UnitedHealth CEO Murdered

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When the social contract breaks down we all return to the state of nature… and when there’s no power to appeal to, that means war.

Safe to say that CEO homeboy "broke the social contract first".

I didn't write this, but it fits:

"It's important to lead your life in such a way that when you're gunned down in public by an anonymous hitman on a NYC street that the country at large doesn't react like the Ewoks watching the second Death Star explode."
 
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It seems CEOs will take more security precautions. Its crazy that in California you are punished if you don't have health insurance but insurance can deny claims with no recourse
 
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Wouldn't the bullet just ricochet off his lats or something?

Yeah I don't know man, when the reaction to a person's death is largely positive or indifferent because of that person being at the helm of a company for the past 3-4 years during which there has been unparalleled growth largely based off of widespread denials for lifesaving care? That lady in Des Moines has a boss, who has a boss whose boss is eventually this CEO. He's at the helm, you think he's not party to these conversations, to the way his company makes decisions? Top-down leadership, the kind he was paid tens of millions for yearly, for improving the bottom line including via denials. That lady in Des Moines ain't the problem. Government clearly doesn't give a ^*#@ and if anything get ready for removing of MORE societal guardrails. We're all upper middle class or better earning mid six figures yearly so we can afford better insurance or a bigger out of pocket hit, but with wealth inequality at basically all time highs, it was only a matter of time until something like this happened. I don't think anyone can truly condone this activity, but I 100% can understand it.

There's a big difference between us and him. If I deny a patient pain meds, sure they might lash out, can't stop it and of course try and prevent it, but I'm not profiting off of declining to give them pain meds. False equivalence IMO.
With the recent documentation and billing changes, we actually make more money by prescribing the pain meds. Laugh out loud.
 
Thanks for the reminder. Back day is day after tomorrow. My posterior shoulders are my worst group.



Yes. Hey Elon; are you listening? DOGE healthcare next, please.



I'm uncomfortably comfortable with condoning this act. Something's gotta give.



Yep. The false equivalence (or at least misrepresentation of the true concept of the matter) is what bothers me most when I read some of these posts here.
Cables. Cables will solidify your shoulders.
 
Apparently UnitedHealthcare doesn't care about its former CEO. The fact that they haven't chipped in to up the $10k reward NYPD is offering speaks volumes. If they cared, they would be offering millions to help find him.
Didn’t they carry on with their investor conference?
 
Right on.
I just wish the trogs at my gym would get off of them for long enough.
I always lose patience and end up doing prone rear delt flys.

Although far from perfect you can buy a set of bands pretty cheap online and use them for face pulls. If you want to induce rage screams use em on a squat rack during peak time (preferably after taking 5+ minutes per set at low rep) but you can also use them on anything well fixed in the ground.
 
With the recent documentation and billing changes, we actually make more money by prescribing the pain meds. Laugh out loud.
well you can also “consider” Rx’ing them then not Rx them! So you are OK!

Granted there are niche cases where a dose of IM morphine x1 would drive a chart into a higher E&M bracket.
 
Although far from perfect you can buy a set of bands pretty cheap online and use them for face pulls. If you want to induce rage screams use em on a squat rack during peak time (preferably after taking 5+ minutes per set at low rep) but you can also use them on anything well fixed in the ground.

Low rep high weight?
Like, I'm taking a 4 min rest between my 5x5 sets at heavy. Volume, volume, volume.

Edit: then again, I'm never at the gym during peak times because of the broccoli cut crowd.
 
Didn’t they carry on with their investor conference?
to be fair they probably had thousands of people there. The show much go on.. Remember the memes if you were to die your replacement at the job would be there and hired before your body got to room temperature.. this is no different.
 
Low rep high weight?
Like, I'm taking a 4 min rest between my 5x5 sets at heavy. Volume, volume, volume.

Edit: then again, I'm never at the gym during peak times because of the broccoli cut crowd.

No problem with low rep specifically, it's fine. It's even fine to take forever in a squat rack as long as you're willing to rotate efficiently (assuming they are limited like they always seem to be).

My issue isn't with low rep, it's with a specific subspecies of morlocks who dwell in squat racks.

Easily recognized on necropsy by the number of brain sulci being <than the feet away you can smell axe body spray (or its modern equivalent, I don't keep up and get off my lawn), this particular group of folk enjoy the back squat at 1/4 depth and ~200lbs in an unwashed, deep-cut tank top and spend an inordinate amount of time inspecting themselves in the mirror. Mostly they are incapable of doing any exercises except squat and bench, and do not recognize the word accessory. I assume this is mostly because it exceeds the number of syllables they are comfortable with.

