match scramble. there is no coherence to this process unless you are a completely brainwashed med student who gets 230+ on steps (with the aid of stimulant prescriptions, if wanted) and kisses butt on rotations. i wish you all the best.
 
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GoSpursGo

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Thanks gospursgo. Can you also explain where to find the research position and how to go about it .
Wish I could tell you. Regular job posting websites like Indeed or LinkedIn may have some leads, but a lot of times these kinds of positions are word of mouth. If there are any recent grads from your school at university programs who can ask around for you, you might get lucky there.

Realistically, it's about using every connection you have, not getting discouraged by getting told "no" a lot, and ultimately getting lucky that one slim-chance lead pays off in the end. You also need to be willing to cold-email and cold-call places that you have only a tangential connection to. And therein lies the problem--if you don't have one of these jobs NOW, it would be very hard to find one and get any meaningful experience by 9/15 even in a normal environment.

What *have* you been doing since graduation?
 
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shelf exam 1959

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Wish I could tell you. Regular job posting websites like Indeed or LinkedIn may have some leads, but a lot of times these kinds of positions are word of mouth. If there are any recent grads from your school at university programs who can ask around for you, you might get lucky there.

Realistically, it's about using every connection you have, not getting discouraged by getting told "no" a lot, and ultimately getting lucky that one slim-chance lead pays off in the end. You also need to be willing to cold-email and cold-call places that you have only a tangential connection to. And therein lies the problem--if you don't have one of these jobs NOW, it would be very hard to find one and get any meaningful experience by 9/15 even in a normal environment.

What *have* you been doing since graduation?
I have been tutoring for step 1 and step 2 and step 3 students on skype. that is the only option I have for now
 

GoSpursGo

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I have been tutoring for step 1 and step 2 and step 3 students on skype. that is the only option I have for now
Start reaching out to alumni from your school at programs across the country now. Honestly not sure what you can hope to get at this time, but you need to find something that is going to improve your application from when you were unsuccessful this year. Having step 3 will help, and you can apply more broadly, so that's something... but ideally you would have something more meaningful on your CV for this time period.

Of course, nobody knows how PDs will view a gap in the CV during this time period given how crazy the world is with COVID right now. You certainly wouldn't be the only one.
 

shelf exam 1959

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Start reaching out to alumni from your school at programs across the country now. Honestly not sure what you can hope to get at this time, but you need to find something that is going to improve your application from when you were unsuccessful this year. Having step 3 will help, and you can apply more broadly, so that's something... but ideally you would have something more meaningful on your CV for this time period.

Of course, nobody knows how PDs will view a gap in the CV during this time period given how crazy the world is with COVID right now. You certainly wouldn't be the only one.
Will do already did with no positive response so far, will keep doing contacting the all the contacts made during my rotations. thanks for all the right advice.
 
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