They tend to crop up in a month or so annually, but can prove a persistent infestation.
 
IMG_4155.jpeg
 
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No problem with low rep specifically, it's fine. It's even fine to take forever in a squat rack as long as you're willing to rotate efficiently (assuming they are limited like they always seem to be).

My issue isn't with low rep, it's with a specific subspecies of morlocks who dwell in squat racks.

Easily recognized on necropsy by the number of brain sulci being <than the feet away you can smell axe body spray (or its modern equivalent, I don't keep up and get off my lawn), this particular group of folk enjoy the back squat at 1/4 depth and ~200lbs in an unwashed, deep-cut tank top and spend an inordinate amount of time inspecting themselves in the mirror. Mostly they are incapable of doing any exercises except squat and bench, and do not recognize the word accessory. I assume this is mostly because it exceeds the number of syllables they are comfortable with.

They tend to crop up in a month or so annually, but can prove a persistent infestation.

I know the type.
I have this buddy, he's not like you describe above. He's an entry-level gymdude that has been lifting with me for a few months.
I am constantly policing him.

"That's not what that is for."
"Get your leg off of that; people put their heads there."
"Don't stand on that."
"Don't jump rope here. Go in THAT room if you want to jump rope for a whole :90 seconds during my set."

He loves to wrap a resistance band around whatever piece of equipment he can and stretch.
DUDE, get TF out of the way.
 

When I first read this I made a few generous assumptions about the guy. Thought “hey maybe he was new” or “maybe he wasn’t directly responsible, just misguided and ambitious dude who happened to work his way up keeping to grindstone”

But honestly, it sounds like he
1. Took over at start of covidish
2. Is the spot that doubled salary in 2021 (20x 2015 starting)
3. Directly championed the expansion of crappy tech to become the leader (by a mile) in denying payment

I don’t condone murder. It’s obviously wrong.

I also don’t condone murdering thousands and people bsing like he somehow didn’t do it or it didn’t happen because we didn’t count the number.

What’s so messed up about this to me is that even though what this ceo did was unquestionably evil and morally reprehensible on every level, it was also what he was obligated to do to fulfill his duty to shareholders. They whacked one mole, there will be many more.

For every histrionic politician with a surprised pikachu face: you fing made this, and they damn well know it anyway. It shouldn’t be legal to do what the insurance companies do. Ask a five year old what it is if you take something (money) and don’t give back what the person paid for (service). It’s theft with a few extra steps, and they are robbing people at the most vulnerable times of their lives.

If no one is providing a legal Avenue to deal with the frustrations that arise illegal options are gonna get pursued.
 
to be fair they probably had thousands of people there. The show much go on.. Remember the memes if you were to die your replacement at the job would be there and hired before your body got to room temperature.. this is no different.
Still a bad look that just reinforces people's beliefs about these companies.
 
All this yah-yah.
Live by the sword, die by the sword.
You eff around with peoples lives, don't be surprised when they take yours.
This man killed people.
Someone killed him.
Simple as.

This man didn’t kill people. That’s where you are wrong.

Otherwise I agree and support just about 100% of what’s written. I find these private insurance companies particularly abhorrent. I’m not a supporter of single payer, but I will gravitate there if people continue to be denied claims and socked with 100,000s dollars worth of bills.

The whole premise of using insurance to pay for everything in health care is egregiously flawed.
 
This man didn’t kill people. That’s where you are wrong.

We're not gonna agree on "this man didn't kill people."
This man killed more people than people that I know that directly killed people, instead of indirectly like this man did.

I find these private insurance companies particularly abhorrent. I’m not a supporter of single payer, but I will gravitate there if people continue to be denied claims and socked with 100,000s dollars worth of bills.

Hey, we can agree here.

The whole premise of using insurance to pay for everything in health care is egregiously flawed.

Sure, we can agree here - but it shouldn't cost me 2300 a month and then pay for nothing. If you're charging me that much, you had better damn well pay for everything up until my 2300 a month. Unfortunately, it's the insurers who drew up this gambit.
 
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We're not gonna agree on "this man didn't kill people."

This man killed more people than many people that I know that directly killed people.
Not so much him but certainly united. Not allowing for treatments or further testing that a doctor ordered certainly led to the deaths of patients.

The issue is the insurers shouldn’t be in that position. Americans need to consider their health and be more active and aware of things. In the end this dude likely did cause the deaths of a number of people. Not a small number either. That being said I dont believe in violence against those who do not perpetuate violence.

United and the other insurers are simply playing the game congress (with a lot of their lobbying dollars) has put forth.

We don’t have to like the game that is being played but we should play it to the best of our abilities. I found the CMG system particularly disgusting and their business model of being OON and bankrupting people is sickening. That being said do keep in mind that anyone who has seen 10k or more patients in the old system has surely been a contributor to peoples financial woes and their decision to commit suicide. I dont think that blood is on the hands of those docs.

But before we all get high and mighty on our high horse thats a choice you each made. Not quite as bad but it is akin to the SS guards in WW2. We can all pump out the excuses of not having options where you live, best job around, etc etc.. in the end our hands arent quite as squeaky clean as we want to think it is.

The CMGs move to screw patients over directly contributed to the ability for the CMGs to pay you more. Just something to consider.
 
Not so much him but certainly united. Not allowing for treatments or further testing that a doctor ordered certainly led to the deaths of patients.

The issue is the insurers shouldn’t be in that position. Americans need to consider their health and be more active and aware of things. In the end this dude likely did cause the deaths of a number of people. Not a small number either. That being said I dont believe in violence against those who do not perpetuate violence.

United and the other insurers are simply playing the game congress (with a lot of their lobbying dollars) has put forth.

We don’t have to like the game that is being played but we should play it to the best of our abilities. I found the CMG system particularly disgusting and their business model of being OON and bankrupting people is sickening. That being said do keep in mind that anyone who has seen 10k or more patients in the old system has surely been a contributor to peoples financial woes and their decision to commit suicide. I dont think that blood is on the hands of those docs.

But before we all get high and mighty on our high horse thats a choice you each made. Not quite as bad but it is akin to the SS guards in WW2. We can all pump out the excuses of not having options where you live, best job around, etc etc.. in the end our hands arent quite as squeaky clean as we want to think it is.

The CMGs move to screw patients over directly contributed to the ability for the CMGs to pay you more. Just something to consider.

PFFFFFT.

I directly reject that I contributed to the deaths of people "in the old system" when I'm actively and directly trying thru medicine to improve, prolong, or save their lives. Get wrecked with that nonsense. I never sat in a boardroom like this mouthbreather did and tell my legions of underlings to deny as much care as they can because of profits and dividends and shares and things.
 
PFFFFFT.

I directly reject that I contributed to the deaths of people "in the old system" when I'm actively and directly trying thru medicine to improve, prolong, or save their lives. Get wrecked with that nonsense. I never sat in a boardroom like this mouthbreather did and tell my legions of underlings to deny as much care as they can because of profits and dividends and shares and things.
Sure.. but your actions led to financial ruin which had all the downstream effects. Yep.. not as bad as a UHC ceo.. but not without blame. I knew that was gonna be an unpopular opinion but I’ll stick to it. Work for a corrupt organization and their actions under your medical license are tied to you..
 
Sure.. but your actions led to financial ruin which had all the downstream effects. Yep.. not as bad as a UHC ceo.. but not without blame. I knew that was gonna be an unpopular opinion but I’ll stick to it. Work for a corrupt organization and their actions under your medical license are tied to you..

By your logic, the taxi driver that drove them to the hospital for me to do the medicine is also contributing to the financial ruin of the victim. As did the man who sold him an overpriced cheeseburger. Guess they've got blood and cheddar on their hands.
 
By your logic, the taxi driver that drove them to the hospital for me to do the medicine is also contributing to the financial ruin of the victim. As did the man who sold him an overpriced cheeseburger. Guess they've got blood and cheddar on their hands.
Not quite. The cab driver is often up front on the price or the patient has an idea. The burger the patient sees the price up front. In the ED the patient has no idea that you are OON and even less of an idea that your care is going to cost them a ton of money they dont have and the CMG is not willing to give them one break and will take them to court to get their pound of flesh. Em docs choose to work for these broken corporations. EM docs are and were pretty aware of the crpatastic biz practices these people had in place.
 
By your logic, the taxi driver that drove them to the hospital for me to do the medicine is also contributing to the financial ruin of the victim. As did the man who sold him an overpriced cheeseburger. Guess they've got blood and cheddar on their hands.
Keep in mind united blocking payment for services means those patients could pay out of pocket. The patient chooses not to.. (playing devils advocate here). They arent denying the care just the payment for such.
 
Not quite. The cab driver is often up front on the price or the patient has an idea. The burger the patient sees the price up front. In the ED the patient has no idea that you are OON and even less of an idea that your care is going to cost them a ton of money they dont have and the CMG is not willing to give them one break and will take them to court to get their pound of flesh. Em docs choose to work for these broken corporations. EM docs are and were pretty aware of the crpatastic biz practices these people had in place.
Keep in mind united blocking payment for services means those patients could pay out of pocket. The patient chooses not to.. (playing devils advocate here). They arent denying the care just the payment for such.

Those are some pretty impressive mental gymnastics to get around the inarguable fact that the physician is doing the right thing by doing the medicine. The nature and intent there is noble.

I'm also pretty certain that there's a significant number physicians who would feel the same if a CMG overlord met a similar fate.

You can call me barbaric and dumb and all the nasty things you want. This man killed tens, if not hundreds of thousands.

If the system were "perfect" (or even at least improved), our role wouldn't change.
 
They can take down their leadership bios all they want, but as publicly reportable corporations, they have to list their executives with the SEC. Third-party companies will publish this information online.

Perhaps instead of spending more money to increase their security, maybe they should look at not rejecting so many claims, making less profit, and making patients the focus of their company instead of profits.
 
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Those are some pretty impressive mental gymnastics to get around the inarguable fact that the physician is doing the right thing by doing the medicine. The nature and intent there is noble.

I'm also pretty certain that there's a significant number physicians who would feel the same if a CMG overlord met a similar fate.

You can call me barbaric and dumb and all the nasty things you want. This man killed tens, if not hundreds of thousands.

If the system were "perfect" (or even at least improved), our role wouldn't change.
It’s not about the work.. it’s about the back end of it. This dude while i agree not my favorite also provided a ton of jobs to people. Created wealth for himself and those employees and shareholders.

I had heard there was some stuff of questionable legality. The scale of what he did was simply there on the scale of their operations.

No one knows how involved he was in the whole denial thing. Personally, i think it is absurd. A doctor orders a test / medicine that is FDA approved. The insurer must pay for it. Period.. experimental stuff i get them not paying.

For me I tried to get protonix.. my insurer BCBS wouldnt pay for it.. NO BS.. so i paid the $20/month out of pocket.. $20.. beyond stupid..

If the system were perfect the side of your role you care about and see wouldnt change. The backend already has. It led to Envision, APP, and NES collapsing. Those entities use YOUR NPI (if you worked for them) and bilked both taxpayers and commercially insured patients out of BILLIONS.

That led some to be broke etc etc. Just cause many docs dont see the back end and find it “disgusting” doesnt mean it doesnt exist. Private equity didnt drop their Billions because they care 1 iota about the care you provide and the right thing you do medically. Ignoring the reality of the whole doesnt mean it is not there and isnt real.
 
@RustedFox I know you well enough from years on here. I wouldnt call you barbaric etc. Everyone can have an opinion. The overall bipartisan lack of empathy says enough. My point isnt about this guys killing but to look at the role we all play. As an EP you arent equivalent to him the CEO of the CMG or PE company is. Us EPs are more in line with the actual person who denies the claim though to a lesser degree. Of course optum was using AI (I believe) cause why pay for a human?
 
Not quite. The cab driver is often up front on the price or the patient has an idea. The burger the patient sees the price up front. In the ED the patient has no idea that you are OON and even less of an idea that your care is going to cost them a ton of money they dont have and the CMG is not willing to give them one break and will take them to court to get their pound of flesh. Em docs choose to work for these broken corporations. EM docs are and were pretty aware of the crpatastic biz practices these people had in place.

Except posting prices can be construed as an EMTALA violation.

Keep in mind united blocking payment for services means those patients could pay out of pocket. The patient chooses not to.. (playing devils advocate here). They arent denying the care just the payment for such.

Found the UHC stock holder.

Honestly your whole take is atrocious. Placing blame at the feet of docs who happen to work for CMGs, as if they see any of that money. They aren't complicit whatsoever. Those who choose to be upper executives for big insurance actively chose their mission of maximizing shareholder value. Many people don't have much of a choice who they work for . The oft repeated "just move" is tired and, frankly abhorrent.
 
Except posting prices can be construed as an EMTALA violation.



Found the UHC stock holder.

Honestly your whole take is atrocious. Placing blame at the feet of docs who happen to work for CMGs, as if they see any of that money. They aren't complicit whatsoever. Those who choose to be upper executives for big insurance actively chose their mission of maximizing shareholder value. Many people don't have much of a choice who they work for . The oft repeated "just move" is tired and, frankly abhorrent.
Dont think so. Actually the law requires price transparency for the hospitals. The issue is the hospitals and insurers don't want this so the machine readable files are complete trash.

Re being a UHC stock holder.. Unless it is in a mutual fund I own I don't own any. Though I wish I did. Around 2009/2010 the stock was worth about $30/share.. Today $550.. so yeah I'm not gonna sit here and pretend I don't wish I had an 18x return on my money. Throw in the dividends and its probably around 20x my investment in 15 years.

I don't absolve this dude from what he did just simply saying we all need to look in the mirror.. Nope most people don't have to move.. Work at the VA.. be employed by the hospital etc. But many people give up their morals or stick their heads in the sand for $20/hr more. Thats all. Some people have no choice.. alsmot everyone has SOME choice but the choice isn't best for them. I looked at the VA.. at the time horrific pay, hours etc. Surely easy but I chased the dollar. I did it without working for the CMGs. I worked for these scumbags for a few months.. When I was an ignorant resident I moonlit for them, I had another brief 4-5 month period where my job got taken over by them and I finished out my time before we moved so my kids didn't have to change schools mid year.

Again, its not "just move" it can be go do locums, the VA, be employed by the hospital. for 95% of EM docs those are reasonable choices for them but they chase the dollar or have another reason to stick with the CMG/HCA scumbags..

Im not even mad at them for it. But it comes with the flip side and the blame that falls at their feet.
 
Except posting prices can be construed as an EMTALA violation.



Found the UHC stock holder.

Honestly your whole take is atrocious. Placing blame at the feet of docs who happen to work for CMGs, as if they see any of that money. They aren't complicit whatsoever. Those who choose to be upper executives for big insurance actively chose their mission of maximizing shareholder value. Many people don't have much of a choice who they work for . The oft repeated "just move" is tired and, frankly abhorrent.
Thinking more about this.. im legit sad I didnt invest in UHG. I was late residency/early attendinghood when Obamacare passed. The writing was on the wall. I had no money but man I wish I scraped every nickel and invested it in UHG and spread a little love to the other insurers. Obamacare was a big boon to them all. Im not some ESG investor. UHG is in bed with the government so deep they will always make a ton of money. they do much more than insurance.

When the recent report came out about them upcoding for MA patients with nonsense info and not one person was brought on criminal charges whats the reason for them not to do more of it? A fine? It will likely be 10% or less of the profits they made doing these shenanigans.. its the cost of doing business.

I was talking with a business (non medical) acquaintance and this guys murder got brought up. I mentioned how UHG is likely the least favorite for docs and hospitals. Tons of shenanigans, unfair practices etc.

his response.. They are the best insurance I have ever had. They covered everything and I could get someone on the phone with me all the time. I simply said they screw doctors really bad but unsurprisingly that's not his issue. Perhaps he didn't have enough of a medical issue to deal with denials. Just a single data point.
 
We're not gonna agree on "this man didn't kill people."
This man killed more people than people that I know that directly killed people, instead of indirectly like this man did.



Hey, we can agree here.



Sure, we can agree here - but it shouldn't cost me 2300 a month and then pay for nothing. If you're charging me that much, you had better damn well pay for everything up until my 2300 a month. Unfortunately, it's the insurers who drew up this gambit.
I think our family medical insurance premiums next year will run around $15k and basically covers nothing (other than getting us a terribly negotiated rate) until our out of pocket hits another $15k. We self pay whenever possible for medical care because our insurance is useless.
 
They can take down their leadership bios all they want, but as publicly reportable corporations, they have to list their executives with the SEC. Third-party companies will publish this information online.

Perhaps instead of spending more money to increase their security, maybe they should look at not rejecting so many claims, making less profit, and making patients the focus of their company instead of profits.
There's always the Wayback Machine.... (Archive.org)

 
Doctors also create wealth by supporting their family and buying things and investing but you didn't give them that argument.
 
I am not talking about this particular guy but to be CEO of any major company requires some level of stepping on others to get there. Being CEO of any major company always create potential for customers to hate you/decisions. IS UHC a bad apple, probably but if you go into health insurance you will always piss off many people from copays to denials to you name it. They get pissed off more b/c it affects their health but man, there are lots of jobs that creates unhappy customers and only takes one crazy to kill you.

This world has gone crazy and it takes very little for someone to take you out even as small as flipping off someone that cut you off.
 
I am not talking about this particular guy but to be CEO of any major company requires some level of stepping on others to get there. Being CEO of any major company always create potential for customers to hate you/decisions. IS UHC a bad apple, probably but if you go into health insurance you will always piss off many people from copays to denials to you name it. They get pissed off more b/c it affects their health but man, there are lots of jobs that creates unhappy customers and only takes one crazy to kill you.

This world has gone crazy and it takes very little for someone to take you out even as small as flipping off someone that cut you off.

We have gone crazy. Similar arguments can be made about malpractice attorneys who unjustly go after doctors who have not committed gross negligence. They want to suck your $$$ insurance money and numerous well intentioned and good doctors have left the field or lost their license to BS stuff argued by a crooked lawyer. These docs have had their lives ruined.
 
We have gone crazy. Similar arguments can be made about malpractice attorneys who unjustly go after doctors who have not committed gross negligence. They want to suck your $$$ insurance money and numerous well intentioned and good doctors have left the field or lost their license to BS stuff argued by a crooked lawyer. These docs have had their lives ruined.
Yep even with epsert witness docs when about 90% of cases that go to trial and several are dismissed before trial. It shows that expert witness and lawsuits for malpractice are mostly crap.
 
I think our family medical insurance premiums next year will run around $15k and basically covers nothing (other than getting us a terribly negotiated rate) until our out of pocket hits another $15k. We self pay whenever possible for medical care because our insurance is useless.
What’s happened is you pay premiums like normal but the coverage has gotten so much worse and is only useful for catastrophic care.
 
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The mob also created wealth for the kingpin, fellow mobsters, and their family members...
Publicly traded companies.. If you follow WCI and VTSAX or VOO and chill.. you are an owner there as well. What the mob did/ does was illegal. We and I dont like what UHG does but it is quite legal. When the feds gave physicians and hospitals those covid dollars i knew the game was over when the money from the government came through “optum”. Imagine that. Someone is gonna give you a big chunk of money but instead of giving it to you directly they go through a 3rd party. I dont know for sure but im guessing UHG got some money to do this.

If you do any sort of investing you own UHG.. i think the 5th largest corporation in the US. No escaping them.
 
We have gone crazy. Similar arguments can be made about malpractice attorneys who unjustly go after doctors who have not committed gross negligence. They want to suck your $$$ insurance money and numerous well intentioned and good doctors have left the field or lost their license to BS stuff argued by a crooked lawyer. These docs have had their lives ruined.
Don’t forget about the scumbag docs who testify on behalf of the plaintiffs and make some of the dumbest arguments out there. It’s crazy stuff they mention.
 
Yep even with epsert witness docs when about 90% of cases that go to trial and several are dismissed before trial. It shows that expert witness and lawsuits for malpractice are mostly crap.
Yep people want any bad outcome to have someone at fault. Everyone dies.. thats the reality of stuff. Sick people have problems, systems are broken.

The hospital wants to push for throughput but the faster you move a system that involves humans you will have mistakes.

I had a patient recently, creatinine was 8, they scanned him anyhow and no one called me with the result. Guy did ok.. Nephro called etc. but if we weren’t trying to run a super efficient factory those mistakes would be less likely to be made.

The push for faster door to balloon or door to needle only begs for errors. Where is the data they do better? Hint it doesnt exist..
 
It’s not about the work.. it’s about the back end of it. This dude while i agree not my favorite also provided a ton of jobs to people. Created wealth for himself and those employees and shareholders.

I had heard there was some stuff of questionable legality. The scale of what he did was simply there on the scale of their operations.

No one knows how involved he was in the whole denial thing. Personally, i think it is absurd. A doctor orders a test / medicine that is FDA approved. The insurer must pay for it. Period.. experimental stuff i get them not paying.

For me I tried to get protonix.. my insurer BCBS wouldnt pay for it.. NO BS.. so i paid the $20/month out of pocket.. $20.. beyond stupid..

If the system were perfect the side of your role you care about and see wouldnt change. The backend already has. It led to Envision, APP, and NES collapsing. Those entities use YOUR NPI (if you worked for them) and bilked both taxpayers and commercially insured patients out of BILLIONS.

That led some to be broke etc etc. Just cause many docs dont see the back end and find it “disgusting” doesnt mean it doesnt exist. Private equity didnt drop their Billions because they care 1 iota about the care you provide and the right thing you do medically. Ignoring the reality of the whole doesnt mean it is not there and isnt real.

You're upset about paying 20 bucks for protonix?

With regard to your last sentence:

Sure. But none of that changes the noble nature of my work. How am I at fault for the mouthbreathing parasites doing what they do?
 
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